So, former Microsoft manager makes a decision, that is good for Microsoft (great opportunity, nothing to lose) and frankly lame for Nokia (why, on planet Earth, would I pay premium to buy something associated with that ugly Balmer guy? What's the deal with jumping on Android bandwagon, if Symbian is abandoned?)
There might be something missing in this picture, like Microsoft's influence on US Mobile providers, that seem to essentially boycott Nokia, but, heh..
With current megashpuxel/multicore/gigaherz marketing driven techno-cretinism, it's depressing to see one of the most capable manufacturers do stupid things...
This isn't stupid at all, it's great. Whats stupid is how you've replied to a post that has nothing to do with what you've said just so your retarded idiotic comment is at the top.
I have a feeling that if Microsoft released anything more than a half-baked copy of what someone else already did, he wouldn't care that Ballmer lacks good looks.
There are very few companies that have had successful partnerships with Microsoft when Microsoft decides to compete in the same space. SGI did a similar move to Windows NT as their OS to try to stop bleeding, and it failed miserably.
Windows "Phone" is just another "me, too" in a world filled with Microsoft "me, too" products. Nobody wants them*. So why would Nokia switch to that rather than Android? Seems a little bit suspicious that the new non-Finnish CEO who worked for MS is trying to steer them in that direction.
* Disclaimer: you might want a WP7 phone, but that doesn't count.
This is huge for Microsoft. They had very little chance of taking significant market share from Apple/Google without something like this. Now, assuming Nokia stays relatively close to their current market share, this would instantly make them a global competitor. What I'm curious about, however, is how this impacts their domestic prospects. Nokia doesn't really have much of a presence here in the States.
Microsoft's best bet was to get it on as many devices as it could. Locking it into one distributor is a poor decision for the OS. Sure it guarantees a product, but Nokia products really haven't be anything to write home about as of late. Nokia's market-share is on a decline and Microsoft will just go down with it.
It's sort of like a computer, the weakest part is your bottleneck. Your chain is only as strong as its weakest link. That also exists for mobile phones. You need to provide the best hardware and software at a competitive price - WP7 might be good software, but without the high quality touchscreen software, which Nokia is not known for, I'm not sure this is going to work. Nokia was best with plastics - putting cheap plastic phones together and somehow making them durable - this sounds like Palm all over again.
But is Microsoft locked to one distributor? I wasn't under that impression.
Mithun, when will we get some analysis on this partnership? This is pretty big news, but it does beg a few questions.
1) How does this affect MS' partnerships with other mobile device vendors like LG, Samsung and HTC? They weren't allowed to put their custom skins on and weren't very aggressive in their WP7 product cycles to begin with. What now?
2) How realistic is it to expect WP7 to be ported to current Nokia hardware in development, or is this something that will take a few product cycles to actually make it to market? Remember, WP7 had some very stringent hardware requirements for all of it's vendors to be able to license the OS. Are those going to be lax for Nokia? Do they get even further preferential treatment?
Unfortunately, since AT wasn't at the event itself, we haven't been able to get hold of a lot more information that what is openly available. However, that being said I can answer your questions with reasonable confidence:
1) As it stands, Nokia is going to be just another hardware vendor for MS WP7. Nokia has also mentioned that although it can if it wants to, it will steer away from going in for deep customizations on its implementation of WP7.
2) I don't think it is very realistic to expect current Nokia hardware to get WP7. As mentioned in the article, Nokia plans to continue using Symbian for the short term. Plus, considering the fact that apart from the N900, all the other Nokia phones in the recent past have ARM11 CPU's (with only a handful even having GPU's), I don't think either Microsoft or Nokia would be interested in porting over WP7 to existing phones.
Could use some clarification: on what hardware/firmware/chipset changes might be required, when Nokia drops Symbian and switches over to WP7. I'm guessing that they could NOT easily re-program existing Symbian "smart phones" and switch over to WP7, but your article doesn't exactly say as much.
Only the N900 can even run WP7 in its current shape, but it doesn't meet the actual requirements: capacitive, multi-touch 800x480 screen and 1 GHz Armv7 cpu. So no, non of the current Nokia smartphones will be upgraded.
And there's no need for the quotation marks, they are smartphones by any metric. Even the older ones.
I don't thing this will be something in between "good" or "bad"; it will simply be "Fantastic" or "Catastrophic".
Hope Nokia can teach MS to be on time with their OS, so they don't get screwed over this "partnership" and MS actually learns to deliver without lawyer-rumble.
I have VERY high expectations of this, just hope we get another big player in the market, cause I'd say we need it. And by player, I mean Phone+OS.
Nokia has fairly nice phones (although build quality is sometimes rather questionable) and some nice software (mostly the in-house stuff like Ovi Maps, which I absolutely love), and MS has more software expertise.
