I was just about to post just that. could it be that short people with small hands are the only ones to complain about flat edged phones (and other things)? those for 4 edges, intelligently chamfered of course, are what give you purchased to hold on to that slippery thing.
I think completely flat edges work better on smaller phones. Mini, 5, 5S, 5C, etc. 4 and 4S as well. Though the 4 and 4S were "technically" flat, they did have the actual back and screen protruding enough to be a stepped approximation of a curved edge.
I still don't understand what makes the iPhone 12 worth ~$850 after tax compared to iPhone 11 that apples website is selling for $640~? Can someone explain?
My biggest gripe with iOS is it kills my previous app pretty fast e.g. I could be watching YouTube or browsing a chrome tab but if I switch to reddit and or then whatsapp and then come back to the chrome or youtube, it'll make likely reload the entire app/page and I lose my progress.
I got tired of the small keyboard on my 2020 iphone SE and was going back and forth between picking iPhone 11 vs iPhone 12 and when I realized the 13 still has the same 4gb RAM, it was an easy decision going for the iphone 11 as both have the same display size and except for the tiny bit faster cpu which I probably wouldn't have noticed browsing chrome or reddit and the oled screen which isn't a big deal.
I couldn't justify spending almost 35-40% more for a tiny tiny upgrade.
What I would love for would be to get a bigger screen size like the pro max but apple has prices those out of my budget and most people's budgets I'd assume.
Your point about iOS is one of the main reasons I don't use an iPhone. I day trade and iOS suspending apps in the background means that I have switched quickly to a trading app to check prices not realising they are totally out of date. Totally useless
That sounds like that particular app doesn't work properly. Apps can refresh in the background, but even if not, why would it take more than a second to update from waking a suspended app?
As with everything it depends on which models your looking and how your looking to buy. If looking at purchasing outright for some of the mvno carriers or prepaid service the 11 is a better deal. If looking at deals with bill pay credits and other incentives it can be very cheap to get a 12.
Sales around Black Friday had the iPhone 12 for free with qualifying trade and bill pay credits....12 Pro for $99 and 12 Pro Max for $199 if you had the right set of circumstances (new line/port-in only for AT&T and Best Buy).
In general year or year performance gains are generally pretty small, it's the two to five year old devices that can see larger performance improvements.....and a fresh battery.
@milkywayer these are some of the reasons that would lead me to pick a 12 over an 11...
1. The iPhone 11 is an LCD screen instead of OLED, with a 2x Retina display and 1792‑by‑828‑pixel resolution at 326 ppi. The 12 is OLED with a 3 pixel per point for 2532-by-1170-pixel resolution at 460 ppi. The OLED allows the screen to be closer to the edge. I would think that is the biggest reason. 2. Significantly better night mode 3. Only 32% more, not 35-40
There are a bunch of other reasons to choose the 12 over the 11, but for me the change from LCD to OLED at MUCH higher pixel resolution and a more durable screen is sufficient.
That being said, I am still on my XS Max and will be waiting for the 13. There were days when I would upgrade my iPhone EVERY year (original all the way through the 4S). As the curve of improvements slowed down I went to every other year (5S, 6S Plus). Now I am on a 3 year tick and the XS Max is plenty good enough for me. I am looking forward to HOPEFULLY some kind of better optical zoom in the iPhone 13. However, if this was my tock year I'd be going for a 12 Pro Max with 256, but if I had to choose between an 11 and a 12 it would be a NO brainer, much more than last year choosing between the 11 and the XR (much more of a valid comparison because they both shared very similar screens). The screen on the 12 is on its own worth the price delta between the 12 and 11.
The 2GB extra RAM on the Pro models have shown in a lot of comparison videos I’ve watched on Youtube that they keep more apps open in the background than a standard Android phone with 12GB RAM. But I hope next year we’ll see 6GB in the normal and 8GB RAM in the Pro models, because I have problems keeping apps open in the background with the 4GB RAM in my 11 Pro Max as well.
I mean, it’s going in a case anyway, the edges and texture of a phone mean nothing if it’s in a case. Which frankly it should be these are like $1000 investments and everybody eventually drops their phone at some point. I’ve been lucky enough to have never broken one, probably because it’s always in a case and I’m not clumsy enough for it to fall on its screen.
The key part here is "mini" - that form factor is totally ok for small phones, but hold the 12 pro max and you can clearly tell it's a lot less comfortable vs the 11 pro max.
I've always preferred the square edges older models to the rounder newer ones myself. Seemed like I had better grip and the phone wasn't about to slip out of my hand.
Exactly, I love the 12 edge, in fact I just went back to iPhones after years using Pixel and Nexus phones partly because I love the "new" old design of flat edges.
That’s how I feel about my 12 Pro Max as well. Yes, it’s big, but the flat edges actually provide a better grip for me. I would actually feel comfortable not using a case at least at home with this phone, which I definitely wouldn’t say about the iPhone 11 Pro Max.
That is a bit irrelevant - since basically no one uses high end phone with no case these days, unless you get a 10pack of them and don't care if you break one, once a month.
This iPhone 12 is really well designed but high cost and released in some countries normally we can buy it online. I want to buy this but it isn't released in my country. I must buy this phone but this time I am so much busy with my office work https://accountancyseekers.co.uk/ here doing work as a marketing executive since 2017.
iPhone 12 LCD screens are much tougher than before, we had cases that glass was intact but LCD under glass was shattered. However we could always fix the problem via https://www.LagaiPhone.se/
The 12 mini hits the sweet spot for design and features this year, and I’m surprised it isn’t selling better (apparently Apple is seeing more demand than expected for the Pro and Max and somewhat less for the 12 and mini).
I agree that the 12 Pro is a bit heavy and the new design isn’t as easy to hold as the 11 Pro. But the mini is only slightly bigger than the original iPhone SE/5/5s, and is the most comfortable phone to hold that I’ve seen in years.
I assume some of it is just that people have gotten accustomed to gargantuan phones over time and it can be a bit of a shock to scale back down. After holding the 12 mini in one hand and my OnePlus 6 in the other, I was certainly hesitant to give up that much screen. It was mostly fond memories of my Essential Phone's form factor that pushed me to choose the mini. My wife on the other hand is eyeing the regular 12 for this exact reason. She's accustomed to the size of her OnePlus 7T and the progressively larger phones that have landed her there.
calleng is completely off base but I do sympathize with Apple being tugged multiple ways here. If 70-80% of owners use a case, well, 20-30% naked is still a LOT. Tens of millions, and reviewers in particular always mention it, and it's what people feel in the store too. So it definitely matters to pay major attention to a quality naked phone experience. Yet that doesn't change a super majority using it with a case, and Apple can't possibly be completely ignoring that either.
"Why bother with a heavier steel variant then" though really is an interesting question give the noticeable weight difference. There are lots of other premium materials, titanium of course but also all sorts of alloys and even ceramics that Apple has worked with in the past. Steel is certainly really versatile and can be very tough, but it's still a curious choice for a company that has tended to pay a lot of attention to weight and hand feel. As you say in the review it's genuinely debatable if it even is more "premium" here, and it's not like Apple doesn't have serious materials chops. They have high end titanium case options for their watches as well.
