I guess they wanted to make the case that everyone buying this board will use a CPU that cannot be overclocked and that the B550 is "a cut down chipset".
Of course, the reality is that one may use a top of the line CPU (like a 5950X) with a moderate 8-10% OC in which case very solid VRM and good cooling is really useful. This board seems to be targeted at content creators who might use such a setup and the theoretically increased reliability.
Also the B550 is really more or less on par with the X570 overall. With B550 you lose PCIe 4.0 in the chipset but would still have up to 20 PCIe 4.0 lanes from the CPU, which for all intents and purposes will make no difference for 99.9999% of cases.
It does and if there's any limitation there it's either the VRM or the CPU. Having good VRM and associated cooling is always a good idea regardless what that smart-arse above thinks. He's probably learning about CPUs from the "recommended for you" section on Newegg, and random discussions on the internet he doesn't understand, so it doesn't cross his mind that such a board could very well be used with 12/16 core CPUs, OC or not. VRM matters regardless.
Well you were free to make a case and came up with "Uh huh." which was pretty much expected. The only scenario where you can *show* how severely limited this platform would either be ridiculous or simply show you're looking at the wrong platform to begin with.
If the features of the higher-end chipset are superfluous to the intended market for the board, then what is the point of using it except to add unnecessary cost to the BOM? Satisfying pretentious asses like yourself?
Not sure I agree that B550's are a cut down chipset. It's cheaper to make due to pcie 4.0 being absent on the chipset but ASUS probably has to ask some basic questions to make such a product marketable. I try to avoid chipset lanes in most cases no matter the tech and there's plenty very overclockable B550s that I would buy over X570s any day. You have to look at more than than the chipset names.. Are the VRMs solid? Do I have all the USB ports I want... just being X570 doesn't make it better by any stretch of the imagination.
So long as the plastic isn't molded to the fins, it will act as a convection element. It would be best to mount this motherboard vertically (as pictured) to maximize the effect (heat rises)
Wow, I just now noticed that. Thats pretty stupid and is going to hurt thermals while also looking cheap. I'm sure it comes off easily enough but hopefully Asus does better next time.
Its not just chipset but also on VR heatsink(for once on an Asus motherboard there seems to be good surface area for heat dissipitation) that is covered by plastic cover.
> ASUS advertises the B550-Creator as including a 12+2 phase power delivery with teamed power stages ...
Correction:
Asus specifically and deliberately *doesn't* advertize it as "12+2 phases", but "teamed power stages comprised of a 12+2 VRM design". Nowhere in the post is the word "phase" used.
Asus these days doesn't use phase doublers. Instead they team multiple sets of components per phase, so it's still (probably) 6 phases for the main CPU portion of the VRM.
There's nothing inherently wrong with either design, but journalists shouldn't make up or alter the published specs where it's clear that was not what the manufacturer meant (due to the word "teamed"). This is an ongoing problem with motherboard announcements when reporting their VRM setup: replacing "power stage" with the word "phase", as if they meant the same or the numbers were always equal.
ASUS does advertise a 12+2 design because technically, the phases are physically there. This is how motherboard manufacturers have done things for a very long time now. On this particular model, on the official product page, they relate to both, but in both instances, they refer to 12+2. ASUS makes this claim; we do not. That is why I made it clear that ASUS advertises the fact.
In relation to being teamed or using doublers, the phases are physically there. That means vendors can advertise them. If ASUS didn't want to advertise a 12+2 phase delivery for this board (which they do), they could have written it as 6+1 teamed. But they advertise it with 12+2 teamed.
In summing it up, if they meant something, they should have said it. Again, that's why we make sure we onus on the vendor here as they are the ones who are advertising it. Whether that be with teamed power stages or doublers, it's still 12+2 because they are all physically present.
I'm not disputing the "12+2" (power stage) part, but I can't find Asus referring to them as "phases" anywhere.
Two power stages being in different "phases" would require them to be in different phase (in terms of the timing signal from the controller). Teamed ones share the exact same timing (only multiplying the capacity), so are in the same phase.
Having 12+2 power stages does not imply that those are all in distinct phases, which is the exact reason ASUS doesn't even use the word "phase"; If they did they'd have to specify it having 6 phases (for the core portion), which doesn't sound nearly as impressive as "12+2 power stages".
