Hi people i have read reviews of the following LCD's HP W2408,Acer G24 and Asus MK24. I cant seem to find which is the best of all.My main uses would PC games, Movies and internet browsing. Please guys i am to order one of the by tuesday.. Please Help
I research purchases pretty hard - and I've been trying to figure out what display to buy for quite some time. I've read every article and comparison I could get my eyes on.
In the end, I wanted a monitor - not a tv or blu-ray display my Sony LCD can take care of that. I settled on the Soyo DYLM24D6 for $300 at OfficeMax. It is outstanding. A non-TN 24" display with NO backlight bleed for $380 out the door with a very good OfficeMax two year warranty. I realize they have had some production issues with some - but this thing is perfect and with the OfficeMax policy, if there is something wrong, take it back and they hand you another - for a value screen it cannot be beaten.
I was researching into LCDs a bit recently, and figured that they had come down in price a lot since I bought my Dell 2005FPW so it might be time to pickup a cheap secondary 20", or a 24".
I couldn't believe the slew of TN panels on the market these days. It seems like monitors with equivalent LCDs to the S-IPS panel in the Dell haven't come down in price at all, just the budget market has been filled in with inferior display technology.
Looking at the viewing angle on my laptop (which I'm guessing is TN), I couldn't see any way I'd be happy with that as a main or secondary monitor. I guess with the laptop I must subconsciously adjust the orientation and pitch so it looks alright.. doubt that would work with a large monitor. Sideways tilted viewing like this HP offers would also give a bit of an odd effect, as both eyes would be seeing different brightnesses.
More LCD reviews from AT would definitely be welcome! 32" 1080p TVs reviewed purely as a monitor would also be interesting.. some offer a "game mode" which may eliminate the picture processing latencies mentioned?
Is there any significance to the "08" vs. "07" (in the HP monitor model numbers)?
The w2207 is only available in a glossy surface.
I think I'd prefer a matte anti-glare finish monitor.
Also: are there any rumors Apple monitors being updated for faster response times? Thanks.
Don't know about Apple, but Dell is supposed to be coming out with a bunch of new models. I'd assume the w2207 vs. w2408 is a case of the w2408 being a bit newer - maybe some minor updates to firmware? Anyway, these two HP displays are glossy, and I definitely understand that a lot of people prefer matte - I know I do. I've got another 24" I'm working on reviewing next which should be more in the realm of what I think a 24" LCD should offer.
I like my w2207, and use the portrait mode (rotating issues with the cables are easy to prevent once you do it a few times). But, the viewing angle becomes a bit of an issue, even then. I just can't imagine a 24" being worth it, using such a panel, at any price. At this size, it's begging for a *VA, even if it means being a $700 monitor.
On quality:
It really is too bad that for the most part LCDs are getting cheaper at the expense of quality these days. I recently purchased a 24" Acer that was on sale for under $300.00 and I took it back the next day. My archaic 17" LCD was WAY better overall than that.
On the issue of review units: (Comment/question for AT)
Are you somehow not permitted to buy your own test units? So many companies have lavish return policies, what would be the big deal? I'm thinking Best Buy, Circuit City etc. You know, the places we're still most likely to get a monitor from.
I think very highly of Anandtech, and I guess I imagine it being an extremely profitable site. I hope I'm not wrong there. In any case, it seems very strange to me to have such a prestigious site at the whim of manufacturers.
I could not for the life of me find a review on said 24" Acer, and the only thing it did was make me buy it and return it. If not full reviews, perhaps AT could concatenate a list of which monitors use what kind of panel and some expert "at a glance" comments.
I am kind of baffled by new LCDs on the market, I'm not too impressed so far actually. I use a 24" LG that is now $450 at best buy and it seems to me to be a fantastic deal at that price.
I believe you should drop monitor reviews. Reviewing a couple of monitors a year (not even belonging to "desirable" category) is not very helpful to your readers.
The truth is, there’s not even one site out there serious about reviewing costumer-grade monitors, and the main reason for that situation is the one you have mentioned yourself: manufacturers don’t send their products to reviewers.
And why is that? I suspect most of them have too much to hide.
I would love to find on AnandTech a 24 inchers shoot-out broke into two categories: cheap TN panels and more expensive IPS & PVA. Shoot-out of 22 inchers would be useful to even greater number of readers. And why not a quick take on several wide screen 20 inchers...
You wouldn’t have to go too much in-depth in these reviews. Some basic tests and subjective evaluation of text, video and games usage would be enough. I bet people trust your ability to pick up a winner.
Now, in reality there is only one possibility for all these to happen. You need a big retailer to supply you with monitors. I’m sure it would be very beneficial for them, because they would have professional evaluation of products they’re carrying (they could stock more of highly rated monitors and sell them like hot rolls), and gain a positive reputation for helping their customers to choose the right product.