Apple markets this as the strongest iPhone ever, this is pure BS. The back glass on my iphone12 broke in 3 days. I was putting on boots and the phone fell about 18 inches to a concrete floor. Unbelievable. Apple wants me to pay $100 to fix!!!! The fact is that the iPhone 12, from my experience, is by FAR the most fragile iPhone I've ever owned. Very unhappy that Apple won't even fix their defect. Phone didn't last 3 full days!
They strictly clarify it's for the FRONT glass, most likely they saved upgrading the back glass for the next year model + glass is glass, no matter how strong it is, the wrong angle/force and you are done.
Thanks for the review! I upgraded from an iPhone X to the 12 Pro Max this time around, and have been kicking the tires for a week and a half or so now. SO wanted a 12 Pro regular, and a friend got the plain 12. These days I think the additive improvements over 3-5 generations is probably how must people view these things, year-over-year upgrades, or even every 2 years, seems to quite reasonably be less common (which is a good thing). Coming directly from an X, the changes are quite significant. There are obvious sticker items like improved performance and cameras. But there is also more subtle yet extreme important day-to-day use stuff like the Face ID system being a lot more responsive and accepting more angles and distances now then the generation 1 I had before. Some other disagreement, agreement, and comment:
Disagreement: I think you really missed the mark on how big a deal the new LIDAR sensor is for pro usage (you barely gave it a sentence) and in turn as a differentiator. In fact even though it's early days and rough, I think that might be one of the most significant Pro differentiators in a long time, "pro" here as-in actual contracting to make money. I've been trying it out with magicplan and RoomScanLiDAR and already used it at a project site. Apps like magicplan previously could be paired with bluetooth laser rangers and used that way (and still can of course), but from my testing so far the new built-in lidar does an extremely close and competent job in measuring over shorter distances and details, and you get a pretty passable v1 3D point cloud too for something you get in your pocket all the time for a few hundred extra. I was able to throw together for plans and basic 3D from scratch for a historic hotel and then use that for mockups and renovation deployment way, way better than I'd ever have expected even a year ago from a handheld with this pricing (dedicated laser 3D scan units have been available for a while, and will produce better results more quickly, but are NOT cheap or pocketable). Even the simple AR Measure app suddenly no longer feels gimicky or last resort but actually is usable without my measuring tape in many cases. The whole calibration thing is gone, it's fast, and accurate in my use to at least 1/2" which for bulk is often good enough.
Again definitely early, early days. There are obvious holes in the apps, basic things like import are non-existent, etc etc. Yet even so it's already saved me some money and time in commercial work. As far as professional usage goes, it feels like a bigger leap forward in terms of the phone itself being a tool (vs an interface to other tools) than many things before.
Agreement: I'm glad you highlighted that the new sharp edges are a definite step back in ergonomics. It was what struck me most immediately of course in terms of out-of-box experience. Maybe it works well for the Mini, but even on the regular (let alone the Max) the hand feel stinks compared to the iPhone X/XS/11. The edges really dig in and add to fatigue.
However, some of that can be mitigated with a case, and that leads me to the comment that I strong suspect Apple is now designing the iPhone at least in part around case use. It's been a while since I last looked it up, but in a previous discussion we did some research and it looked like at least 75% (yes, 3/4) of phone users use cases. They're a big source of personalization, not just in terms of looks but adapting the phone to various personal use cases. Obviously drop/scratch protection to a customizable degree depending on whether someone tends to have accidents or works/hobbies in heavier duty environments, but also more exotic stuff like camera lens/telescope attachment (or just plain extra battery).
That being the case (harhar), there a reasons to design the phone with that in mind. The camera bump for example, they extra z-distance is necessitated by the camera modules. But of course Apple could just make the whole phone thicker so that it was still smooth. And if it was expected the phone would be used bare, that'd make sense. But if it's expected it'll usually be in a case, it makes *more* sense to have it as it is now, because the available mm means the end result is something that provides whatever else the owner wants but being thinner, lighter and flush on the back than if it was a case over an already thickened device.
As someone who has never dropped their expensive handheld stuff in 30 someodd years now and previously never bothered with a case, I do kind of miss good old naked devices. But I can't argue with the numbers either. And for the first time with the 12 I feel like a case is a requirement, not just a nice-to-have, it's too sharp and too slippery without it. Of course this makes the use of steel in the Pro even dumber, extra weight for absolutely nothing. I wonder why Apple didn't use titanium instead, they used to do a lot with that material and it seems like it'd let them claim a different "pro" material without so much weight. Oh well.
Incidentally I think the Max might be the least popular model this time around. I was lazy about ordering, didn't bother for a few days. Yet it shipped almost instantly, while I know people who ordered regular 12s/12 Pros much more quickly than me (same channel/phone company) who are still waiting. Would be interesting if Apple breaks things out, the Mini and regular are really compelling this time (which is as it should be!).
Also to add: CreateML (https://developer.apple.com/documentation/createml... is starting to get really impressive, and that Apple has been expending effort to allow it to all stay local rather than dependent on cloud services is useful too. Given the review points out the minimal GPU improvements, it seems like there a implications worth considering given that Apple has chosen to spend a lot of silicon budget on specialized stuff, NN etc instead. At some point I'd like to see more bench marks and articles investigating how that stuff is getting used (even basic simple first party stuff like photo facial recognition), the performance, and what kinds of network dependency and privacy the various iOS/macOS/Android/Windows/Linux implementations have. It's going to be more challenging to to see where silicon budget is yielding gains, but some of that may ultimately matter more than raw CPU/GPU in a lot of day to day and application specific use.
It's always difficult to know just how much of Apple's timing is planned and how much is luck.
I think it's definitely planned that the MAC's this year have the same appearance as always, to reassure most buyers that while techies might get excited about the new internals, this is the same familiar mac as always.
BUT I think it's also clear that the CPU/SoC this year had a very different set of priorities from performance, that it was basically more of the same. Changed where that was easy to do given the new process characteristics, but the emphasis on the stuff required for the mac, secondarily on peak power. I raise this because the corollary to the point I made above is that the best time to change the appearance is precisely when the internals are undergoing their least exciting change...
If I had to guess, my guess would be that Apple has established the line (mini, maybe refreshed every two years; mainstream; pro; pro max) and the design language, for the next four years or so. Get used to these sizes and the squared off edges!
On the flip side the most essential Mac-relevant SoC changes are done. Next year may again be "disappointing" in that the leading edge team will have the many core high end machines as its priority, so while the A15 SoC won't exactly be phoned in, it may still be less than we might hope. On the other hand, as soon as the A16 Apple may be willing to say "OK, Rosetta2 is over for new machines. If a vendor hasn't ported by now, it's not worth our time to keep coddling them". Being able to drop the compatibility stuff [memory ordering, 4kB subpages] will help a bit (less complexity always helps some), and they'll finally be past the huge effort of the transition, so once again performance can get top billing.
