He said he is shooting RAW. For most consumers something that is encoded already is fine, but for most professional photographers they want RAW because they do not want to lose quality to compression
Maybe if you use a good inter-frame codec and compress it do death it is. As it stands, the hardware encoders in most cameras are pretty rubbish. Most cameras that shoot 4K these days are pushing *at least* 30MB/s, and if you're shooting in a raw format it could easily quadruple that.
Yes, DSLRs especially those of the "C"-Company usually are far from delivering a good 4K quality, sometimes even worse than phones. No wonder Bitrates are just similar to good 1080p footage. You need a Fuji, Panasonic or Sony to record good 4K in F-log, 10bit and all-I for better editing capability. The XT3 and XT4 are recording 400Mbps.
Also keep in mind, that Latencys add up. So even if the Card is able to do 240Mbps with the right card readeras long as its empty, your Cameras SDcard controller could introduce some latency that makes it slower in practice. I have this with a 64mb Card by PNY, which theoreticaly hits 90/45mb/s but hangs after a few minutes in 4K all-I recordings in an xt4.
1. you need to keep it all time its ~18 MB/s is needed. 2. any other app using the card cannot stop the recording -> a bit of catch up time should also be there to make sure buffors can be flushed. 3. not all recordings are equal, and standard should say 4k will work or not, hence the overhead is added for other standards to work if needed.
On the high end, ProRes 4444 XQ requires 4242 Mbps for 4K60. Raw formats go much higher. At some point, though, recording transitions to SSDs instead of SD cards.
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The industrial SD cards which use true SLC flash are horrible in terms of performance and capacity. Since this product has regular MLC backing the small pseudo-SLC bits, why is 64 GB the best that they could do? Delkin Devices has a V90 (90 MB/s minimum) MicroSDXC card that can do bursts of 250 MB/s write—though of course they do not claim to have the endurance afforded by SLC flash.
The only way the small size could be explained is if the entirety of the NAND was in "SLC mode", which I highly doubt. The quite low minimum and maximum transfer/write speeds cannot be explained either way though. Industrial SD cards apparently have crappy controllers that cannot take advantage of their SLC flash. In their market the primary objective is "high endurance".
4K p60 video has a basic data requirement of 3840*2160*60*3 bytes/sec which is 1,492,992,000 bytes /sec (almost 1.5 GB/sec) (HDR multiplies that rate by 1.25). Inter frame and intra frame compression reduce this amount drastically but the level of compression that can be applied in a camera without leading to excessive scene degradation with rapidly changing scenes requires over 50 MB/sec recording rate. (There are cameras which compress further (eg on phones) but severe degradation occurs on any rapidly changing scene.) Off camera compression where the video is passed without compression to a separate recorder and finally compressed on a computer allow for lower final average bit rates without excessive degradation. YouTube videos with a bit rate around 25Mbps show degradation even on fairly static scenes at 1080p.
Professional cameras and recorders don't normally use interframe compression, though. They use intraframe compression or raw codecs (which are also intraframe).
Hope to see more to come with good pricing, these can bee good for Raspberry pi's with data logging, thought log2ram is still a must for any RPi logging setup...
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shabby - Monday, March 30, 2020 - link
"write speed of up to 30 MB/s, which is good enough for 4K video shooting"Since when is 4k 240Mbps? 4k needs maybe 5-10MB/sec so any card can record 4k.
willis936 - Monday, March 30, 2020 - link
Wrong.Samus - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
Are you joking? My 26MP DSLR shoots RAW files that come out to 19MB EACH. That's a single frame, albeit at "12K"My point is, you need cards of this performance just for shooting multi-frame still photography.
