If they are upgrading the Compute Stick, they might as well change the SOC. I am not sure if the Atom chip is going to keep up with the requirements of WIndows in the near future. And to be honest, the likes of Raspberry PI is starting to catch up with them.
Yup. That and 8GB of RAM and it'd actually be usable for a lot of things. Who cares if the price goes up a bit - this is basically e-waste in fancy packaging.
I also concur the Lakefield would make a formidable compute stick device. The retro-computing possibilities are endless! I own 3 VivoSticks and love them for retro stuff! I can run old Silicon Graphics demos on these devices way faster than the 500K InfiniteReality supercomputers of yesteryear! I own an O2 and the VivoStick runs circles around it!
That Cherry Trail SoC is a 2 W part. You can't dissipate much heat from a stick form factor (remember, being an external device, it mustn't get hot enough to burn someone).
Do we have a part number on Lakefield? I wonder how low you'd have to clock it, to stay within 2W.
The shell appears to be made of plastic. ASUS can make the stick out of aluminum or something to dissipate more heat. This is the approach taken by the RTL-SDR USB sticks. No, it won't burn you if done properly.
Previously, Intel said Lakefield could get down to as low as 3W. It seems that it will be at 7W in typical designs.
Also, I'm sure Lakefield isn't cheap. The CPU, alone, could be a multiple of the current stick's price.
It wouldn't be a bad compromise to drop the Sunny Cove core and just go with 4x Tremont cores, in a conventional 2D package. The Sunny Cove probably wouldn't be able to clock high enough to stretch its legs, anyhow.
The small/big approach looks like a good way to boost single-threaded performance, and it can let Intel mix process nodes. So they can make the big core on 10nm+ and small ones on 14nm+++++++, etc.
Intel is overcharging for a lot of its products, but people still buy them. A better chip could turn this form factor from aggravating to useful. At a minimum, looks like it needs a fresher Atom with 4K H.265 decode support.
That would be JavaScript, the scourge of the modern internet, because we totally need a gigabyte of active scripting, telemetry gathering and social media connectors to display a paragraph of poorly written text fenced in by advertisements and clickbait aggregators.
I wish there were modern variants of this form factor -- I have plenty of fun things to attach to my NexDock but something of this nature would be optimal for "pseudo-laptop" usage. The corded RPi option isn't great for on-lap usage without adhesives.
"Are you sick having hair on your head? Does it get in your eyes, and keep your head warm? Introducing s a solution to all your problems: The Asus Vivostick TS10 'compute stick'. We guarantee that within 3 weeks of using this product, you'll have ripped out every hair on your head in frustration. Whether it's the slow eMMC storage or the complete lack of available RAM, this thing is sure to make your blood pressure skyrocket and give you heartburn. If you're looking to go bald ASAP and possibly have a heart attack, we've got the product for you!"
I agree that it needs a newer SOC. However, I have the same SOC in my Asus T100ha, including 4GB of RAM and 64GB eMMC. It sure as heck isn't blazing fast, but it works okay. I am looking at a full up 11.6 or 13" 2-in-1 to replace it, but that is as much about desiring a larger screen than anything. That and they keep getting thinner and lighter, so most of the nicer 11.6 and 13" 2-in-1 don't weigh much more than my 10.1" T100ha.
It is NOT blazing fast, but the experience in most of Windows is fine.
My biggest concern as a media streamer is that there is no h265 hardware acceleration. My T100ha does okay with 1080p h.265 with even reasonably demanding settings. However it CANNOT do 4k. Full stop. And with 1080p h.265 decoding it is humming along at around 60% CPU load. 1080p h.264, which does have hardware decode support it ticks over at around 15% CPU load.
So using this for a 4K display/TV would be disappointing at best since the GPU can't support that resolution as well as not having the muscle to decode it (I've tried 4K h.265 decodes just to the 720p display on my T100ha and it just won't do it.
So I can see where this could have a place, especially if you wanted a tiny footprint file server or something (connected to USB storage), maybe a network firewall. As a media streamer, the fact that it lacks hardware h.265 decode as well as 4k support leaves it flat.
