$207(USD) for a 280mm/360mm size AIO is on the extremely expensive side. 280mm/360mm typically cost half that, even when sticking to recognizable brands like Deepcool and MSI.
In fact, it is cheaper still to buy an average cost 280/360mm and then attach noctua sterrox fans onto that.
Thanks for the review, it's mostly well done. But I take issue with this statement: "just 32.1 dB(A). To regular human ears, this is entirely inaudible from a distance of one meter." First of all, why say from a distance of one meter, if the measurement is already at one meter?
But most importantly, 32.1dB(A) does not mean entirely inaudible. The hearing threshold for humans is at around 0dB.
And if you want to measure quiet gear, you need a very quiet room and some equipment which can detect very low SPL levels. That's a bit expensive, though, so I feel your pain.
If we assume the measurement was taken completely perfectly (I know this is not reasonable) it is still likely that 32.1 dB(A) is below the noise floor of almost everyone's rooms, rendering it effectively inaudible.
>it is still likely that 32.1 dB(A) is below the noise floor of almost everyone's rooms
No, not at all. With the windows closed, in the evenings, a room is definitely quieter than 32dB(A), unless there's a source of noise present inside. Look at various sound level charts to get an idea, or get a good SPL meter (but as I said, the good ones that measure low are expensive).
For what it's worth, as a suburbanite, I've never been able to do better than 30dB(A). And that was on a snowy night. Otherwise 31dB(A) is the normal floor around here. The experience has been similar for other AT editors.
Living in a rural area, IE where there are few people around, I can tell you that the noise floor here is about 30db. I have measured it with a decibel meter. The noise that enters the house at night is a combination of the cicadas and the road noise from a 2 lane road about 1400ft away. And those cicadas are loud! I should measure how loud someday, but really, it can hurt your ears if you're outside of the house.
You can use a closer distance (eg. 12½cm) & assume at 1m will be much quieter. If ideal then at 12½cm is 18dB louder than at 1m, in reality it maybe 12dB different. At >1m a speaker sounds would drop 6dB per doubling of distance. 2x 24dB of the same sound would be 3dB louder than 1. 2x perceived volume adds 10dB.
In the first paragraph of the Conclusion "Wrapping things up..."
1) I am not sure if the performance description "within the realm of mediocrity" and the assessment "without significantly sacrificing effective heat dissipation" go together. You must have a low initial expectation bar for mediocre to not be a significant sacrifice.
2) While I certainly agree with professionals you included “enthusiasts”? We appear to have different ideas of what constitutes an enthusiast. Is an enthusiast just someone that owns a pc and runs it stock? I feel like we have another low expectation bar here. I am a big believer that everyone has their own use case but unless they are silent pc enthusiasts, I have trouble accepting that “enthusiasts” who significantly prioritize noise to the point of accepting mediocre thermal performance are anything but a niche market.
1) It really is mediocre among AIO water cooling in terms of results so that's 100% reasonable.
2) No one, to my knowledge, has gotten that specific about what constitutes an enthusiast aside from the fact that, in terms of people that own PCs, they are a pack of idiots that are easy to sell googaws to by slapping a fast car, dragon, or a big boob girl on the package in order to pump them for money while they aspire to waste electricity and manufacturing capacity.
right, I wasn't disputing the mediocre, just saying that calling it mediocre than saying that using it isn't sacrificing effective heat dissipation are not congruent thoughts.
Where did "handle" even entered this conversation? Literally every cooler in the chart can handle 340W but without you providing some further context to what you mean, what does that have to do with the price of fish?
Do you know how to read graphs? It's pretty obvious you can read, but can you comprehend what is being said?
Look at the graphs for Maximum fan speed, Core temp, 340W. It says "25.8C delta over ambient". That means, if you're in a 20C room, core temp would be at 45.8C. That would be a good result. If you can't understand that, you need to go back to school.
Yes, I know how to read but that really isn't the question so much as can YOU read, or did you just jump into a random comment to ramble off course? I pointed out that the author called thermal performance mediocre THEN goes on to say, "without significantly sacrificing effective heat dissipation". Those thoughts are not congruent. They do not agree. Pick one, not both. Do you understand what I am saying now, or do you REALLY want to continue shaking your fists at the sky about what it can handle? The performance was never my dispute, the author’s contrary thought expression is. So again I ask you, how does your initial or elaborated comment disagree with my expression that the author’s two thoughts do not belong together? It seems to me that you agree with me as you contend it is a good result, not mediocre as the author stated.
If you were intending to respond to PeachNCream where they said that its performance IS mediocre then there is a handy reply button, and probably always was, after their comment instead.