Another data point for my theory (this is the appearance for the next four years or so), when do we get an Apple modem? Maybe 2022? Once again that will come in a shell that looks absolutely familiar, like an iPhone has looked for years, so that the fact of getting new technology that the techies are all chattering about won't seem strange and unnerving; what you buy will feel like last year's iPhone.
It was a good run since the OG iPhone launched, but I seem to have lost all interest in replacing smart phones. I've been using an XS Max (~work phone) and an LG V40 (~personal phone) for two years now and I'm still perfectly satisfied with both devices. They both do what I ask of them with little fuss and there just haven't been any new features or phones that have generated more than a passing interest for me.
As someone who would sometimes change phones more than once a year, I've been in a similar place. We are getting to the point of "good enough" performance. Faster is always better, but high end (and even midrange) SOCs are pretty good these days. My 2 year old phone has 8GB of RAM, 256GB of storage, and a nice large display.
I do think this generation of iPhones is interesting for a few reasons though. The Mini doesn't even have a good analogue in the Android world, and I'm excited that premium smaller form factor phones are a thing again.
"The Mini doesn't even have a good analogue in the Android world, and I'm excited that premium smaller form factor phones are a thing again."
it depends on use case. for those who use a smartphone mostly as a phone, then these Godzilla handsets are contraindicated. OTOH, if the use case is mostly watching video on the run, then the Max and similar make the most sense. Steve clearly intended the former, Mr. Market gave him a full body enema by telling him to shove those teeny, tiny thingees.
Well is there any reason why LPDDR5 was not used over the entire lineup (including M1) ? Is there some hidden compromise with LPDDR5 ?
So if CPU is improved quite a bit in regards to efficiency, why the GPU lacks an update ? Is it possible that newer node benefits the CPU more than GPU ?
I heard about new Pro Oleds having better viewing angles. This is something i would greatly appreciate. 11´s Pro do have quite big shifts in white - at screen edges it has greenish, bluish cast. Can somebody describe it a but more ?
I think this generation could be better. But 5G is quite monumental increse in RF complexity and imagining they did it with custom antena designs and thinner designs is quite remarkable. For exemple three mmWave antenas were discoverd so far. One on the side next to the battery, one behind the motherboard and one under the notch on the front.
But on the other hand 5G sucked up all the effort for other upgrades like better bigger cameras, batteries, 120 Hz and so on.
I refuse to believe that the next one is iPhone 13. That is just so unlucky...
I could tell you how good the new 12 Pro Max display is. It is better than Apple MBP16 in both color and brightness stability! 2 weeks in I'm amazed still how good the Pro display is!
Don't like the oversaturated images made indoor. Just too much vibrance and saturation. Looks unnatural. 2.5x telephoto is great outdoors in sunny weather. HDR video capture is mindblowing! Using 1080p30 and 1080p60 - looks great on LG OLED!
It's quite possible that world LPDD5 production capacity was not yet large enough? My GUESS is that the memory controller can handle LPDD5, and the M1X machines will ship with it (and those will be in low enough volume that it's not an issue).
I was surprised that the M1 Macs did not, but presumably Apple concluded it made no engineering sense -- they are clearly fast enough as is, so why not hold something in reserve to make the M1X machines look even better when they ship?
Why do you do camera tests without a SINGLE shot of a human being? You know, because how everyone uses phone cameras to take pictures of people at parties and other social events?
Are you unable to find anyone willing to have photos taken?
Taking pictures of people aren't actually important for the test scenarios: Daylight evaluation is measuring the sensor and software in their ability to balance contrast, dynamic range, shadows, details, and color (and of course there were some people in those pictures)
Low light evaluation is evaluating how well the software can enhance the image without sacrificing color information, creating unusual color casts, capturing details, and balancing the light and darker portions of the pictures.
Right, but that requires you perform a Portrait Mode test, which you just claimed was the least important piece of information here.
You cannot perform a test of the camera's skill at rendering skin tone and texture without also executing the Portrait Mode code, since that is the code that was creating the over-smooth skin texture.
When I'm taking photos of my pizza with my iPhone, I tend to prefer almost any kind of pizza. Meat pizzas, veggie pizzas, thin crust, thick crust, New York-style crust, whatever. Not picky about pizza. Don't really care for Chicago-style, as it's basically just dough and cheese, but other than that, I'm pretty easy to please.
Like I said -- Apple does a (multi-year) tick tock with the guts vs the design. iPhone 6 was the A8 CPU. A7 excitement was housed in the good old familiar A5S case. A8 was very much a catch-up CPU, cleanup, tweak power, nothing exciting; the excitement was in the new phone casing.
But then the next year the A9... 70%+ speed boost! Maybe too much to hope for with the A15 (as I discussed above!) But maybe we can expect ~15..20% IPC for the A15 and then 40..50% overall for the A16 (especially if it transitions to N3).
What the hell? 5S and 6? Who the hell is keeping track of all these models? They suck and they're overpriced, you get the last year's one for $500 or something.
Is there a pending Mate 40 Pro / Kirin 9000 review where all of the numbers for that are coming from? The GPU in particular for that looks very.... not great.
A small error: On the GPU Performance & Power page, the performance drop from 11 Pro to 12 Pro is 64.78 fps to 56.06 fps. The following paragraph lists a 45% performance regression, but that would be comparing the peak performance of 11 Pro to the sustained performance of 12 Pro. 56.06/64.78 = 86.53%. Still a regression, but only ~14%, not 45.
Speaking of the throttling, do the 12 series employ the same graphene layer to disperse the heat as last year iPhones? I haven't seen any indication of using it this time (iFixit didn't mention it), and maybe that's the reason for the lower sustained performance even when the efficiency is better?
No, that doesn't matter at all. The point is that phones are cheap to make, and we should seek an option between $145-300 USD. Not an artificially gimped or overpriced option, or "midrange plus" Samsung phones sold to clueless consumers for $600 or more with inferior specifications. $300 is a good price for a Nexus 5 type phone.
1 - they're still made with a high level of labor input (not so much automation), both the final assembly that most consider 'making the phone' and the same for all the constituent parts all the way down the BoM
2 - they're made with a high level of automation (not so much labor), ditto the rest
in the 1) case, all producers from final assembly down the BoM, can maintain minimum average cost for most levels of output simply by expanding or contracting the labor force, and thus preserve profit
in the 2) case, there's less flexibility to maintain minimum average cost at any level of output, since all that automation has to be paid for no matter the level of output. in fact, the only way to maximize profit is to run that automation 24/7/365, thus spreading capital cost as thinly as possible over maximum output. moving production to still more 'business friendly, labor antagonistic' jurisdictions means there's less and less money to be had by exploiting labor; just not enough in the BoM to exploit.
so, if the BoM for smartphones is closer to 2), it's in the companies interest to maximize output level at all times, thus increasing supply, thus competition for consumers, and thus a lowering of actual sale price.
perhaps one of the AT mavens could look into this?
Just out of curiosity: can you record in 4K60p with Dolby until the storage or the battery runs out, or does the iPhone 12 go into thermal shutdown like so many "action cams"? I know this is a niche question, but maybe you, Andrei, or someone else here has tried it?