Please check the meaning of the word "phase" as it pertains to wave functions.
So you can output video from your PCI Express graphics card through the Thunderbolt ports. You use a short DisplayPort cable to go from the video card's output port to this port on the motherboard, then your Thunderbolt 5K monitor or Thunderbolt dock will get video properly, while still using the Thunderbolt features.
At some point it'd be nice if Intel's TB team would work with their GPU designers along with AMD and NVidia to design an internal connection standard to replace that external kludge.
Some ASRock motherboards and GPUs used to have internal regular DisplayPort connectors for this purpose (motherboard DP in, GPU DP out), so doesn't require any special connector. Too many of those already.
I think they phased it out because no other manufacturer started doing it, so taking advantage of the feature would require pairing an ASRock motherboard with an ASRock (Radeon) GPU. Not only would they be wasting one of their GPU's DP connectors in a place where most people wouldn't have use for it, the motherboard input would be hard to access using any other manufacturer's (Nvidia-based perhaps) GPU.
DisplayPort input. With Thunderbolt if you want to include a display stream in that connection, you have to run your GPU out to the DisplayPort input on the motherboard. Then, if you use a Thunderbolt dock or display, you can get video out of the Thunderbolt port.
I agree. Even if they need to sacrifice some things (obviously 2x DIMMs and all but one PCIe slot will go) but mounting an M2 on the back or both vertically and/or losing one of the 2.5G ports would still make a legit ITX board. They might still be able to keep the TB4 + 2x2.5G ports if they put the controllers on the underside of the PCB.
But as it is this looks like a really good board and the price isn't ridiculous.
Yes, I'm willing to have some things chopped to make it happen. Do not need two network ports, or 4 dimms. It would be nice to add wifi but not required.
Needs an ASUS board with "Thunderbolt readiness header". Searched for Thunderbolt in my ASUS mobo manual, but nothing came up. Perhaps it's only for x5xx and upwards. I have a 470 board.
Checked out the Gigabyte one (GC-TITAN RIDGE), and it too seems to be tied to Gigabyte mobos. I wonder why. There are 3rd party stuff, but they seem to be crappy compared to these from ASUS and Gigabyte.
The GC-TITAN-RIDGE is a Thunderbolt 3 (not 4) add-in card, but I believe it will work on pretty much any platform. There are reports over at egpu.io of using those cards with Intel Macs, for instance.
Yeah, I have an Asus Zenith II Extreme w Threadripper and desperately want a Thunderbolt card, as I boot Linux from an external SSD (Lacie Rugged SSD Pro, JHL7440 chip), which runs at full Thunderbolt speed on my laptop but is stuck in fallback USB 10gbps mode on my AMD workstation, which sucks. Bring on the TB4 cards already!
This will make a good Audio and Video Workstation with a 16 core Ryzen, a decent GPU if you can find one, a Thunderbolt audio interface and a Thunderbolt video capture and playback device. Glad to see more Thunderbolt especially version 4 support with AMD designs.
Intel is not stopping manufacturers to do so, but I doubt they help them them bringing it to competitor's platform. They just need to comply with the certification and do all the integration work by themselves.
Well Intel released the Maple Ridge Thunderbolt 4/USB4 controller in December 2020, even though all of their CPUs these days come with it integrated, why is that? I think there is enough support to implement the Maple Ridge Controller with AMD Ryzen CPUs plus the certification process makes for a rock solid performance. AMD has recent struggled with USB.
Seeing this, and knowing there are multiple TB3 AM4 motherboards out there, but still no TB3/4 in any AMD Laptop, it seems that intel is doing some tricks to not have TB on AMD laptops. I hope AnandTech can ask deeper with OEMs on why is this.
But regardless of that, this motherboard looks great for workstations, I wonder if they will make a x570 version of it, even though it will not matter.
What you say is true, but it should also be noted that Thunderbolt 4 = USB4 + Thunderbolt 3 Alternate Mode + additional Intel requirements and certification.
USB4 does not require hosts or devices to support Thunderbolt interoperability, whereas Thunderbolt 4 obviously does.
