I exchanged my crashing 7811 for another one today, and so far it's working perfectly. No lockups, no webcam crashes, just speed and stability. I can finally see the real potential of this great gaming machine. It really does seem to be luck of draw whether you get a good one or a dud.
As I noted in the comment I added to your first review of this machine, I've had a pretty bad time with stability. It doesn't matter whether I use the stock 176, or the patched 177.92 or 177.98 drivers, my 7811 is still totally unstable when playing games that even moderately tax the graphics subsystem. Spore locks the machine hard after an hour. Crysis gets about 30 minutes. Thereafter, the locks happen more and more frequently, interspersed with occasional BSODs.
I suspect the problem is heat. The increasing frequency of the lockups when gaming, coupled with the fact that the machine works fine for non-gaming tasks, makes me think that the machine's cooling system just can't handle the load. I've ensured that there is plenty of room underneath the machine and even set it on a laptop cooling pad, but none of this has made any difference.
Unfortunately, as it stands, I cannot recomment the 7811 as a gaming PC.
Four "new" models, and one returning model. This was originally going to be a seven laptop roundup, but the text was already too long. The next three are midrange options.
I went to BestBuy today to take a look at the Gateway model. thought i'd add a few observations.
I was surprised by how large the laptop was. The optical drive kept popping out and would not close properly, but that could be due to customer abuse on the display model.
I am not too thrilled about the form factor - it looks kinda ugly but thats subjective. Ethernet port is on the side which is weird since i would like it hidden behind the laptop. For a gaming laptop I dont see the need for a full keyboard. The arrow keys are really cramped together.
I actually purchased the P7811fx from BB this weekend. For those interested it is $200 off (at least in my area) and you get a free PC game up to $50 value.
It does have a large form factor, in fact it wont fit most 17' carrying cases. Sitting on my lap, it feels like a table because it is so large. I don't mind though, I wanted the 17 in screen as well as a full keyboard. Many people want a keypad for uses in things like MMOs, that is a big selling point for me.
As for the optical drive... it opens easily. Mine will stay closed unless I push on the button (which as indicated in this roundup, is very easy to do just picking it up).
From what I have read, the lockups on these machines are only affecting some laptops. Many people have exchanged in the 14 day window to get one and their problems have been fixed.
Oh, the wireless button feels kinda cheap... I will have to see how long it lasts. I look forward to being able to upgrade it in the future (hopefully) and keep this laptop for a long time. Its a good machine, the colors aren't fabulous, but they don't really bother me. Its a great time to get one if you are looking at it since it is discounted right now.
can you also laptop from killernotebook.com into the review as well? they are similar to the sager systems in the sense that they are also custom built based on ODM chassis by Mark from killernotebook. I am keen on looking at some head on comparisons for those with the rest of the field.
It's difficult to properly evaluate service and support, but since all three companies offer the same Clevo D901C notebook seen in this review, consider this configuration:
1920x1200
Q9550
2x9800M GT
2x2GB RAM
3x320GB HDD in RAID 5
Blu-ray Recorder
3-year Warranty
There's no ability to select a warranty at KillerNotebooks.com (it's 1-year according to the "About Us" page), and the site layout does not instill confidence. The support section doesn't even list 8800M or 9800M drivers for the Odachi (apparently misspelled "Odach" in various locations). I'm definitely not going to recommend spending $500 or $600 more to get the same notebook with a lesser warranty.
Thanks for the review, this is a good start. I've been researching gaming laptops myself lately because I plan on buying one soon. From what I've seen so far, the Asus G50V-A2 seems to have the most bang for the buck. Can you add this laptop to the review?
Core 2 Duo T9400 2.53Ghz
15.4" WSXGA+ (1680 x 1050)
4GB DDR2
2 x 7200rpm 200GB HD in raid
Blu-ray drive
NVIDIA GeForce 9700M GT (512MB VRAM DDR3)
All for only $1899 on newegg (and I'm sure you can find it on sale somewhere).
