Hi everyone.
I have removed the gpu clamp from the bottom of the xbox motherboard, there seems to be some blown components, therefore I was hoping there was some good photo's of the motherboard with gpu xclamp removed?? Any help is v much appreciated.
Why was Hypertransport classified as a serial bus? As implemented on K8, it's a 16-bit wide data bus in each direction, so 32 pins in total for data per HT link. Moreover it doesn't have any SERDES logic (serializer/deserializer that converts parallel data to serial data and vice versa). This gives Hypertransport a latency advantage over serial links that require these extra steps, and low latency, as I understand it, was one of the main concerns when developing Hypertransport.
I wondered the same thing. Althought the author is confused on this point he does make a nice comparison between serial and parallel buses.
"Note the clear definition of the traces the clean routing, to the point where you can count the individual data, address and clock lines:"
This statement also is a little misleading since every serial bus that I have looked at (PCIe/SATA/IB) dervives the clock from the data stream. Additionally the address and data are typically sent on the same lines in the form of a packet.
Good article. I'm looking forward to the flurry of xbox 360 hacking that is about to ensue.
I like the inclusion of the little thumbnails with red circles on them. It's a simple yet effective method of communicating just where something is on the motherboard. Props to whoever proposed that idea!
I'm pretty sure that mystery chip is the custom hdtv encoder/scaler created by the old WebTV team for the xbox360. Maybe it has some other functions as well though.
Robbie Bach, the chief Xbox officer, even came down for a visit once to make sure all the WebTV folks stayed aboard and helped with the 360. He knew that they had a lot of options in the valley. One of the chips they designed was a TV encoder that would support the TV-side of the system.
That comparison between serial and parallel on the last page was very informative. Sometimes a picture really does speak for a volume of words. Very cool.
This is a great breakdown of a very custom, sophisticated motherboard. I was wondering if Anandtech could do the same thing with another custom, sophisticatd moetherboard...the one in the Powermac G5. That's got to have some pretty cool features also.
I don't think you can modify it now to run Linux - at least not to run Linux well. The hardware inside doesn't have yet drivers in Linux (while the CPU could be supported right now by Linux, the video probably isn't. The others probably are, but might not identify themselves as the parts they (just like the chips are engraved with Microsoft XBox 360 no matter who produce them)
Yes, playing the game, are ANY games 60 FPS? 30 FPS is the previous gen, we're moving to a new era where all games needs to be 60fps... Namely Bizarre, who keeps saying that their PGr3 game will run at 60 fps... But been so quiet since they said it.. In fact, no one mentions it... Bizarre probably has a NDA on that because people will not buy the game because it didn't hit 60fps.
All kidding aside, it is interesting to see the ways the board designers try to make all the traces the same length from the GPU to the memory. It also shows that the technology is so fast, that slight differences in the amount of time it takes the signal to travel can cause errors.
They are just like physical copper wires and those lines are not there for beauty either. Some lines carry data and others transmit the various levels of power (voltage) needed to run the components. These are the lines that keep every thing on and connected to each other.
Power can be provided using two complete layers- one for ground, one for power. With the added benefit that, if they separate layers with data connections (those nice lines), they reduce interference between signals on different layers.
A pc with a similar spec to the xbox would cost at least 3 times as much, probably more. And to play multiplayer games you would need another pc per person.
3 times the price of an xbox360 isnt that much really. Especially when you think about the tenfold possibilites you have with a PC compared to a console. These arguments just dont cut it. If you can get the games you want to play on the PC you work with, no point in buying a console. If you prefer the console style games and dont really care too much about a PC besides browsing and e-mails, stick to the consoles.
If you want the best of both worlds, get both.
I dont own a console because I realized, the games I like to play are simply sub standard as far as playability is concerned on consoles and/or dont exists (yet) and when they do, they play horrible due to other limitations.
The Xbox 360 sold much better than its predecessor, and although not the best-selling console of the seventh generation, it is regarded as a success since it strengthened Microsoft as a major force in the console market at the expense of well-established rivals. https://mcdvoice.me/
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Bally900 - Monday, June 2, 2008 - link
Hi everyone.I have removed the gpu clamp from the bottom of the xbox motherboard, there seems to be some blown components, therefore I was hoping there was some good photo's of the motherboard with gpu xclamp removed?? Any help is v much appreciated.
Kensei - Sunday, November 20, 2005 - link
FYI... have a look at last Friday's WSJ article on the XBox 360. Lots of interesting information on how the XBox is made in China.Kensei
Clauzii - Sunday, November 20, 2005 - link
I think there is too much ´splatter´ on that GPU-tingy..agnot - Saturday, November 19, 2005 - link
Why was Hypertransport classified as a serial bus? As implemented on K8, it's a 16-bit wide data bus in each direction, so 32 pins in total for data per HT link. Moreover it doesn't have any SERDES logic (serializer/deserializer that converts parallel data to serial data and vice versa). This gives Hypertransport a latency advantage over serial links that require these extra steps, and low latency, as I understand it, was one of the main concerns when developing Hypertransport.segfault7 - Sunday, November 20, 2005 - link
I wondered the same thing. Althought the author is confused on this point he does make a nice comparison between serial and parallel buses."Note the clear definition of the traces the clean routing, to the point where you can count the individual data, address and clock lines:"
This statement also is a little misleading since every serial bus that I have looked at (PCIe/SATA/IB) dervives the clock from the data stream. Additionally the address and data are typically sent on the same lines in the form of a packet.
