Think they'll eventually stop making Power and PowerPC processors? Seems like they're moving to all services and software. I wonder if things like the Power8 are worth the investment now?
There is currently nothing like pSeries on the market. It is a very niche product, but it's power, scalability, and hardware cannot be overstated! It is an incredible product line that, eventhough it will fully adopt Linux, AIX is unbelievably entrenched in its hardware virtualization use.
I had never been exposed much to these machines prior to my current job. Now that I have gained hands on experience with them, I have much greater appreciation for them!
Otherwise, I'm glad to see Lenovo pickup the product line mentioned above. I think they will offer greater value, as their desktops and laptops lineups have never been better!
I've worked with them a tad too and did some mainframe programming in school, but I'm wondering if it's worth it for them financially for a small market.
Yes it is worth it for them. There is nothing on the market today that even comes close to what these things do.
I'll give you a hint - Do you recall when VMware first came out? It actually allowed you to virtualize YOUR PC's hardware. The virtualization was a direct snapshot of your PC. You could then prep your Window 95/98 installation with drivers for that exoctic SCSI controller for you CDROM and HDat boot time, restructure the layout of boot partitions, test it, Ghost it, then in case your PC would BSOD and wipe out important system areas you could recover easily. Anyhow, this is becoming a rant.
pSeries + AIX = same concept. You hardware and logical components are bound at the lowest possible level. Each core can support an LPAR (which is basically a computer-inside-a-computer), so your $50k 16 core p7 Series server actually can run 16 LPARs. If you decide on the p8 16 core, you can run 32 LPARs. Not to mention the 2 Expansion drawers you can connect to a p740 (or above) that provides you with 4 low profile slots and 6 full height slots on the main server, + 20 full height slots per expansion drawer, that's a total of 50 slots to for either Quad Etherchannel or Fiberchannel HBAs!
You're still confusing "are they good" with "are they worth it for IBM", I have no doubt they are great systems, but like Vaio PCs good doesn't mean money making. Someone else explained it to me though, even with not a bunch of revenue from hardware, that hardware locks others into software which is the big money maker for them.
Yes, it is worth for IBM. Because there is nothing like this on the market - THEY OWN that vertical! It locks companies into a huge licensing and support.
There are no "PowerPC mainframes"; there are POWER systems (POWER8 now); "POWER" and "PowerPC" are very different things. Should not be confused with each other.
Hard to say but it still drives massive R&D spend and has big big margins.
IBM revenue was 7% hardware and related maintenance services last year. Most of that was the power stuff anyways and still it was down 33%.
The x86 business was an insignificant part of the company and even the Power stuff is a very minor part.
IBM revenue is almost 50/50 integrator/consulting or software licenses for the other $94 Billion. Websphere alone is close to a $20b dollar business.
A large part of IBM development and R&D goes to software enabled hardware.
Hardware cost seems insignificant when a $10,000 server means $100,000 in licenses ($70,000 p/y maintenance).
Of course put GBS and software group in a room together and I can assure you with a little alcohol a fight will break out so it is often like 2 separate companies in one.
The one thing that enables IBM high prices for services and software is hardware vendor lock-in. While several IBM products are multi-platform, IBM is keen to keep some exclusive to their hardware platforms.
The other side is that POWER is still competitive with the best Intel has to offer and thus IBM's price premium can be justified in both higher hardware prices and higher software licensing prices.
I have to give you partial points here! However, there is absolutely no means of comparing the service offering from Intel vs pSeries! That's like comparing a 1984 K-Car (Intel) with a 2012 Ferrari 458 Italia (pSeries)... however this 458 weighs 20 times more than it should because it is meant to survive IED blasts, Lapua 8mm rounds to the winshield, and have a gas tank the size of swimming pool to drive East to West Coast of Canada!
DO NOT buy y510p SLI or similar! They are all defective or potentially defective!
Okay, the title is not entirely true, and considering speed, this laptop is a BEAST, it is really cheap compared to other laptops with similar processing power, however there is 1 huge problem that Lenovo forgots to warn users about.
The chassis of this laptop was designed for 2x 650M VGA and because of this the 2x 750M are having heat issues due to the higher voltage and clock speeds. The built in main 750M/755M is okay for most models (however many are factory defective and does not have thermal paste applied properly), however the Ultrabay VGA may be a deal breaker for many people.
The 650M in the Ultrabay can operate on relative acceptable temps (max 176F-185F/80-85C), however the higher clocked 750M (and also the 755M) with higher core voltage will reach 208F/98C in a matter of minutes and starts to throttle with GPU intensive games, like Crysis 3, Bioshock Infinite, Witcher 2, etc.