Personally, I think alienware is VERY over priced and a horrible value. They even use slower 667Mhz ram and last generation video cards. I've never heard anything good about their customer service. You can easily spend $1000 more on the alienware and get a worse laptop than the Asus. The gateway's are a good deal (and tempting) but I want a 15.4" screen, not 17". Finally, I don't know or trust Sager yet.
I've requested a couple ASUS laptops, so we'll see. Outside of the 15.4" part, I'd rate the Gateway higher in every area. However, form factor is a pretty major consideration. I expect the 9700M GT will be around 65-75% of the performance of the P-7811, so with a lower maximum resolution it should run pretty well.
As for Sager, they have been selling laptops (with a moderate focus on enthusiast models) for over 20 years - since 1985. I would have no problem recommending them as a company. As such, the NP2096 is one option (15.4" 1680x1050, 9600M GT, P9500 CPU, 4GB RAM, and 320GB HDD for ~$1550). For more gaming performance, check out the NP8660. It's more expensive than the ASUS, the the 9800M GT is about twice as fast as the 9700M GT I'd guess. It actually looks quite similar to the m15x in terms of specs, for a lot less money. $2300 for a nearly top-end config. Too bad there's no Smart Bay battery, and I don't know if you can disable the discrete GPU.
" this is the first laptop we've tested that includes the option to shut off the discrete graphics and use integrated graphics."
Cough. A bit behind the times on laptops, are we? Several Asus and Sony models have featured this already, going back as far as 2 years ago.
The Montevina refresh to the thinkpad T series (T400, T500) allow you to switch between integrated and discrete (Radeon 36xx) graphics on-the-fly in Vista. Now we're talkin'!
"first laptop we've tested" says it all. I know perfectly well that others have done it, and I mention (repeatedly) that the Centrino 2 offerings are supposed to improve that functionality. Now I just need to get the appropriate companies to send laptops for review, which is always the difficult part. Still, the feature is far more useful IMO when you're using it with high-end GPUs. Switching between 8400M and IGP isn't as critical as switching between 8800M/9800M and IGP.
Another great "budget" gaming laptop would be the Asus G50V. The specs show the price to performance ratio is very good and comes equipped with 9700M GT. I would love to see a review on it.
I would like to mention that the Sager seems to use close to what A 'medium power' Desktop would use for power consumption(minus the monitor). That is *if* these figures you're showing are accurate compared to my readings (or vice versa).
Again, to be fair, what I measured was just the hardware in the case, so there are no LCD/CRT monitor figures counted in. At idle the above system uses 124-125W. while web surfing and doing other non intensive tasks the system above uses 128W-135W. With a full load on the CPU using orthos for an hour with 2 threads running(100% CPU load), this system uses 171-174W. In World of conflict, using the in game benchmark with everything maxed(no AA or AF) this machine has peaked up to 215W. Running the same benchmark with the game output limited to 30FPS uses only 195W peak, but mostly between 185-190W.
World in conflict I have noticed so far can use by far the most power while gaming. Games such as Hellgate: London, and FEAR use around 180-195W(everything maxed).
As a kind of interesting side comparison I checked the older card I used before the 9600 GT (eVGA 7600 GT KO edition) peak idle was 106w, while peak gaming was 168W. Much lower than I had anticipated. Granted the 9600GT is also lower in power usage than I had originally thought based on reviews, and about twice as fast as the 7600 GT in most games.
Now I am very interested in how much power the new Intel mini ITX board, with x4500HD graphics and a reasonably powered desktop CPU would use. You hearing me Jarred? Derrick ? Anand ?! Would be nice if you guys could find out for all of us ; ) Something tells me that it'll only be marginally lower in power consumption though . . .
Monitor I use is a 19" widescreen LCD. Native resolution of 1440x900, so that is the resolution I tend to play games in. All of my figures are based on a 1440x900 resolution(for what it is worth).
