ummm, it is a follow on to OpenGL type stuff, how many games, apps etc use GL... MANY MANY MANY Vulkan while "complex" due to low level nature is from my understanding was and IS vastly superior option to the "legacy" GL from Chronos (sorry on typos etc)
There is a reason why AMD made it in the first place, mainly cause Intel, MSFT, Nvidia (mainly) had stranglehold in regards to GL and certainly DirectX (DX) Vulkan was made to get away from certain folks having "access to what others legally or otherwise could not and CANNOT do because of such)
(yes my wording)
Vulkan is software/hardware "independant" meaning in essence pretty much cares little if it is a Radeon or a Geforce branded or Core i whatever or now Ryzen cpu wise, if programmed (at the metal) (basically speaking) it will work .. sure it has some issues, no doubt about that, but than again, DX has massive and many issues mostly due to being "locked up tight" by those "in power" such as Intel or Nvidia who "hold the keys to the castle" therefore MSFT "bends a knee" to them while everyone who is NOT THEM play by other rules.
so what is the worst evil...NOT Vulkan which was and is meant to not care what the product is, where other API absolutely care and make you pay if NOT using the named stuff.
When someone is clearly speaking well outside their realm of expertise, it should be called out. I don't agree with how MFinn3333 characterized it, but at least it dealt with the post, rather than the poster.
And, yes, if someone can't spell Khronos (in spite of the 15 times it appeared in the article!), their views on Khronos standards should obviously be taken with a grain of salt... if not outright disregarded.
The purpose of Vulkan was to work around overhead, restrictions, and legacy in OpenGL - not to break a corporate hegemony or cartel. Vulkan was created & standardized by most of the same folks that participate in the OpenGL working group.
Vulkan was largely informed by AMD's proprietary Mantle API, which proved a number of API concepts and demonstrated the performance benefits and increased flexibility that could come from such a low-level API.
"Hopefully this shows some light to the vast majority, how bad Vulkan was or is." Please elaborate. What is "bad" about it? And do you mean bad compared to DX12 or OpenGL?
How do you figure that "nVidia is going one better" with a beta release for devs? AMD just released it's 1.2 Vulkan drivers in a new driver this p.m--for everyone--not just developers.
I've since updated the article to mention AMD as well. But that was an unexpected development, as AMD apparently didn't inform the right parties in advance.
Khronos is an industry consortium. I doubt they have the resources to hire dedicated staff. As such, it's necessarily staffed by industry insiders. If you're *that* concerned, you could probably look up their governance statutes and by-laws, to see what the leadership selection process involves. However, I'd guess they have elections, in which case it'd be a bit odd for him to continually hold the position, if he abused his power.
And I *highly* doubt that *anyone* on the Vulkan working group didn't know the 1.2 release was either imminent or even scheduled for this specific date. They almost certainly have a sign-off process, to certify the final release of a standard.
That's not to say there's not politics, in Khronos. But, it's a bit more subtle, like GPU vendors bribing ISVs in certain working groups to vote a particular way, on a given feature.
Concurrency is critical to graphics performance. OpenGL has its own contingent of synchronization primitives and atomics, as does Direct3D.
You just need to learn the proper design patterns and adhere to them, closely. I'd guess that most of the problems people encounter involve trying to use synchronization with only a rudimentary understanding of the primitives, and not strictly following prescribed techniques.
Sure, in theory, you can still use it. But, they basically just killed the main reason anyone would still be interested in it. I predict the next version of OpenGL will also feature HLSL support.
We’ve updated our terms. By continuing to use the site and/or by logging into your account, you agree to the Site’s updated Terms of Use and Privacy Policy.
Facebook
Twitter
RSS
23 Comments
Back to Article
willis936 - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
Too bad godot isn’t listed in the game engines section of slide 3.willis936 - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
To be clear: I’m aware that it shouldn’t be right now. I just wish that godot did have moltenVK support.ksec - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
Thank You Anandtech / Ryan Smith. The hype was absolutely awful. Hopefully this shows some light to the vast majority, how bad Vulkan was or is.I think 1.2 is a big deal, at least it gained some support for Professional Apps.
Dragonstongue - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
How bad Vulkan was / is ?ummm, it is a follow on to OpenGL type stuff, how many games, apps etc use GL... MANY MANY MANY
Vulkan while "complex" due to low level nature is from my understanding was and IS vastly superior option to the "legacy" GL from Chronos (sorry on typos etc)
There is a reason why AMD made it in the first place, mainly cause Intel, MSFT, Nvidia (mainly) had stranglehold in regards to GL and certainly DirectX (DX) Vulkan was made to get away from certain folks having "access to what others legally or otherwise could not and CANNOT do because of such)
(yes my wording)
Vulkan is software/hardware "independant" meaning in essence pretty much cares little if it is a Radeon or a Geforce branded or Core i whatever or now Ryzen cpu wise, if programmed (at the metal) (basically speaking) it will work .. sure it has some issues, no doubt about that, but than again, DX has massive and many issues mostly due to being "locked up tight" by those "in power" such as Intel or Nvidia who "hold the keys to the castle" therefore MSFT "bends a knee" to them while everyone who is NOT THEM play by other rules.
so what is the worst evil...NOT Vulkan which was and is meant to not care what the product is, where other API absolutely care and make you pay if NOT using the named stuff.