I think you're right. It will either be awesome or horrible, but it's what Nokia really needs, and what MS really needs. It moves Nokia forwards, and gives MS a really strong foothold.
I can only see 'catastrophic' TBH, for Nokia anyway.
WP7 has nothing on Symbian, on a functional level.
The UI is different, certainly better than S^3 even if it's not personal ideal, but WP7 is basically iOS for people who won't buy Apple products. It's just as locked and controlled and extremely limited functionally.
My gf has an N8 and if you ignore the pure hardware aspects of the device every single reason for buying the device would vaporize if it were running WP7.
This unholy alliance will no doubt be cheered by US investors and WP7 fans (both of them) but it'll cost Nokia dearly in every market which they are currently doing well in.
It's sad really, as I'm now feeling limited to SE when it comes to providing phones which are phones first and mobile computers second.
So two players on the very margins of relevancy in this field have joined forces in an attempt to gain traction. I don't think that the sum of this partnership is any greater than the sum of its parts.
I wouldn't call Nokia a margin player. They're still the largest phone maker in the world. Android may have overtaken them in sales but that's because theres half a dozen different companies pushing it versus one Nokia.
Given Nokia's development speed and current workforce reduction, the results of this will appear in late 2012 as the earliest. WP7 may be even less relevant by that time.
There's a lot more info on this in Finnish media. I'll try and translate some of the main points:
Nokia's Windows Phone products will have (some) unique software and hardware solutions. They say Nokia's WP products will be based on "the next generation WP operating system", but it is not known if this means WP7 or something that is yet to come. They will, however, be clearly different products than the products of other WP manufacturers.
MeeGo will not be dropped completely, but it will be made in to an open source experimental OS that concentrates on new kinds of devices and user experiences. A MeeGo product should be released later this year, but it will not be the rumoured N9 with a QWERTY keyboard. MeeGo 1.2 should be released in April and 1.3 in October.
Symbian will be used on cheaper consumer models, and it will slowly be killed off completely. There are a couple of slides showing the future development of the OSes and a slide showing the new R&D structure (the site is Finnish but the slides are in English): http://plaza.fi/muropaketti/taskumuro/nokia-ajaa-s...
That is possible if the first product will be based on WP8 or whatever the next Windows Phone OS is named. Although if it's based on WP7, something might be released this year.
Anyways, Nokia Maps and the Ovi Store are going to be integrated in to the new devices, with Microsoft's Bing search features.
Microsoft SDK ecosystem has always been superior, same with WP7 SDK. Don't underestimate how easy is to write applications with it. Nokia and MS probably will flood the market with applications. Also, MS most likely will push into tablets through Nokia, trying seemless integration with the existing Windows PC and XBox installation base. This can be huge for both companies and it is an example for a great strategic decision.
Nokia and MS don't need to flood the market with applications, they need to create an environment where 3rd party developers do that. The quality of the SDK is far less important than the number of potential customers a developer can sell their app to.
I don't see how they can create this market given the mindshare that Android and iOS have.
It doesn't matter how many phones Nokia has sold in the past, it matters how many WP7 phones they can sell in the future. This agreement is no different than Microsoft partnering up with HTC and LG to sell their phones. It doesn't help them that HTC has already sold a crap-ton of Android phones at all. It only helps in the sense that HTC is a recognizable vendor.
Windows Phone 7 doesn't gain instant market share through this deal, as some (including myself) may have originally speculated. Instead, they have to bank on the Nokia-loyal customer base (which was already trending downwards) continuing to patronize Nokia at the same rate they were before, but being interest in WP7 at the high end (since Symbian & Meego may still occupy the low-end).
I still think they'd have to try very hard to take a dominant position, and not vice-versa.
Considering WM and Nokia are pretty much becoming irrelevant in the high-end/margin market, this partnership couldn't possibly hurt them, right? Now that Palm has proper backing with HP it looks like the smartphone market is going to be heating up for 2011 which certainly makes me excited about things to come!
No offense to you Mithun as you've turned out some good content on this site so far such as the WebOS 2.0 review, but I question the value of a 4-paragraph news blurb on Anandtech's front page. You have a sister site (Dailytech) that is a better venue for an article like this, and in fact this is kind of a "dupe post" since there's a news article there on this same subject with even more meat than this
Anandtech is known for high-quality in-depth reviews, and this is not one of them. Am I alone in this opinion?
I agree that I come to Anandtech for analysis and reviews, but I do recall an announcement (in 2010) that they would be incorporating more "news"-style reporting into their website going forward.
I really don't have a problem with it, but I'd prefer it act as a placeholder to a more in-depth analysis/review of the news item rather than a stand-alone report. Even still, we can always overlook it using their filters :)
Whenever possible, at AT we try our level best to do a technical analysis of any announcement made. This is why in case of the iPhone on Verizon, Honeycomb and HP webOS announcements, we followed the quick blurb with a detailed analysis of the days events. However, unfortunately, no one from AT could be present for the Nokia-Microsoft announcement. And since it is in fact a very important announcement, with the possibility of changing the mobile landscape in the near-future, we thought it would be a good idea to inform our readers of this event and what it meant.
