I can understand why OEMs that want to make small systems use custom boards with soldered graphics, but what I really don't get is why they choose to use expensive mobile cpus in desktops (which run off the mains anyway). i5-5200U is a 281$ cpu and performs worse than a 72$ LGA Pentium G3258. OK, maybe the system would be an inch wider, but then again it would be faster, cheaper and even upgradable.
I like SFF and NUC, but being thicker than a laptop is a good thing if it means you can use a current gen cpu with a higher TDP.
15W is excessively low, if apple can put a 28w cpu in their 13-inch mbpr, then SFF machines can handle a 28w cpu too... and probably with a few inches of thickness, a 65 or even a 95W cpu would work just fine.
the stock cooler for 95W cpus is only a couple inches high.
OEMs are building such machines, because they already have main board design handy from their laptops, CPUs are already bought in large quantities /comes with volume rebates and other marketing incentives/. Essentially, Asus only needs to design a case and put already free R&D components inside. That overall decreases the marginal cost of Asus laptops, since they may increase their volume sales. Asus and everybody else, is after the laptop sales, "gaming" etc is just marginal cost decreaser. This is the same as Ford building electric vehicles to decrease the marginal fleet polution, so they can sell more F trucks - which is their core business.
This is an awesome lanparty box. You'd be hauling ~3kg with a 22" monitor, that's lighter than some gaming notebooks/DTR's. It does need to be a few hundred bucks cheaper: a custom ITX system with less flair could be built for nearly half as much, while maintaining upgradability. It'd be much heavier, though.
The only good steam machine is the alienware alpha, which has better specs (35w desktop i3, gtx 860m) and retails for $500 (currently 449 on amazon). All the others are either too expensive or too underpowered. It even has a special Console-like UI!
True. But making this box three times as thick and putting a very slow running silent fan is not going to hurt much but can allow the gpu to be clocked way faster!. It is a shame where such form factors wanted to emulate super-thin laptops when there is no need but compromises being had all around it!.
I disagree, that thing will most certainly throttle. If you want a Windows system build a properly cooled properly powered desktop, if you want a STB buy that Nvidia thing, they are serious players who made some serious claims.
@edzieba, Thank you for mentioning my Build. I'm actually working on a production run for this system, it should compete with a top spec ASUS ROG G20 in terms of hardware/pricing and with the GR8/6 in terms of size.
@AT I'm not sure if this counts as advertising, if so feel free to remove this comment.
The graphics card is actually a downgrade. The GTX 750 ti and gtx 960m are both full gm107 the 750 ti has a 1085mhz core and the gtx 960m has a 1096mhz core so it does have 11 more mhz core but the ram is 5ghz on the 960 and 5.4ghz on the 750ti giving 80GB/sec vs 86.4GB/sec. So i think the boost in memory bandwidth is bigger than the 11mhz core difference. So just barely it seems the 960m is a slight downgrade. Why even bother changing the graphics card to slightly lower performing. The 960m has a 75 watt tdp would it rly have been that much a stretch to add another 45 watts and put a desktop 960 in there at 120 watt tdp. Even if they had to use a custom bios that slightly underclocked and undervolted the desktop 960 to thermally fit inside this mini pc it still would be a lot more graphics performance and would of actually been a killer 1080p gaming machine.
Since it won't be using integrated graphics the 28 watt broadwell U's should be fine since that higher tdp is more for giving the iris pro 6100 enough power to operate in tandem with the cores with 0 igp usage the amount of heat it gives off compared to the 15 watt tdp chip is barely different. So if this pc had the i7-5557u at 3.1ghz base 3.4ghz turbo and the desktop gtx 960 with a custom vbios that slightly under clocks and under volts since its tdp is 45 watts higher than the 960m to make sure the temps don't get too crazy or possibly just make the radiator and fans a little more beefy im sure it could be engineered to work. I would consider buying something like this for when I lan at a friends house.