Removing the need for Intel certification means Thunderbolt 3 specific features are optional and the minimum spec is even lower than Thunderbolt 3.
Remember both USB4 and DisplayPort 2.0 are taking advantage of Intel making good on their promise for Thunderbolt 3 to be open and royalty free allowing it to be used as the underlying technology.
The physical layer for DisplayPort 2.0, DisplayPort Alt Mode 2.0, and USB4 is based on Thunderbolt 3.
Thunderbolt 4 = (USB4 + Intel Certification)
Intel certification for Thunderbolt 4 increases the minimum spec over both Thunderbolt 3 and USB4.
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Operandi - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
I appreciate the clean looks.And it may not need it if the VRM is efficient enough but it would be nice to see more surface area on the heatsinks.
Oxford Guy - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
A big VRM is essential when running low-power overclocking-is-pointless CPUs with a cut down chipset.Gothmoth - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
wut?...... is that oxford english?at_clucks - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
I guess they wanted to make the case that everyone buying this board will use a CPU that cannot be overclocked and that the B550 is "a cut down chipset".Of course, the reality is that one may use a top of the line CPU (like a 5950X) with a moderate 8-10% OC in which case very solid VRM and good cooling is really useful. This board seems to be targeted at content creators who might use such a setup and the theoretically increased reliability.
Also the B550 is really more or less on par with the X570 overall. With B550 you lose PCIe 4.0 in the chipset but would still have up to 20 PCIe 4.0 lanes from the CPU, which for all intents and purposes will make no difference for 99.9999% of cases.
So the "worry" is completely unwarranted.
Operandi - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
B550 supports overclocking, do these "Pro Art" boards not support it? Seems like a shame as the board looks up to it.at_clucks - Friday, March 5, 2021 - link
It does and if there's any limitation there it's either the VRM or the CPU. Having good VRM and associated cooling is always a good idea regardless what that smart-arse above thinks. He's probably learning about CPUs from the "recommended for you" section on Newegg, and random discussions on the internet he doesn't understand, so it doesn't cross his mind that such a board could very well be used with 12/16 core CPUs, OC or not. VRM matters regardless.Oxford Guy - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
'Also the B550 is really more or less on par with the X570 overall.will make no difference for 99.9999% of cases'
Uh huh.
at_clucks - Friday, March 5, 2021 - link
Well you were free to make a case and came up with "Uh huh." which was pretty much expected. The only scenario where you can *show* how severely limited this platform would either be ridiculous or simply show you're looking at the wrong platform to begin with.Oxford Guy - Sunday, March 7, 2021 - link
What’s ridiculous is choosing a cut down chipset for a premium board.kyuu - Wednesday, March 10, 2021 - link
If the features of the higher-end chipset are superfluous to the intended market for the board, then what is the point of using it except to add unnecessary cost to the BOM? Satisfying pretentious asses like yourself?Lestdog - Thursday, April 22, 2021 - link
Not sure I agree that B550's are a cut down chipset. It's cheaper to make due to pcie 4.0 being absent on the chipset but ASUS probably has to ask some basic questions to make such a product marketable. I try to avoid chipset lanes in most cases no matter the tech and there's plenty very overclockable B550s that I would buy over X570s any day. You have to look at more than than the chipset names.. Are the VRMs solid? Do I have all the USB ports I want... just being X570 doesn't make it better by any stretch of the imagination.meacupla - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
I like how they put on a big heatsink with decent surface area for the chipset and then proceeded to cover it up with shiny plastic.Drkrieger01 - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
So long as the plastic isn't molded to the fins, it will act as a convection element. It would be best to mount this motherboard vertically (as pictured) to maximize the effect (heat rises)Operandi - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
Wow, I just now noticed that. Thats pretty stupid and is going to hurt thermals while also looking cheap. I'm sure it comes off easily enough but hopefully Asus does better next time.Chaitanya - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
Its not just chipset but also on VR heatsink(for once on an Asus motherboard there seems to be good surface area for heat dissipitation) that is covered by plastic cover.Hul8 - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
> ASUS advertises the B550-Creator as including a 12+2 phase power delivery with teamed power stages ...Correction:
Asus specifically and deliberately *doesn't* advertize it as "12+2 phases", but "teamed power stages comprised of a 12+2 VRM design". Nowhere in the post is the word "phase" used.
