Degrees mean very little in the IT world. Sure it might help you get a "better" job initially, but hard work, self-learning and experience can more than make up for it.
Maybe, but some companies bar anyone from the more lucrative opportunities if you don't have a degree. I actually went back to school after working a few years to get a degree in Computer Science to avoid all the roadblocks. A lot of the larger companies won't even interview someone without a degree for a software developer position. IT helpdesk and repair-type jobs are more open to people with limited education, but they can also be really miserable work.
Flunk, if you apply for a position at a large company and don't get an interview, chances are they are just parroting the position around before hiring an H1B. That's the only time I've ever seen a company NOT interview someone without a degree. Provided, of course, that you meet all the other qualifications and they haven't already hired someone else.
you haven't applied to to many IT admin jobs or admin asst. jobs.
Most companies are farming out IT support to a third party or contract work. The ones who don't require a degree because they want you to do more than just IT. they want you to be versatile and be able to manage a team, provide leadership, and have the necessary smarts to do all the paper work those positions require.
Hi. I do a ton of interviews for one of the big five tech companies (more than 100 interviews to date). It is absolutely possible to get a job here without a degree, but you need to have years of experience under your belt. Coming in now straight from high school or a local PC shop is not possible. It has nothing to do with potential H1B alternatives, interviewers and managers who make the decisions are not given that information as its handled by recruiting which is firewalled from us.
I would never at this point tell someone who wants to work in tech to skip the degree. While they can make it, the road is far tougher than it would be with at least a CS degree. Increasingly recruiters are now requiring a Masters in CS, I've had recruiters say they flat out won't waste their time on anything lower.
My own background is self taught, when I broke in in the 90's that was fairly typical and fortunately I have amassed 20 years now of experience so the lack of a CS degree has not been an impediment. But for anyone aspiring to my field now I would say they need to get one, its a really tough hurdle without it.
In my experience, large companies will absolutely interview someone for a software developer position without a degree. You just need lots of previous experience (at least 10 years). I've been in corporate level software for about 20 years without a degree, and it's never been an issue that I can tell.
If you don't have experience, you either need a degree, or you need to get that experience by working for a startup, an underpaying employer like a school district, or working your way up (which you won't do unless you're way above average).
The degree route is probably easier. Actually many large companies nowadays are dominated by senior level engineers in their 40's and 50's, and the only practical way to get in the door with no experience is as an intern. Then if you are a "star" as an intern, you can get an offer for a longer term position.
When the senior engineers that are dominant right now retire, which will start happening in the next 10 years or so, my theory is that there will be an engineering shortage and things will get easier for young people.
I couldnt agree more. Plus with all the PC garbage floating around universities these days, it is pretty much a detriment to be a university graduate given the accompanying debt burden. The world outside of university provides plenty of educational opportunity to ANYONE who has the drive to see it and use it.
A university degree in CS is well worth the money. At my company a typical offer to a bachelors in CS is $90k + about $40k in signing bonuses and stock. Add $10k to base pay and bumps on signing and stock for a Masters. These would be for fresh grads just out of college. You can pay off a LOT of school debt with the bonuses, if not all of it. If you do not have such a degree, it will be difficult to get an interview, much less such a decent starting offer.
The "PC garbage" you reference is also a positive for such candidates, tech companies are incredibly diverse. Half of my team is from other countries, and we partner with a team in India, and have multiple other teams we work with in 14 other countries. My colleagues run the gamut of gender, ethnicity, sexuality, faith and political leanings, those who have experience interacting respectfully with others do much better than those who do not. Our interview process includes "culture fit" as a major component and while we will overlook a technical skill here and there, someone who is not deemed a culture fit is a no hire automatically regardless of how intelligent or how much experience they may have.
I have to agree with the above statement. My salary is the highest in my field (development) and related fields, but I never went to college. Anyone requiring a degree doesn't know what they are doing.
It really depends on what your role is, what the size/importance of the company you work for is, and when you got in. Those of us who got in during the 90's were easily able to do so without credentials or degrees. During the 00's that shifted and it is virtually impossible to get a job on the engineering/development side with any tech company that is a relevant driver without a degree. Microsoft, Google, Apple, Amazon and Facebook are not likely to even give you an interview without seeing a CS on your resume/profile unless you have been in the industry so long that your degree would be obsolete and subsumed by experience anyways.
it all boils down to this.. .you can make it without a degree if you do great things, like make a killer app, popular website, or stunning design.
Without a degree, you have to prove your worth before they take a chance on you With a degree, they will take a chance on you and are willing to train you
An interesting move by Amd. They need wider brand recognition, and have a non existent advertising division. Perhaps picking up people who know such things and understand how to move forward on bare bones will help with that. It's not so much their products which are fine (all things considered..) sure they have some lackluster stuff as well but Apple, Nvidia and even Intel have proven that's no really a stumbling block... Anyway guess we shall see what Scott brings to the table for their team.
