Goodness, stop setting such a high bar for pipeline articles. Most of them are just press releases with a dash of generic commentary. Just wait a bit and read AT's in-depth publications like their detailed GPU reviews or deep CPU architecture analysis work if you want extensive content.
The lack of 4TB model shocked me too...that's pretty common among QLC and even TLC drives now with the insane layer density of NAND. It certainly isn't a demand decision so it's probably a supply decision. Corsair, Crucial, Samsung, etc all have 4TB options in their entry-level drives. The Crucial P3 is the one to beat for price imho. Meanwhile Hynix has no 4TB drives that I know of, and WD have many 4TB drives in the Blue and Black line that aren't much more expensive than the P3, so this really seems like a missed opportunity.
In 3 years since I have PCIe 4.0 SSD I have experienced exceeding 300MB transfer rate probably less than 90 minutes in aggregate. 99% of my disk activities involve files too small to engage in sequential transfers involving files in the GBs.
......good for you? Why did you feel the need to share your usage details? Not everything is going to be made for you, although if you're operating with a lot of small files, the high IOPS of higher end drives may still benefit you.
...Is it though? Glad you transfer large videos or databases all day long but most people don't. The performance matrix of PCIe 4.0 SSD or soon PCIe 5.0 SSD is one of those mind boggling numbers just don't translate well into real world performances due to how Windows handle files.
I couldn't tell you exactly how many Intel 660\670 QLC SSD's we have deployed at one client, but it's in the hundreds, mostly 1TB drives but some are 512GB. Zero failures, zero health issues, and while these are basic office PC's and laptops, we are still talking Outlook mailboxes - some OST's exceeding 50GB - and large 100-200GB locally cached OneDrive libraries. It's remarkable how well QLC holds up, and how well the HMB works. Though the 660\670P have a tiny 256MB DRAM cache it is exclusively used to buffer the live indirection table out of the SLC cache.
The spiritual successor, the Solidigm P41 Plus, is essentially identical with some firmware tweaks to support the Hynix-engineered NVMe driver (which ironically works with the 670P in the Solidigm toolbox.)
Great everyday drives. If you copy a terabyte of data to your computer daily it isn't for you but if working with 100GB of daily changes, it would take a minimum of 10 years to hit the 370TB endurance rating. Most user average workloads have 10-20GB of daily writes, meaning these drives would take 50-100 years to hit 370 TBW. A century.
> I couldn't tell you exactly how many Intel 660\670 QLC SSD's we have deployed > Zero failures, zero health issues,
Funny I had exactly the opposite experience. I owned a 660P/1TB and after 1 year of use (mostly linux, but dual boot linux/windows only light workload) I noticed sometimes visual studio builds would be extremly slow - windows task manager showed me the 660P write at 20-30mb/s and was 100% busy. Small spikes in between, but also those very slow phases.
And recently one of my students complained about his laptop's poor performance running docker. Task manager showed SSD busy 100% with just 5-20mb/s write throughput. And device manager revealed it was a 512GB 660p.
So contrary to your experience I met that type of drive only twice, and in both cases - despite reporting great health via SMART - the 660s showed extremly degraded write performance. And yes, both machines had TRIM enabled...
Hello, just an update. Kioxia doesn't have a QLC Die with 176-Layer. They only have under mass production 162-Layer QLC. Which is also 1Tb @ 2400 MT/s Toggle 5.0 using 2 decks of 81-Layers
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artifex - Thursday, March 14, 2024 - link
Since you've stated the line is low-cost, please share that pricing information.PeachNCream - Thursday, March 14, 2024 - link
Goodness, stop setting such a high bar for pipeline articles. Most of them are just press releases with a dash of generic commentary. Just wait a bit and read AT's in-depth publications like their detailed GPU reviews or deep CPU architecture analysis work if you want extensive content.meacupla - Thursday, March 14, 2024 - link
600TBW for 2TB model is very low.That's half of what the SN770 does at the same capacity.
It's also disappointing they don't have a 4TB model.
Samus - Thursday, March 14, 2024 - link
The lack of 4TB model shocked me too...that's pretty common among QLC and even TLC drives now with the insane layer density of NAND. It certainly isn't a demand decision so it's probably a supply decision. Corsair, Crucial, Samsung, etc all have 4TB options in their entry-level drives. The Crucial P3 is the one to beat for price imho. Meanwhile Hynix has no 4TB drives that I know of, and WD have many 4TB drives in the Blue and Black line that aren't much more expensive than the P3, so this really seems like a missed opportunity.wr3zzz - Thursday, March 14, 2024 - link
In 3 years since I have PCIe 4.0 SSD I have experienced exceeding 300MB transfer rate probably less than 90 minutes in aggregate. 99% of my disk activities involve files too small to engage in sequential transfers involving files in the GBs.Dizoja86 - Friday, March 15, 2024 - link
......good for you? Why did you feel the need to share your usage details? Not everything is going to be made for you, although if you're operating with a lot of small files, the high IOPS of higher end drives may still benefit you.wr3zzz - Friday, March 15, 2024 - link
...Is it though? Glad you transfer large videos or databases all day long but most people don't. The performance matrix of PCIe 4.0 SSD or soon PCIe 5.0 SSD is one of those mind boggling numbers just don't translate well into real world performances due to how Windows handle files.Dante Verizon - Friday, March 15, 2024 - link
QLC ? YuckSamus - Friday, March 15, 2024 - link
I couldn't tell you exactly how many Intel 660\670 QLC SSD's we have deployed at one client, but it's in the hundreds, mostly 1TB drives but some are 512GB. Zero failures, zero health issues, and while these are basic office PC's and laptops, we are still talking Outlook mailboxes - some OST's exceeding 50GB - and large 100-200GB locally cached OneDrive libraries. It's remarkable how well QLC holds up, and how well the HMB works. Though the 660\670P have a tiny 256MB DRAM cache it is exclusively used to buffer the live indirection table out of the SLC cache.The spiritual successor, the Solidigm P41 Plus, is essentially identical with some firmware tweaks to support the Hynix-engineered NVMe driver (which ironically works with the 670P in the Solidigm toolbox.)
Great everyday drives. If you copy a terabyte of data to your computer daily it isn't for you but if working with 100GB of daily changes, it would take a minimum of 10 years to hit the 370TB endurance rating. Most user average workloads have 10-20GB of daily writes, meaning these drives would take 50-100 years to hit 370 TBW. A century.
ceisserer - Saturday, March 16, 2024 - link
> I couldn't tell you exactly how many Intel 660\670 QLC SSD's we have deployed> Zero failures, zero health issues,
Funny I had exactly the opposite experience. I owned a 660P/1TB and after 1 year of use (mostly linux, but dual boot linux/windows only light workload) I noticed sometimes visual studio builds would be extremly slow - windows task manager showed me the 660P write at 20-30mb/s and was 100% busy. Small spikes in between, but also those very slow phases.
And recently one of my students complained about his laptop's poor performance running docker. Task manager showed SSD busy 100% with just 5-20mb/s write throughput. And device manager revealed it was a 512GB 660p.
So contrary to your experience I met that type of drive only twice, and in both cases - despite reporting great health via SMART - the 660s showed extremly degraded write performance. And yes, both machines had TRIM enabled...
GabrielFerrazTPU - Friday, March 15, 2024 - link
Hello, just an update. Kioxia doesn't have a QLC Die with 176-Layer. They only have under mass production 162-Layer QLC. Which is also 1Tb @ 2400 MT/s Toggle 5.0 using 2 decks of 81-Layers