I'm really puzzled by what is happening. All reviews on the Internet say how great the battery life of Iphone 12 series is, however in the mean time there are thousands of owners who complain about ridiculously bad battery - drain, 5G battery issues all over the place, yet no one is publicly speaking about it.
Basically every smart phone released since forever has quite a few threads about battery drain problems from some users. You also need to take into account the population size here. I'm sure Apple has sold more than a million units across the range already. My anecdotal rebuttal to anecdotal accounts of problems is that my 12 Mini with the smallest battery has surprised me with how good the battery life is. I skipped charging it a few nights ago and went to sleep with 62%. In the morning it was down to 56%. No low power mode, no turning off any radios, and it was losing less than 1%/hour at idle with all the usual suspects like multiple Gmail accounts, an Exchange account, Facebook etc. setup. Just before midnight the next night it was down to 10%. TL;DR: I think they can all make it through a day of "average" use easily.
There are definitely some 5G issues with this switch to a new modem/radio. I’d think that between Apple and Qualcomm they have enough engineering resources to dial it in.
I understand some members of your staff have problems, but this is ridiculous. In the interests of self preservation, isn't it time to get a GPU review done?
Phones looks simmilar. Difference is much bigger then you picture even it does not look like that in normal use. Let see all differences.
128 GB so real difference is 150 (130) USD 6 GB RAM Telephoto: ƒ/2.0 aperture with OIS 2x optical zoom in, 2x optical zoom out; 4x optical zoom range Digital zoom up to 10x Lidar Night mode portraits enabled by LiDAR Scanner Apple ProRAW Dolby Vision recording up to 60 fps Durable steel frame you do not preffere Brighter display
I think RAM, extra lens with OIS, Lidar and brighter screen can easily justify hugher cost. And 100 USD for Max is really small difference for bigger screen and battery, better image sensor with extra stabilisation when we speak in Apple prices.
I hever had rounded phone so can not comment your feelings from flat edges. ... Sorry I had 3/3GS but it so long time ago and were quite bulky. I would try to compare those phones in cases as many ppl wear them anyway.
Not exciting at all...Personally that move back to the iP4 design is the biggest "upgrade", as I've always felt that to be more premium, just like Razer etc. are all making their laptops more boxy. The camera would be more of a sidegrade.
Outstanding review! Seriously, props to you for not being one of those Apple can do no wrong reviewers.
You hit the nail on the head about the regression to square edges and the fingerprint magnet stainless steel.
The sqaure edges are a massive step backwards. I hate my 12 pro because of it. The stainless looks like garbage and is heavy. I’d prefer alum and rounded edges. When I hold my XS in my hand again it feels amazing compared to the 12 pro.
I feel your review was very accurate and well written. Great job!
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The iPhone 12 made the right-hand button so large and lower down on the side compared to old models that it is almost impossible to pick up or handle the phone without turning it off or taking a photo. It is obnoxious! I hate that about this phone.
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DejayC - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
I find the flat edges of my iPhone 12 mini to be easier to grip on to than the curved edges of the older iPhones.FunBunny2 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
I was just about to post just that. could it be that short people with small hands are the only ones to complain about flat edged phones (and other things)? those for 4 edges, intelligently chamfered of course, are what give you purchased to hold on to that slippery thing.jeremyshaw - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
I think completely flat edges work better on smaller phones. Mini, 5, 5S, 5C, etc. 4 and 4S as well. Though the 4 and 4S were "technically" flat, they did have the actual back and screen protruding enough to be a stepped approximation of a curved edge.xaneo - Saturday, December 26, 2020 - link
I'm jumping onto the flat edges bandwagon, all for it.milkywayer - Wednesday, December 2, 2020 - link
I still don't understand what makes the iPhone 12 worth ~$850 after tax compared to iPhone 11 that apples website is selling for $640~? Can someone explain?My biggest gripe with iOS is it kills my previous app pretty fast e.g. I could be watching YouTube or browsing a chrome tab but if I switch to reddit and or then whatsapp and then come back to the chrome or youtube, it'll make likely reload the entire app/page and I lose my progress.
I got tired of the small keyboard on my 2020 iphone SE and was going back and forth between picking iPhone 11 vs iPhone 12 and when I realized the 13 still has the same 4gb RAM, it was an easy decision going for the iphone 11 as both have the same display size and except for the tiny bit faster cpu which I probably wouldn't have noticed browsing chrome or reddit and the oled screen which isn't a big deal.
I couldn't justify spending almost 35-40% more for a tiny tiny upgrade.
What I would love for would be to get a bigger screen size like the pro max but apple has prices those out of my budget and most people's budgets I'd assume.
Frantisek - Friday, December 4, 2020 - link
I guess very durable screen on 12 can pay for itself.Speedfriend - Sunday, December 6, 2020 - link
Your point about iOS is one of the main reasons I don't use an iPhone. I day trade and iOS suspending apps in the background means that I have switched quickly to a trading app to check prices not realising they are totally out of date. Totally uselessblackcrayon - Thursday, December 10, 2020 - link
That sounds like that particular app doesn't work properly. Apps can refresh in the background, but even if not, why would it take more than a second to update from waking a suspended app?ZGamer - Monday, December 7, 2020 - link
12 Pro models ship with 6GB ram vs 4GB.As with everything it depends on which models your looking and how your looking to buy. If looking at purchasing outright for some of the mvno carriers or prepaid service the 11 is a better deal. If looking at deals with bill pay credits and other incentives it can be very cheap to get a 12.
Sales around Black Friday had the iPhone 12 for free with qualifying trade and bill pay credits....12 Pro for $99 and 12 Pro Max for $199 if you had the right set of circumstances (new line/port-in only for AT&T and Best Buy).
In general year or year performance gains are generally pretty small, it's the two to five year old devices that can see larger performance improvements.....and a fresh battery.
ebernet - Wednesday, December 9, 2020 - link
@milkywayer these are some of the reasons that would lead me to pick a 12 over an 11...1. The iPhone 11 is an LCD screen instead of OLED, with a 2x Retina display and 1792‑by‑828‑pixel resolution at 326 ppi. The 12 is OLED with a 3 pixel per point for 2532-by-1170-pixel resolution at 460 ppi. The OLED allows the screen to be closer to the edge. I would think that is the biggest reason.
2. Significantly better night mode
3. Only 32% more, not 35-40
There are a bunch of other reasons to choose the 12 over the 11, but for me the change from LCD to OLED at MUCH higher pixel resolution and a more durable screen is sufficient.