I think Gary will have an X4500 article up next week. Don't quote me on that, as I know Gary and Anand have run into quite a few issues with the G45 testing, but it's not for lack of trying.
As for power requirements, I figure the LCD is using between 10W and 20W of power, and while it might be using as much power as your midrange desktop, it also happens to be faster. You'd need 9600 GT SLI at the very least (~equal performance), or 8800 GT SLI (faster performance).
The other item that we don't know is power supply/power brick efficiency. If they're both 80% efficient, that's one thing, but if the laptop is 70% efficient and your desktop is 80% efficient, that could account for another 20W or so. Anyway, since this *is* a desktop replacement, it's not too surprising that the power requirements extend into desktop territory.
Yeah, I would not expect my desktop to beat the laptop performance wise(in games), but with what I have for resolution/monitor wise it does perfectly fine for me.
It is just that lately, since we are going 100% green energy(solar/wind), or as close to 100% as possible, I have been on this power consumption 'kick'. I would hope that the Intel motherboard with the desktop G45 chipset, and x4500HD would use half of what I am using power wise now with my current desktop, but I suspect that I would have to get the laptop based mini itx motherboard/CPU/memory for it to be truly where I would like to see things power wise. Even only 100W is roughly 8.33 amps off of the batteries on a 12v system : / Depending on how many batteries you have, that can be substantial.
I do realize that gaming on the Intel mini ITX boards would take the back seat because of performance, but it would be a perfect machine for running almost everything except for games. That is, until Photoshop, Illustrator, etc start leveraging the GPU/parallel processing.
Good article - but the Alienware is not the first laptop with dual graphics cards like this. Maybe for a gaming laptop, but my Sony SZ is getting close to two years old and can do the same thing. Sounds like it even does things the same way, I have to reboot to switch graphics. I've seen it average at about 50% battery performance increase too.
That's why I say the first laptop *we've* tested. Besides, a midrange (at best) GPU that can be disabled isn't quite as useful as a high-end GPU that can be switched on/off.
I liked the article, but I've been looking on the Internet for a review that could tell me how good are ATI's 3650's, of which ASUS seemingly is a fan seeing how they have 5 models for sale on Newegg :)
I've asked AMD to get me a notebook with 3000 series graphics, but no one has been able to do so yet. Outside of the 3870, though, graphics performance will be relatively mediocre. I've got a few midrange notebooks with 9500M/8600M GPUs that I'm reviewing, and one with a Radeon 2600. Performance is around 1/3 of the 9800M GTS in gaming. Many games (GRID, Mass Effect, Assassin's Creed, etc.) need to run at 1280x800 and low to medium detail on such laptops before they can get solid frame rates.
The performance of midrange laptop cards go: 9600m GT GDDR3> HD3650> 8600m GT GDDR3> 9600m GT=HD2600 GDDR3>8600m GT DDR2=9500m GS DDR2>HD2600 DDR2. Now there are a few more nVidia cards, just to muddle the waters more, but this should give rough performance estimates. 9500m GS is just a rebadged 8600m GT.
On my HD2600 DDR2 I play Assassin's Creed with everything on max at 1280x800. On the other hand, my max is for some reason lvl 3 instead of 4. Solid framerates for one person is not the same as for someone else. Some can't stand below 40, som don't see the difference between 30 and 60. For me, over 25 is quite fluid. It helps that Ass Creed has motionblur. That smooths things up.
Oh, And i've OC'd the Graphics memory a bit. That helps too.
I grabbed an Alienware laptop 3 or 4 years ago, and I expected to be able to game on it. I had the Geforce 6800 Ultra Go put in it and had overheating problems from the start. I had to send it into the company for repairs to the motherboard from various components burning up. Whether I got a defective component somewhere that was tearing it up, I don't know, but it has turned me completely off to laptops, gaming ones in particular.
I'd just be scared off of Alienware-which I am anyway...