I was getting the feeling that tr wasn't exactly cash flush for the past few years once they started the subscription service (I.e. they probably lost their ad sales guy), they lost their two big editors (Geoff and cyril), they lost their podcast producer, etc.
Scott probably has experience making do with a light budget, so I agree that probably made him attractive to amd.
It just makes you wonder what will happen to tr since it's now being run by a guy with less than two years experience and a team with even less than that. :/
Tech company hires admired tech reviewer and site founder...Why am I having deja vu?
From starting as a technology fan talking about tech, to making it a full time job, to actually /working/ for one of these companies and getting closer to the innards than he probably ever imagined, it must be a dream come true.
Second it's kind of exciting to hear AMD and Raja were specifically interested in him, particularly as TR was a big initiator and pusher in the whole frame time issue. This, to me, suggests AMD is doing some real introspection and correction, rather than trying to deny it's issues like, say, Blackberry.
Third, stop taking all the good'uns, tech companies!
I'll miss his work on Tech Report, but I'm honestly very happy to see AMD take such a serious step toward acknowledging and correcting the problems they've had with frame pacing for a long time. What better way to leave than to put his work into action at a company that needs it? :)
Sad to see you go but great work on frame times, I post this years later to express my gratitude at the fluidity of my multiple monitor/GPU setup. When I first got these panels I was using 2 6870s in crossfire and there was a ton of microstutter. Between the time Scott released his findings and the time I upgraded to the then R9 290 nearly all of the micro-stutter issue were resolved on the crossfire setup as well the R9 and I haven't had to complain about it since regardless of GPU. That's not to say the problem is solved, only that it is known and is now being taken just as seriously as FPS. Thanks Scott!
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silverblue - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Well done Scott, sad to see you go.dragonsqrrl - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Sad to see Scott go. Hope he can do good things for AMD.Mondozai - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
So after Brian and Anand joined Apple, now Jeff joins AMD. This is starting to look like a trend.Makes you wonder if we'll lose our Ryan to a GPU company, either AMD or NV, in the next few years. Stay with us, Ryan!
hans_ober - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Join Anandtech without any CS/EE related degree, you're guaranteed a job.BackInAction - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Degrees mean very little in the IT world. Sure it might help you get a "better" job initially, but hard work, self-learning and experience can more than make up for it.Flunk - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Maybe, but some companies bar anyone from the more lucrative opportunities if you don't have a degree. I actually went back to school after working a few years to get a degree in Computer Science to avoid all the roadblocks. A lot of the larger companies won't even interview someone without a degree for a software developer position. IT helpdesk and repair-type jobs are more open to people with limited education, but they can also be really miserable work.eek2121 - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Flunk, if you apply for a position at a large company and don't get an interview, chances are they are just parroting the position around before hiring an H1B. That's the only time I've ever seen a company NOT interview someone without a degree. Provided, of course, that you meet all the other qualifications and they haven't already hired someone else.jasonelmore - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
you haven't applied to to many IT admin jobs or admin asst. jobs.Most companies are farming out IT support to a third party or contract work. The ones who don't require a degree because they want you to do more than just IT. they want you to be versatile and be able to manage a team, provide leadership, and have the necessary smarts to do all the paper work those positions require.
Reflex - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Hi. I do a ton of interviews for one of the big five tech companies (more than 100 interviews to date). It is absolutely possible to get a job here without a degree, but you need to have years of experience under your belt. Coming in now straight from high school or a local PC shop is not possible. It has nothing to do with potential H1B alternatives, interviewers and managers who make the decisions are not given that information as its handled by recruiting which is firewalled from us.I would never at this point tell someone who wants to work in tech to skip the degree. While they can make it, the road is far tougher than it would be with at least a CS degree. Increasingly recruiters are now requiring a Masters in CS, I've had recruiters say they flat out won't waste their time on anything lower.
My own background is self taught, when I broke in in the 90's that was fairly typical and fortunately I have amassed 20 years now of experience so the lack of a CS degree has not been an impediment. But for anyone aspiring to my field now I would say they need to get one, its a really tough hurdle without it.
tipoo - Friday, December 4, 2015 - link
Are those the recruiters that list a masters and 20 years experience as requirements, starting pay 40K? :Pbarleyguy - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
In my experience, large companies will absolutely interview someone for a software developer position without a degree. You just need lots of previous experience (at least 10 years). I've been in corporate level software for about 20 years without a degree, and it's never been an issue that I can tell.If you don't have experience, you either need a degree, or you need to get that experience by working for a startup, an underpaying employer like a school district, or working your way up (which you won't do unless you're way above average).
The degree route is probably easier. Actually many large companies nowadays are dominated by senior level engineers in their 40's and 50's, and the only practical way to get in the door with no experience is as an intern. Then if you are a "star" as an intern, you can get an offer for a longer term position.