That being said, I am still on my XS Max and will be waiting for the 13. There were days when I would upgrade my iPhone EVERY year (original all the way through the 4S). As the curve of improvements slowed down I went to every other year (5S, 6S Plus). Now I am on a 3 year tick and the XS Max is plenty good enough for me. I am looking forward to HOPEFULLY some kind of better optical zoom in the iPhone 13. However, if this was my tock year I'd be going for a 12 Pro Max with 256, but if I had to choose between an 11 and a 12 it would be a NO brainer, much more than last year choosing between the 11 and the XR (much more of a valid comparison because they both shared very similar screens). The screen on the 12 is on its own worth the price delta between the 12 and 11.
caribbeanblue - Friday, December 18, 2020 - link
The 2GB extra RAM on the Pro models have shown in a lot of comparison videos I’ve watched on Youtube that they keep more apps open in the background than a standard Android phone with 12GB RAM. But I hope next year we’ll see 6GB in the normal and 8GB RAM in the Pro models, because I have problems keeping apps open in the background with the 4GB RAM in my 11 Pro Max as well.Samus - Wednesday, December 2, 2020 - link
I mean, it’s going in a case anyway, the edges and texture of a phone mean nothing if it’s in a case. Which frankly it should be these are like $1000 investments and everybody eventually drops their phone at some point. I’ve been lucky enough to have never broken one, probably because it’s always in a case and I’m not clumsy enough for it to fall on its screen.crotach - Friday, December 4, 2020 - link
I'm a tall person with massive hands and I prefer flat edged phones :)cha0z_ - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
The key part here is "mini" - that form factor is totally ok for small phones, but hold the 12 pro max and you can clearly tell it's a lot less comfortable vs the 11 pro max.austinsguitar - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
the edges are great at the regular and small sizes. just not okay for the huge phones your 4 foot tall girl friend has. you know.rrinker - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
I've always preferred the square edges older models to the rounder newer ones myself. Seemed like I had better grip and the phone wasn't about to slip out of my hand.RaLX - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Exactly, I love the 12 edge, in fact I just went back to iPhones after years using Pixel and Nexus phones partly because I love the "new" old design of flat edges.Devo2007 - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
That’s how I feel about my 12 Pro Max as well. Yes, it’s big, but the flat edges actually provide a better grip for me. I would actually feel comfortable not using a case at least at home with this phone, which I definitely wouldn’t say about the iPhone 11 Pro Max.cha0z_ - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
I am using 11 pro max from over a year naked, never dropped it or had a feeling I don't have a good grip.Cellar Door - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
That is a bit irrelevant - since basically no one uses high end phone with no case these days, unless you get a 10pack of them and don't care if you break one, once a month.anshelanancy - Wednesday, December 2, 2020 - link
This iPhone 12 is really well designed but high cost and released in some countries normally we can buy it online. I want to buy this but it isn't released in my country. I must buy this phone but this time I am so much busy with my office work https://accountancyseekers.co.uk/ here doing work as a marketing executive since 2017.Byte - Tuesday, December 15, 2020 - link
I kept my X to play games on and found it hurts to hold the X now because the the whole side feels sharp now. Am i weird?Laga Goteborg - Thursday, June 24, 2021 - link
iPhone 12 LCD screens are much tougher than before, we had cases that glass was intact but LCD under glass was shattered. However we could always fix the problem via https://www.LagaiPhone.se/KPOM - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
The 12 mini hits the sweet spot for design and features this year, and I’m surprised it isn’t selling better (apparently Apple is seeing more demand than expected for the Pro and Max and somewhat less for the 12 and mini).I agree that the 12 Pro is a bit heavy and the new design isn’t as easy to hold as the 11 Pro. But the mini is only slightly bigger than the original iPhone SE/5/5s, and is the most comfortable phone to hold that I’ve seen in years.
Bob Todd - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
I assume some of it is just that people have gotten accustomed to gargantuan phones over time and it can be a bit of a shock to scale back down. After holding the 12 mini in one hand and my OnePlus 6 in the other, I was certainly hesitant to give up that much screen. It was mostly fond memories of my Essential Phone's form factor that pushed me to choose the mini. My wife on the other hand is eyeing the regular 12 for this exact reason. She's accustomed to the size of her OnePlus 7T and the progressively larger phones that have landed her there.lmcd - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
I personally think that it's due to upgrade cycle timing -- why buy a 12 mini if you just bought an SE 2020?I think a lot of people in that niche picked up an SE and also are already the type to hold onto their phones longer.
techconc - Monday, December 7, 2020 - link
Agreed. I have the 12 Pro, but after feeling the 12 mini in my hand (and in my pocket), I think I may go mini next time.ikjadoon - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
The Mini is limited to 12W peak MagSafe, unlike “up to 15W” on all the other models.https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211829
Jetcat3 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
12W peak with a 2227 mAh cell is non issue in my opinion.Andrei, in your testing did you notice increased black levels with low APL’s at brightness levels between 0-40%?
ikjadoon - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
I don't think a single person genuinely cares or notices peak charging rates: minutes at best? Though the first page chart is a little incorrect.On displays, I'd be much more interested in power consumption of the two panels, so we can compare with the 11 Pro.
GC2:CS - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Displaymate says peak white is like 10% down compared to 11 Pro.11 Pro was 8% down from the XS but at higher max brightness the efficiency suffers (apple said 15% better isoperf).
That combined with the A14 would pretty much eliminate any fears of downgraded battery life. Unless you turn 5G on.
KPOM - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Still better than what iPhones can draw from normal Qi chargers.calleng - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
All this talk about edges and surface of the phone is bull. Who uses an iphone without a proper case. Maybe apple should make them out of rubber.Andrei Frumusanu - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
If we didn't care about the design then why bother with a heavier steel variant then? I don't care for cases for one and use all my phones naked.zanon - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
calleng is completely off base but I do sympathize with Apple being tugged multiple ways here. If 70-80% of owners use a case, well, 20-30% naked is still a LOT. Tens of millions, and reviewers in particular always mention it, and it's what people feel in the store too. So it definitely matters to pay major attention to a quality naked phone experience. Yet that doesn't change a super majority using it with a case, and Apple can't possibly be completely ignoring that either."Why bother with a heavier steel variant then" though really is an interesting question give the noticeable weight difference. There are lots of other premium materials, titanium of course but also all sorts of alloys and even ceramics that Apple has worked with in the past. Steel is certainly really versatile and can be very tough, but it's still a curious choice for a company that has tended to pay a lot of attention to weight and hand feel. As you say in the review it's genuinely debatable if it even is more "premium" here, and it's not like Apple doesn't have serious materials chops. They have high end titanium case options for their watches as well.
cha0z_ - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
The last pools I saw on the subject (this summer), it was 50% using their phones naked and 50% with a case. ;) the pool had around 40 000 voters.cha0z_ - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Same, used all of my phones totally naked (no case, no screen protector) - all in perfect condition.FunBunny2 - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
from what I gather, most cracked screens are from butt compression due to carrying in back pocket. spongy rubber-ish case won't stop that.iphonebestgamephone - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Look harder and youll see how its not perfect.Unashamed_unoriginal_username_x86 - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
I know it's not as comfortable or sexy, but I hope you put something on when you go outside. I don't want you getting arrested!raemike - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Apple markets this as the strongest iPhone ever, this is pure BS. The back glass on my iphone12 broke in 3 days. I was putting on boots and the phone fell about 18 inches to a concrete floor. Unbelievable. Apple wants me to pay $100 to fix!!!! The fact is that the iPhone 12, from my experience, is by FAR the most fragile iPhone I've ever owned. Very unhappy that Apple won't even fix their defect. Phone didn't last 3 full days!Holliday75 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
You dropped it on concrete ad you blame Apple? LOL.I shot my dog....its the guns fault. I ran a little old lady over. It's the car's fault.
