No mention of internet connected coffee machines and vacuums like when Internet of Things was first proposed, but they still won't let go of the buzzword.
IoT for industry devices is basically Embedded Standard or componentized semi full blown Windows license for machines/embedded applications like Windows 8.1 Embedded Standard, XP Embedded, Embedded Standard 7 et cetera before it. The SKU for small devices seams to essentially be WE8.1H but also for x86.
Essentially no more "one Windows" than with 8.1 SKUs of WP and Windows before it. Just Windows Runtime seems too restrictive and hardly replaces the applications where WINCE was used before. It's nothing that will power small base stations or the like any how.
Any X86 device you would want to run a modern Windows OS on is powerful enough to run full blown Windows too. ARM boards people use for DIY projects might find use of the small SKU, but it will be more difficult than running other software on it, in most cases it's not that straight forward to run standard C++ on WinRT and it's not the environment you would use for services/server applications. Look how awful VLC is to port to Windows Runtime (or Universal Apps as they now call it). Technically Win32 is still on those platforms too, not just directly usable.
The difficulty of porting VLC to other platforms has less to do with RunTime being "too restrictive" and more to do with their code being less-portable. In the process of porting it to other platforms, they've improved it. Also this is something a couple of guys work on in their spare time.
A highly portable codebase will have less trouble. An old application with piles upon piles of archaic convoluted code will be more difficult to port. If you've got legacy code you can't/won't port (don't have the source or the resources), just run an x86 version with Win32.
IoT seems like a kitschy buzzword to me with little practicality to it. Why does my coffee machine or my fridge need to be connected to the internet? There's no selling point here, it's a solution looking for a problem to solve.
Mine already does. It's called a "timer". Unless your start time at work changes every other day, a coffee maker on a timer is probably going to be good enough. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for technology advances. But sometimes it gets incorporated into things that really don't need it.
Timers are a pia and have to be reset if you want to use it on the weekend. Also it allows a remote notification for when cleaning is needed. Perhaps it can tell you when you phone notices you are at the store so you get stuff to clean it?
With added sensors it could tell when you get out of bed or get in the shower to start brewing.
Diagnostics. It might be nice if your fridge could tell you it is under strain and suggesting clearing dust build up or that some component is performing poorly and on the road to failure. Or perhaps even that it is experiencing a critical failure. It might definitely be nice to get a notification the fridge/freezer is no longer running rather than simply finding the ice cream melted the next day. At one point we had a second stand alone freezer. It was kept out of normal traffic areas. Happened in there after some kids had been in the house the previous afternoon to find they had opened it looking for ice cream but had not shut the door completely. Would have been great to get a little notification that the temp was not able to be maintained rather than find everything mostly thawed and ruined the next day. Not to mention the waste of the freezer running at full bore all that time trying to get the temp down.
None of the things you describe require an internet connection, let alone any sort of network connectivity. I don't think anyone is contesting the usefulness of having small electronic devices that can do a lot of cool things - but rather, why would they need the internet? The whole point from the OP is the coined term 'Internet of Things,' and people are wondering if this is really a useful thing to be calling it.
It sold a whole load of new televisions DESPITE people having laptops and computers that they could connect instead (Which offered more than a smart tv)
I was actually going to add network connectivity to my coffee machine (rasp-pi + 7" screen) to show current weather, stream news, stream video from my STB etc.
It's not free, it's one Windows SKU and two Windows Phone SKUs – the one used on ATM's, cash registers et cetera is an embedded version of Windows (with win32 and the desktop) that will of course cost some money to license. The small SKU which is basically the continuation of Windows Embedded 8.1 Handheld or Windows Phone for embedded devices and restricted to Windows Runtime development will only be free for non commercial use. The other SKU's won't be available for tinkerers, but you could easily buy a retail copy of Windows for those systems that need a full blown Windows OS.
I'm not really sure I understand where the Raspberry Pi2 fits in... and if it's not an ARM version of the top one ("industry devices") I really don't expect people to use it over the Linux distributions. It's not a "mobile device" so being modern ui only makes no sense, and having no shell at all makes little sense either for a device like the Pi... sure there are some use cases that might work, but having options is what makes a device like the Pi so great. I guess we still don't know for sure what it will be like...