When the senior engineers that are dominant right now retire, which will start happening in the next 10 years or so, my theory is that there will be an engineering shortage and things will get easier for young people.
tipoo - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
On the engineering side, yeah they do. "IT" as a vague umbrella, sure you can get in without any papers.Shadowmaster625 - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
I couldnt agree more. Plus with all the PC garbage floating around universities these days, it is pretty much a detriment to be a university graduate given the accompanying debt burden. The world outside of university provides plenty of educational opportunity to ANYONE who has the drive to see it and use it.Reflex - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
A university degree in CS is well worth the money. At my company a typical offer to a bachelors in CS is $90k + about $40k in signing bonuses and stock. Add $10k to base pay and bumps on signing and stock for a Masters. These would be for fresh grads just out of college. You can pay off a LOT of school debt with the bonuses, if not all of it. If you do not have such a degree, it will be difficult to get an interview, much less such a decent starting offer.The "PC garbage" you reference is also a positive for such candidates, tech companies are incredibly diverse. Half of my team is from other countries, and we partner with a team in India, and have multiple other teams we work with in 14 other countries. My colleagues run the gamut of gender, ethnicity, sexuality, faith and political leanings, those who have experience interacting respectfully with others do much better than those who do not. Our interview process includes "culture fit" as a major component and while we will overlook a technical skill here and there, someone who is not deemed a culture fit is a no hire automatically regardless of how intelligent or how much experience they may have.
eek2121 - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
I have to agree with the above statement. My salary is the highest in my field (development) and related fields, but I never went to college. Anyone requiring a degree doesn't know what they are doing.jasonelmore - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
coding is a totally different beast, than ITReflex - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
It really depends on what your role is, what the size/importance of the company you work for is, and when you got in. Those of us who got in during the 90's were easily able to do so without credentials or degrees. During the 00's that shifted and it is virtually impossible to get a job on the engineering/development side with any tech company that is a relevant driver without a degree. Microsoft, Google, Apple, Amazon and Facebook are not likely to even give you an interview without seeing a CS on your resume/profile unless you have been in the industry so long that your degree would be obsolete and subsumed by experience anyways.jasonelmore - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
it all boils down to this.. .you can make it without a degree if you do great things, like make a killer app, popular website, or stunning design.Without a degree, you have to prove your worth before they take a chance on you
With a degree, they will take a chance on you and are willing to train you
Reflex - Friday, December 4, 2015 - link
Yes, absolutely.Ryan Smith - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
I'm not going anywhere. I need to beat Anand's record.;-)ikjadoon - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Whew.yannigr2 - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Now he will have plenty of R9 Nanos to play :Dwolfemane - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Finally some real talent at AMD.just4U - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
An interesting move by Amd. They need wider brand recognition, and have a non existent advertising division. Perhaps picking up people who know such things and understand how to move forward on bare bones will help with that. It's not so much their products which are fine (all things considered..) sure they have some lackluster stuff as well but Apple, Nvidia and even Intel have proven that's no really a stumbling block... Anyway guess we shall see what Scott brings to the table for their team.ImSpartacus - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
That's a good point.I was getting the feeling that tr wasn't exactly cash flush for the past few years once they started the subscription service (I.e. they probably lost their ad sales guy), they lost their two big editors (Geoff and cyril), they lost their podcast producer, etc.
Scott probably has experience making do with a light budget, so I agree that probably made him attractive to amd.
It just makes you wonder what will happen to tr since it's now being run by a guy with less than two years experience and a team with even less than that. :/
tipoo - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
He's in the Radeon Technology Group, so I don't think he's tied to marketing/brand recognition. Could be though I guess, if specific to Radeon.tipoo - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
Tech company hires admired tech reviewer and site founder...Why am I having deja vu?From starting as a technology fan talking about tech, to making it a full time job, to actually /working/ for one of these companies and getting closer to the innards than he probably ever imagined, it must be a dream come true.
Second it's kind of exciting to hear AMD and Raja were specifically interested in him, particularly as TR was a big initiator and pusher in the whole frame time issue. This, to me, suggests AMD is doing some real introspection and correction, rather than trying to deny it's issues like, say, Blackberry.
Third, stop taking all the good'uns, tech companies!
typographie - Thursday, December 3, 2015 - link
I'll miss his work on Tech Report, but I'm honestly very happy to see AMD take such a serious step toward acknowledging and correcting the problems they've had with frame pacing for a long time. What better way to leave than to put his work into action at a company that needs it? :)watersb - Friday, December 4, 2015 - link
Thanks very much, Scott. Congratulations!questgraves - Wednesday, April 19, 2017 - link
Sad to see you go but great work on frame times, I post this years later to express my gratitude at the fluidity of my multiple monitor/GPU setup. When I first got these panels I was using 2 6870s in crossfire and there was a ton of microstutter. Between the time Scott released his findings and the time I upgraded to the then R9 290 nearly all of the micro-stutter issue were resolved on the crossfire setup as well the R9 and I haven't had to complain about it since regardless of GPU. That's not to say the problem is solved, only that it is known and is now being taken just as seriously as FPS. Thanks Scott!