I'm shocked that even the build quality is garbage. I don't get the point of that 15x thing. Dell's 1730 is SOOOO much better built, and it's higher end, for basically the same price. Those Gateway models seem to be a lot better built too, for at least $1000 less (or worse...)
We reviewed that http://www.anandtech.com/mobile/showdoc.aspx?i=324...">six months ago. Dell hasn't updated it to support the 9800M (yet?), but otherwise it would be very comparable in performance to the Sager unit. The Sager is still a bit faster because of the desktop CPU, and it consumes a bit more power and is a bit heavier. The Dell is also more expensive because of the cost of mobile CPUs, so if you want i.e. an X9000, it's over 3X the cost of an E9500. Since both weigh a lot and cost a lot, you might as well get the fractionally larger Sager/Clevo.
I understand you reviewed the 1730 6+months ago (and I bought one based on that review with the extreme CPU and SLi 8800GTX's) however some of us would like to see how it still stacks up to the competition, and being a "round-up" and all, I think it makes sense to include it, even if its just for old time sake.
I did mention the laptop, and there are a few games where we tested on both laptops. However, we don't generally get to hang onto $5000 laptops for a long time, so I can't just go back and retest the M1730. In terms of performance, the Sager is going to be slightly faster on the CPU, but overall gaming performance is a tie. If I were to pick between the two now, I would probably go with the Sager for the high-end, because price is a bit cheaper for the same level of performance. Plus you can run quad-core if you want (though that's not really useful for games). I'd be much more likely to go with the Gateway units for the price, but obviously the Dell and Sager are over twice as fast in most games.
While I agree with you on the astetics of the P series, its price/performance ratio and upgradability are unmatched at the moment. A few months back, I picked up a 6860FX and have been nothing but pleased with it. I've replaced the CPU with a used X7800 ES, and swapped the hard drives for 2x Hitachi 200GBs in a Raid 0 array.
I didn't do it all at the same time of course, but thats the beauty of it. Whenever you need a lil bit more horsepower, all you have to do is just shop around for parts
I'm *sure* there are typos in the article (or errors in speech recognition). I've spent most of the past two days trying to finish all the writing and graphs, so go easy on me while I get some sleep. In the meantime, if you want to point out errors, reply to this post and we'll (eventually) correct them. Hopefully, none of the issues "ruin" the article for you or make it "unreadable". ;-)
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NotebookGamer - Monday, October 20, 2008 - link
I've been wanting to see a gaming laptops showdown between the Clevo matched up against the m1730.I got my NP9262 from Factor Gaming.
cg0def - Monday, September 15, 2008 - link
Say it ain so! I still remember when Alienware laptops used to look good. What happened guys? Oh, nm dell bough them ... well tough luck ...jfdmit - Saturday, September 13, 2008 - link
I exchanged my crashing 7811 for another one today, and so far it's working perfectly. No lockups, no webcam crashes, just speed and stability. I can finally see the real potential of this great gaming machine. It really does seem to be luck of draw whether you get a good one or a dud.jfdmit - Thursday, September 11, 2008 - link
As I noted in the comment I added to your first review of this machine, I've had a pretty bad time with stability. It doesn't matter whether I use the stock 176, or the patched 177.92 or 177.98 drivers, my 7811 is still totally unstable when playing games that even moderately tax the graphics subsystem. Spore locks the machine hard after an hour. Crysis gets about 30 minutes. Thereafter, the locks happen more and more frequently, interspersed with occasional BSODs.I suspect the problem is heat. The increasing frequency of the lockups when gaming, coupled with the fact that the machine works fine for non-gaming tasks, makes me think that the machine's cooling system just can't handle the load. I've ensured that there is plenty of room underneath the machine and even set it on a laptop cooling pad, but none of this has made any difference.
Unfortunately, as it stands, I cannot recomment the 7811 as a gaming PC.