But maybe in IT world this kind of cooperation is just not possible for some reasons. I don’t know, why don’t you enlight us?
It's partly an issue of getting enough reviews done so that more manufacturers are willing to work with us on monitor reviews. Things take time, and sometimes we go through periods where nothing new comes out for a while. I've got at least a few more LCDs coming shortly, and I hope many more post-CES will get sent our way for review.
IPS panels are the best for all things. some s-pva or mva's are close competitors to ips but still have colour errors and colour washout on angles over 20 degrees from center.
tn panels shouldnt be priced higher than 350 dollars. one could get an almost 0 lag (15-19ms) 24" s-pva panel from LG and be more pleased for gaming and general use for 500 dollars.
i paid a grand for my 26" 1920x1200 H-IPS panel from planar. it is incredibly clear and accurate and has less than 1 frame lag. spending 550 dollars on a tn panel vs 900 dollars on a IPS pro fessional panel... sux cant see the point/value.
Have you lurked in the xtknight's LCD thread at the forums?
Perhaps you might get ideas about what people seek from reviews and what kind of LCDs they seek.
For me it seems that there are more interesting LCD models out there than reviews of LCDs. Pretty much the opposite situation when compared to GPUs or other less subjective review targets.
Anandtech LCD reviews seem a bit bare for me, as there are less measurements than in some other LCD review sites. It is difficult to say if reviewers at the other sites measure things that I would notice though, or if the extra measurements just generate artificial desires. Input lag measurements at behardware or RTC error measurements at xbitlabs are interesting, for example, but I don't know if I would be bothered by less than ideal results in actual use.
PS. The old comment system was better - no need to load/reload the article page when browsing comments.
The simple answer is that in my opinion:
S-IPS > S-PVA > S-TN/TN+Film
TN panels often have lower stated response times, but frankly I can't see the difference. I can however see the difference between the two in viewing angles and color quality.
I know it should go without saying (and usually does) but thanks for another great review that is so clearly unbiased. Just seems to me that if Anandtech is having a hard time getting manufacturers to send LCDs for review, handing out a negative article on the first offering is probably not going to encourage other manufacturers to follow suite. But the truth is the truth, and particularly after recent high profile events on other sites its nice to get a little reminder of the quality we can enjoy here.
(This probably is coming across all doe-eyed fanboyish.. meh. It's just really nice to have trust worthy info sources)
The LG L246WP-BN is a P-MVA panel... it's beautiful and doesn't seem to exhibit some of the colour shifting that some PVA panels do. It'll be either that or Dell's next 24" for my next LCD.
I recommend it at the $450.00 price tag. I own this display and I am very pleased with it overall. I vastly prefer the HDMI/DVI input as opposed to VGA on this particular display (some displays you literally can't tell the difference, not so on this panel).
It is WORLDS better than the cheapish 24" Samsung. Samsung is building an overinflated name for itself... that or they are seriously risking their brand name over some "too good to be true" products (they really aren't good when you get them home).
I more than ever depend on review sites and user comments to help me navigate the sea of available products. I personally believe that the Dell is superior to the LG 24", however, the LG is more readily available at retail stores and a fantastic deal at $449.00.
I would like to see how HP plans to really markey this screen costing what it does and doing so litle for its return really. Right now though I am using my HP 42" Plasma as a monitor. I can honestly say it looks much nicer than the LCD equivalent. It would be nice to see something between the 42 and 26 size range though.
$570? I paid around that price a year ago for a Dell 2407. I got an S-PVA panel, additional inputs (component, s-video), 9-in-1 card reader, 4 USB ports, and I got the five-year warranty.
If HP thinks they can sell that panel for $570, they need to think again. 6-bit color, poorer viewing angle, limited inputs --you can do better for your money.
1) Question to AT - when do you guys intend to review any of the latest 28" LCD monitors? There are at least two of them at newegg, ViewSonic and Hanns-G
2) Question to AT readers - have anyone tried to use something like 37" Westinghouse LCD TV (1920x1080) with their PC as a main monitor? I've got a buddy who has Mac Mini connected to such a TV and he swears this TV is the best monitor one can dream about. Could someone share their experience?
3) Question to AT - do you guys think about revieweing say 37" Westy as a PC monitor? Test response, color, tell us what the panel is (TN film I suppose?) - all the usual tests.
I'm thinking about upgrading to widescreen, and since 1080p Westys are so cheap these days (especially 37" one) I'm seriously considering them too, so please please share your experience if you have one, thanks!
I'm kind of puzzled why AT ahven't realized such an obvious thing as using Westy 1080p as the main PC monitor, why no reviews, nothing... they just review eithet uberduperexpensive 2560x1600 panels, or some smaller cheapo ones like 24" - and no 28? No 37" TV? No 42" or 47" TV? I'm talking about 1080p LCD TVs here.