Meh... I don't really see too many use cases for this. For $25, I bought a cable that enables Dex on my Samsung Galaxy. Got the basic apps I need, and if I need a Win10 PC, I RDP into a VM. For a permanent install, I'd probably look to a PI 4 or an Intel NUC.
Market is probably what we wanted them for (but never used them for because of Windows Home edition).
Permanently turning dumb older meeting room displays into computers so that everyone needn't haul their laptops in and fark around with cables, discover that their new laptop doesn't have that output. Run out and get an adapter etc etc.
Office docs, maybe a website or two and it makes the room tidy and will always work.
Factoring in buying another Windows license meant it was uneconomical and so the idea was scrapped.
W10 pro is only £100 ? emmc storage is not necesaarily slow . I've used it and noted speeds at 50% of a samsung SSD, so perfectly usable. But that Soc.. Good for presentations websites power point etc as long as you bring an air mouse. What could they do on a bigger power budget ?
"due in part to limitations imposed by the form factor" - I'd say that the 'main' reason would be price, or that 2Gb is awful for Windows. Oh... also the 32Gb which would be full within two months. Also the cpu. Pretty much everything. Intel had a few nice sticks.
I bought a similar machine from Azulle, with an Ethernet jack (unusual for this form factor), for $70 refurbished from NewEgg. I installed OpenBSD on it and it serves as a VPN server using OpenIKEd, and perfectly fine for that purpose.
Been looking at buying one of these to turn a spare monitor into a low cost office display - show a live schedule (on an excel spreadsheet!), and a couple of Chrome windows with other schedules and stats, all at the same time. Hopefully this new model means the older ASUS ones will be cheaper.
Not sure if its up to the task - it would probably work out of the box, but I dont want to babysit it through windows updates every few months and have it run out of storage etc.
Compared to my Bay Trail 11.6 inch laptop, this would be an improvement from a CPU perspective, but I find it hard to consider hardware like this with a 4GB RAM and 64GB storage limitation. That's one of the reasons I'm still sitting on my Bay Trail PC. It has a SO-DIMM slot with 8GB and I've fed it a 1TB SATA SSD which makes it comfortable to use from a storage and memory standpoint, though the GPU and CPU performance leave a lot to be desired.
Quite unfortunate that they're sticking with Cherry Trail. I used this for a couple years as a media center streaming stick, but it's now too slow to even handle 1080p Netflix reliably (A/V sync issues emerge every time, necessitating scrubbing to re-buffer). Tried a bunch of things, but it's essentially just too slow -- eventually switched to using an Xbox for the same purpose.
Everyone thinking of home, not business. Perfect as a citrix/RDS/Horizon client, locked down like a gnats chuff and a VPN, perfect for on call techies, remote helldesk/callcenter types or just stuck in the back of a screen in a hotdesk.
OMFG how hard is it to upgrade the cpu ? seriously the most expensive intel compute chip dating years back has a better faster CPU and just as much ram. This new compute stick is a failure for 2020 why won't someone release a new model with a much better CPU ?
I pity the fool who has to run Win 10 apps on this thing. Whether it's web browsing or MS Office, I'm sure it's virtually unusable. Win 10 on a 6-core Haswell workstation already feels noticeably more sluggish than Win 7 did.
I wonder how many of these things are actually being used for Linux.
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watzupken - Wednesday, February 19, 2020 - link
If they are upgrading the Compute Stick, they might as well change the SOC. I am not sure if the Atom chip is going to keep up with the requirements of WIndows in the near future. And to be honest, the likes of Raspberry PI is starting to catch up with them.nandnandnand - Wednesday, February 19, 2020 - link
This seems like a good form factor to stick that 5-core Lakefield chip in.yeeeeman - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Exactly what I was thinking.Spunjji - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Yup. That and 8GB of RAM and it'd actually be usable for a lot of things. Who cares if the price goes up a bit - this is basically e-waste in fancy packaging.atifz - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
I also concur the Lakefield would make a formidable compute stick device. The retro-computing possibilities are endless! I own 3 VivoSticks and love them for retro stuff! I can run old Silicon Graphics demos on these devices way faster than the 500K InfiniteReality supercomputers of yesteryear! I own an O2 and the VivoStick runs circles around it!mode_13h - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
That Cherry Trail SoC is a 2 W part. You can't dissipate much heat from a stick form factor (remember, being an external device, it mustn't get hot enough to burn someone).Do we have a part number on Lakefield? I wonder how low you'd have to clock it, to stay within 2W.