The reason for this is that the Ultrabay in this model was designed for 650M, which means: a) The fan is too small b) Technically there is almost no point where the fan could take in air, there is only a small hole at the bottom of the laptop c) There is an aluminium casing inside, surrounding the Ultrabay slot which will eventually overheat and retain the heat
I have to note that even though the Ultrabay VGA reaches throttle temperature, the ultrabay fan will not start to work on maximum RPM, currently the only way to use the fans on maximum RPM is to use the dust removal service in the Lenovo software. Running the fans on maximum would help the ultrabay vga, but Lenovo does not allow it, probably because the laptop would be too loud and people would complain because of that.
Repasting the ultrabay vga will not do anything. A notebook cooler can help to lower the cpu and built in VGA temp, but it will not help the Ultrabay VGA, it only makes it reach throttle temp slower.
In short: A beast of a laptop regarding speed, however the Ultrabay slot is not designed to hold a 750M/755M and the VGA inside it will overheat with any game that utilize 99% of the VGA.
It is okay with games like Skyrim and X-Com EU, but Crysis 3, Bioshock Infinite, Witcher 2, etc will fry the Ultrabay.
There are 2 things that Lenovo could do to lower Ultrabay temp and do not loose performance and also these fixes are only changes in the software and anybody could apply them at home. What are these?
1) Increase the Ultrabay fan RPM to maximum, why is the fan only running on max when the dust removal is operating? Why does it let that poor VGA burn? -> Simple BIOS update for the system
2) Lower Ultrabay, 2nd 750M/755M VGA voltage, this could mean -50-60 F (10-15C) and the vga would perform the same in games and benchmarks. This fix only needs a new vBIOS for the 2nd VGA
Both fixes could be made by Lenovo in a matter of hours (counting the time Lenovo would need to test the lowest stable voltage for the 750/755M), so why aren't they released yet ? Is is better for Lenovo to let the Ultrabay videocards burn and give a complete new ultrabay vga for their customers? Wouldn't making a new BIOS/vBIOS be cheaper ?
(BIOS and vBIOS are locked so users can not modify fan speed or change voltage)
Please keep the above mentioned in mind when you purchase an SLI y510p or similar system from Lenovo.
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tipoo - Monday, September 29, 2014 - link
Think they'll eventually stop making Power and PowerPC processors? Seems like they're moving to all services and software. I wonder if things like the Power8 are worth the investment now?Noëlius - Monday, September 29, 2014 - link
There is currently nothing like pSeries on the market. It is a very niche product, but it's power, scalability, and hardware cannot be overstated! It is an incredible product line that, eventhough it will fully adopt Linux, AIX is unbelievably entrenched in its hardware virtualization use.I had never been exposed much to these machines prior to my current job. Now that I have gained hands on experience with them, I have much greater appreciation for them!
Otherwise, I'm glad to see Lenovo pickup the product line mentioned above. I think they will offer greater value, as their desktops and laptops lineups have never been better!
tipoo - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
I've worked with them a tad too and did some mainframe programming in school, but I'm wondering if it's worth it for them financially for a small market.Noëlius - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
Yes it is worth it for them. There is nothing on the market today that even comes close to what these things do.I'll give you a hint - Do you recall when VMware first came out? It actually allowed you to virtualize YOUR PC's hardware. The virtualization was a direct snapshot of your PC. You could then prep your Window 95/98 installation with drivers for that exoctic SCSI controller for you CDROM and HDat boot time, restructure the layout of boot partitions, test it, Ghost it, then in case your PC would BSOD and wipe out important system areas you could recover easily. Anyhow, this is becoming a rant.
pSeries + AIX = same concept. You hardware and logical components are bound at the lowest possible level. Each core can support an LPAR (which is basically a computer-inside-a-computer), so your $50k 16 core p7 Series server actually can run 16 LPARs. If you decide on the p8 16 core, you can run 32 LPARs. Not to mention the 2 Expansion drawers you can connect to a p740 (or above) that provides you with 4 low profile slots and 6 full height slots on the main server, + 20 full height slots per expansion drawer, that's a total of 50 slots to for either Quad Etherchannel or Fiberchannel HBAs!
No, there is just nothing like these. Nothing.
tipoo - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
You're still confusing "are they good" with "are they worth it for IBM", I have no doubt they are great systems, but like Vaio PCs good doesn't mean money making. Someone else explained it to me though, even with not a bunch of revenue from hardware, that hardware locks others into software which is the big money maker for them.Noëlius - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
Yes, it is worth for IBM. Because there is nothing like this on the market - THEY OWN that vertical! It locks companies into a huge licensing and support.Duraz0rz - Monday, September 29, 2014 - link
Nope, their PowerPC mainframes are still the best out there.TiGr1982 - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
There are no "PowerPC mainframes"; there are POWER systems (POWER8 now); "POWER" and "PowerPC" are very different things. Should not be confused with each other.tipoo - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
The best, but are they worth it for them financially? Thats what I'm wondering.errorr - Monday, September 29, 2014 - link
Hard to say but it still drives massive R&D spend and has big big margins.IBM revenue was 7% hardware and related maintenance services last year. Most of that was the power stuff anyways and still it was down 33%.