That's just weird - there must be something wrong with using those TVs as PC monitors or else we'd seen such a review from AT a loong time ago, I guess...
"when do you guys intend to review any of the latest 28" LCD monitors? There are at least two of them at newegg, ViewSonic and Hanns-G"
I've got the Hanns-G 28" monitor from Costco earlier this month and absolutely love it. First of all, because it is Costco, I have a lifetime, full money back, satisfaction guarantee and it only cost $499 which of course is much less than this 24". It also can be used as a full HD 1080p monitor as it has HDMI hookup.
The monitor itself has been great. I use it quite a bit for gaming and no complaints so far but I must admit I am no expert monitor reviewer either. It replaced my old Dell 20" widescreen.
I have a 40 inch Samsung 1080p which I use as a monitor but not as a day to day one, personally I think it's just far too physically big for that. To use it properly I need to sit a fair distance back, it's normally only for placing back media and occasionally photo work.
If I could get dual DVI out of my laptops (can't find a cheap dual link DVI PCI card to use in their dock) I'd pick up a 30 inch Dell - personally that's the upper limit on size for using as a monitor.
I have the Westy lvm-37w1 in my living room. While I haven't used it primarily as a PC monitor, the times that I have it has been perfect: absolutely beautiful at 1080p over either DVI or VGA. Using it to upscale DVD's playing on my laptop Dell D810 (VGA) is fantastic. HD sample footage and playback from hdhomerun (OTA) look amazing as well.
The biggest flaw in this monitor is the backlight bleed in the corners, obvious when watching DVD's, but not a problem for PC use.
I'm eventually going to replace this in the living room with a better TV for movie & TV use, but this one will be kept busy as well.
Actually, it's really just an issue of getting companies to send us product for review. LCDs aren't cheaper, and neither are HDTVs. Westinghouse sent me their 42" 1080p display back in July. Unfortunately, UPS wasn't a good shipping choice. I noticed the box had a rip, and it turned out that the panel inside was shattered. They never did offer to send me another test unit for some reason. After trying to get one for testing for ~8 months only to have it damaged in shipping, I'm not holding my breath for seeing another any time soon.
That said, CES is in January and I will be doing my best to hit up all of the display companies to see about getting some review samples sent my way. I'd love to be able to do a roundup of 24", 22", 27", etc. LCDs, though for roundups I'll have to trim down some of the writing and graphs in order to keep things manageable most likely.
Here's a question in return: Out of the stuff I'm currently discussing in display reviews, what do you find good, what do you find lacking? I'd like to do color gamut testing, but I don't have the hardware for that right now. I don't even know how big of a difference it is for most users - I mean, side-by-side I can see color differences between various displays, but using each individually, it's a lot more difficult to say which is better.
The one problem with HDTVs as computer displays appears to be in regards to signal processing. Some displays do extra work (i.e. deinterlacing, noise reduction, whatever) and they introduce noticeable lag - around 50ms I've heard. There's also the issue of finding room on your desk for a 37" or 42" display... I've got a 30" LCD and it's almost too big at times. HDTVs don't have height, tilt, pivot, or rotate features either, or USB ports on most. They probably end up best for movie/video use, good for gaming, and not so great for standard office work.
If I get one for review, I'll see what I can say about it, but honestly reviewing such hardware is a daunting task. Do we review as an HDTV with computer options, as a computer display with TV options, both? I can do the computer display review, but HDTV reviews aren't something I feel really qualified to handle.
[quote]Do we review as an HDTV with computer options, as a computer display with TV options, both?[/quote]
Review it as a "multimedia monitor". Something that can be used for multiple purposes. Right now, I'm using a 24" BenQ FP241VW, which is self proclaimed the "ultimate gaming PC monitor". It's connected to my C2D box, a 360, PS3 and some cable TV. As a gaming monitor it's decent, but all the extra features it has are absolutely useless in every aspect. For console gaming it leaves a LOT to be desired - my games look slightly washed out and like they're running in 16-bit color. Bioshock 360 looked really bad in dark areas. And as TV it's average as can be.
Now, in comparison...
I used to use a Viewsonic 32" LCD TV (1366x768) for my PC, console gaming and TV. Despite the resolution, I always felt it did everything great. Games, movies, computing. Blacks were so-so, but colors were great and it had a superb response time.
And that's what got me. My dedicated "gaming" monitor was only really really useful as as monitor, yet the cheap LCD TV I got was great at everything. So the aspect of having a monitor good at multiple forms of media (PC, consoles, TV) is really the selling point for an enthusiast like myself.
I have an OTA HD tuner hooked up to a component input on my Gateway FPD 2485W. Watching similar content (NFL football) is quite comparable between this and a friend's 40" 1080p Bravia. The Bravia is a touch sharper (probably better video processing) but otherwise there is nothing that stands out without the two side-by-side.