Ben - Sunday, August 31, 2008 - link
Thanks for the article, but I expected more than 3 laptops when I read the title, "roundup".Ben - Sunday, August 31, 2008 - link
OK, you have 3 models listed on the index, you say 4 in the test setup, and then there's 5 benchmarks.I guess 5 is enough for a "roundup" though. :)
JarredWalton - Sunday, August 31, 2008 - link
Four "new" models, and one returning model. This was originally going to be a seven laptop roundup, but the text was already too long. The next three are midrange options.ikjadoon - Sunday, August 31, 2008 - link
What gives? Overdrive PC overclocks their laptops and Velocity Micro has some fine systems, too..Great review, however. :)
rvikul - Sunday, August 31, 2008 - link
I went to BestBuy today to take a look at the Gateway model. thought i'd add a few observations.I was surprised by how large the laptop was. The optical drive kept popping out and would not close properly, but that could be due to customer abuse on the display model.
I am not too thrilled about the form factor - it looks kinda ugly but thats subjective. Ethernet port is on the side which is weird since i would like it hidden behind the laptop. For a gaming laptop I dont see the need for a full keyboard. The arrow keys are really cramped together.
nycromes - Tuesday, September 2, 2008 - link
I actually purchased the P7811fx from BB this weekend. For those interested it is $200 off (at least in my area) and you get a free PC game up to $50 value.It does have a large form factor, in fact it wont fit most 17' carrying cases. Sitting on my lap, it feels like a table because it is so large. I don't mind though, I wanted the 17 in screen as well as a full keyboard. Many people want a keypad for uses in things like MMOs, that is a big selling point for me.
As for the optical drive... it opens easily. Mine will stay closed unless I push on the button (which as indicated in this roundup, is very easy to do just picking it up).
From what I have read, the lockups on these machines are only affecting some laptops. Many people have exchanged in the 14 day window to get one and their problems have been fixed.
Oh, the wireless button feels kinda cheap... I will have to see how long it lasts. I look forward to being able to upgrade it in the future (hopefully) and keep this laptop for a long time. Its a good machine, the colors aren't fabulous, but they don't really bother me. Its a great time to get one if you are looking at it since it is discounted right now.
Th3G4mbl3r - Saturday, August 30, 2008 - link
can you also laptop from killernotebook.com into the review as well? they are similar to the sager systems in the sense that they are also custom built based on ODM chassis by Mark from killernotebook. I am keen on looking at some head on comparisons for those with the rest of the field.JarredWalton - Sunday, August 31, 2008 - link
It's difficult to properly evaluate service and support, but since all three companies offer the same Clevo D901C notebook seen in this review, consider this configuration:1920x1200
Q9550
2x9800M GT
2x2GB RAM
3x320GB HDD in RAID 5
Blu-ray Recorder
3-year Warranty
Sager NP9262: $4538.00
AVADirect D901C: $4659
Killer Notebooks Odachi: $5174
There's no ability to select a warranty at KillerNotebooks.com (it's 1-year according to the "About Us" page), and the site layout does not instill confidence. The support section doesn't even list 8800M or 9800M drivers for the Odachi (apparently misspelled "Odach" in various locations). I'm definitely not going to recommend spending $500 or $600 more to get the same notebook with a lesser warranty.
SpacePope - Saturday, August 30, 2008 - link
Thanks for the review, this is a good start. I've been researching gaming laptops myself lately because I plan on buying one soon. From what I've seen so far, the Asus G50V-A2 seems to have the most bang for the buck. Can you add this laptop to the review?Core 2 Duo T9400 2.53Ghz
15.4" WSXGA+ (1680 x 1050)
4GB DDR2
2 x 7200rpm 200GB HD in raid
Blu-ray drive
NVIDIA GeForce 9700M GT (512MB VRAM DDR3)
All for only $1899 on newegg (and I'm sure you can find it on sale somewhere).