The Pi works best when used in specific projects, for a specific purpose: they're rarely used as general computers. If you want to run a single app (or suite of apps) on the Pi, what do you need the shell for? At that point, you're running a full-screen app anyhow, so it might as well be using the modern UI. This is for kiosks, ATMs, digital signage, all that sort of stuff.
Given the problems I've been having getting a couple I2C devices working on a Pi the past week or so, at this point I'd gladly tell Raspbian to blow me and install Windows instead.
Right, because Windows is commonly known as an platform for easy development and great debugging capabilities. I'm sorry to tell you but if you're already struggling with I2C on Raspian you're going to have a horror time with Windows.
I'd be very surprised if Windows improves your ability to talk to hardware via low-level protocols like i2c or SPI. There's at least plenty of documentation under Linux. If you want it to be super-simple, code in Wiring or something else that does all the heavy lifting for you. But you won't learn as much as you are now. And you'll still find hardware uses comms protocols in unconventional ways that make your life hell.
There are benefits to this, especially from MS and devs point of view. However I can't help but feel this also makes a large target even larger. I picture a future where I have little way to notice my sump pump has been enslaved as an e-mail spam bot.
Somehow I liked the idea that Windows could only be found on x86-computers using BIOS. Because it made upgrading any part or any piece of software simple. Now it seems like we'll more often than not have to ask not only "does it run on Windows" but "does it run on this specific type of Windows on this specific type of hardware?"
As both Windows Mobile, Windows Phone and Windows RT proved just naming something Windows in any way guarantee it will sell. And in some cases it actually seems quite the opposite. Imagine what would have happened if Microsoft had tried to sell the first Xbox as "Windows GameStation" while not supporting running games made for Windows? Confusion and angry customers in abundance.
> Somehow I liked the idea that Windows could only be found on x86-computers using BIOS.
You're going to have to really look hard to find the small spans of time where that actually might have been the case; I'm no Microsoft historian but I cannot remember *any* time where they only products for x86...
They imply that the "mobile devices" version is ARM-only, but I bet it'll work on ARM or x86. They just mean that you won't have access to the desktop, even if it's an x86.
Also, ARM is usually cheaper, so if they were thinking of using x86 they'd probably also be bumping the RAM a bit and putting the higher version on it. Even if x86 works with the mobile version, I doubt we'll see many x86 chips running it.
That SKU probably has access to the store, which won't host x86 apps for "Windows Mobile" or is at least compatible with that version when it comes to drivers, apps etc. On an mobile handheld x86 devices you can just run full blown Windows instead. An phone SKU Atom is more than enough there.
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Scabies - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
No mention of internet connected coffee machines and vacuums like when Internet of Things was first proposed, but they still won't let go of the buzzword.Penti - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
IoT for industry devices is basically Embedded Standard or componentized semi full blown Windows license for machines/embedded applications like Windows 8.1 Embedded Standard, XP Embedded, Embedded Standard 7 et cetera before it. The SKU for small devices seams to essentially be WE8.1H but also for x86.Essentially no more "one Windows" than with 8.1 SKUs of WP and Windows before it. Just Windows Runtime seems too restrictive and hardly replaces the applications where WINCE was used before. It's nothing that will power small base stations or the like any how.
Any X86 device you would want to run a modern Windows OS on is powerful enough to run full blown Windows too. ARM boards people use for DIY projects might find use of the small SKU, but it will be more difficult than running other software on it, in most cases it's not that straight forward to run standard C++ on WinRT and it's not the environment you would use for services/server applications. Look how awful VLC is to port to Windows Runtime (or Universal Apps as they now call it). Technically Win32 is still on those platforms too, not just directly usable.
Alexvrb - Sunday, March 22, 2015 - link
The difficulty of porting VLC to other platforms has less to do with RunTime being "too restrictive" and more to do with their code being less-portable. In the process of porting it to other platforms, they've improved it. Also this is something a couple of guys work on in their spare time.A highly portable codebase will have less trouble. An old application with piles upon piles of archaic convoluted code will be more difficult to port. If you've got legacy code you can't/won't port (don't have the source or the resources), just run an x86 version with Win32.
