> though its configuration is unknown and we have no idea whether ROG Ally uses what's just a semi-custom configuration of one of AMD's Phoenix APUs, or if indeed uses a truly custom-designed SoC with certain perks exclusive for the console.
There's no way they could tape out a new chip and make this thing profitable. Some call the Deck chip "fully custom" but (because of a Videocardz leak in 2020, search for "Videocardz Van Gogh") I think its a repurposed laptop chip too.
Apparently Asus mentioned close integration with Gamepass... which is smart, as Microsoft essentialy culls and verifies controller supper for Asus here.
They also mentioned Armory Crate as the interface, which is *NOT* great. AC is an absolute pig on my ROG laptop, and (with an alternative to control power states) battery life shoots up with it uninstalled. That is going to be even more dramatic in the Ally, which doesn't have the TDP budget to burn power on background junk like a dGPU laptop does.
The Steam Deck very much is a custom SoC as it uses Zen 2 CPU bits with RDNA 2 GPU and a custom memory controller. Chips and Cheese did an analysis on it and went over the varying parts of the SoC.
While the Ally has no reason to be as custom given that it's using all modern pieces it could easily be a lower end 6 core CPU combined with the full GPU which isn't a configuration AMD sells.
Interesting thing about the Steam Deck/PS5/XboxSeries is that they are all "custom" with RDNA2/Zen2(laptop) chips .. it's almost like AMD had a standard design and offered variants of it to different buyers with different core/CU counts.
Nothing odd there. What is odd is that they never made it available to consumers directly (or non console hardware makers afaik) - and stuck with GCN up to 2021. Not sure why..
It's likely that AMD wanted to refine the RDNA architecture and drivers before offering that as a custom option for all of the non-console hardware makers.
I dont think this is true either. The PS5 and XSX have tons of really weird, very nonstandard accelerators baked into them.
I think Renoir (Ryzen 4000) was "old" which is why it was GCN: RDNA2 was just not ready for Windows yet.
Cezzane (Ryzen 5000) seemed like a low cost Renoir tweak, with conspicuous empty area in the die around where they "swapped" the Zen 3 cores in. Maybe switching to RDNA2 would have required a full redesign, which is exactly what Rembrandt is.
AMD desperately needed OEM prebuilt money, and OEMs want iGPs, and they want stagnant platforms. AMD's chipsets were mostly drop-in replacements even if you did pair Ryzen generation with chipset generation, with minimal change. That means the iGP was staying the same architecture basically no matter what.
Cezanne might've been an adaptation of Renoir -- my alternate theory is that it was an adaptation of Rembrandt backported with DDR4 and Vega for the sake of delivering an OEM product (which then became useful with GPU prices as direct-to-consumer, especially with backlash over Ryzen 4000 being OEM-only at first).
Ryzen 4000 Renoir then gets rebranded to Ryzen 5000 with some clock tweaks on the low end, and Rembrandt slots in at the top of Ryzen 5000 high end laptops (and doesn't ship to desktop).
My theory stems from that Rembrandt's "uncore" (for lack of a better word) is both late and underperforming expectations, which is by no coincidence where Zen 4 has struggled on desktop re: memory controller, and is the primary differentiator between Cezzane (shipped arguably ahead of schedule, in high volume and seemingly-high yields) and Rembrandt (low volume, will probably sell more total units as Ryzen 7000 than 6000).
The PS5 CPU core features a cut down FPU, but I don't believe the Xbox one is much different from the desktop Zen 2 CPUs. AMD does these custom designs all the time and it just varies how big the differences are. They do custom variants for laptop OEMs fairly regularly which tend to have very small differences.
Those usually just had different clocks on the CPU side, but sometimes different graphics configuration so these were maybe binned die, but I'm not familiar enough with vega to say one way or another on that part.
Its not though, as a slide from 2020 in that Videocardz article shows it as a low power laptop part alongside Cezzane.
This is pure speculation on my part, but I think laptop OEMs passed on it, but Valve swooped in and picked it up because it was *exactly* what they needed.
I get why you'd think that, but it doesn't actually make sense when you put together all of the parts. It's a Zen 2 mobile CPU based part with RNDA2 graphics (which weren't available in any AMD SoC yet) with a bandwidth optimized LPDDR5x memory controller (no other part used this either). The configuration only makes sense for a low powered graphics optimized product and given that the only thing it appeared in is the Steam Deck it's safe to say this was driven by Valve.
But what about Dragon Crest, which was supposed to be a Van Gogh sucessor and a contemporary to Rembrandt? Why would AMD plan that if Valve didn't even know the Deck would succeed?
The leaker describes it as a "Premium APU," which to me means an APU for media heavy small laptops and tablets that ultimately never materialized.
Many details of the 2020 leak (including Van Gogh/Rembrandt specs) were panned out, other than some apparent cancelations, so I am willing to put stock in that leak.
This is an interesting piece of hardware. Especially with the external GPU dock support from the get-go. It's too bad they didn't go with a 16:10 screen, there's enough room in the top/bottom bezels for one (and would make all 4 bezels the same width; it looks lopsided right now).