Asus these days doesn't use phase doublers. Instead they team multiple sets of components per phase, so it's still (probably) 6 phases for the main CPU portion of the VRM.
There's nothing inherently wrong with either design, but journalists shouldn't make up or alter the published specs where it's clear that was not what the manufacturer meant (due to the word "teamed"). This is an ongoing problem with motherboard announcements when reporting their VRM setup: replacing "power stage" with the word "phase", as if they meant the same or the numbers were always equal.
gavbon - Thursday, March 11, 2021 - link
Hi Hul8.ASUS does advertise a 12+2 design because technically, the phases are physically there. This is how motherboard manufacturers have done things for a very long time now. On this particular model, on the official product page, they relate to both, but in both instances, they refer to 12+2. ASUS makes this claim; we do not. That is why I made it clear that ASUS advertises the fact.
In relation to being teamed or using doublers, the phases are physically there. That means vendors can advertise them. If ASUS didn't want to advertise a 12+2 phase delivery for this board (which they do), they could have written it as 6+1 teamed. But they advertise it with 12+2 teamed.
In summing it up, if they meant something, they should have said it. Again, that's why we make sure we onus on the vendor here as they are the ones who are advertising it. Whether that be with teamed power stages or doublers, it's still 12+2 because they are all physically present.
Hul8 - Friday, March 12, 2021 - link
I'm not disputing the "12+2" (power stage) part, but I can't find Asus referring to them as "phases" anywhere.Two power stages being in different "phases" would require them to be in different phase (in terms of the timing signal from the controller). Teamed ones share the exact same timing (only multiplying the capacity), so are in the same phase.
Having 12+2 power stages does not imply that those are all in distinct phases, which is the exact reason ASUS doesn't even use the word "phase"; If they did they'd have to specify it having 6 phases (for the core portion), which doesn't sound nearly as impressive as "12+2 power stages".
Please check the meaning of the word "phase" as it pertains to wave functions.
akvadrako - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
What is "DP IN" ? That sounds pretty interesting.ajp_anton - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
For the Thunderbolt.lmcd - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
Yea the host system doesn't see that port at all afaik.CharonPDX - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
So you can output video from your PCI Express graphics card through the Thunderbolt ports. You use a short DisplayPort cable to go from the video card's output port to this port on the motherboard, then your Thunderbolt 5K monitor or Thunderbolt dock will get video properly, while still using the Thunderbolt features.DanNeely - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
At some point it'd be nice if Intel's TB team would work with their GPU designers along with AMD and NVidia to design an internal connection standard to replace that external kludge.Hul8 - Sunday, March 7, 2021 - link
Some ASRock motherboards and GPUs used to have internal regular DisplayPort connectors for this purpose (motherboard DP in, GPU DP out), so doesn't require any special connector. Too many of those already.I think they phased it out because no other manufacturer started doing it, so taking advantage of the feature would require pairing an ASRock motherboard with an ASRock (Radeon) GPU. Not only would they be wasting one of their GPU's DP connectors in a place where most people wouldn't have use for it, the motherboard input would be hard to access using any other manufacturer's (Nvidia-based perhaps) GPU.
rickeo - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
DisplayPort input. With Thunderbolt if you want to include a display stream in that connection, you have to run your GPU out to the DisplayPort input on the motherboard. Then, if you use a Thunderbolt dock or display, you can get video out of the Thunderbolt port.wam3001 - Tuesday, July 19, 2022 - link
Wont TB4.0 provide a bi-directional VIDEO and Audio at 30-40 GB/sec for VR helmit sets in the future?Reflex - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
If they would release an mITX version of this with TB4 I would buy it in a heartbeat. Seems like the ultimate AM4 board.darckhart - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
+1Samus - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
I agree. Even if they need to sacrifice some things (obviously 2x DIMMs and all but one PCIe slot will go) but mounting an M2 on the back or both vertically and/or losing one of the 2.5G ports would still make a legit ITX board. They might still be able to keep the TB4 + 2x2.5G ports if they put the controllers on the underside of the PCB.But as it is this looks like a really good board and the price isn't ridiculous.