MFinn3333 - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
What a dangerously incoherent rant.silencer12 - Thursday, January 16, 2020 - link
Don't be a dick.mode_13h - Sunday, January 19, 2020 - link
When someone is clearly speaking well outside their realm of expertise, it should be called out. I don't agree with how MFinn3333 characterized it, but at least it dealt with the post, rather than the poster.mode_13h - Sunday, January 19, 2020 - link
I would say it was misguided, not incoherent.And, yes, if someone can't spell Khronos (in spite of the 15 times it appeared in the article!), their views on Khronos standards should obviously be taken with a grain of salt... if not outright disregarded.
mode_13h - Saturday, January 18, 2020 - link
The purpose of Vulkan was to work around overhead, restrictions, and legacy in OpenGL - not to break a corporate hegemony or cartel. Vulkan was created & standardized by most of the same folks that participate in the OpenGL working group.Vulkan was largely informed by AMD's proprietary Mantle API, which proved a number of API concepts and demonstrated the performance benefits and increased flexibility that could come from such a low-level API.
Santoval - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
"Hopefully this shows some light to the vast majority, how bad Vulkan was or is."Please elaborate. What is "bad" about it? And do you mean bad compared to DX12 or OpenGL?
Spunjji - Thursday, January 16, 2020 - link
Not sure how you got the idea that Vulkan was/is bad. The Doom 2016 Vulkan patch indicated the precise opposite.silencer12 - Thursday, January 16, 2020 - link
You know not what you speak.domboy - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
Qualcomm needs to get their act together and build opengl/vulkan drivers for Windows. It's currently stuck at 1.1 that Microsoft includes by natively.domboy - Thursday, January 16, 2020 - link
Ugh, my kingdom for an edit button!!"...includes natively."
WaltC - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
How do you figure that "nVidia is going one better" with a beta release for devs? AMD just released it's 1.2 Vulkan drivers in a new driver this p.m--for everyone--not just developers.Ryan Smith - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
When this article was written last night, Khronos was only listing that NVIDIA would have Vulkan 1.2 drivers ready to go on launch day.https://images.anandtech.com/doci/15401/Vulkan%201...
I've since updated the article to mention AMD as well. But that was an unexpected development, as AMD apparently didn't inform the right parties in advance.
soresu - Thursday, January 16, 2020 - link
Or a certain Khronos president on the nVidia payroll didn't give other companies advanced notice of the 1.2 spec release.I've said it before and I'll say it again - having an nVidia staffer as the Khronos president is like having the fox in charge of the hen house.
mode_13h - Saturday, January 18, 2020 - link
Khronos is an industry consortium. I doubt they have the resources to hire dedicated staff. As such, it's necessarily staffed by industry insiders. If you're *that* concerned, you could probably look up their governance statutes and by-laws, to see what the leadership selection process involves. However, I'd guess they have elections, in which case it'd be a bit odd for him to continually hold the position, if he abused his power.And I *highly* doubt that *anyone* on the Vulkan working group didn't know the 1.2 release was either imminent or even scheduled for this specific date. They almost certainly have a sign-off process, to certify the final release of a standard.
That's not to say there's not politics, in Khronos. But, it's a bit more subtle, like GPU vendors bribing ISVs in certain working groups to vote a particular way, on a given feature.
casperes1996 - Wednesday, January 15, 2020 - link
I think I just got PTSD symptoms reading the section on semaphores. God I hate synchronisation issues. A pain to debug, and often hard to fix as well.AndrewJacksonZA - Thursday, January 16, 2020 - link
Multiuse is a threading to plea su re.mode_13h - Sunday, January 19, 2020 - link
Concurrency is critical to graphics performance. OpenGL has its own contingent of synchronization primitives and atomics, as does Direct3D.You just need to learn the proper design patterns and adhere to them, closely. I'd guess that most of the problems people encounter involve trying to use synchronization with only a rudimentary understanding of the primitives, and not strictly following prescribed techniques.
mode_13h - Monday, January 20, 2020 - link
Also, I just want to say: R.I.P. GLSL.Sure, in theory, you can still use it. But, they basically just killed the main reason anyone would still be interested in it. I predict the next version of OpenGL will also feature HLSL support.
smartaffiliaxe - Friday, March 20, 2020 - link
Nice post thanks! as here also https://yesalternatives.com/yesmovies/