nandnandnand - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
The shell appears to be made of plastic. ASUS can make the stick out of aluminum or something to dissipate more heat. This is the approach taken by the RTL-SDR USB sticks. No, it won't burn you if done properly.Previously, Intel said Lakefield could get down to as low as 3W. It seems that it will be at 7W in typical designs.
mode_13h - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
Also, I'm sure Lakefield isn't cheap. The CPU, alone, could be a multiple of the current stick's price.It wouldn't be a bad compromise to drop the Sunny Cove core and just go with 4x Tremont cores, in a conventional 2D package. The Sunny Cove probably wouldn't be able to clock high enough to stretch its legs, anyhow.
nandnandnand - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
The small/big approach looks like a good way to boost single-threaded performance, and it can let Intel mix process nodes. So they can make the big core on 10nm+ and small ones on 14nm+++++++, etc.Intel is overcharging for a lot of its products, but people still buy them. A better chip could turn this form factor from aggravating to useful. At a minimum, looks like it needs a fresher Atom with 4K H.265 decode support.
Jorgp2 - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Even the newest atom at the same TDP would offer double the performance.p1esk - Wednesday, February 19, 2020 - link
I had a stick PC with that Atom processor. It's crap.deil - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
what did you expect from 1W cpu? its powered with less than your phone.nandnandnand - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Atom x5-Z8350 is listed as 2W "scenario design power".Is the VivoStick "chassis" made of plastic? If so, fixing that bad design choice could boost performance, along with using Lakefield.
konbala - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
x7 with 4gb ram is pretty OK, had a GPD Win 1 and used it A LOT.mkozakewich - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
It seems you need 8GB minimum, these days. I have no idea what's been going on with browsers, but mine routinely take up 4 GB with just a few tabs.Pessimism - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
That would be JavaScript, the scourge of the modern internet, because we totally need a gigabyte of active scripting, telemetry gathering and social media connectors to display a paragraph of poorly written text fenced in by advertisements and clickbait aggregators.lmcd - Wednesday, February 19, 2020 - link
I wish there were modern variants of this form factor -- I have plenty of fun things to attach to my NexDock but something of this nature would be optimal for "pseudo-laptop" usage. The corded RPi option isn't great for on-lap usage without adhesives.Kakti - Wednesday, February 19, 2020 - link
"Are you sick having hair on your head? Does it get in your eyes, and keep your head warm? Introducing s a solution to all your problems: The Asus Vivostick TS10 'compute stick'. We guarantee that within 3 weeks of using this product, you'll have ripped out every hair on your head in frustration. Whether it's the slow eMMC storage or the complete lack of available RAM, this thing is sure to make your blood pressure skyrocket and give you heartburn. If you're looking to go bald ASAP and possibly have a heart attack, we've got the product for you!"just4U - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
I got a laugh out of that!azazel1024 - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
I agree that it needs a newer SOC. However, I have the same SOC in my Asus T100ha, including 4GB of RAM and 64GB eMMC. It sure as heck isn't blazing fast, but it works okay. I am looking at a full up 11.6 or 13" 2-in-1 to replace it, but that is as much about desiring a larger screen than anything. That and they keep getting thinner and lighter, so most of the nicer 11.6 and 13" 2-in-1 don't weigh much more than my 10.1" T100ha.It is NOT blazing fast, but the experience in most of Windows is fine.
My biggest concern as a media streamer is that there is no h265 hardware acceleration. My T100ha does okay with 1080p h.265 with even reasonably demanding settings. However it CANNOT do 4k. Full stop. And with 1080p h.265 decoding it is humming along at around 60% CPU load. 1080p h.264, which does have hardware decode support it ticks over at around 15% CPU load.
So using this for a 4K display/TV would be disappointing at best since the GPU can't support that resolution as well as not having the muscle to decode it (I've tried 4K h.265 decodes just to the 720p display on my T100ha and it just won't do it.
So I can see where this could have a place, especially if you wanted a tiny footprint file server or something (connected to USB storage), maybe a network firewall. As a media streamer, the fact that it lacks hardware h.265 decode as well as 4k support leaves it flat.