And on a side not I'm glad my Gateway has the extra inputs, as I did not own the tuner when I bought the monitor but was able to hook the tuner up without needing a component-to-VGA converter or anything.
>Out of the stuff I'm currently discussing in display reviews,
>what do you find good, what do you find lacking?
I have no major complaints, maybe this info is a bit technical for me (I'm no photographer so I don't care much about precise color calibration) but other ppl will disagree for sure, hence I wouldn't change anything. The only thing that does lack is the AMOUNT of monitors to test, but since it's out of your hands and UPS is such a POS (they broke my MP3 player screen as well, and haven't paid for it, bastards!!!) I understand I can't complain, so... nothing to say here, very good job, very detailed and everything - probably just leave it as is for now.
>The one problem with HDTVs as computer displays appears to be
>in regards to signal processing. Some displays do extra work
>(i.e. deinterlacing, noise reduction, whatever) and they
>introduce noticeable lag - around 50ms I've heard.
Does it apply to HDMI and DVI inputs as well? Or is it only about VGA/S-Video/Component/Composite stuff, i.e. analog inputs?
>Do we review as an HDTV with computer options, as a computer
>display with TV options, both? I can do the computer display
>review, but HDTV reviews aren't something I feel really
>qualified to handle.
I thought as a computer geek oriented review site you should definitely focus on a PC side of the HDTV device. Probably just ignore its analog inputs altogether, test only DVI and HDMI, I mean treat it as just another PC monitor. Given its restrictions with regard to ergonomics write about where would you put it on your tabel, how far would you seat from it, how legible the text is, etc etc.
Why I think so? Because there are many other consumer electronics review sites, and you should not repeat their job. Let them look at the analog inputs and TV reception and stuff like that. You should solely focus on gaming and response, viewing angles, ergonomics for PC user, maybe Mac user too? Anand has a Mac or two, he can give you some imput, right? ;-)
I'd suggest to start with 37" Westinghous and after you do it we'll see if those 37+ inch behemoths are worth even considering.
Here's the story of my buddy that might give you more perspective on that. He was a self-assembly PC guy, but then he caught that Mac bug, and soon PC is gone and he's sitting in front of his new 37" Westinghouse (he bought a lower table for it and a new gamer armchair, also a lowered one - he loves perfect ergonomics. So he has Mac Mini connected to it, wireless keyboard, mouse, and he also has Xbox 360 for games (he doesn't miss PC games at all, given latest Xbox blockbusters like assassin creed and such) - so that's an interesting way to use huge monitor/TV to do a) Xbox HD gaming b) PC/Mac stuff, like all that web email and whatever, on his Mini, connected to the same TV as Xbox of course, using just keyboard insted of gamepad.
Here you can see an interesting approach, where the old big PC box was replaced by two smaller boxes, one is specialized home computer (Mac) and the other is the specialized gaming device (Xbox 360) sharing same 37" Westy TV. This is something I'd like to hear about from you, I mean add some stuff about ergonomics as well.
Yeah, sounds not that geeky, huh? Not sure you should do it that way - but I just noticed the latest trends that people start to think more and more about comfort and ergonomics when working with PC so old big boxes get replaced with notebooks/macbooks/consoles, and big 37" monitor/TV plays iportant role here.
Ah, this guy also has Xbox 360 HD-DVD, naturally, so his TV is not only for gaming and computer/Unix work (he's Unix admin by occupation), but also for watching HD-DVD movies in 1080p.
There ya go, food for thought. Hoewever if you wanna stay hardcore technical and avoid ergonomics, Macs and such - sure, no problem with that :-)
400-450cd/m2 for the 24" models but the 30's are always 300-350. STILL keeps me happily using 24's, but it's a shameful mark on 30" models and their cost.
I really appreciate your effort that you made in writing this blog. Thanks for sharing such an useful & relevant information with us about HP w2408: A "New" Twist on 24" LCDs. To get more information i suggest you to read this blog once: https://www.hptechnicalsupportphonenumbersusa.com/...
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wagaduku - Sunday, November 9, 2008 - link
Hi people i have read reviews of the following LCD's HP W2408,Acer G24 and Asus MK24. I cant seem to find which is the best of all.My main uses would PC games, Movies and internet browsing. Please guys i am to order one of the by tuesday.. Please Helpbolwin1 - Monday, January 14, 2008 - link
I research purchases pretty hard - and I've been trying to figure out what display to buy for quite some time. I've read every article and comparison I could get my eyes on.In the end, I wanted a monitor - not a tv or blu-ray display my Sony LCD can take care of that. I settled on the Soyo DYLM24D6 for $300 at OfficeMax. It is outstanding. A non-TN 24" display with NO backlight bleed for $380 out the door with a very good OfficeMax two year warranty. I realize they have had some production issues with some - but this thing is perfect and with the OfficeMax policy, if there is something wrong, take it back and they hand you another - for a value screen it cannot be beaten.
wagoo - Sunday, January 6, 2008 - link
I was researching into LCDs a bit recently, and figured that they had come down in price a lot since I bought my Dell 2005FPW so it might be time to pickup a cheap secondary 20", or a 24".I couldn't believe the slew of TN panels on the market these days. It seems like monitors with equivalent LCDs to the S-IPS panel in the Dell haven't come down in price at all, just the budget market has been filled in with inferior display technology.