Good article. I'm looking forward to the flurry of xbox 360 hacking that is about to ensue.
TheInvincibleMustard - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
I like the inclusion of the little thumbnails with red circles on them. It's a simple yet effective method of communicating just where something is on the motherboard. Props to whoever proposed that idea!-TIM
icube - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
I'm pretty sure that mystery chip is the custom hdtv encoder/scaler created by the old WebTV team for the xbox360. Maybe it has some other functions as well though.See: http://blogs.mercurynews.com/aei/2005/08/a_walk_th...">http://blogs.mercurynews.com/aei/2005/08/a_walk_th...
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Robbie Bach, the chief Xbox officer, even came down for a visit once to make sure all the WebTV folks stayed aboard and helped with the 360. He knew that they had a lot of options in the valley. One of the chips they designed was a TV encoder that would support the TV-side of the system.
-----------------
yacoub - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
That comparison between serial and parallel on the last page was very informative. Sometimes a picture really does speak for a volume of words. Very cool.mlittl3 - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
This is a great breakdown of a very custom, sophisticated motherboard. I was wondering if Anandtech could do the same thing with another custom, sophisticatd moetherboard...the one in the Powermac G5. That's got to have some pretty cool features also.stmok - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
I'm always curious...We can modify the current Xbox 1 to run Linux...How about the 360? :)Calin - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
I don't think you can modify it now to run Linux - at least not to run Linux well. The hardware inside doesn't have yet drivers in Linux (while the CPU could be supported right now by Linux, the video probably isn't. The others probably are, but might not identify themselves as the parts they (just like the chips are engraved with Microsoft XBox 360 no matter who produce them)Alphafox78 - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
Its way too early for that, the DRM has to be cracked first so uncoded apps can be usedPhantronius - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
You would think Anandtech had never seen a console before judging from the way they rip into them like a 5 year old.ksherman - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
YOU HAVE A YONAH PROCESSOR!?!?!?! is it any good? i guess it would likely be under an NDA...Great article! too bad i cant afford one of these puppies for a while... happy with my BF2 fragging machine for now!
fuzzynavel - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
Nice pair of 360 articles....but have you actually played the damn thing yet!!!!finbarqs - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
Yes, playing the game, are ANY games 60 FPS? 30 FPS is the previous gen, we're moving to a new era where all games needs to be 60fps... Namely Bizarre, who keeps saying that their PGr3 game will run at 60 fps... But been so quiet since they said it.. In fact, no one mentions it... Bizarre probably has a NDA on that because people will not buy the game because it didn't hit 60fps.Calin - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
Yes, I was wondering about that too...mrgq912 - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
I always thought those lines on the motherboards were a design element. Who ever knew it actually carried data.Learn something new on anand everyday. got a love it.
Zirconium - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
All kidding aside, it is interesting to see the ways the board designers try to make all the traces the same length from the GPU to the memory. It also shows that the technology is so fast, that slight differences in the amount of time it takes the signal to travel can cause errors.Googer - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
They are just like physical copper wires and those lines are not there for beauty either. Some lines carry data and others transmit the various levels of power (voltage) needed to run the components. These are the lines that keep every thing on and connected to each other.Calin - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
Power can be provided using two complete layers- one for ground, one for power. With the added benefit that, if they separate layers with data connections (those nice lines), they reduce interference between signals on different layers.Lifted - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
Loading a little faster this time around. Ohh look, pictures!Gigahertz19 - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
Haha 1st post..who carez about X-Box..I got my PCDonegrim - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
A pc with a similar spec to the xbox would cost at least 3 times as much, probably more. And to play multiplayer games you would need another pc per person.DrZoidberg - Monday, November 21, 2005 - link
u dont need another pc for multiplayer, u just need to play online multiplayer games.Griswold - Friday, November 18, 2005 - link
3 times the price of an xbox360 isnt that much really. Especially when you think about the tenfold possibilites you have with a PC compared to a console. These arguments just dont cut it. If you can get the games you want to play on the PC you work with, no point in buying a console. If you prefer the console style games and dont really care too much about a PC besides browsing and e-mails, stick to the consoles.If you want the best of both worlds, get both.
I dont own a console because I realized, the games I like to play are simply sub standard as far as playability is concerned on consoles and/or dont exists (yet) and when they do, they play horrible due to other limitations.
Langley951 - Monday, July 23, 2018 - link
The Xbox 360 sold much better than its predecessor, and although not the best-selling console of the seventh generation, it is regarded as a success since it strengthened Microsoft as a major force in the console market at the expense of well-established rivals. https://mcdvoice.me/