The x86 business was an insignificant part of the company and even the Power stuff is a very minor part.
IBM revenue is almost 50/50 integrator/consulting or software licenses for the other $94 Billion. Websphere alone is close to a $20b dollar business.
A large part of IBM development and R&D goes to software enabled hardware.
Hardware cost seems insignificant when a $10,000 server means $100,000 in licenses ($70,000 p/y maintenance).
Of course put GBS and software group in a room together and I can assure you with a little alcohol a fight will break out so it is often like 2 separate companies in one.
Kevin G - Monday, September 29, 2014 - link
The one thing that enables IBM high prices for services and software is hardware vendor lock-in. While several IBM products are multi-platform, IBM is keen to keep some exclusive to their hardware platforms.The other side is that POWER is still competitive with the best Intel has to offer and thus IBM's price premium can be justified in both higher hardware prices and higher software licensing prices.
tipoo - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
I guess that's a good point. Hardware to sell the software, even if the hardware isn't a huge profit.Noëlius - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
I have to give you partial points here! However, there is absolutely no means of comparing the service offering from Intel vs pSeries! That's like comparing a 1984 K-Car (Intel) with a 2012 Ferrari 458 Italia (pSeries)... however this 458 weighs 20 times more than it should because it is meant to survive IED blasts, Lapua 8mm rounds to the winshield, and have a gas tank the size of swimming pool to drive East to West Coast of Canada!Vardhan - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
Is x86 synonymous with 32-bit in this context?tipoo - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
No, includes x86-64tipoo - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
Usually does these days.TiGr1982 - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
No, because, looking at x86 these days, only some smartphone Atoms are still 32-bit, and all the rest is 64-bit (x86-64).AppleCrappleHater2 - Tuesday, September 30, 2014 - link
DO NOT buy y510p SLI or similar! They are all defective or potentially defective!Okay, the title is not entirely true, and considering speed, this laptop is a BEAST,
it is really cheap compared to other laptops with similar processing power, however there
is 1 huge problem that Lenovo forgots to warn users about.
The chassis of this laptop was designed for 2x 650M VGA and because of this the 2x 750M are
having heat issues due to the higher voltage and clock speeds. The built in main 750M/755M is okay for most models (however many are factory defective and does not have thermal paste applied properly), however the Ultrabay VGA may be a deal breaker for many people.
The 650M in the Ultrabay can operate on relative acceptable temps (max 176F-185F/80-85C),
however the higher clocked 750M (and also the 755M) with higher core voltage will reach 208F/98C in a matter of minutes and starts to throttle with GPU intensive games, like Crysis 3, Bioshock Infinite, Witcher 2, etc.
The reason for this is that the Ultrabay in this model was designed for 650M, which means:
a) The fan is too small
b) Technically there is almost no point where the fan could take in air, there is only a small hole at the bottom of the laptop
c) There is an aluminium casing inside, surrounding the Ultrabay slot which will eventually overheat and retain the heat
I have to note that even though the Ultrabay VGA reaches throttle temperature, the ultrabay
fan will not start to work on maximum RPM, currently the only way to use the fans on maximum RPM is to use the dust removal service in the Lenovo software. Running the fans on maximum would help the ultrabay vga, but Lenovo does not allow it, probably because the laptop would be too loud and people would complain because of that.
Repasting the ultrabay vga will not do anything. A notebook cooler can help to lower the cpu and built in VGA temp, but it will not help the Ultrabay VGA, it only makes it reach throttle temp slower.
In short: A beast of a laptop regarding speed, however the Ultrabay slot is not designed to hold a 750M/755M and the VGA inside it will overheat with any game that utilize 99% of the VGA.
It is okay with games like Skyrim and X-Com EU, but Crysis 3, Bioshock Infinite, Witcher 2, etc will fry the Ultrabay.
There are 2 things that Lenovo could do to lower Ultrabay temp and do not loose performance
and also these fixes are only changes in the software and anybody could apply them at home. What are these?
1) Increase the Ultrabay fan RPM to maximum, why is the fan only running on max when the dust
removal is operating? Why does it let that poor VGA burn? -> Simple BIOS update for the system
2) Lower Ultrabay, 2nd 750M/755M VGA voltage, this could mean -50-60 F (10-15C) and the vga would perform the same in games and benchmarks. This fix only needs a new vBIOS for the 2nd VGA
Both fixes could be made by Lenovo in a matter of hours (counting the time Lenovo would need to test the lowest stable voltage for the 750/755M), so why aren't they released yet ? Is is better
for Lenovo to let the Ultrabay videocards burn and give a complete new ultrabay vga for their customers?
Wouldn't making a new BIOS/vBIOS be cheaper ?
(BIOS and vBIOS are locked so users can not modify fan speed or change voltage)
Please keep the above mentioned in mind when you purchase an SLI y510p or similar system from Lenovo.