I don't get Nokia. It's like they're bound and determined to cut their own throats.
We get it. Symbian is outdated, but you know, that's fine. It runs great on slower hardware, so relegate it to the mid-range and entry-level smartphones.
WHERE THE HELL IS MEEGO, NOKIA?
WHERE'S THE N9?!
You screwed up your only chance for salvation! With MeeGo and Myriad's Alien Dalvik letting it run Android apps, we could have had something amazing going on here.
But... really?
Windows Phone 7?
... really?
I guess we'll never see a true hacker's-dream-superphone, if they're going to forget the N9 and MeeGo.
Look honestly at the market any player that is trying to be a sole software and hardware defender is running into issues retaining market share, apple will be next. Apple already sees the writing on the wall that is why they opened up to verizon and why rumors are spreading they will intruduce a budget iPhone. History is repeating itself. This is the best thing nokia can do focus on putting out high end hardware and let M$ focus on the OS. Nokia has tried for years now to make symbian relevant and the mass market just has not cared. M$ badly needed a big partner to go with them exclusively no one else was willing to commit. Now google has motorola whom used to be the 2nd biggest phone maker so it makes sense that Nokia and M$ would really want this to go through. Nokia needs to compete with motorola and other phone producers and M$ needs an exclusive hardware vender to offset android.
Stop thinking about what might be right or what might be awesome Nokia cannot be an amazing hardware and software vender. Even apple cannot do that all of their hardware is basically designed by foxconn. At the heart nokia makes hardware and they need to stick with that or they will be in trouble.
This is bad, Nokia and Finland will let all of its OS talent and skills to go away and demolish structures supporting it. Nokia don't have any competition advantages of own platform.
Then Nokia will lock itself to .NET, SilverSomeThing and XNA. They should have kept backdoor open by making MeeGo and using Qt. This would have helped in negotiations with MS and keeping some own talent.
Personally this is close to treason. Tho Nokia was in bad position but I have hard times to believe this was the best in long run.
But now the decisions are made and need to make best out of them.
Not only that, but Microsoft leeched key IP for the Cell processor from IBM while developing their xbox. It kind of boggles the mind why any company would want to do business with a company like Microsoft with their business practices.
Yes, Bill Gates is a great guy and philanthropic blah blah blah but he also created a software company with a history of creating relationships with companies only to turn around and gut them later.
Although it was rumoured I couldn't see it happening as it makes no sense for Nokia as one of the most open and varied handset manufacturers to go with the most locked down OS. Looks like the N900 will be my last Nokia for a while.
guys, read the article. deal goes both ways. Nokia gets to put ovi store in wp7, and they are the only phone manufacturer allowed to skin the OS, although CEO said he doesn't iniitially want to change too much for compatibility with other wp7 phones.
This is a very sad day for Nokia, and even Qt, Linux and Finland. A lot of good open-source ideas and developers are now thrown out with the bathwater. While Nokia has been messing up for years, becoming a Microsoft slave and seeing its stock price crash is rather painful. I don't believe Nokia can set themselves apart with Microsoft's interface, and we all know that most companies that went in bed with Microsoft come out screwed pretty badly. The writing was on the wall though, considering the Microsoft shill that took over as CEO... I don't understand why they didn't put more serious effort behind Linux, Maemo and Meego instead of years of standing by passively and waiting out where the market was headed. They could have kick-started "Android" before Google, if they had only played their cards right and believed in their own products.
I can only hope they continue to experiment with Meego or something completely different behind closed doors, so we might see some more original devices – if even HP can do so with webOS, perhaps all is not lost...
The Nokia+ WP7 partnership isn't a dead end like it seems at first glance. Nokia got beta up pretty bad on the stock market after the announcement with Microsoft so the market thinks this is a pretty bad idea but if they (Nokia) keeps slipping like they have been, then they become a tempting buyout target from a competently managed company which would see Nokia shaken up with a management pruning and life goes on for Nokia. See? It's not all doom and gloom. (:
Have you actually used WP7? Because i be you haven't. If the OS is combined with better hardware than the current phones then it will be a great combinations. It's one of the best and most polished phone OS's out there. FAR better than Android and iOS when they first come out.
Open source Nokia supporters unite! It's time for Project Chemo (chemotherapy).
I am a proud Nokia N73 owner; PLEASE JOIN ME IN BOYCOTTING NOKIA until 1) Elop leaves Nokia and 2) Nokia drops their Phone 7 strategy.
Only an idiot more loyal to Microsoft than Nokia would publically kill Nokia's smartphone brands (Symbian and MeeGo) and pubcially take Nokia out of the game during this critical year by not having the product they've chosen to hype (Phone 7) nearly ready for sale and by pairing with the industry's ugly duckling (Phone 7) that's just a transitional product until Windows 8 arrives.