Hopefully they add some tweaks to the bottom to make it fit the hands. Could be just the pictures, and using bright white plastic, but the bottom looks too flat to be comfortable to hold for hours on end.
This looks like something that could be used/supported for awhile. Wonder how long Asus will support it. Hopefully, they're able to keep the price tag under $1000.
The major point of discussion should be the longevity since x86 hardware is longer life. Be it the Junk consoles like PS4, XB or the better PS3, X360. Esp with PS3/4 &X360 with Jailbreak.
As for Steam Deck it's garbage because the major flaws are - Battery design is L Shape custom with tight glue, and the Heatsink is an abomination. The battery will die, the pathetic battery life cannot be helped at all and without possible user repair it's a joke, the heatsink plate is stupid as if you remove it for SSD upgrade that thing may lose mechanical tolerances and cause issues, then the screws go into that plate onto the shaft of the heatsink design, a total dumpster.
ASUS engineering on Motherboards is already shoddy with their poor QC and their Armory Crate malware junk. ASUS Android OS support is also bad. They ruined their forum software too, check the new ROG forums, absolute destruction of what's left good of ROG brand.
Now this console wannabe, it is not good since it is already having worst ergo and then the whole battery will be same as Steam Deck, the retail market will be poor. Then the lack of Steam Deck like UI and OS. Gamepass is just garbage, since Steam/Proton is light years ahead, it will work even on bootleg copies and relying on UWP is a joke esp with mods etc.
All in all, long story short. Modern portables are just use and throw garbage, be it BGA lapjokes or mobile phones, or portables like Switch and this. Look at past 3DSXL solid battery design, Xbox Series and old Controllers with Li-Ion pack OR Ni-MH AA batteries option that's how "Environment" should be considered for improving longevity and serviceability not this fake garbage use and throw dumpster class hardware selling for $1000+
It would need a decent, reputable reviewer. Also not so interested in the color for something held in-hand. ROG branding is pretty stupid and infantile so there's that. Thumb sticks would need to be hall effect.
We’ve updated our terms. By continuing to use the site and/or by logging into your account, you agree to the Site’s updated Terms of Use and Privacy Policy.
Facebook
Twitter
RSS
18 Comments
Back to Article
brucethemoose - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
> though its configuration is unknown and we have no idea whether ROG Ally uses what's just a semi-custom configuration of one of AMD's Phoenix APUs, or if indeed uses a truly custom-designed SoC with certain perks exclusive for the console.There's no way they could tape out a new chip and make this thing profitable. Some call the Deck chip "fully custom" but (because of a Videocardz leak in 2020, search for "Videocardz Van Gogh") I think its a repurposed laptop chip too.
Apparently Asus mentioned close integration with Gamepass... which is smart, as Microsoft essentialy culls and verifies controller supper for Asus here.
They also mentioned Armory Crate as the interface, which is *NOT* great. AC is an absolute pig on my ROG laptop, and (with an alternative to control power states) battery life shoots up with it uninstalled. That is going to be even more dramatic in the Ally, which doesn't have the TDP budget to burn power on background junk like a dGPU laptop does.
thestryker - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
The Steam Deck very much is a custom SoC as it uses Zen 2 CPU bits with RDNA 2 GPU and a custom memory controller. Chips and Cheese did an analysis on it and went over the varying parts of the SoC.While the Ally has no reason to be as custom given that it's using all modern pieces it could easily be a lower end 6 core CPU combined with the full GPU which isn't a configuration AMD sells.
xol - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
Interesting thing about the Steam Deck/PS5/XboxSeries is that they are all "custom" with RDNA2/Zen2(laptop) chips .. it's almost like AMD had a standard design and offered variants of it to different buyers with different core/CU counts.Nothing odd there. What is odd is that they never made it available to consumers directly (or non console hardware makers afaik) - and stuck with GCN up to 2021. Not sure why..
NeuralNexus - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
It's likely that AMD wanted to refine the RDNA architecture and drivers before offering that as a custom option for all of the non-console hardware makers.brucethemoose - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
I dont think this is true either. The PS5 and XSX have tons of really weird, very nonstandard accelerators baked into them.I think Renoir (Ryzen 4000) was "old" which is why it was GCN: RDNA2 was just not ready for Windows yet.
Cezzane (Ryzen 5000) seemed like a low cost Renoir tweak, with conspicuous empty area in the die around where they "swapped" the Zen 3 cores in. Maybe switching to RDNA2 would have required a full redesign, which is exactly what Rembrandt is.
lmcd - Friday, April 7, 2023 - link
AMD desperately needed OEM prebuilt money, and OEMs want iGPs, and they want stagnant platforms. AMD's chipsets were mostly drop-in replacements even if you did pair Ryzen generation with chipset generation, with minimal change. That means the iGP was staying the same architecture basically no matter what.Cezanne might've been an adaptation of Renoir -- my alternate theory is that it was an adaptation of Rembrandt backported with DDR4 and Vega for the sake of delivering an OEM product (which then became useful with GPU prices as direct-to-consumer, especially with backlash over Ryzen 4000 being OEM-only at first).