Looking at the viewing angle on my laptop (which I'm guessing is TN), I couldn't see any way I'd be happy with that as a main or secondary monitor. I guess with the laptop I must subconsciously adjust the orientation and pitch so it looks alright.. doubt that would work with a large monitor. Sideways tilted viewing like this HP offers would also give a bit of an odd effect, as both eyes would be seeing different brightnesses.
More LCD reviews from AT would definitely be welcome! 32" 1080p TVs reviewed purely as a monitor would also be interesting.. some offer a "game mode" which may eliminate the picture processing latencies mentioned?
vailr - Wednesday, December 26, 2007 - link
Is there any significance to the "08" vs. "07" (in the HP monitor model numbers)?The w2207 is only available in a glossy surface.
I think I'd prefer a matte anti-glare finish monitor.
Also: are there any rumors Apple monitors being updated for faster response times? Thanks.
JarredWalton - Wednesday, December 26, 2007 - link
Don't know about Apple, but Dell is supposed to be coming out with a bunch of new models. I'd assume the w2207 vs. w2408 is a case of the w2408 being a bit newer - maybe some minor updates to firmware? Anyway, these two HP displays are glossy, and I definitely understand that a lot of people prefer matte - I know I do. I've got another 24" I'm working on reviewing next which should be more in the realm of what I think a 24" LCD should offer.Cerb - Monday, December 24, 2007 - link
I like my w2207, and use the portrait mode (rotating issues with the cables are easy to prevent once you do it a few times). But, the viewing angle becomes a bit of an issue, even then. I just can't imagine a 24" being worth it, using such a panel, at any price. At this size, it's begging for a *VA, even if it means being a $700 monitor.gochichi - Monday, December 24, 2007 - link
On quality:It really is too bad that for the most part LCDs are getting cheaper at the expense of quality these days. I recently purchased a 24" Acer that was on sale for under $300.00 and I took it back the next day. My archaic 17" LCD was WAY better overall than that.
On the issue of review units: (Comment/question for AT)
Are you somehow not permitted to buy your own test units? So many companies have lavish return policies, what would be the big deal? I'm thinking Best Buy, Circuit City etc. You know, the places we're still most likely to get a monitor from.
I think very highly of Anandtech, and I guess I imagine it being an extremely profitable site. I hope I'm not wrong there. In any case, it seems very strange to me to have such a prestigious site at the whim of manufacturers.
I could not for the life of me find a review on said 24" Acer, and the only thing it did was make me buy it and return it. If not full reviews, perhaps AT could concatenate a list of which monitors use what kind of panel and some expert "at a glance" comments.
I am kind of baffled by new LCDs on the market, I'm not too impressed so far actually. I use a 24" LG that is now $450 at best buy and it seems to me to be a fantastic deal at that price.
complectus - Sunday, December 23, 2007 - link
All of the Color Accuracy (Delta E) graphs are an utter mess. Can anyone actually read them without going blind?SoBizarre - Sunday, December 23, 2007 - link
I believe you should drop monitor reviews. Reviewing a couple of monitors a year (not even belonging to "desirable" category) is not very helpful to your readers.The truth is, there’s not even one site out there serious about reviewing costumer-grade monitors, and the main reason for that situation is the one you have mentioned yourself: manufacturers don’t send their products to reviewers.
And why is that? I suspect most of them have too much to hide.
I would love to find on AnandTech a 24 inchers shoot-out broke into two categories: cheap TN panels and more expensive IPS & PVA. Shoot-out of 22 inchers would be useful to even greater number of readers. And why not a quick take on several wide screen 20 inchers...
You wouldn’t have to go too much in-depth in these reviews. Some basic tests and subjective evaluation of text, video and games usage would be enough. I bet people trust your ability to pick up a winner.
Now, in reality there is only one possibility for all these to happen. You need a big retailer to supply you with monitors. I’m sure it would be very beneficial for them, because they would have professional evaluation of products they’re carrying (they could stock more of highly rated monitors and sell them like hot rolls), and gain a positive reputation for helping their customers to choose the right product.
But maybe in IT world this kind of cooperation is just not possible for some reasons. I don’t know, why don’t you enlight us?
SoBizarre - Sunday, December 23, 2007 - link
Something else I forgot to say:MERRY WINTER SOLSTICE and a HAPPY NEW YEAR!