Maybe Nokia has not been that smart (going with Elop is proof), but they have good technology and Elop has already proven himself to be a total sellout idiot to Microsoft. He of all people should know that Phone 7 did a lousy job implementing an office productivity suite. More importantly, Microsoft's long term strategy is apparent--they will put Windows 8 on ARM tablets and for unity sake they will need to consolidate by putting Windows 8 on phones. Where does that leave Nokia? In a temporary marriage with Microsoft so Microsoft can save face until the real bride shows up.
The market has already made it's decision about Phone 7. It's a total flop. Per Ars Technica, every other major smartphone platform (Android, Nokia, Apple, RIM, Others) rose at least 30% in market share year over year in 4th Quarter 2010. Microsoft was the sole major loser with it's dumb smartphone debut, and lost 20% in market share year over year. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2011/01/androi...
Why would Nokia go with a smartphone that's years behind in technology and doesn't have it's own ecosystem that Elop desperatly ascribes to? Phone 7 doesn't even multi-task . . . it can take an inordinant amount of time revisit applications becasue it has to restart them everytime you switch back to them. Plus it won't do static IP addresses, it does DHCP only. The list goes on.
Since I'm not on Facebook or Twitter, feel free to post this everywhere possible!!
I think this alliance was carefully planned well in advance more than five months ago when Nokia appointed Elop as its new CEO. Both parties needed to know if the alliance was feasible, and now after mulling it for some months they decided to go ahead with it. I have feeling this will turn up to be a good move, when one of the best hardware manufacturer join forces with the best software company in the world. One is battling for survival and the other one needs to prove that it's still relevant in today's shift paradigm to mobile computing. I think they will put up a good fight this time, and we as customer will benefit from this three horse race.
I am not so keen on Microsoft & Nokia deal. Neithier i am planning to buy one soon. I prefer more open platform based OS so as it gives developers that flexibility to create app. Open source also means you end up spending more Free applications. I am not so keen on spending money for doing basic task and buy necessary applications which is available with third party or so. And this is the only reason i choose Android over other platforms. Its very simple if you lack certain functionality and you need to install the same at some cost then its not feasible but if available free of cost to install then i am fine going for it.
Applications on RIM, Apple & Microsoft will always going cost you at the end.
I prefer using Nokia Symbian old ver software. For eg. i like my Nokia 6630 a lot and havnt replaced this mobile since 7years now and not either willing to replace it untill other OS impresses me. I would definately like to give u the list of reasons why i like this phone then other phones but dont have space to post my comments.
Did i mention that even newer ver of symbian OS is not upto mark. Nokia 6630 S60 is best i say.
The day i find the same functionality in other OS then i am totally sold to that newer OS. But dont really like to spend over $500 on a mobile phone when you can get a whole big new Computer for that price. Not worth it
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natebigdawg - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Might want clarify that one...medi01 - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
So, former Microsoft manager makes a decision, that is good for Microsoft (great opportunity, nothing to lose) and frankly lame for Nokia (why, on planet Earth, would I pay premium to buy something associated with that ugly Balmer guy? What's the deal with jumping on Android bandwagon, if Symbian is abandoned?)There might be something missing in this picture, like Microsoft's influence on US Mobile providers, that seem to essentially boycott Nokia, but, heh..
With current megashpuxel/multicore/gigaherz marketing driven techno-cretinism, it's depressing to see one of the most capable manufacturers do stupid things...
B3an - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
This isn't stupid at all, it's great.Whats stupid is how you've replied to a post that has nothing to do with what you've said just so your retarded idiotic comment is at the top.
medi01 - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
It's great because ... you say it's great, that's convincing.(childish part ignored)
quiksilvr - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
Says the guy that didn't want to associate with a company because their CEO is ugly.takumsawsherman - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
I have a feeling that if Microsoft released anything more than a half-baked copy of what someone else already did, he wouldn't care that Ballmer lacks good looks.There are very few companies that have had successful partnerships with Microsoft when Microsoft decides to compete in the same space. SGI did a similar move to Windows NT as their OS to try to stop bleeding, and it failed miserably.
Windows "Phone" is just another "me, too" in a world filled with Microsoft "me, too" products. Nobody wants them*. So why would Nokia switch to that rather than Android? Seems a little bit suspicious that the new non-Finnish CEO who worked for MS is trying to steer them in that direction.
* Disclaimer: you might want a WP7 phone, but that doesn't count.
sdffds6546 - Tuesday, February 22, 2011 - link
It's great because ... you say it's great, that's convincing.(childish part ignored)
gnomepunk - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Micrisoft? Stratergic?mythun.chandra - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Very sorry for that!I typed it out just before running for work!