Personally, I think alienware is VERY over priced and a horrible value. They even use slower 667Mhz ram and last generation video cards. I've never heard anything good about their customer service. You can easily spend $1000 more on the alienware and get a worse laptop than the Asus. The gateway's are a good deal (and tempting) but I want a 15.4" screen, not 17". Finally, I don't know or trust Sager yet.
JarredWalton - Saturday, August 30, 2008 - link
I've requested a couple ASUS laptops, so we'll see. Outside of the 15.4" part, I'd rate the Gateway higher in every area. However, form factor is a pretty major consideration. I expect the 9700M GT will be around 65-75% of the performance of the P-7811, so with a lower maximum resolution it should run pretty well.As for Sager, they have been selling laptops (with a moderate focus on enthusiast models) for over 20 years - since 1985. I would have no problem recommending them as a company. As such, the NP2096 is one option (15.4" 1680x1050, 9600M GT, P9500 CPU, 4GB RAM, and 320GB HDD for ~$1550). For more gaming performance, check out the NP8660. It's more expensive than the ASUS, the the 9800M GT is about twice as fast as the 9700M GT I'd guess. It actually looks quite similar to the m15x in terms of specs, for a lot less money. $2300 for a nearly top-end config. Too bad there's no Smart Bay battery, and I don't know if you can disable the discrete GPU.
Voldenuit - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
" this is the first laptop we've tested that includes the option to shut off the discrete graphics and use integrated graphics."Cough. A bit behind the times on laptops, are we? Several Asus and Sony models have featured this already, going back as far as 2 years ago.
The Montevina refresh to the thinkpad T series (T400, T500) allow you to switch between integrated and discrete (Radeon 36xx) graphics on-the-fly in Vista. Now we're talkin'!
JarredWalton - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
"first laptop we've tested" says it all. I know perfectly well that others have done it, and I mention (repeatedly) that the Centrino 2 offerings are supposed to improve that functionality. Now I just need to get the appropriate companies to send laptops for review, which is always the difficult part. Still, the feature is far more useful IMO when you're using it with high-end GPUs. Switching between 8400M and IGP isn't as critical as switching between 8800M/9800M and IGP.Jumpman23 - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
Another great "budget" gaming laptop would be the Asus G50V. The specs show the price to performance ratio is very good and comes equipped with 9700M GT. I would love to see a review on it.yyrkoon - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
I would like to mention that the Sager seems to use close to what A 'medium power' Desktop would use for power consumption(minus the monitor). That is *if* these figures you're showing are accurate compared to my readings (or vice versa).Let me define a 'medium power' desktop system:
ABIT IP35-E
Intel E6550 @ 2.8Ghz
2x2GB A-DATA 1.8v DDR2-800
eVGA 9600GT 512MB
1x DVD/CD burner(Liteon if applicable)
4x HDDs (all Seagate if applicable)
Antec Earthwatts 500
Again, to be fair, what I measured was just the hardware in the case, so there are no LCD/CRT monitor figures counted in. At idle the above system uses 124-125W. while web surfing and doing other non intensive tasks the system above uses 128W-135W. With a full load on the CPU using orthos for an hour with 2 threads running(100% CPU load), this system uses 171-174W. In World of conflict, using the in game benchmark with everything maxed(no AA or AF) this machine has peaked up to 215W. Running the same benchmark with the game output limited to 30FPS uses only 195W peak, but mostly between 185-190W.
World in conflict I have noticed so far can use by far the most power while gaming. Games such as Hellgate: London, and FEAR use around 180-195W(everything maxed).
As a kind of interesting side comparison I checked the older card I used before the 9600 GT (eVGA 7600 GT KO edition) peak idle was 106w, while peak gaming was 168W. Much lower than I had anticipated. Granted the 9600GT is also lower in power usage than I had originally thought based on reviews, and about twice as fast as the 7600 GT in most games.