Please don't drag me into this one. I get what you're saying but I was trying to add a little more context. Modern writers often stop writing, look at a phone, and then resume. That creates disjointed thoughts like the one you highlighted as a bit mismatched. I get it. I even agree to an extent, but I also see the fact that it doesn't really stand out all that much among water-cooled AIOs so it still makes a bit of sense even if its obvious the writer was distracted and no one bothered to do any editing before publication.
I apologize; I'm not attempting to drag you in on the copy edit comments but just trying to point out that IF he was intending to reply to your analysis of the performance then he replied to the wrong posts. Then again, meaculpa has been around the Anandtech block more than a few times so that was probably unnecessary.
1) mediocrity within a range of possible developments for cost or a price (not about technology for a 21. century level of 'heat dissipation')
2) enthusiasts are developers who aim towards impossible setups without (necessarily) being backed with company infrastructures and doing with a limited budget (that's impressive, but getting harder with technology being more diverse and specialized development structures), getting towards lower noise than to be heard within a silent room running full spec or oc tasks could be a lower priority compared to limiting logics&sram&peripherals(&gpu) heat addition from its source (some of it will appear with photon switched transistors within circuits(?, 'fastest demonstrated all-optical switching signal is 900 attoseconds'), but 'enthusiasts' designing optical circuits(?), again a rare niche to meet and worth a price(?) )
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osteopathic1 - Thursday, September 7, 2023 - link
Thanks for the review. I have been looking for an AIO but dont want fancy or RGB festooned devices. This fits the bill.Kevinlangford - Thursday, September 7, 2023 - link
is $207 a good starting point for a cooler?meacupla - Thursday, September 7, 2023 - link
$207(USD) for a 280mm/360mm size AIO is on the extremely expensive side.280mm/360mm typically cost half that, even when sticking to recognizable brands like Deepcool and MSI.
In fact, it is cheaper still to buy an average cost 280/360mm and then attach noctua sterrox fans onto that.
osteopathic1 - Friday, September 8, 2023 - link
Thanks for the head's up.deporter - Thursday, September 7, 2023 - link
Thanks for the review, it's mostly well done. But I take issue with this statement: "just 32.1 dB(A). To regular human ears, this is entirely inaudible from a distance of one meter."First of all, why say from a distance of one meter, if the measurement is already at one meter?
But most importantly, 32.1dB(A) does not mean entirely inaudible. The hearing threshold for humans is at around 0dB.
And if you want to measure quiet gear, you need a very quiet room and some equipment which can detect very low SPL levels. That's a bit expensive, though, so I feel your pain.
evilspoons - Thursday, September 7, 2023 - link
If we assume the measurement was taken completely perfectly (I know this is not reasonable) it is still likely that 32.1 dB(A) is below the noise floor of almost everyone's rooms, rendering it effectively inaudible.meacupla - Thursday, September 7, 2023 - link
Not only that, most consumer grade sound measuring devices only go down to around 30dBA.And then there is the pitch of the sound, which requires a very expensive professional grade device to measure.
deporter - Friday, September 8, 2023 - link
>it is still likely that 32.1 dB(A) is below the noise floor of almost everyone's roomsNo, not at all. With the windows closed, in the evenings, a room is definitely quieter than 32dB(A), unless there's a source of noise present inside. Look at various sound level charts to get an idea, or get a good SPL meter (but as I said, the good ones that measure low are expensive).
Ryan Smith - Friday, September 8, 2023 - link
For what it's worth, as a suburbanite, I've never been able to do better than 30dB(A). And that was on a snowy night. Otherwise 31dB(A) is the normal floor around here. The experience has been similar for other AT editors.ballsystemlord - Saturday, September 16, 2023 - link
Living in a rural area, IE where there are few people around, I can tell you that the noise floor here is about 30db. I have measured it with a decibel meter.The noise that enters the house at night is a combination of the cicadas and the road noise from a 2 lane road about 1400ft away.
And those cicadas are loud! I should measure how loud someday, but really, it can hurt your ears if you're outside of the house.
tygrus - Thursday, September 7, 2023 - link
You can use a closer distance (eg. 12½cm) & assume at 1m will be much quieter. If ideal then at 12½cm is 18dB louder than at 1m, in reality it maybe 12dB different. At >1m a speaker sounds would drop 6dB per doubling of distance. 2x 24dB of the same sound would be 3dB louder than 1.2x perceived volume adds 10dB.
deporter - Friday, September 8, 2023 - link
>You can use a closer distance (eg. 12½cm) & assume at 1m will be much quieter.Yes, sure, but they measured from 1 meter. It says so on page 2.
mr2ns - Friday, September 8, 2023 - link
In the first paragraph of the Conclusion "Wrapping things up..."1) I am not sure if the performance description "within the realm of mediocrity" and the assessment "without significantly sacrificing effective heat dissipation" go together. You must have a low initial expectation bar for mediocre to not be a significant sacrifice.