AshlayW - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Why did you shoot your dog? Also, you're probably going to prison now.PickUrPoison - Saturday, December 12, 2020 - link
Don’t you care about the little old lady?!?cha0z_ - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
They strictly clarify it's for the FRONT glass, most likely they saved upgrading the back glass for the next year model + glass is glass, no matter how strong it is, the wrong angle/force and you are done.29a - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
What is unbelievable is you didn't have any protection on your phone and now you're bitching about breaking it.techconc - Monday, December 7, 2020 - link
"The back glass on my iphone12 broke in 3 days."If anything, that shows you how strong the ceramic shield is, since only the front of the phone has the ceramic shield.
zanon - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Thanks for the review! I upgraded from an iPhone X to the 12 Pro Max this time around, and have been kicking the tires for a week and a half or so now. SO wanted a 12 Pro regular, and a friend got the plain 12. These days I think the additive improvements over 3-5 generations is probably how must people view these things, year-over-year upgrades, or even every 2 years, seems to quite reasonably be less common (which is a good thing). Coming directly from an X, the changes are quite significant. There are obvious sticker items like improved performance and cameras. But there is also more subtle yet extreme important day-to-day use stuff like the Face ID system being a lot more responsive and accepting more angles and distances now then the generation 1 I had before. Some other disagreement, agreement, and comment:Disagreement: I think you really missed the mark on how big a deal the new LIDAR sensor is for pro usage (you barely gave it a sentence) and in turn as a differentiator. In fact even though it's early days and rough, I think that might be one of the most significant Pro differentiators in a long time, "pro" here as-in actual contracting to make money. I've been trying it out with magicplan and RoomScanLiDAR and already used it at a project site. Apps like magicplan previously could be paired with bluetooth laser rangers and used that way (and still can of course), but from my testing so far the new built-in lidar does an extremely close and competent job in measuring over shorter distances and details, and you get a pretty passable v1 3D point cloud too for something you get in your pocket all the time for a few hundred extra. I was able to throw together for plans and basic 3D from scratch for a historic hotel and then use that for mockups and renovation deployment way, way better than I'd ever have expected even a year ago from a handheld with this pricing (dedicated laser 3D scan units have been available for a while, and will produce better results more quickly, but are NOT cheap or pocketable). Even the simple AR Measure app suddenly no longer feels gimicky or last resort but actually is usable without my measuring tape in many cases. The whole calibration thing is gone, it's fast, and accurate in my use to at least 1/2" which for bulk is often good enough.
Again definitely early, early days. There are obvious holes in the apps, basic things like import are non-existent, etc etc. Yet even so it's already saved me some money and time in commercial work. As far as professional usage goes, it feels like a bigger leap forward in terms of the phone itself being a tool (vs an interface to other tools) than many things before.
Agreement: I'm glad you highlighted that the new sharp edges are a definite step back in ergonomics. It was what struck me most immediately of course in terms of out-of-box experience. Maybe it works well for the Mini, but even on the regular (let alone the Max) the hand feel stinks compared to the iPhone X/XS/11. The edges really dig in and add to fatigue.
However, some of that can be mitigated with a case, and that leads me to the comment that I strong suspect Apple is now designing the iPhone at least in part around case use. It's been a while since I last looked it up, but in a previous discussion we did some research and it looked like at least 75% (yes, 3/4) of phone users use cases. They're a big source of personalization, not just in terms of looks but adapting the phone to various personal use cases. Obviously drop/scratch protection to a customizable degree depending on whether someone tends to have accidents or works/hobbies in heavier duty environments, but also more exotic stuff like camera lens/telescope attachment (or just plain extra battery).
That being the case (harhar), there a reasons to design the phone with that in mind. The camera bump for example, they extra z-distance is necessitated by the camera modules. But of course Apple could just make the whole phone thicker so that it was still smooth. And if it was expected the phone would be used bare, that'd make sense. But if it's expected it'll usually be in a case, it makes *more* sense to have it as it is now, because the available mm means the end result is something that provides whatever else the owner wants but being thinner, lighter and flush on the back than if it was a case over an already thickened device.
As someone who has never dropped their expensive handheld stuff in 30 someodd years now and previously never bothered with a case, I do kind of miss good old naked devices. But I can't argue with the numbers either. And for the first time with the 12 I feel like a case is a requirement, not just a nice-to-have, it's too sharp and too slippery without it. Of course this makes the use of steel in the Pro even dumber, extra weight for absolutely nothing. I wonder why Apple didn't use titanium instead, they used to do a lot with that material and it seems like it'd let them claim a different "pro" material without so much weight. Oh well.
Incidentally I think the Max might be the least popular model this time around. I was lazy about ordering, didn't bother for a few days. Yet it shipped almost instantly, while I know people who ordered regular 12s/12 Pros much more quickly than me (same channel/phone company) who are still waiting. Would be interesting if Apple breaks things out, the Mini and regular are really compelling this time (which is as it should be!).
Thanks again for the review.
zanon - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Also to add: CreateML (https://developer.apple.com/documentation/createml... is starting to get really impressive, and that Apple has been expending effort to allow it to all stay local rather than dependent on cloud services is useful too. Given the review points out the minimal GPU improvements, it seems like there a implications worth considering given that Apple has chosen to spend a lot of silicon budget on specialized stuff, NN etc instead. At some point I'd like to see more bench marks and articles investigating how that stuff is getting used (even basic simple first party stuff like photo facial recognition), the performance, and what kinds of network dependency and privacy the various iOS/macOS/Android/Windows/Linux implementations have. It's going to be more challenging to to see where silicon budget is yielding gains, but some of that may ultimately matter more than raw CPU/GPU in a lot of day to day and application specific use.name99 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
It's always difficult to know just how much of Apple's timing is planned and how much is luck.I think it's definitely planned that the MAC's this year have the same appearance as always, to reassure most buyers that while techies might get excited about the new internals, this is the same familiar mac as always.
BUT I think it's also clear that the CPU/SoC this year had a very different set of priorities from performance, that it was basically more of the same. Changed where that was easy to do given the new process characteristics, but the emphasis on the stuff required for the mac, secondarily on peak power. I raise this because the corollary to the point I made above is that the best time to change the appearance is precisely when the internals are undergoing their least exciting change...
If I had to guess, my guess would be that Apple has established the line (mini, maybe refreshed every two years; mainstream; pro; pro max) and the design language, for the next four years or so. Get used to these sizes and the squared off edges!
On the flip side the most essential Mac-relevant SoC changes are done. Next year may again be "disappointing" in that the leading edge team will have the many core high end machines as its priority, so while the A15 SoC won't exactly be phoned in, it may still be less than we might hope.
On the other hand, as soon as the A16 Apple may be willing to say "OK, Rosetta2 is over for new machines. If a vendor hasn't ported by now, it's not worth our time to keep coddling them". Being able to drop the compatibility stuff [memory ordering, 4kB subpages] will help a bit (less complexity always helps some), and they'll finally be past the huge effort of the transition, so once again performance can get top billing.