Thanks,
fic2 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Apparently it is Finnish.Ben90 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Aww, they changed it... Good for a morning lol thoughbplewis24 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
This is huge for Microsoft. They had very little chance of taking significant market share from Apple/Google without something like this. Now, assuming Nokia stays relatively close to their current market share, this would instantly make them a global competitor. What I'm curious about, however, is how this impacts their domestic prospects. Nokia doesn't really have much of a presence here in the States.Btw, Microsoft is misspelled in the title.
Brandon
vol7ron - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
This is bad news.Microsoft's best bet was to get it on as many devices as it could. Locking it into one distributor is a poor decision for the OS. Sure it guarantees a product, but Nokia products really haven't be anything to write home about as of late. Nokia's market-share is on a decline and Microsoft will just go down with it.
It's sort of like a computer, the weakest part is your bottleneck. Your chain is only as strong as its weakest link. That also exists for mobile phones. You need to provide the best hardware and software at a competitive price - WP7 might be good software, but without the high quality touchscreen software, which Nokia is not known for, I'm not sure this is going to work. Nokia was best with plastics - putting cheap plastic phones together and somehow making them durable - this sounds like Palm all over again.
bplewis24 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
But is Microsoft locked to one distributor? I wasn't under that impression.Mithun, when will we get some analysis on this partnership? This is pretty big news, but it does beg a few questions.
1) How does this affect MS' partnerships with other mobile device vendors like LG, Samsung and HTC? They weren't allowed to put their custom skins on and weren't very aggressive in their WP7 product cycles to begin with. What now?
2) How realistic is it to expect WP7 to be ported to current Nokia hardware in development, or is this something that will take a few product cycles to actually make it to market? Remember, WP7 had some very stringent hardware requirements for all of it's vendors to be able to license the OS. Are those going to be lax for Nokia? Do they get even further preferential treatment?
Brandon
mythun.chandra - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Unfortunately, since AT wasn't at the event itself, we haven't been able to get hold of a lot more information that what is openly available. However, that being said I can answer your questions with reasonable confidence:1) As it stands, Nokia is going to be just another hardware vendor for MS WP7. Nokia has also mentioned that although it can if it wants to, it will steer away from going in for deep customizations on its implementation of WP7.
2) I don't think it is very realistic to expect current Nokia hardware to get WP7. As mentioned in the article, Nokia plans to continue using Symbian for the short term. Plus, considering the fact that apart from the N900, all the other Nokia phones in the recent past have ARM11 CPU's (with only a handful even having GPU's), I don't think either Microsoft or Nokia would be interested in porting over WP7 to existing phones.
Kepe - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
I wrote some of the main points of the press event in to a comment currently at the last place.It seems that Nokia will be more than just another hardware vendor for WP7. Please read my other comment for more =)
tipoo - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
They aren't locking it in.vol7ron - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Well that's good news and so I retract my last comment.vailr - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Could use some clarification: on what hardware/firmware/chipset changes might be required, when Nokia drops Symbian and switches over to WP7.I'm guessing that they could NOT easily re-program existing Symbian "smart phones" and switch over to WP7, but your article doesn't exactly say as much.
fabarati - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Only the N900 can even run WP7 in its current shape, but it doesn't meet the actual requirements: capacitive, multi-touch 800x480 screen and 1 GHz Armv7 cpu. So no, non of the current Nokia smartphones will be upgraded.And there's no need for the quotation marks, they are smartphones by any metric. Even the older ones.
LostPassword - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Cool. I would love to see an updated n8 with wp7 and better hardware. I just hope they keep features like HDMI out, USB otg, pentaband, and cameraShadowmaster625 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Is absordbed a finnish word?mythun.chandra - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
No. It is an English word, written by an Indian who was getting late for work! :pThanks :)
YukaKun - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
I don't thing this will be something in between "good" or "bad"; it will simply be "Fantastic" or "Catastrophic".Hope Nokia can teach MS to be on time with their OS, so they don't get screwed over this "partnership" and MS actually learns to deliver without lawyer-rumble.
I have VERY high expectations of this, just hope we get another big player in the market, cause I'd say we need it. And by player, I mean Phone+OS.
GL Nokia!
Cheers!
Lonyo - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Nokia has fairly nice phones (although build quality is sometimes rather questionable) and some nice software (mostly the in-house stuff like Ovi Maps, which I absolutely love), and MS has more software expertise.I think you're right. It will either be awesome or horrible, but it's what Nokia really needs, and what MS really needs. It moves Nokia forwards, and gives MS a really strong foothold.
Exodite - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
I can only see 'catastrophic' TBH, for Nokia anyway.WP7 has nothing on Symbian, on a functional level.
The UI is different, certainly better than S^3 even if it's not personal ideal, but WP7 is basically iOS for people who won't buy Apple products. It's just as locked and controlled and extremely limited functionally.