LarsBolender - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
Have you ever heard of encoding?RadiclDreamer - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
He said he is shooting RAW. For most consumers something that is encoded already is fine, but for most professional photographers they want RAW because they do not want to lose quality to compressionbenzosaurus - Monday, March 30, 2020 - link
Maybe if you use a good inter-frame codec and compress it do death it is. As it stands, the hardware encoders in most cameras are pretty rubbish. Most cameras that shoot 4K these days are pushing *at least* 30MB/s, and if you're shooting in a raw format it could easily quadruple that.shabby - Monday, March 30, 2020 - link
Perhaps we're thinking of different camera's then.shelbystripes - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
Perhaps. We’re all thinking of good cameras.Maksdampf - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
Yes, DSLRs especially those of the "C"-Company usually are far from delivering a good 4K quality, sometimes even worse than phones. No wonder Bitrates are just similar to good 1080p footage.You need a Fuji, Panasonic or Sony to record good 4K in F-log, 10bit and all-I for better editing capability. The XT3 and XT4 are recording 400Mbps.
Also keep in mind, that Latencys add up. So even if the Card is able to do 240Mbps with the right card readeras long as its empty, your Cameras SDcard controller could introduce some latency that makes it slower in practice.
I have this with a 64mb Card by PNY, which theoreticaly hits 90/45mb/s but hangs after a few minutes in 4K all-I recordings in an xt4.
deil - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
1. you need to keep it all time its ~18 MB/s is needed.2. any other app using the card cannot stop the recording -> a bit of catch up time should also be there to make sure buffors can be flushed.
3. not all recordings are equal, and standard should say 4k will work or not, hence the overhead is added for other standards to work if needed.
Guspaz - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
On the high end, ProRes 4444 XQ requires 4242 Mbps for 4K60. Raw formats go much higher. At some point, though, recording transitions to SSDs instead of SD cards.ashleysguy43 - Sunday, April 5, 2020 - link
Sara Jackson Makes $140 to $180 per day online work and i received $16894 in one month online acting from home.I am a daily student and work simply one to a pair of hours in my spare time.Everybody will do that job and monline akes extra cash by simply open this link... WWW.iⅭash68.ⅭＯⅯLiKenun - Monday, March 30, 2020 - link
The industrial SD cards which use true SLC flash are horrible in terms of performance and capacity. Since this product has regular MLC backing the small pseudo-SLC bits, why is 64 GB the best that they could do? Delkin Devices has a V90 (90 MB/s minimum) MicroSDXC card that can do bursts of 250 MB/s write—though of course they do not claim to have the endurance afforded by SLC flash.Santoval - Monday, March 30, 2020 - link
The only way the small size could be explained is if the entirety of the NAND was in "SLC mode", which I highly doubt. The quite low minimum and maximum transfer/write speeds cannot be explained either way though.Industrial SD cards apparently have crappy controllers that cannot take advantage of their SLC flash. In their market the primary objective is "high endurance".
PixyMisa - Monday, March 30, 2020 - link
Maybe the target market is endurance-oriented rather than capacity - 140TBW is a lot for a 64GB SD card.Samus - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
If they take 256GB of TLC and make 32GB SLC, the card is effectively going to become 64GB total capacity.Duncan Macdonald - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
4K p60 video has a basic data requirement of 3840*2160*60*3 bytes/sec which is 1,492,992,000 bytes /sec (almost 1.5 GB/sec) (HDR multiplies that rate by 1.25). Inter frame and intra frame compression reduce this amount drastically but the level of compression that can be applied in a camera without leading to excessive scene degradation with rapidly changing scenes requires over 50 MB/sec recording rate. (There are cameras which compress further (eg on phones) but severe degradation occurs on any rapidly changing scene.) Off camera compression where the video is passed without compression to a separate recorder and finally compressed on a computer allow for lower final average bit rates without excessive degradation.YouTube videos with a bit rate around 25Mbps show degradation even on fairly static scenes at 1080p.
Guspaz - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
Professional cameras and recorders don't normally use interframe compression, though. They use intraframe compression or raw codecs (which are also intraframe).Xajel - Tuesday, March 31, 2020 - link
Hope to see more to come with good pricing, these can bee good for Raspberry pi's with data logging, thought log2ram is still a must for any RPi logging setup...