JarredWalton - Sunday, December 23, 2007 - link
It's partly an issue of getting enough reviews done so that more manufacturers are willing to work with us on monitor reviews. Things take time, and sometimes we go through periods where nothing new comes out for a while. I've got at least a few more LCDs coming shortly, and I hope many more post-CES will get sent our way for review.GlassHouse69 - Saturday, December 22, 2007 - link
IPS panels are the best for all things. some s-pva or mva's are close competitors to ips but still have colour errors and colour washout on angles over 20 degrees from center.tn panels shouldnt be priced higher than 350 dollars. one could get an almost 0 lag (15-19ms) 24" s-pva panel from LG and be more pleased for gaming and general use for 500 dollars.
i paid a grand for my 26" 1920x1200 H-IPS panel from planar. it is incredibly clear and accurate and has less than 1 frame lag. spending 550 dollars on a tn panel vs 900 dollars on a IPS pro fessional panel... sux cant see the point/value.
nevbie - Saturday, December 22, 2007 - link
Have you lurked in the xtknight's LCD thread at the forums?Perhaps you might get ideas about what people seek from reviews and what kind of LCDs they seek.
For me it seems that there are more interesting LCD models out there than reviews of LCDs. Pretty much the opposite situation when compared to GPUs or other less subjective review targets.
Anandtech LCD reviews seem a bit bare for me, as there are less measurements than in some other LCD review sites. It is difficult to say if reviewers at the other sites measure things that I would notice though, or if the extra measurements just generate artificial desires. Input lag measurements at behardware or RTC error measurements at xbitlabs are interesting, for example, but I don't know if I would be bothered by less than ideal results in actual use.
PS. The old comment system was better - no need to load/reload the article page when browsing comments.
9nails - Saturday, December 22, 2007 - link
What is "TN"?How about "S-PVA"?
Bonus question: How do the two differ / which is better?
JarredWalton - Saturday, December 22, 2007 - link
Well, I could try to explain it, but wikipedia already has a good deal of data on the matter. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thin_film_transistor_...">This Film TransistorsThe simple answer is that in my opinion:
S-IPS > S-PVA > S-TN/TN+Film
TN panels often have lower stated response times, but frankly I can't see the difference. I can however see the difference between the two in viewing angles and color quality.
trajan - Saturday, December 22, 2007 - link
I know it should go without saying (and usually does) but thanks for another great review that is so clearly unbiased. Just seems to me that if Anandtech is having a hard time getting manufacturers to send LCDs for review, handing out a negative article on the first offering is probably not going to encourage other manufacturers to follow suite. But the truth is the truth, and particularly after recent high profile events on other sites its nice to get a little reminder of the quality we can enjoy here.(This probably is coming across all doe-eyed fanboyish.. meh. It's just really nice to have trust worthy info sources)
KorruptioN - Friday, December 21, 2007 - link
The LG L246WP-BN is a P-MVA panel... it's beautiful and doesn't seem to exhibit some of the colour shifting that some PVA panels do. It'll be either that or Dell's next 24" for my next LCD.gochichi - Monday, December 24, 2007 - link
I recommend it at the $450.00 price tag. I own this display and I am very pleased with it overall. I vastly prefer the HDMI/DVI input as opposed to VGA on this particular display (some displays you literally can't tell the difference, not so on this panel).It is WORLDS better than the cheapish 24" Samsung. Samsung is building an overinflated name for itself... that or they are seriously risking their brand name over some "too good to be true" products (they really aren't good when you get them home).
I more than ever depend on review sites and user comments to help me navigate the sea of available products. I personally believe that the Dell is superior to the LG 24", however, the LG is more readily available at retail stores and a fantastic deal at $449.00.
agull22 - Friday, December 21, 2007 - link
I would like to see how HP plans to really markey this screen costing what it does and doing so litle for its return really. Right now though I am using my HP 42" Plasma as a monitor. I can honestly say it looks much nicer than the LCD equivalent. It would be nice to see something between the 42 and 26 size range though.LoneWolf15 - Friday, December 21, 2007 - link
$570? I paid around that price a year ago for a Dell 2407. I got an S-PVA panel, additional inputs (component, s-video), 9-in-1 card reader, 4 USB ports, and I got the five-year warranty.If HP thinks they can sell that panel for $570, they need to think again. 6-bit color, poorer viewing angle, limited inputs --you can do better for your money.
Pirks - Friday, December 21, 2007 - link
1) Question to AT - when do you guys intend to review any of the latest 28" LCD monitors? There are at least two of them at newegg, ViewSonic and Hanns-G2) Question to AT readers - have anyone tried to use something like 37" Westinghouse LCD TV (1920x1080) with their PC as a main monitor? I've got a buddy who has Mac Mini connected to such a TV and he swears this TV is the best monitor one can dream about. Could someone share their experience?