Reflex - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Yes, I'm willing to have some things chopped to make it happen. Do not need two network ports, or 4 dimms. It would be nice to add wifi but not required.Mr Perfect - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
That rear IO on a mITX would be fantastic.tyger11 - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
Are there any TB4 pcie cards yet?Eliadbu - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.techpowerup.com/2...Desierz - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Needs an ASUS board with "Thunderbolt readiness header". Searched for Thunderbolt in my ASUS mobo manual, but nothing came up. Perhaps it's only for x5xx and upwards. I have a 470 board.Desierz - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Checked out the Gigabyte one (GC-TITAN RIDGE), and it too seems to be tied to Gigabyte mobos. I wonder why. There are 3rd party stuff, but they seem to be crappy compared to these from ASUS and Gigabyte.repoman27 - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
The GC-TITAN-RIDGE is a Thunderbolt 3 (not 4) add-in card, but I believe it will work on pretty much any platform. There are reports over at egpu.io of using those cards with Intel Macs, for instance.29a - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Asrock offers something similar for their boards.Eliadbu - Friday, March 5, 2021 - link
My asus x299 prime deluxe has that header.hubick - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Yeah, I have an Asus Zenith II Extreme w Threadripper and desperately want a Thunderbolt card, as I boot Linux from an external SSD (Lacie Rugged SSD Pro, JHL7440 chip), which runs at full Thunderbolt speed on my laptop but is stuck in fallback USB 10gbps mode on my AMD workstation, which sucks. Bring on the TB4 cards already!KimGitz - Wednesday, March 3, 2021 - link
This will make a good Audio and Video Workstation with a 16 core Ryzen, a decent GPU if you can find one, a Thunderbolt audio interface and a Thunderbolt video capture and playback device.Glad to see more Thunderbolt especially version 4 support with AMD designs.
Eliadbu - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Intel is not stopping manufacturers to do so, but I doubt they help them them bringing it to competitor's platform. They just need to comply with the certification and do all the integration work by themselves.KimGitz - Monday, March 15, 2021 - link
Well Intel released the Maple Ridge Thunderbolt 4/USB4 controller in December 2020, even though all of their CPUs these days come with it integrated, why is that? I think there is enough support to implement the Maple Ridge Controller with AMD Ryzen CPUs plus the certification process makes for a rock solid performance. AMD has recent struggled with USB.Xajel - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Seeing this, and knowing there are multiple TB3 AM4 motherboards out there, but still no TB3/4 in any AMD Laptop, it seems that intel is doing some tricks to not have TB on AMD laptops. I hope AnandTech can ask deeper with OEMs on why is this.But regardless of that, this motherboard looks great for workstations, I wonder if they will make a x570 version of it, even though it will not matter.
danjw - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Thunderbolt 4 = USB4 40GBps + Intel Certification. So, it looks like this will also be the first AMD board supporting USB4!repoman27 - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
What you say is true, but it should also be noted that Thunderbolt 4 = USB4 + Thunderbolt 3 Alternate Mode + additional Intel requirements and certification.USB4 does not require hosts or devices to support Thunderbolt interoperability, whereas Thunderbolt 4 obviously does.
KimGitz - Monday, March 15, 2021 - link
Actually USB4 = (Thunderbolt 3 - Intel certification).Removing the need for Intel certification means Thunderbolt 3 specific features are optional and the minimum spec is even lower than Thunderbolt 3.
Remember both USB4 and DisplayPort 2.0 are taking advantage of Intel making good on their promise for Thunderbolt 3 to be open and royalty free allowing it to be used as the underlying technology.
The physical layer for DisplayPort 2.0, DisplayPort Alt Mode 2.0, and USB4 is based on Thunderbolt 3.
Thunderbolt 4 = (USB4 + Intel Certification)
Intel certification for Thunderbolt 4 increases the minimum spec over both Thunderbolt 3 and USB4.
anad0commenter - Thursday, March 4, 2021 - link
Uh.. PS/2 port? I am confused seeing this in 2021.. Anyone can shed light on the point of it compared to just sticking in a usb m/kb?danjw - Saturday, March 6, 2021 - link
They have lower latency than USB. More a gamer thing, than an artist thing, but often the two are the same.