My gf has an N8 and if you ignore the pure hardware aspects of the device every single reason for buying the device would vaporize if it were running WP7.
This unholy alliance will no doubt be cheered by US investors and WP7 fans (both of them) but it'll cost Nokia dearly in every market which they are currently doing well in.
It's sad really, as I'm now feeling limited to SE when it comes to providing phones which are phones first and mobile computers second.
I hope I turn out to be wrong but I can't see it.
tech6 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
So two players on the very margins of relevancy in this field have joined forces in an attempt to gain traction. I don't think that the sum of this partnership is any greater than the sum of its parts.LostPassword - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
I wouldn't call Nokia a margin player. They're still the largest phone maker in the world. Android may have overtaken them in sales but that's because theres half a dozen different companies pushing it versus one Nokia.micksh - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Given Nokia's development speed and current workforce reduction, the results of this will appear in late 2012 as the earliest.WP7 may be even less relevant by that time.
Kepe - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
There's a lot more info on this in Finnish media. I'll try and translate some of the main points:Nokia's Windows Phone products will have (some) unique software and hardware solutions. They say Nokia's WP products will be based on "the next generation WP operating system", but it is not known if this means WP7 or something that is yet to come. They will, however, be clearly different products than the products of other WP manufacturers.
MeeGo will not be dropped completely, but it will be made in to an open source experimental OS that concentrates on new kinds of devices and user experiences. A MeeGo product should be released later this year, but it will not be the rumoured N9 with a QWERTY keyboard. MeeGo 1.2 should be released in April and 1.3 in October.
Symbian will be used on cheaper consumer models, and it will slowly be killed off completely. There are a couple of slides showing the future development of the OSes and a slide showing the new R&D structure (the site is Finnish but the slides are in English):
http://plaza.fi/muropaketti/taskumuro/nokia-ajaa-s...
Kepe - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
The whole webcast is available to everyone here:http://www.thomson-webcast.net/uk/dispatching/?eve...
Kepe - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
And there are three new press releases available here:http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases
bplewis24 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
It seems to me that a Nokia W7P in 2011 may not even be likely, let alone a certainty.Brandon
Kepe - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
That is possible if the first product will be based on WP8 or whatever the next Windows Phone OS is named. Although if it's based on WP7, something might be released this year.Anyways, Nokia Maps and the Ovi Store are going to be integrated in to the new devices, with Microsoft's Bing search features.
Ananke - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Microsoft SDK ecosystem has always been superior, same with WP7 SDK. Don't underestimate how easy is to write applications with it. Nokia and MS probably will flood the market with applications. Also, MS most likely will push into tablets through Nokia, trying seemless integration with the existing Windows PC and XBox installation base. This can be huge for both companies and it is an example for a great strategic decision.Taft12 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Nokia and MS don't need to flood the market with applications, they need to create an environment where 3rd party developers do that. The quality of the SDK is far less important than the number of potential customers a developer can sell their app to.I don't see how they can create this market given the mindshare that Android and iOS have.
PsychoPif - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
When about a third of the phone sold are Nokia's, the market is already there.And that's not even counting the other phones with WP7.
It's just an announcement, but unless they try very hard, I don't see how that cannot take a dominant position with this partnership.
Exodite - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Only a very small part of those phones will be capable of running Windows Phone though. Nokia's major market isn't high-end superphones.bplewis24 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
It doesn't matter how many phones Nokia has sold in the past, it matters how many WP7 phones they can sell in the future. This agreement is no different than Microsoft partnering up with HTC and LG to sell their phones. It doesn't help them that HTC has already sold a crap-ton of Android phones at all. It only helps in the sense that HTC is a recognizable vendor.Windows Phone 7 doesn't gain instant market share through this deal, as some (including myself) may have originally speculated. Instead, they have to bank on the Nokia-loyal customer base (which was already trending downwards) continuing to patronize Nokia at the same rate they were before, but being interest in WP7 at the high end (since Symbian & Meego may still occupy the low-end).
I still think they'd have to try very hard to take a dominant position, and not vice-versa.
Sam125 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Considering WM and Nokia are pretty much becoming irrelevant in the high-end/margin market, this partnership couldn't possibly hurt them, right? Now that Palm has proper backing with HP it looks like the smartphone market is going to be heating up for 2011 which certainly makes me excited about things to come!saf227 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
I haven't bought a Nokia phone in a looooong time - and it looks like I'm still not going to be. The less Windows is in my life, the better.Taft12 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
No offense to you Mithun as you've turned out some good content on this site so far such as the WebOS 2.0 review, but I question the value of a 4-paragraph news blurb on Anandtech's front page. You have a sister site (Dailytech) that is a better venue for an article like this, and in fact this is kind of a "dupe post" since there's a news article there on this same subject with even more meat than thisAnandtech is known for high-quality in-depth reviews, and this is not one of them. Am I alone in this opinion?