3) Question to AT - do you guys think about revieweing say 37" Westy as a PC monitor? Test response, color, tell us what the panel is (TN film I suppose?) - all the usual tests.
I'm thinking about upgrading to widescreen, and since 1080p Westys are so cheap these days (especially 37" one) I'm seriously considering them too, so please please share your experience if you have one, thanks!
I'm kind of puzzled why AT ahven't realized such an obvious thing as using Westy 1080p as the main PC monitor, why no reviews, nothing... they just review eithet uberduperexpensive 2560x1600 panels, or some smaller cheapo ones like 24" - and no 28? No 37" TV? No 42" or 47" TV? I'm talking about 1080p LCD TVs here.
That's just weird - there must be something wrong with using those TVs as PC monitors or else we'd seen such a review from AT a loong time ago, I guess...
timmiser - Friday, December 28, 2007 - link
"when do you guys intend to review any of the latest 28" LCD monitors? There are at least two of them at newegg, ViewSonic and Hanns-G"I've got the Hanns-G 28" monitor from Costco earlier this month and absolutely love it. First of all, because it is Costco, I have a lifetime, full money back, satisfaction guarantee and it only cost $499 which of course is much less than this 24". It also can be used as a full HD 1080p monitor as it has HDMI hookup.
The monitor itself has been great. I use it quite a bit for gaming and no complaints so far but I must admit I am no expert monitor reviewer either. It replaced my old Dell 20" widescreen.
Johnmcl7 - Saturday, December 22, 2007 - link
I have a 40 inch Samsung 1080p which I use as a monitor but not as a day to day one, personally I think it's just far too physically big for that. To use it properly I need to sit a fair distance back, it's normally only for placing back media and occasionally photo work.If I could get dual DVI out of my laptops (can't find a cheap dual link DVI PCI card to use in their dock) I'd pick up a 30 inch Dell - personally that's the upper limit on size for using as a monitor.
John
somedude1234 - Saturday, December 22, 2007 - link
I have the Westy lvm-37w1 in my living room. While I haven't used it primarily as a PC monitor, the times that I have it has been perfect: absolutely beautiful at 1080p over either DVI or VGA. Using it to upscale DVD's playing on my laptop Dell D810 (VGA) is fantastic. HD sample footage and playback from hdhomerun (OTA) look amazing as well.The biggest flaw in this monitor is the backlight bleed in the corners, obvious when watching DVD's, but not a problem for PC use.
I'm eventually going to replace this in the living room with a better TV for movie & TV use, but this one will be kept busy as well.
JarredWalton - Friday, December 21, 2007 - link
Actually, it's really just an issue of getting companies to send us product for review. LCDs aren't cheaper, and neither are HDTVs. Westinghouse sent me their 42" 1080p display back in July. Unfortunately, UPS wasn't a good shipping choice. I noticed the box had a rip, and it turned out that the panel inside was shattered. They never did offer to send me another test unit for some reason. After trying to get one for testing for ~8 months only to have it damaged in shipping, I'm not holding my breath for seeing another any time soon.That said, CES is in January and I will be doing my best to hit up all of the display companies to see about getting some review samples sent my way. I'd love to be able to do a roundup of 24", 22", 27", etc. LCDs, though for roundups I'll have to trim down some of the writing and graphs in order to keep things manageable most likely.
Here's a question in return: Out of the stuff I'm currently discussing in display reviews, what do you find good, what do you find lacking? I'd like to do color gamut testing, but I don't have the hardware for that right now. I don't even know how big of a difference it is for most users - I mean, side-by-side I can see color differences between various displays, but using each individually, it's a lot more difficult to say which is better.
The one problem with HDTVs as computer displays appears to be in regards to signal processing. Some displays do extra work (i.e. deinterlacing, noise reduction, whatever) and they introduce noticeable lag - around 50ms I've heard. There's also the issue of finding room on your desk for a 37" or 42" display... I've got a 30" LCD and it's almost too big at times. HDTVs don't have height, tilt, pivot, or rotate features either, or USB ports on most. They probably end up best for movie/video use, good for gaming, and not so great for standard office work.
If I get one for review, I'll see what I can say about it, but honestly reviewing such hardware is a daunting task. Do we review as an HDTV with computer options, as a computer display with TV options, both? I can do the computer display review, but HDTV reviews aren't something I feel really qualified to handle.
Inkjammer - Saturday, December 22, 2007 - link
[quote]Do we review as an HDTV with computer options, as a computer display with TV options, both?[/quote]Review it as a "multimedia monitor". Something that can be used for multiple purposes. Right now, I'm using a 24" BenQ FP241VW, which is self proclaimed the "ultimate gaming PC monitor". It's connected to my C2D box, a 360, PS3 and some cable TV. As a gaming monitor it's decent, but all the extra features it has are absolutely useless in every aspect. For console gaming it leaves a LOT to be desired - my games look slightly washed out and like they're running in 16-bit color. Bioshock 360 looked really bad in dark areas. And as TV it's average as can be.