Another data point for my theory (this is the appearance for the next four years or so), when do we get an Apple modem? Maybe 2022? Once again that will come in a shell that looks absolutely familiar, like an iPhone has looked for years, so that the fact of getting new technology that the techies are all chattering about won't seem strange and unnerving; what you buy will feel like last year's iPhone.
mrvco - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
It was a good run since the OG iPhone launched, but I seem to have lost all interest in replacing smart phones. I've been using an XS Max (~work phone) and an LG V40 (~personal phone) for two years now and I'm still perfectly satisfied with both devices. They both do what I ask of them with little fuss and there just haven't been any new features or phones that have generated more than a passing interest for me.Bob Todd - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
As someone who would sometimes change phones more than once a year, I've been in a similar place. We are getting to the point of "good enough" performance. Faster is always better, but high end (and even midrange) SOCs are pretty good these days. My 2 year old phone has 8GB of RAM, 256GB of storage, and a nice large display.I do think this generation of iPhones is interesting for a few reasons though. The Mini doesn't even have a good analogue in the Android world, and I'm excited that premium smaller form factor phones are a thing again.
FunBunny2 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
"The Mini doesn't even have a good analogue in the Android world, and I'm excited that premium smaller form factor phones are a thing again."it depends on use case. for those who use a smartphone mostly as a phone, then these Godzilla handsets are contraindicated. OTOH, if the use case is mostly watching video on the run, then the Max and similar make the most sense. Steve clearly intended the former, Mr. Market gave him a full body enema by telling him to shove those teeny, tiny thingees.
KPOM - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
My mother and sister both opted for the 12 mini since they got tired of big phones. I’m sure they aren’t alone.GC2:CS - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Well is there any reason why LPDDR5 was not used over the entire lineup (including M1) ? Is there some hidden compromise with LPDDR5 ?So if CPU is improved quite a bit in regards to efficiency, why the GPU lacks an update ? Is it possible that newer node benefits the CPU more than GPU ?
I heard about new Pro Oleds having better viewing angles. This is something i would greatly appreciate. 11´s Pro do have quite big shifts in white - at screen edges it has greenish, bluish cast. Can somebody describe it a but more ?
I think this generation could be better. But 5G is quite monumental increse in RF complexity and imagining they did it with custom antena designs and thinner designs is quite remarkable.
For exemple three mmWave antenas were discoverd so far. One on the side next to the battery, one behind the motherboard and one under the notch on the front.
But on the other hand 5G sucked up all the effort for other upgrades like better bigger cameras, batteries, 120 Hz and so on.
I refuse to believe that the next one is iPhone 13. That is just so unlucky...
michael2k - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
I think you answered your own question. The focus on 5G took resources away from lpddr5.mmm200 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
I had both X and Xs Max, wife has 11 Pro.I could tell you how good the new 12 Pro Max display is.
It is better than Apple MBP16 in both color and brightness stability! 2 weeks in I'm amazed still how good the Pro display is!
Don't like the oversaturated images made indoor. Just too much vibrance and saturation. Looks unnatural.
2.5x telephoto is great outdoors in sunny weather.
HDR video capture is mindblowing! Using 1080p30 and 1080p60 - looks great on LG OLED!
name99 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
It's quite possible that world LPDD5 production capacity was not yet large enough?My GUESS is that the memory controller can handle LPDD5, and the M1X machines will ship with it (and those will be in low enough volume that it's not an issue).
I was surprised that the M1 Macs did not, but presumably Apple concluded it made no engineering sense -- they are clearly fast enough as is, so why not hold something in reserve to make the M1X machines look even better when they ship?
vFunct - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Why do you do camera tests without a SINGLE shot of a human being? You know, because how everyone uses phone cameras to take pictures of people at parties and other social events?Are you unable to find anyone willing to have photos taken?
michael2k - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Taking pictures of people aren't actually important for the test scenarios:Daylight evaluation is measuring the sensor and software in their ability to balance contrast, dynamic range, shadows, details, and color (and of course there were some people in those pictures)
Low light evaluation is evaluating how well the software can enhance the image without sacrificing color information, creating unusual color casts, capturing details, and balancing the light and darker portions of the pictures.
What you seem to be asking for is a review of https://www.anandtech.com/show/14892/the-apple-iph...">Portrait Mode? The 2018 https://www.anandtech.com/show/13392/the-iphone-xs...">Portrait Mode review was similarly brief (both less than 5 paragraphs!)
vFunct - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
"Portrait-mode" is the least important piece of information necessary here for a camera review.You test your subjects on people to understand how well it recreates skin tones and textures.
There were issues with previous iPhones where it would over-smooth skin textures leading to a plastic doll-like effect, for example.
michael2k - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Right, but that requires you perform a Portrait Mode test, which you just claimed was the least important piece of information here.You cannot perform a test of the camera's skill at rendering skin tone and texture without also executing the Portrait Mode code, since that is the code that was creating the over-smooth skin texture.
PickUrPoison - Saturday, December 12, 2020 - link
That over smoothing was corrected after a few weeks with an update.ABR - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
The larger phones are real porkers. I have no desire to carry a half-pound of phone around, and that's before a case!name99 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
My favorite color is blue.Maybe everyone wants to chime in with totally non-technical personal statements of choice?
The Garden Variety - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
When I'm taking photos of my pizza with my iPhone, I tend to prefer almost any kind of pizza. Meat pizzas, veggie pizzas, thin crust, thick crust, New York-style crust, whatever. Not picky about pizza. Don't really care for Chicago-style, as it's basically just dough and cheese, but other than that, I'm pretty easy to please.flyingpants265 - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Wow, you are not too bright.dudedud - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Feels like the iphone 6 update coming from a 5S all over again: much better screen, somewhat better / somewhat flat on everything else.Hope the base 13 comes with 6GB of RAM next year to upgrade from my 11.
name99 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Like I said -- Apple does a (multi-year) tick tock with the guts vs the design.iPhone 6 was the A8 CPU.
A7 excitement was housed in the good old familiar A5S case.
A8 was very much a catch-up CPU, cleanup, tweak power, nothing exciting; the excitement was in the new phone casing.
But then the next year the A9... 70%+ speed boost! Maybe too much to hope for with the A15 (as I discussed above!) But maybe we can expect ~15..20% IPC for the A15 and then 40..50% overall for the A16 (especially if it transitions to N3).
flyingpants265 - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
What the hell? 5S and 6? Who the hell is keeping track of all these models? They suck and they're overpriced, you get the last year's one for $500 or something.PickUrPoison - Saturday, December 12, 2020 - link
5s and 6 are like $25-50 used, they’re 5+ years old.TelstarTOS - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
yet another skip year with notch.PickUrPoison - Saturday, December 12, 2020 - link
Get used to it. Apple’s ok with it. Eventually it’ll get smaller and occupy minimal bezel space. Think 7-10 years and be happy if it’s faster.anonomouse - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Is there a pending Mate 40 Pro / Kirin 9000 review where all of the numbers for that are coming from? The GPU in particular for that looks very.... not great.tk.icepick - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Great review Andrei!A small error: On the GPU Performance & Power page, the performance drop from 11 Pro to 12 Pro is 64.78 fps to 56.06 fps. The following paragraph lists a 45% performance regression, but that would be comparing the peak performance of 11 Pro to the sustained performance of 12 Pro.