Now I am very interested in how much power the new Intel mini ITX board, with x4500HD graphics and a reasonably powered desktop CPU would use. You hearing me Jarred? Derrick ? Anand ?! Would be nice if you guys could find out for all of us ; ) Something tells me that it'll only be marginally lower in power consumption though . . .
yyrkoon - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
Monitor I use is a 19" widescreen LCD. Native resolution of 1440x900, so that is the resolution I tend to play games in. All of my figures are based on a 1440x900 resolution(for what it is worth).JarredWalton - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
I think Gary will have an X4500 article up next week. Don't quote me on that, as I know Gary and Anand have run into quite a few issues with the G45 testing, but it's not for lack of trying.As for power requirements, I figure the LCD is using between 10W and 20W of power, and while it might be using as much power as your midrange desktop, it also happens to be faster. You'd need 9600 GT SLI at the very least (~equal performance), or 8800 GT SLI (faster performance).
The other item that we don't know is power supply/power brick efficiency. If they're both 80% efficient, that's one thing, but if the laptop is 70% efficient and your desktop is 80% efficient, that could account for another 20W or so. Anyway, since this *is* a desktop replacement, it's not too surprising that the power requirements extend into desktop territory.
yyrkoon - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
Yeah, I would not expect my desktop to beat the laptop performance wise(in games), but with what I have for resolution/monitor wise it does perfectly fine for me.It is just that lately, since we are going 100% green energy(solar/wind), or as close to 100% as possible, I have been on this power consumption 'kick'. I would hope that the Intel motherboard with the desktop G45 chipset, and x4500HD would use half of what I am using power wise now with my current desktop, but I suspect that I would have to get the laptop based mini itx motherboard/CPU/memory for it to be truly where I would like to see things power wise. Even only 100W is roughly 8.33 amps off of the batteries on a 12v system : / Depending on how many batteries you have, that can be substantial.
I do realize that gaming on the Intel mini ITX boards would take the back seat because of performance, but it would be a perfect machine for running almost everything except for games. That is, until Photoshop, Illustrator, etc start leveraging the GPU/parallel processing.
Oarngemeat - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
Good article - but the Alienware is not the first laptop with dual graphics cards like this. Maybe for a gaming laptop, but my Sony SZ is getting close to two years old and can do the same thing. Sounds like it even does things the same way, I have to reboot to switch graphics. I've seen it average at about 50% battery performance increase too.JarredWalton - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
That's why I say the first laptop *we've* tested. Besides, a midrange (at best) GPU that can be disabled isn't quite as useful as a high-end GPU that can be switched on/off.denka - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
I liked the article, but I've been looking on the Internet for a review that could tell me how good are ATI's 3650's, of which ASUS seemingly is a fan seeing how they have 5 models for sale on Newegg :)Still looking.
denka - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
Sorry, must have been a stupid question. Found my answers on www.notebookcheck.netJarredWalton - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
I've asked AMD to get me a notebook with 3000 series graphics, but no one has been able to do so yet. Outside of the 3870, though, graphics performance will be relatively mediocre. I've got a few midrange notebooks with 9500M/8600M GPUs that I'm reviewing, and one with a Radeon 2600. Performance is around 1/3 of the 9800M GTS in gaming. Many games (GRID, Mass Effect, Assassin's Creed, etc.) need to run at 1280x800 and low to medium detail on such laptops before they can get solid frame rates.fabarati - Saturday, August 30, 2008 - link
The performance of midrange laptop cards go: 9600m GT GDDR3> HD3650> 8600m GT GDDR3> 9600m GT=HD2600 GDDR3>8600m GT DDR2=9500m GS DDR2>HD2600 DDR2. Now there are a few more nVidia cards, just to muddle the waters more, but this should give rough performance estimates. 9500m GS is just a rebadged 8600m GT.On my HD2600 DDR2 I play Assassin's Creed with everything on max at 1280x800. On the other hand, my max is for some reason lvl 3 instead of 4. Solid framerates for one person is not the same as for someone else. Some can't stand below 40, som don't see the difference between 30 and 60. For me, over 25 is quite fluid. It helps that Ass Creed has motionblur. That smooths things up.