Currently I use an m18x r1 upgraded to 2960xm at 4ghz and gtx 780m in sli and cpu heatsink upgraded to a larger triple heatpipe design for the extreme cpu from the r2 and all thermal paste changed to coollaboratory liquid metal ultra on cpu and gpu's as my portable lan gaming machine. Just throw the laptop + keyboard + mouse + 21.5" monitor in my carrying backpack and I LAN away. But I am looking to replace this semi portable setup with an ncase m1 mini itx build once the 16nm finfet gpu's are released. But if a system like this asus had at least what I asked for above I would go with this instead of a ncase m1 build. But the ncase is still small enough to go in a backpack and be portable so its all good. And the ncase allows full power unlocked oc'd desktop cpu and full power flagship desktop gpu. Even tho the laptop is old with all the upgrades i've done and the massive storage inside (512GB 840 pro + 2x 2TB HDD I should be able to get 1500 out of it which almost pays for the entire ncase build assuming 150 for ram 650 for gpu 200 for mobo 330 for cpu 70 for psu 100 for cooling basically I'm only paying for storage drives out of pocket if i can sell the laptop for 1500. Not a bad way to get a massive upgrade.
what is really sad is that, for the price of this thing, you could build a computer with a core i3 4370 and a gtx 960 or r9 285, and build it in the in win bk623, which is the size of an xbox 360. and it would be cheaper. and more powerful. and could be undervolted to use less power. kinda defeats the purpose of the "steam machine"
I want to say that Asus gr series Broadwell is quite good, it is compatible with other devices but according to me its price range is high, As I had also bought it and after some time it was showing problems,So I had contacted https://babasupport.org/pc/acer-customer-service/1... for their help and must say they had resolved my problem very well and very soon. Their technical team is quite versed and well trained in these kinds of problem.
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Hace - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
That price tells me that Steam machines will never take offdj_aris - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
I can understand why OEMs that want to make small systems use custom boards with soldered graphics, but what I really don't get is why they choose to use expensive mobile cpus in desktops (which run off the mains anyway). i5-5200U is a 281$ cpu and performs worse than a 72$ LGA Pentium G3258. OK, maybe the system would be an inch wider, but then again it would be faster, cheaper and even upgradable.Laststop311 - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
i agree 100% I would not mind a system even 4 inches wider if it meant desktop cpu and desktop gpu.8steve8 - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
I like SFF and NUC, but being thicker than a laptop is a good thing if it means you can use a current gen cpu with a higher TDP.15W is excessively low, if apple can put a 28w cpu in their 13-inch mbpr, then SFF machines can handle a 28w cpu too... and probably with a few inches of thickness, a 65 or even a 95W cpu would work just fine.
the stock cooler for 95W cpus is only a couple inches high.
Samus - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
They're using what they can get. Currently Apple has dibs on the 28w chips (I haven't seen them in any other shipping devices)Ananke - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
OEMs are building such machines, because they already have main board design handy from their laptops, CPUs are already bought in large quantities /comes with volume rebates and other marketing incentives/. Essentially, Asus only needs to design a case and put already free R&D components inside. That overall decreases the marginal cost of Asus laptops, since they may increase their volume sales. Asus and everybody else, is after the laptop sales, "gaming" etc is just marginal cost decreaser. This is the same as Ford building electric vehicles to decrease the marginal fleet polution, so they can sell more F trucks - which is their core business.nathanddrews - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
That's a bit of a non sequitur, since this is not a Steam Machine. You're thinking of the ROG GR8 and ROG G20:http://www.asus.com/Microsite/rog/GR8_G20/
Samus - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
I agree. If this is a steam machine, it's a steam machine on steroids. Many of them use integrated graphics lol.Samus - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
This is an awesome lanparty box. You'd be hauling ~3kg with a 22" monitor, that's lighter than some gaming notebooks/DTR's. It does need to be a few hundred bucks cheaper: a custom ITX system with less flair could be built for nearly half as much, while maintaining upgradability. It'd be much heavier, though.DryAir - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
The only good steam machine is the alienware alpha, which has better specs (35w desktop i3, gtx 860m) and retails for $500 (currently 449 on amazon). All the others are either too expensive or too underpowered. It even has a special Console-like UI!fteoath64 - Thursday, April 16, 2015 - link
True. But making this box three times as thick and putting a very slow running silent fan is not going to hurt much but can allow the gpu to be clocked way faster!. It is a shame where such form factors wanted to emulate super-thin laptops when there is no need but compromises being had all around it!.coburn_c - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
I disagree, that thing will most certainly throttle. If you want a Windows system build a properly cooled properly powered desktop, if you want a STB buy that Nvidia thing, they are serious players who made some serious claims.edzieba - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
Or if you want a chassis that tiny AND a decently performing machine (i7-4790, GTX 970), then you can go semi-custom (and insane): http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1848777After seeing what someone dedicated can do, laptop hardware in a screenless case doesn't look all that impressive.