bplewis24 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
I agree that I come to Anandtech for analysis and reviews, but I do recall an announcement (in 2010) that they would be incorporating more "news"-style reporting into their website going forward.I really don't have a problem with it, but I'd prefer it act as a placeholder to a more in-depth analysis/review of the news item rather than a stand-alone report. Even still, we can always overlook it using their filters :)
Brandon
mythun.chandra - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Taft12, I hear you loud and clear! :)Whenever possible, at AT we try our level best to do a technical analysis of any announcement made. This is why in case of the iPhone on Verizon, Honeycomb and HP webOS announcements, we followed the quick blurb with a detailed analysis of the days events. However, unfortunately, no one from AT could be present for the Nokia-Microsoft announcement. And since it is in fact a very important announcement, with the possibility of changing the mobile landscape in the near-future, we thought it would be a good idea to inform our readers of this event and what it meant.
Thanks :)
synaesthetic - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
I don't get Nokia. It's like they're bound and determined to cut their own throats.We get it. Symbian is outdated, but you know, that's fine. It runs great on slower hardware, so relegate it to the mid-range and entry-level smartphones.
WHERE THE HELL IS MEEGO, NOKIA?
WHERE'S THE N9?!
You screwed up your only chance for salvation! With MeeGo and Myriad's Alien Dalvik letting it run Android apps, we could have had something amazing going on here.
But... really?
Windows Phone 7?
... really?
I guess we'll never see a true hacker's-dream-superphone, if they're going to forget the N9 and MeeGo.
PubFiction - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Look honestly at the market any player that is trying to be a sole software and hardware defender is running into issues retaining market share, apple will be next. Apple already sees the writing on the wall that is why they opened up to verizon and why rumors are spreading they will intruduce a budget iPhone. History is repeating itself. This is the best thing nokia can do focus on putting out high end hardware and let M$ focus on the OS. Nokia has tried for years now to make symbian relevant and the mass market just has not cared. M$ badly needed a big partner to go with them exclusively no one else was willing to commit. Now google has motorola whom used to be the 2nd biggest phone maker so it makes sense that Nokia and M$ would really want this to go through. Nokia needs to compete with motorola and other phone producers and M$ needs an exclusive hardware vender to offset android.Stop thinking about what might be right or what might be awesome Nokia cannot be an amazing hardware and software vender. Even apple cannot do that all of their hardware is basically designed by foxconn. At the heart nokia makes hardware and they need to stick with that or they will be in trouble.
FunBunny2 - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
They hired a M$ refugee as CEO. What else would you expect? I wouldn't be at all surprised if Elop didn't demand this before taking the post.Anato - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
This is bad, Nokia and Finland will let all of its OS talent and skills to go away and demolish structures supporting it. Nokia don't have any competition advantages of own platform.Then Nokia will lock itself to .NET, SilverSomeThing and XNA. They should have kept backdoor open by making MeeGo and using Qt. This would have helped in negotiations with MS and keeping some own talent.
Personally this is close to treason. Tho Nokia was in bad position but I have hard times to believe this was the best in long run.
But now the decisions are made and need to make best out of them.
LostPassword - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Merging is still on. Just wont be flagship anymore. They still got a deal with Intel after allLostPassword - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Meant meego. Damn auto correctTanclearas - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Microsoft partnered with Sega on the Dreamcast just before introducing the XBox. I wonder what will happen to Nokia phones...Sam125 - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
Not only that, but Microsoft leeched key IP for the Cell processor from IBM while developing their xbox. It kind of boggles the mind why any company would want to do business with a company like Microsoft with their business practices.Yes, Bill Gates is a great guy and philanthropic blah blah blah but he also created a software company with a history of creating relationships with companies only to turn around and gut them later.
Johnmcl7 - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
Although it was rumoured I couldn't see it happening as it makes no sense for Nokia as one of the most open and varied handset manufacturers to go with the most locked down OS. Looks like the N900 will be my last Nokia for a while.John
LostPassword - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
guys, read the article. deal goes both ways. Nokia gets to put ovi store in wp7, and they are the only phone manufacturer allowed to skin the OS, although CEO said he doesn't iniitially want to change too much for compatibility with other wp7 phones.wvh - Friday, February 11, 2011 - link
This is a very sad day for Nokia, and even Qt, Linux and Finland. A lot of good open-source ideas and developers are now thrown out with the bathwater. While Nokia has been messing up for years, becoming a Microsoft slave and seeing its stock price crash is rather painful. I don't believe Nokia can set themselves apart with Microsoft's interface, and we all know that most companies that went in bed with Microsoft come out screwed pretty badly. The writing was on the wall though, considering the Microsoft shill that took over as CEO... I don't understand why they didn't put more serious effort behind Linux, Maemo and Meego instead of years of standing by passively and waiting out where the market was headed. They could have kick-started "Android" before Google, if they had only played their cards right and believed in their own products.I can only hope they continue to experiment with Meego or something completely different behind closed doors, so we might see some more original devices – if even HP can do so with webOS, perhaps all is not lost...
