Micron D1α = 14nm | density 0.241Gb/mm² | die size 66.26mm² (DDR5-4800 16Gb chip) Micron D1β = ?nm | density "35% better density than D1α" | die size? (the claim is 15% better power efficiency compared to D1α, and is used in LPDDR5) Micron D1γ = ???
I can't even find the relevant data for Micron D1β, but if it wants to compete for smallest die size in 2025, surely it has to be smaller than Samsung's 12nm?
The Greek letter dram nodes do not correspond to specific logic nodes, but for what it's worth Samsung has branded all of their nodes since 2016 as "10nm equivalent".
D1β is most likely 12 nm (0.0013 um2), if going by the 35% density increase. Samsung already had to change its capacitor dielectric for 12 nm, so it is getting hard to scale.
I'd like to see Intel and AMD SKUs with HBM myself. No DIMM sockets, just a CPU socket with the RAM integrated ala Apple silicon. Intel would of course triple their already insane number of SKUs but it would be worth it. 14996K, 14964K, 14932K, etc.
But memory on package would also be great. It could take a long time before acceptable amounts are entirely on package for consumer CPUs/APUs. Minimum 8 GB, 16-32 GB preferred. Hopefully Intel's Adamantine can hit 8 GB in a consumer CPU sooner than say, 2030.
It's possible to have RAM in the CPU as well as DIMM slots, or PCIe slots, if needed. If you don't need something smaller than Mini-ITX, you are probably going to get 2 memory slots, unless DIMM form factors go away. But we will see at least a DDR6 standard in desktops.
China represents about 15% of Micron's revenue, however even that is misleading as the ban is for use in certain government and infrastructure spaces, not in all of the country and the vast majority of Micron's business in China is not even with Chinese companies, it's with western countries using Micron memory in computers they assemble in China, which are not subject to the ban.
Until China clarifies what it applies to this means little, but even a worst case reading puts it at around 1-3% of the business per reports.
If that applies to all manufacturing, hopefully, then it would be way over 60%. That is not just China market. That is any OEM manufacturing in China. That would be good. US should take a taste of its own medicine. And Micron should suffer no less than ZTE and Huawei.
It does not apply to all markets or products not destined for the Chinese market. It's only Chinese infrastructure, such as telcomm. They have zero ability to tell third party companies what brand of SSD or memory they can use in their products, and are not attempting to do so as it would hasten the move of OEM's out of the country.
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meacupla - Friday, May 19, 2023 - link
Micron D1α = 14nm | density 0.241Gb/mm² | die size 66.26mm² (DDR5-4800 16Gb chip)Micron D1β = ?nm | density "35% better density than D1α" | die size? (the claim is 15% better power efficiency compared to D1α, and is used in LPDDR5)
Micron D1γ = ???
I can't even find the relevant data for Micron D1β, but if it wants to compete for smallest die size in 2025, surely it has to be smaller than Samsung's 12nm?
saratoga4 - Friday, May 19, 2023 - link
The Greek letter dram nodes do not correspond to specific logic nodes, but for what it's worth Samsung has branded all of their nodes since 2016 as "10nm equivalent".Anymoore - Saturday, May 20, 2023 - link
D1β is most likely 12 nm (0.0013 um2), if going by the 35% density increase. Samsung already had to change its capacitor dielectric for 12 nm, so it is getting hard to scale.nandnandnand - Saturday, May 20, 2023 - link
It's about time for 3D DRAM.Duwelon - Saturday, May 20, 2023 - link
I'd like to see Intel and AMD SKUs with HBM myself. No DIMM sockets, just a CPU socket with the RAM integrated ala Apple silicon. Intel would of course triple their already insane number of SKUs but it would be worth it. 14996K, 14964K, 14932K, etc.nandnandnand - Sunday, May 21, 2023 - link
I was referring to 3D DRAM on DIMMs: http://www.businesskorea.co.kr/news/articleView.ht... which is going to be the key to reducing cost per bit.But memory on package would also be great. It could take a long time before acceptable amounts are entirely on package for consumer CPUs/APUs. Minimum 8 GB, 16-32 GB preferred. Hopefully Intel's Adamantine can hit 8 GB in a consumer CPU sooner than say, 2030.
It's possible to have RAM in the CPU as well as DIMM slots, or PCIe slots, if needed. If you don't need something smaller than Mini-ITX, you are probably going to get 2 memory slots, unless DIMM form factors go away. But we will see at least a DDR6 standard in desktops.
regsEx - Monday, May 22, 2023 - link
Very unlikely now. After China ban Micron will likely bankrupt. They are losing probably way over 60% of revenue.Reflex - Monday, May 22, 2023 - link
China represents about 15% of Micron's revenue, however even that is misleading as the ban is for use in certain government and infrastructure spaces, not in all of the country and the vast majority of Micron's business in China is not even with Chinese companies, it's with western countries using Micron memory in computers they assemble in China, which are not subject to the ban.Until China clarifies what it applies to this means little, but even a worst case reading puts it at around 1-3% of the business per reports.
regsEx - Monday, May 22, 2023 - link
If that applies to all manufacturing, hopefully, then it would be way over 60%. That is not just China market. That is any OEM manufacturing in China. That would be good. US should take a taste of its own medicine. And Micron should suffer no less than ZTE and Huawei.Reflex - Wednesday, May 24, 2023 - link
It does not apply to all markets or products not destined for the Chinese market. It's only Chinese infrastructure, such as telcomm. They have zero ability to tell third party companies what brand of SSD or memory they can use in their products, and are not attempting to do so as it would hasten the move of OEM's out of the country.