QinX - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
@edzieba, Thank you for mentioning my Build.I'm actually working on a production run for this system, it should compete with a top spec ASUS ROG G20 in terms of hardware/pricing and with the GR8/6 in terms of size.
@AT I'm not sure if this counts as advertising, if so feel free to remove this comment.
Cellar Door - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
Dude that is amazing, puts this Asus joke of a system to shame.@AT hope this is NOT sponsored by ASUS.
Samus - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
Wow, that is an impressive build. I love ITX!Laststop311 - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
The graphics card is actually a downgrade. The GTX 750 ti and gtx 960m are both full gm107 the 750 ti has a 1085mhz core and the gtx 960m has a 1096mhz core so it does have 11 more mhz core but the ram is 5ghz on the 960 and 5.4ghz on the 750ti giving 80GB/sec vs 86.4GB/sec. So i think the boost in memory bandwidth is bigger than the 11mhz core difference. So just barely it seems the 960m is a slight downgrade. Why even bother changing the graphics card to slightly lower performing. The 960m has a 75 watt tdp would it rly have been that much a stretch to add another 45 watts and put a desktop 960 in there at 120 watt tdp. Even if they had to use a custom bios that slightly underclocked and undervolted the desktop 960 to thermally fit inside this mini pc it still would be a lot more graphics performance and would of actually been a killer 1080p gaming machine.Laststop311 - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
Since it won't be using integrated graphics the 28 watt broadwell U's should be fine since that higher tdp is more for giving the iris pro 6100 enough power to operate in tandem with the cores with 0 igp usage the amount of heat it gives off compared to the 15 watt tdp chip is barely different. So if this pc had the i7-5557u at 3.1ghz base 3.4ghz turbo and the desktop gtx 960 with a custom vbios that slightly under clocks and under volts since its tdp is 45 watts higher than the 960m to make sure the temps don't get too crazy or possibly just make the radiator and fans a little more beefy im sure it could be engineered to work. I would consider buying something like this for when I lan at a friends house.Currently I use an m18x r1 upgraded to 2960xm at 4ghz and gtx 780m in sli and cpu heatsink upgraded to a larger triple heatpipe design for the extreme cpu from the r2 and all thermal paste changed to coollaboratory liquid metal ultra on cpu and gpu's as my portable lan gaming machine. Just throw the laptop + keyboard + mouse + 21.5" monitor in my carrying backpack and I LAN away. But I am looking to replace this semi portable setup with an ncase m1 mini itx build once the 16nm finfet gpu's are released. But if a system like this asus had at least what I asked for above I would go with this instead of a ncase m1 build. But the ncase is still small enough to go in a backpack and be portable so its all good. And the ncase allows full power unlocked oc'd desktop cpu and full power flagship desktop gpu. Even tho the laptop is old with all the upgrades i've done and the massive storage inside (512GB 840 pro + 2x 2TB HDD I should be able to get 1500 out of it which almost pays for the entire ncase build assuming 150 for ram 650 for gpu 200 for mobo 330 for cpu 70 for psu 100 for cooling basically I'm only paying for storage drives out of pocket if i can sell the laptop for 1500. Not a bad way to get a massive upgrade.
Samus - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
The 960m had HDMI 1.4 though right?SirPerro - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
Sorry for the harsh words ahead but this redefines the concept of utterly useless piece of shitTheinsanegamerN - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
what is really sad is that, for the price of this thing, you could build a computer with a core i3 4370 and a gtx 960 or r9 285, and build it in the in win bk623, which is the size of an xbox 360. and it would be cheaper. and more powerful. and could be undervolted to use less power. kinda defeats the purpose of the "steam machine"meacupla - Sunday, April 19, 2015 - link
I don't know about your xbox360, but that BK623 has about thee times the volume as mine.But I do get where you're going at.
If one could plug in one of those desktop 750Ti or 960 short cards into this machine, it would be a lot better.
Shadowmaster625 - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
This is a notebook-priced system that comes with no screen and no built in UPS.Flunk - Wednesday, April 15, 2015 - link
Niche within a niche.vineeta kumari - Thursday, March 8, 2018 - link
I want to say that Asus gr series Broadwell is quite good, it is compatible with other devices but according to me its price range is high, As I had also bought it and after some time it was showing problems,So I had contacted https://babasupport.org/pc/acer-customer-service/1... for their help and must say they had resolved my problem very well and very soon. Their technical team is quite versed and well trained in these kinds of problem.