Mushkins - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
IoT seems like a kitschy buzzword to me with little practicality to it. Why does my coffee machine or my fridge need to be connected to the internet? There's no selling point here, it's a solution looking for a problem to solve.Speedfriend - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
Mushkins - imagine a coffee machine that switches on when your alarm goes off in the morning...Creig - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
Mine already does. It's called a "timer". Unless your start time at work changes every other day, a coffee maker on a timer is probably going to be good enough. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for technology advances. But sometimes it gets incorporated into things that really don't need it.toyotabedzrock - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
Timers are a pia and have to be reset if you want to use it on the weekend. Also it allows a remote notification for when cleaning is needed. Perhaps it can tell you when you phone notices you are at the store so you get stuff to clean it?With added sensors it could tell when you get out of bed or get in the shower to start brewing.
Michael Bay - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
I`ll have your average dumb cofeemaker over monstrosity you describe any day of the week.jeffry - Sunday, March 22, 2015 - link
My is a 50 bucks filter coffee machine. As simple as that. And im not willing to pay for MS Software in my coffee machine ;) MS-it wont happen! ;)Alexvrb - Sunday, March 22, 2015 - link
I do believe the article indicated it would be free.jeffry - Monday, March 23, 2015 - link
Sure it will be free. In Cuba.Alexvrb, get real! MS wants to make money with this. We live in a capitalist society.
HugeVibes - Monday, March 23, 2015 - link
Jeffry: I think Microsoft wants to tie in Azure and make money that way.jeffry - Sunday, March 22, 2015 - link
I got a timer for my coffee machine, too. I prepare it before i go to sleep, next morning coffee machine starts automatic by switching on power.savagemike - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
Diagnostics. It might be nice if your fridge could tell you it is under strain and suggesting clearing dust build up or that some component is performing poorly and on the road to failure. Or perhaps even that it is experiencing a critical failure.It might definitely be nice to get a notification the fridge/freezer is no longer running rather than simply finding the ice cream melted the next day. At one point we had a second stand alone freezer. It was kept out of normal traffic areas. Happened in there after some kids had been in the house the previous afternoon to find they had opened it looking for ice cream but had not shut the door completely. Would have been great to get a little notification that the temp was not able to be maintained rather than find everything mostly thawed and ruined the next day. Not to mention the waste of the freezer running at full bore all that time trying to get the temp down.
inighthawki - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
None of the things you describe require an internet connection, let alone any sort of network connectivity. I don't think anyone is contesting the usefulness of having small electronic devices that can do a lot of cool things - but rather, why would they need the internet? The whole point from the OP is the coined term 'Internet of Things,' and people are wondering if this is really a useful thing to be calling it.edzieba - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
"Why does my coffee machine or my fridge need to be connected to the internet?"So you don't need to invent the webcam: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trojan_Room_coffee_po...
damianrobertjones - Monday, March 23, 2015 - link
It sold a whole load of new televisions DESPITE people having laptops and computers that they could connect instead (Which offered more than a smart tv)medi03 - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
I was actually going to add network connectivity to my coffee machine (rasp-pi + 7" screen) to show current weather, stream news, stream video from my STB etc.So not sure what the problem is.
acrodex - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
windows 10 IoT is the successor of windows embedded, which have been used in various devices/smart machines for a long time.HisDivineOrder - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
I just don't see this having more of a future than Windows RT.andrewaggb - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
I think it'll do much better than RT.It's free, you can use your own hardware, and it can be used for many things that currently use windows ce, like ATMs, POS, digital signage, etc.