56.06/64.78 = 86.53%. Still a regression, but only ~14%, not 45.
dudedud - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
Speaking of the throttling, do the 12 series employ the same graphene layer to disperse the heat as last year iPhones?I haven't seen any indication of using it this time (iFixit didn't mention it), and maybe that's the reason for the lower sustained performance even when the efficiency is better?
flyingpants265 - Monday, November 30, 2020 - link
$799 is high, but it's more reasonable than $1300.Always remember that the Realme X 4GB is $145 USD on AliExpress, that should be the price for all budget phones going forward.
Amandtec - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Unless you work in an industry where China engages in industrial espionage. Then the extra $600 is easily worth it.flyingpants265 - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
No, that doesn't matter at all. The point is that phones are cheap to make, and we should seek an option between $145-300 USD. Not an artificially gimped or overpriced option, or "midrange plus" Samsung phones sold to clueless consumers for $600 or more with inferior specifications. $300 is a good price for a Nexus 5 type phone.FunBunny2 - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
"The point is that phones are cheap to make"depends on why that is.
1 - they're still made with a high level of labor input (not so much automation), both the final assembly that most consider 'making the phone' and the same for all the constituent parts all the way down the BoM
2 - they're made with a high level of automation (not so much labor), ditto the rest
in the 1) case, all producers from final assembly down the BoM, can maintain minimum average cost for most levels of output simply by expanding or contracting the labor force, and thus preserve profit
in the 2) case, there's less flexibility to maintain minimum average cost at any level of output, since all that automation has to be paid for no matter the level of output. in fact, the only way to maximize profit is to run that automation 24/7/365, thus spreading capital cost as thinly as possible over maximum output. moving production to still more 'business friendly, labor antagonistic' jurisdictions means there's less and less money to be had by exploiting labor; just not enough in the BoM to exploit.
so, if the BoM for smartphones is closer to 2), it's in the companies interest to maximize output level at all times, thus increasing supply, thus competition for consumers, and thus a lowering of actual sale price.
perhaps one of the AT mavens could look into this?
iphonebestgamephone - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Ah the realme x, the gold standard of all budget phones with a flagship soc.RSAUser - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
That mini is making me quite tempted to move over, been looking for a good small phone to upgrade to since Samsung dropped continuing the S10e line.eastcoast_pete - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Just out of curiosity: can you record in 4K60p with Dolby until the storage or the battery runs out, or does the iPhone 12 go into thermal shutdown like so many "action cams"? I know this is a niche question, but maybe you, Andrei, or someone else here has tried it?Bob Todd - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
I just did a quick test for you, 30 minutes of 4k60 with Dolby Vision on. No thermal issues here on a 12 Mini.HalideRadar - Monday, January 4, 2021 - link
iPhone 12 mini doesn’t support Dolby Vision at 4K60, only up to 4K30zepi - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Any hope for 12 pro max camera test?radoslavp - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
I'm really puzzled by what is happening.All reviews on the Internet say how great the battery life of Iphone 12 series is, however in the mean time there are thousands of owners who complain about ridiculously bad battery - drain, 5G battery issues all over the place, yet no one is publicly speaking about it.
I will share just one link: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251956914
If you type "iphone 12 battery" in google you will end up with countless complains ........ yet not a single line with all reviewers.
Strange isn't it?
Bob Todd - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
Basically every smart phone released since forever has quite a few threads about battery drain problems from some users. You also need to take into account the population size here. I'm sure Apple has sold more than a million units across the range already. My anecdotal rebuttal to anecdotal accounts of problems is that my 12 Mini with the smallest battery has surprised me with how good the battery life is. I skipped charging it a few nights ago and went to sleep with 62%. In the morning it was down to 56%. No low power mode, no turning off any radios, and it was losing less than 1%/hour at idle with all the usual suspects like multiple Gmail accounts, an Exchange account, Facebook etc. setup. Just before midnight the next night it was down to 10%. TL;DR: I think they can all make it through a day of "average" use easily.PickUrPoison - Saturday, December 12, 2020 - link
There are definitely some 5G issues with this switch to a new modem/radio. I’d think that between Apple and Qualcomm they have enough engineering resources to dial it in.theblitz707 - Tuesday, December 1, 2020 - link
its a shame you guys dont test minimum brightness anymore :( Im very interested in black clippingRanger1065 - Wednesday, December 2, 2020 - link
I understand some members of your staff have problems, but this is ridiculous. In the interests of self preservation, isn't it time to get a GPU review done?29a - Wednesday, December 2, 2020 - link
Let me guess, no 3060 ti review?zeeBomb - Thursday, December 3, 2020 - link
that's tough!!!Frantisek - Friday, December 4, 2020 - link
Phones looks simmilar. Difference is much bigger then you picture even it does not look like that in normal use. Let see all differences.128 GB so real difference is 150 (130) USD
6 GB RAM
Telephoto: ƒ/2.0 aperture with OIS
2x optical zoom in, 2x optical zoom out; 4x optical zoom range
Digital zoom up to 10x
Lidar
Night mode portraits enabled by LiDAR Scanner
Apple ProRAW
Dolby Vision recording up to 60 fps
Durable steel frame you do not preffere
Brighter display
I think RAM, extra lens with OIS, Lidar and brighter screen can easily justify hugher cost.
And 100 USD for Max is really small difference for bigger screen and battery, better image sensor with extra stabilisation when we speak in Apple prices.
I hever had rounded phone so can not comment your feelings from flat edges. ... Sorry I had 3/3GS but it so long time ago and were quite bulky.
I would try to compare those phones in cases as many ppl wear them anyway.
s.yu - Friday, December 4, 2020 - link
Not exciting at all...Personally that move back to the iP4 design is the biggest "upgrade", as I've always felt that to be more premium, just like Razer etc. are all making their laptops more boxy. The camera would be more of a sidegrade.sharathc - Friday, December 4, 2020 - link
Boring 🙄iphonebestgamephone - Sunday, December 6, 2020 - link
More exciting than whatever you are doing, atleast.gerard143 - Thursday, January 28, 2021 - link
Outstanding review! Seriously, props to you for not being one of those Apple can do no wrong reviewers.You hit the nail on the head about the regression to square edges and the fingerprint magnet stainless steel.
The sqaure edges are a massive step backwards. I hate my 12 pro because of it. The stainless looks like garbage and is heavy. I’d prefer alum and rounded edges. When I hold my XS in my hand again it feels amazing compared to the 12 pro.
I feel your review was very accurate and well written. Great job!
mobilecampus - Monday, September 6, 2021 - link
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Tami Brown - Saturday, December 4, 2021 - link
The iPhone 12 made the right-hand button so large and lower down on the side compared to old models that it is almost impossible to pick up or handle the phone without turning it off or taking a photo. It is obnoxious! I hate that about this phone.