2) While I certainly agree with professionals you included “enthusiasts”? We appear to have different ideas of what constitutes an enthusiast. Is an enthusiast just someone that owns a pc and runs it stock? I feel like we have another low expectation bar here. I am a big believer that everyone has their own use case but unless they are silent pc enthusiasts, I have trouble accepting that “enthusiasts” who significantly prioritize noise to the point of accepting mediocre thermal performance are anything but a niche market.
PeachNCream - Saturday, September 9, 2023 - link
Counterpoints:1) It really is mediocre among AIO water cooling in terms of results so that's 100% reasonable.
2) No one, to my knowledge, has gotten that specific about what constitutes an enthusiast aside from the fact that, in terms of people that own PCs, they are a pack of idiots that are easy to sell googaws to by slapping a fast car, dragon, or a big boob girl on the package in order to pump them for money while they aspire to waste electricity and manufacturing capacity.
mr2ns - Saturday, September 9, 2023 - link
right, I wasn't disputing the mediocre, just saying that calling it mediocre than saying that using it isn't sacrificing effective heat dissipation are not congruent thoughts.meacupla - Saturday, September 9, 2023 - link
It can handle a 340W load. It's more than enough for desktop CPUs.mr2ns - Saturday, September 9, 2023 - link
Where did "handle" even entered this conversation? Literally every cooler in the chart can handle 340W but without you providing some further context to what you mean, what does that have to do with the price of fish?meacupla - Saturday, September 9, 2023 - link
Do you know how to read graphs? It's pretty obvious you can read, but can you comprehend what is being said?Look at the graphs for Maximum fan speed, Core temp, 340W.
It says "25.8C delta over ambient".
That means, if you're in a 20C room, core temp would be at 45.8C.
That would be a good result.
If you can't understand that, you need to go back to school.
mr2ns - Monday, September 11, 2023 - link
Yes, I know how to read but that really isn't the question so much as can YOU read, or did you just jump into a random comment to ramble off course?I pointed out that the author called thermal performance mediocre THEN goes on to say, "without significantly sacrificing effective heat dissipation". Those thoughts are not congruent. They do not agree. Pick one, not both.
Do you understand what I am saying now, or do you REALLY want to continue shaking your fists at the sky about what it can handle? The performance was never my dispute, the author’s contrary thought expression is. So again I ask you, how does your initial or elaborated comment disagree with my expression that the author’s two thoughts do not belong together? It seems to me that you agree with me as you contend it is a good result, not mediocre as the author stated.
If you were intending to respond to PeachNCream where they said that its performance IS mediocre then there is a handy reply button, and probably always was, after their comment instead.
¿Comprende?
PeachNCream - Tuesday, September 12, 2023 - link
Please don't drag me into this one. I get what you're saying but I was trying to add a little more context. Modern writers often stop writing, look at a phone, and then resume. That creates disjointed thoughts like the one you highlighted as a bit mismatched. I get it. I even agree to an extent, but I also see the fact that it doesn't really stand out all that much among water-cooled AIOs so it still makes a bit of sense even if its obvious the writer was distracted and no one bothered to do any editing before publication.mr2ns - Thursday, September 14, 2023 - link
I apologize; I'm not attempting to drag you in on the copy edit comments but just trying to point out that IF he was intending to reply to your analysis of the performance then he replied to the wrong posts. Then again, meaculpa has been around the Anandtech block more than a few times so that was probably unnecessary.back2future - Saturday, September 9, 2023 - link
1) mediocrity within a range of possible developments for cost or a price (not about technology for a 21. century level of 'heat dissipation')2) enthusiasts are developers who aim towards impossible setups without (necessarily) being backed with company infrastructures and doing with a limited budget (that's impressive, but getting harder with technology being more diverse and specialized development structures), getting towards lower noise than to be heard within a silent room running full spec or oc tasks could be a lower priority compared to limiting logics&sram&peripherals(&gpu) heat addition from its source (some of it will appear with photon switched transistors within circuits(?, 'fastest demonstrated all-optical switching signal is 900 attoseconds'), but 'enthusiasts' designing optical circuits(?), again a rare niche to meet and worth a price(?) )