Penti - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
It's not free, it's one Windows SKU and two Windows Phone SKUs – the one used on ATM's, cash registers et cetera is an embedded version of Windows (with win32 and the desktop) that will of course cost some money to license. The small SKU which is basically the continuation of Windows Embedded 8.1 Handheld or Windows Phone for embedded devices and restricted to Windows Runtime development will only be free for non commercial use. The other SKU's won't be available for tinkerers, but you could easily buy a retail copy of Windows for those systems that need a full blown Windows OS.domboy - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
I'm not really sure I understand where the Raspberry Pi2 fits in... and if it's not an ARM version of the top one ("industry devices") I really don't expect people to use it over the Linux distributions. It's not a "mobile device" so being modern ui only makes no sense, and having no shell at all makes little sense either for a device like the Pi... sure there are some use cases that might work, but having options is what makes a device like the Pi so great. I guess we still don't know for sure what it will be like...Guspaz - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
The Pi works best when used in specific projects, for a specific purpose: they're rarely used as general computers. If you want to run a single app (or suite of apps) on the Pi, what do you need the shell for? At that point, you're running a full-screen app anyhow, so it might as well be using the modern UI. This is for kiosks, ATMs, digital signage, all that sort of stuff.fluxtatic - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
Given the problems I've been having getting a couple I2C devices working on a Pi the past week or so, at this point I'd gladly tell Raspbian to blow me and install Windows instead.Daniel Egger - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
Right, because Windows is commonly known as an platform for easy development and great debugging capabilities. I'm sorry to tell you but if you're already struggling with I2C on Raspian you're going to have a horror time with Windows.Michael Bay - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
Windows is undoubtedly the platform with great debugging capabilities and easy development.overzealot - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
I'd be very surprised if Windows improves your ability to talk to hardware via low-level protocols like i2c or SPI. There's at least plenty of documentation under Linux.If you want it to be super-simple, code in Wiring or something else that does all the heavy lifting for you.
But you won't learn as much as you are now. And you'll still find hardware uses comms protocols in unconventional ways that make your life hell.
savagemike - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
There are benefits to this, especially from MS and devs point of view. However I can't help but feel this also makes a large target even larger. I picture a future where I have little way to notice my sump pump has been enslaved as an e-mail spam bot.Etsp - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
Perhaps you could put an IDS and firewall on your internet edge? Just an idea...chlamchowder - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
Firewalls aren't perfect. Maybe have home appliances on an air-gapped network?Calista - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
Somehow I liked the idea that Windows could only be found on x86-computers using BIOS. Because it made upgrading any part or any piece of software simple. Now it seems like we'll more often than not have to ask not only "does it run on Windows" but "does it run on this specific type of Windows on this specific type of hardware?"As both Windows Mobile, Windows Phone and Windows RT proved just naming something Windows in any way guarantee it will sell. And in some cases it actually seems quite the opposite. Imagine what would have happened if Microsoft had tried to sell the first Xbox as "Windows GameStation" while not supporting running games made for Windows? Confusion and angry customers in abundance.
Calista - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
As both Windows Mobile, Windows Phone and Windows RT proved just naming something Windows *does not* in any way guarantee it will sell.Daniel Egger - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
> Somehow I liked the idea that Windows could only be found on x86-computers using BIOS.You're going to have to really look hard to find the small spans of time where that actually might have been the case; I'm no Microsoft historian but I cannot remember *any* time where they only products for x86...
mkozakewich - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
They imply that the "mobile devices" version is ARM-only, but I bet it'll work on ARM or x86. They just mean that you won't have access to the desktop, even if it's an x86.Also, ARM is usually cheaper, so if they were thinking of using x86 they'd probably also be bumping the RAM a bit and putting the higher version on it. Even if x86 works with the mobile version, I doubt we'll see many x86 chips running it.
Penti - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
That SKU probably has access to the store, which won't host x86 apps for "Windows Mobile" or is at least compatible with that version when it comes to drivers, apps etc. On an mobile handheld x86 devices you can just run full blown Windows instead. An phone SKU Atom is more than enough there.emsorkun - Friday, March 20, 2015 - link
IoT is so hot, not only for big companies, but also for makers. Almost every week i see a couple of iot projects on pihunt.coruthan - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
ARM Windows is dead end, without x86 translation layer, Android already won and coming to desktop.fancylearar - Saturday, March 21, 2015 - link
It's not important but I need to point out that the location of winHEC was "shenzhen" not "shenzen"....