S4Lee - Wednesday, February 19, 2020 - link
Meh... I don't really see too many use cases for this. For $25, I bought a cable that enables Dex on my Samsung Galaxy. Got the basic apps I need, and if I need a Win10 PC, I RDP into a VM. For a permanent install, I'd probably look to a PI 4 or an Intel NUC.Danvelopment - Wednesday, February 19, 2020 - link
Market is probably what we wanted them for (but never used them for because of Windows Home edition).Permanently turning dumb older meeting room displays into computers so that everyone needn't haul their laptops in and fark around with cables, discover that their new laptop doesn't have that output. Run out and get an adapter etc etc.
Office docs, maybe a website or two and it makes the room tidy and will always work.
Factoring in buying another Windows license meant it was uneconomical and so the idea was scrapped.
MASSAMKULABOX - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
W10 pro is only £100 ? emmc storage is not necesaarily slow . I've used it and noted speeds at 50% of a samsung SSD, so perfectly usable. But that Soc.. Good for presentations websites power point etc as long as you bring an air mouse. What could they do on a bigger power budget ?69369369 - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Atom x5 in 2020 🤢damianrobertjones - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
"due in part to limitations imposed by the form factor" - I'd say that the 'main' reason would be price, or that 2Gb is awful for Windows. Oh... also the 32Gb which would be full within two months. Also the cpu. Pretty much everything. Intel had a few nice sticks.fazalmajid - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
I bought a similar machine from Azulle, with an Ethernet jack (unusual for this form factor), for $70 refurbished from NewEgg. I installed OpenBSD on it and it serves as a VPN server using OpenIKEd, and perfectly fine for that purpose.Cliff34 - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Newbie question.. What if they stick a 8cx in the stick? Price points may be diff but performance should be better than atom?Tomatotech - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Been looking at buying one of these to turn a spare monitor into a low cost office display - show a live schedule (on an excel spreadsheet!), and a couple of Chrome windows with other schedules and stats, all at the same time. Hopefully this new model means the older ASUS ones will be cheaper.Not sure if its up to the task - it would probably work out of the box, but I dont want to babysit it through windows updates every few months and have it run out of storage etc.
Tomatotech - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Also not looking to spend more than around £100, so either a very cheap used PC on a stick, or a used Lenovo ThinkCentre, one of the tiny beasties.PeachNCream - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Compared to my Bay Trail 11.6 inch laptop, this would be an improvement from a CPU perspective, but I find it hard to consider hardware like this with a 4GB RAM and 64GB storage limitation. That's one of the reasons I'm still sitting on my Bay Trail PC. It has a SO-DIMM slot with 8GB and I've fed it a 1TB SATA SSD which makes it comfortable to use from a storage and memory standpoint, though the GPU and CPU performance leave a lot to be desired.amb9800 - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Quite unfortunate that they're sticking with Cherry Trail. I used this for a couple years as a media center streaming stick, but it's now too slow to even handle 1080p Netflix reliably (A/V sync issues emerge every time, necessitating scrubbing to re-buffer). Tried a bunch of things, but it's essentially just too slow -- eventually switched to using an Xbox for the same purpose.Whiteknight2020 - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
Everyone thinking of home, not business. Perfect as a citrix/RDS/Horizon client, locked down like a gnats chuff and a VPN, perfect for on call techies, remote helldesk/callcenter types or just stuck in the back of a screen in a hotdesk.youwillhereeMEME - Thursday, February 20, 2020 - link
OMFG how hard is it to upgrade the cpu ? seriously the most expensive intel compute chip dating years back has a better faster CPU and just as much ram. This new compute stick is a failure for 2020 why won't someone release a new model with a much better CPU ?mode_13h - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
I pity the fool who has to run Win 10 apps on this thing. Whether it's web browsing or MS Office, I'm sure it's virtually unusable. Win 10 on a 6-core Haswell workstation already feels noticeably more sluggish than Win 7 did.I wonder how many of these things are actually being used for Linux.
moseo - Wednesday, January 13, 2021 - link
Great but we're still waiting on the 8GB version!!Mo Seo
http://www.buysellram.com