Now, in comparison...
I used to use a Viewsonic 32" LCD TV (1366x768) for my PC, console gaming and TV. Despite the resolution, I always felt it did everything great. Games, movies, computing. Blacks were so-so, but colors were great and it had a superb response time.
And that's what got me. My dedicated "gaming" monitor was only really really useful as as monitor, yet the cheap LCD TV I got was great at everything. So the aspect of having a monitor good at multiple forms of media (PC, consoles, TV) is really the selling point for an enthusiast like myself.
strikeback03 - Monday, December 24, 2007 - link
I have an OTA HD tuner hooked up to a component input on my Gateway FPD 2485W. Watching similar content (NFL football) is quite comparable between this and a friend's 40" 1080p Bravia. The Bravia is a touch sharper (probably better video processing) but otherwise there is nothing that stands out without the two side-by-side.And on a side not I'm glad my Gateway has the extra inputs, as I did not own the tuner when I bought the monitor but was able to hook the tuner up without needing a component-to-VGA converter or anything.
Pirks - Friday, December 21, 2007 - link
>Out of the stuff I'm currently discussing in display reviews,>what do you find good, what do you find lacking?
I have no major complaints, maybe this info is a bit technical for me (I'm no photographer so I don't care much about precise color calibration) but other ppl will disagree for sure, hence I wouldn't change anything. The only thing that does lack is the AMOUNT of monitors to test, but since it's out of your hands and UPS is such a POS (they broke my MP3 player screen as well, and haven't paid for it, bastards!!!) I understand I can't complain, so... nothing to say here, very good job, very detailed and everything - probably just leave it as is for now.
>The one problem with HDTVs as computer displays appears to be
>in regards to signal processing. Some displays do extra work
>(i.e. deinterlacing, noise reduction, whatever) and they
>introduce noticeable lag - around 50ms I've heard.
Does it apply to HDMI and DVI inputs as well? Or is it only about VGA/S-Video/Component/Composite stuff, i.e. analog inputs?
>Do we review as an HDTV with computer options, as a computer
>display with TV options, both? I can do the computer display
>review, but HDTV reviews aren't something I feel really
>qualified to handle.
I thought as a computer geek oriented review site you should definitely focus on a PC side of the HDTV device. Probably just ignore its analog inputs altogether, test only DVI and HDMI, I mean treat it as just another PC monitor. Given its restrictions with regard to ergonomics write about where would you put it on your tabel, how far would you seat from it, how legible the text is, etc etc.
Why I think so? Because there are many other consumer electronics review sites, and you should not repeat their job. Let them look at the analog inputs and TV reception and stuff like that. You should solely focus on gaming and response, viewing angles, ergonomics for PC user, maybe Mac user too? Anand has a Mac or two, he can give you some imput, right? ;-)
I'd suggest to start with 37" Westinghous and after you do it we'll see if those 37+ inch behemoths are worth even considering.
Here's the story of my buddy that might give you more perspective on that. He was a self-assembly PC guy, but then he caught that Mac bug, and soon PC is gone and he's sitting in front of his new 37" Westinghouse (he bought a lower table for it and a new gamer armchair, also a lowered one - he loves perfect ergonomics. So he has Mac Mini connected to it, wireless keyboard, mouse, and he also has Xbox 360 for games (he doesn't miss PC games at all, given latest Xbox blockbusters like assassin creed and such) - so that's an interesting way to use huge monitor/TV to do a) Xbox HD gaming b) PC/Mac stuff, like all that web email and whatever, on his Mini, connected to the same TV as Xbox of course, using just keyboard insted of gamepad.
Here you can see an interesting approach, where the old big PC box was replaced by two smaller boxes, one is specialized home computer (Mac) and the other is the specialized gaming device (Xbox 360) sharing same 37" Westy TV. This is something I'd like to hear about from you, I mean add some stuff about ergonomics as well.
Yeah, sounds not that geeky, huh? Not sure you should do it that way - but I just noticed the latest trends that people start to think more and more about comfort and ergonomics when working with PC so old big boxes get replaced with notebooks/macbooks/consoles, and big 37" monitor/TV plays iportant role here.
Ah, this guy also has Xbox 360 HD-DVD, naturally, so his TV is not only for gaming and computer/Unix work (he's Unix admin by occupation), but also for watching HD-DVD movies in 1080p.
There ya go, food for thought. Hoewever if you wanna stay hardcore technical and avoid ergonomics, Macs and such - sure, no problem with that :-)
FXi - Friday, December 21, 2007 - link
400-450cd/m2 for the 24" models but the 30's are always 300-350. STILL keeps me happily using 24's, but it's a shameful mark on 30" models and their cost.krti seta - Friday, November 23, 2018 - link
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