Sam125 - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
The Nokia+ WP7 partnership isn't a dead end like it seems at first glance. Nokia got beta up pretty bad on the stock market after the announcement with Microsoft so the market thinks this is a pretty bad idea but if they (Nokia) keeps slipping like they have been, then they become a tempting buyout target from a competently managed company which would see Nokia shaken up with a management pruning and life goes on for Nokia. See? It's not all doom and gloom. (:nofumble62 - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
Win7 didn't excite buyer. Adding a Nokia name to it won't make any damn difference.Android phone is a commodity. Betcha, but they are far better than Window Phone. Sorry MS.
B3an - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
Have you actually used WP7? Because i be you haven't. If the OS is combined with better hardware than the current phones then it will be a great combinations. It's one of the best and most polished phone OS's out there. FAR better than Android and iOS when they first come out.shangshang - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
stupid American spelling police on patrol.. get lifeTommer D - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
Open source Nokia supporters unite! It's time for Project Chemo (chemotherapy).I am a proud Nokia N73 owner; PLEASE JOIN ME IN BOYCOTTING NOKIA until 1) Elop leaves Nokia and 2) Nokia drops their Phone 7 strategy.
Only an idiot more loyal to Microsoft than Nokia would publically kill Nokia's smartphone brands (Symbian and MeeGo) and pubcially take Nokia out of the game during this critical year by not having the product they've chosen to hype (Phone 7) nearly ready for sale and by pairing with the industry's ugly duckling (Phone 7) that's just a transitional product until Windows 8 arrives.
Maybe Nokia has not been that smart (going with Elop is proof), but they have good technology and Elop has already proven himself to be a total sellout idiot to Microsoft. He of all people should know that Phone 7 did a lousy job implementing an office productivity suite. More importantly, Microsoft's long term strategy is apparent--they will put Windows 8 on ARM tablets and for unity sake they will need to consolidate by putting Windows 8 on phones. Where does that leave Nokia? In a temporary marriage with Microsoft so Microsoft can save face until the real bride shows up.
The market has already made it's decision about Phone 7. It's a total flop. Per Ars Technica, every other major smartphone platform (Android, Nokia, Apple, RIM, Others) rose at least 30% in market share year over year in 4th Quarter 2010. Microsoft was the sole major loser with it's dumb smartphone debut, and lost 20% in market share year over year. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2011/01/androi...
Why would Nokia go with a smartphone that's years behind in technology and doesn't have it's own ecosystem that Elop desperatly ascribes to? Phone 7 doesn't even multi-task . . . it can take an inordinant amount of time revisit applications becasue it has to restart them everytime you switch back to them. Plus it won't do static IP addresses, it does DHCP only. The list goes on.
Since I'm not on Facebook or Twitter, feel free to post this everywhere possible!!
Tommer D.
giani2k11 - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
Thanks for the writeup. Nice article. It's cool that you keep us informed.----------------------------
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Pole - Saturday, February 12, 2011 - link
I think this alliance was carefully planned well in advance more than five months ago when Nokia appointed Elop as its new CEO. Both parties needed to know if the alliance was feasible, and now after mulling it for some months they decided to go ahead with it. I have feeling this will turn up to be a good move, when one of the best hardware manufacturer join forces with the best software company in the world. One is battling for survival and the other one needs to prove that it's still relevant in today's shift paradigm to mobile computing. I think they will put up a good fight this time, and we as customer will benefit from this three horse race.ruzveh - Wednesday, February 23, 2011 - link
I am not so keen on Microsoft & Nokia deal. Neithier i am planning to buy one soon. I prefer more open platform based OS so as it gives developers that flexibility to create app. Open source also means you end up spending more Free applications. I am not so keen on spending money for doing basic task and buy necessary applications which is available with third party or so. And this is the only reason i choose Android over other platforms. Its very simple if you lack certain functionality and you need to install the same at some cost then its not feasible but if available free of cost to install then i am fine going for it.Applications on RIM, Apple & Microsoft will always going cost you at the end.
I prefer using Nokia Symbian old ver software. For eg. i like my Nokia 6630 a lot and havnt replaced this mobile since 7years now and not either willing to replace it untill other OS impresses me. I would definately like to give u the list of reasons why i like this phone then other phones but dont have space to post my comments.
Did i mention that even newer ver of symbian OS is not upto mark. Nokia 6630 S60 is best i say.
The day i find the same functionality in other OS then i am totally sold to that newer OS. But dont really like to spend over $500 on a mobile phone when you can get a whole big new Computer for that price. Not worth it
lili53 - Friday, March 11, 2011 - link
welcomekjdjasgj - Thursday, May 12, 2011 - link
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