Ryzen 4000 Renoir then gets rebranded to Ryzen 5000 with some clock tweaks on the low end, and Rembrandt slots in at the top of Ryzen 5000 high end laptops (and doesn't ship to desktop).
My theory stems from that Rembrandt's "uncore" (for lack of a better word) is both late and underperforming expectations, which is by no coincidence where Zen 4 has struggled on desktop re: memory controller, and is the primary differentiator between Cezzane (shipped arguably ahead of schedule, in high volume and seemingly-high yields) and Rembrandt (low volume, will probably sell more total units as Ryzen 7000 than 6000).
thestryker - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
The PS5 CPU core features a cut down FPU, but I don't believe the Xbox one is much different from the desktop Zen 2 CPUs. AMD does these custom designs all the time and it just varies how big the differences are. They do custom variants for laptop OEMs fairly regularly which tend to have very small differences.brucethemoose - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
The customized laptop variants are not new dies, are they?thestryker - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
Those usually just had different clocks on the CPU side, but sometimes different graphics configuration so these were maybe binned die, but I'm not familiar enough with vega to say one way or another on that part.brucethemoose - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
Its not though, as a slide from 2020 in that Videocardz article shows it as a low power laptop part alongside Cezzane.This is pure speculation on my part, but I think laptop OEMs passed on it, but Valve swooped in and picked it up because it was *exactly* what they needed.
thestryker - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
I get why you'd think that, but it doesn't actually make sense when you put together all of the parts. It's a Zen 2 mobile CPU based part with RNDA2 graphics (which weren't available in any AMD SoC yet) with a bandwidth optimized LPDDR5x memory controller (no other part used this either). The configuration only makes sense for a low powered graphics optimized product and given that the only thing it appeared in is the Steam Deck it's safe to say this was driven by Valve.brucethemoose - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
But what about Dragon Crest, which was supposed to be a Van Gogh sucessor and a contemporary to Rembrandt? Why would AMD plan that if Valve didn't even know the Deck would succeed?The leaker describes it as a "Premium APU," which to me means an APU for media heavy small laptops and tablets that ultimately never materialized.
Many details of the 2020 leak (including Van Gogh/Rembrandt specs) were panned out, other than some apparent cancelations, so I am willing to put stock in that leak.
lmcd - Friday, April 7, 2023 - link
It's a die shrunk Van Gogh. LPDDR5x is just an overclock that AMD validated (it's not even a spec).phoenix_rizzen - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
This is an interesting piece of hardware. Especially with the external GPU dock support from the get-go. It's too bad they didn't go with a 16:10 screen, there's enough room in the top/bottom bezels for one (and would make all 4 bezels the same width; it looks lopsided right now).Hopefully they add some tweaks to the bottom to make it fit the hands. Could be just the pictures, and using bright white plastic, but the bottom looks too flat to be comfortable to hold for hours on end.
This looks like something that could be used/supported for awhile. Wonder how long Asus will support it. Hopefully, they're able to keep the price tag under $1000.
meacupla - Wednesday, April 5, 2023 - link
I see what you mean with a 16:10 screen being a better match with the bezel width.It would also give more screen space for 4:3 screens in emulators.
Dahak - Tuesday, April 11, 2023 - link
I know LTT did a video about this and mentioned it too about the hand fit, but cannot find the time stamphttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9a3oAiN2ik
Silver5urfer - Thursday, April 6, 2023 - link
Everyone talking about the SoC.The major point of discussion should be the longevity since x86 hardware is longer life. Be it the Junk consoles like PS4, XB or the better PS3, X360. Esp with PS3/4 &X360 with Jailbreak.
As for Steam Deck it's garbage because the major flaws are - Battery design is L Shape custom with tight glue, and the Heatsink is an abomination. The battery will die, the pathetic battery life cannot be helped at all and without possible user repair it's a joke, the heatsink plate is stupid as if you remove it for SSD upgrade that thing may lose mechanical tolerances and cause issues, then the screws go into that plate onto the shaft of the heatsink design, a total dumpster.
ASUS engineering on Motherboards is already shoddy with their poor QC and their Armory Crate malware junk. ASUS Android OS support is also bad. They ruined their forum software too, check the new ROG forums, absolute destruction of what's left good of ROG brand.
Now this console wannabe, it is not good since it is already having worst ergo and then the whole battery will be same as Steam Deck, the retail market will be poor. Then the lack of Steam Deck like UI and OS. Gamepass is just garbage, since Steam/Proton is light years ahead, it will work even on bootleg copies and relying on UWP is a joke esp with mods etc.
All in all, long story short. Modern portables are just use and throw garbage, be it BGA lapjokes or mobile phones, or portables like Switch and this. Look at past 3DSXL solid battery design, Xbox Series and old Controllers with Li-Ion pack OR Ni-MH AA batteries option that's how "Environment" should be considered for improving longevity and serviceability not this fake garbage use and throw dumpster class hardware selling for $1000+
PeachNCream - Monday, April 10, 2023 - link
It would need a decent, reputable reviewer. Also not so interested in the color for something held in-hand. ROG branding is pretty stupid and infantile so there's that. Thumb sticks would need to be hall effect.