Oh, And i've OC'd the Graphics memory a bit. That helps too.
flahdgee - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
I grabbed an Alienware laptop 3 or 4 years ago, and I expected to be able to game on it. I had the Geforce 6800 Ultra Go put in it and had overheating problems from the start. I had to send it into the company for repairs to the motherboard from various components burning up. Whether I got a defective component somewhere that was tearing it up, I don't know, but it has turned me completely off to laptops, gaming ones in particular.Wolfpup - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
I'd just be scared off of Alienware-which I am anyway...I'm shocked that even the build quality is garbage. I don't get the point of that 15x thing. Dell's 1730 is SOOOO much better built, and it's higher end, for basically the same price. Those Gateway models seem to be a lot better built too, for at least $1000 less (or worse...)
cheetah2k - Monday, September 1, 2008 - link
Anandtech, you call this a "gaming laptop round-up"??Wheres the almighty Dell 1730 with dual 8800GTX's in all its glory? The little girls to scared to come out to play??
Who wants an Alienware, Gateway or Sagem-blahh??? Build quality and service is just shocking....
Get a grip fellas
JarredWalton - Monday, September 1, 2008 - link
We reviewed that http://www.anandtech.com/mobile/showdoc.aspx?i=324...">six months ago. Dell hasn't updated it to support the 9800M (yet?), but otherwise it would be very comparable in performance to the Sager unit. The Sager is still a bit faster because of the desktop CPU, and it consumes a bit more power and is a bit heavier. The Dell is also more expensive because of the cost of mobile CPUs, so if you want i.e. an X9000, it's over 3X the cost of an E9500. Since both weigh a lot and cost a lot, you might as well get the fractionally larger Sager/Clevo.cheetah2k - Monday, September 1, 2008 - link
I understand you reviewed the 1730 6+months ago (and I bought one based on that review with the extreme CPU and SLi 8800GTX's) however some of us would like to see how it still stacks up to the competition, and being a "round-up" and all, I think it makes sense to include it, even if its just for old time sake.JarredWalton - Tuesday, September 2, 2008 - link
I did mention the laptop, and there are a few games where we tested on both laptops. However, we don't generally get to hang onto $5000 laptops for a long time, so I can't just go back and retest the M1730. In terms of performance, the Sager is going to be slightly faster on the CPU, but overall gaming performance is a tie. If I were to pick between the two now, I would probably go with the Sager for the high-end, because price is a bit cheaper for the same level of performance. Plus you can run quad-core if you want (though that's not really useful for games). I'd be much more likely to go with the Gateway units for the price, but obviously the Dell and Sager are over twice as fast in most games.SniperWulf - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
While I agree with you on the astetics of the P series, its price/performance ratio and upgradability are unmatched at the moment. A few months back, I picked up a 6860FX and have been nothing but pleased with it. I've replaced the CPU with a used X7800 ES, and swapped the hard drives for 2x Hitachi 200GBs in a Raid 0 array.I didn't do it all at the same time of course, but thats the beauty of it. Whenever you need a lil bit more horsepower, all you have to do is just shop around for parts
Kardax - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
I took a chance and got a P-7811 a couple weeks ago. Its stability has been rock-solid, even after hours of intense load.My only complaint would be that the keyboard has a Bluetooth enable/disable option, but there's apparently no Bluetooth hardware inside...
JarredWalton - Friday, August 29, 2008 - link
Hi guys,I'm *sure* there are typos in the article (or errors in speech recognition). I've spent most of the past two days trying to finish all the writing and graphs, so go easy on me while I get some sleep. In the meantime, if you want to point out errors, reply to this post and we'll (eventually) correct them. Hopefully, none of the issues "ruin" the article for you or make it "unreadable". ;-)
Good night,
Jarred Walton
Senior Editor