Oh, good thing Samsung literally had an "Upcoming high speed SSD used for the PS5" teased only a few weeks ago, and the chief designer of the PS5 announced it was using a new high end NVME SSD last year. Glad you're keeping up with things and not anyone else though.
There's no realistic interpretation of the leaks and hints about the upcoming consoles that should lead you to believe they'll use something like the 980 PRO. Samsung might have been able to score a design win for a console, but definitely not with a MLC drive.
MLC (multi-level cell) is longer lasting, faster, but less dense than TLC (triple-level cell) which is longer lasting, noticeably faster, but less dense than QLC (quad-level cell). Density drives the price, so QLC is likely to be used in inexpensive consumer applications, such as a gaming console. MLC is the best we can get outside a data-center, which would be using MLC or possibly the holy grail that is SLC (single-level cell). Simply cost is the factor. A MLC drive of a size that will hold multiple next gen games will cost as much as a current gen console. So, unless consoles are going to double in price, they will have the cheaper, QLC (likely) SSDs.
QLC is far too slow for that. It is also not durable enough to withstand the constant install/uninstall/reinstall cycle that most console gamers tend to do.
You right, but there is new QLC SSD Sabrent Rocket Q that does: 1TB 3200/2000 2TB 3200/2900 <Thats just tad lower then what best TLC SSDs like MP510 do 4Tb 3200/2000
QLC is more than fast enough for that. It is also more than durable enough to withstand the very few install/uninstall/reinstall cycle that most console gamers tend to do.
Digital Foundry put out a 10 minute video named "In Theory: How SSD Could Radically Change Next-Gen Games Beyond Faster Loading" a few weeks ago. It is worth watching to inform yourself on what's going on with next gen console storage.
I know it's poor form to reference other sources here, but anandtech has not been covering this.
We haven't been covering it, because most of what's out there is misguided speculation. A lot of it is stuff I know is outright wrong. When there's interesting and reliable information about console storage hardware, we'll publish it.
Keep up? most are already ahead. Can't remember if it was this site or another one a while back reported or tested the PSS5's SSD benchmark scores. It was around 1000mbps (1 GB/s) actual read speed. Most PC nvme's are 3-4x that.
this is great news! phison's pcie4 controller is a mega energy hog and terrible performer in random writes, with other serious issues. hopefully samsung can correct this.
Phison E16 was obviously intended to be a short-lived stopgap product, so that they could ride the wave of the Ryzen 3000 release. The "real" Phison PCIe 4.0 design is the E18 coming later this year, which should take care of most of the E16's shortcomings.
"... by the end of this year we should start seeing the Phison E18 and other controllers offering sequential speeds around 7GB/s, so the 980 PRO may have little or no time to set throughput records for the consumer*** SSD market."
*** "consumer" :: artificial benchmark that runs I/O at QD 128, I presume? I mean, we aren't *seriously* talking about QD1 numbers here, are we? In which case, WHAT THE HELL ARE WE TALKING ABOUT - AND WHY!?!?
The Samsung PRO line has hardly ever been something for people who care about real-world performance or who have a realistic idea about their endurance requirements. These drives are largely for consumers who want bragging rights, plus a handful of niche use cases that really aren't common enough to sustain this product line without the more-money-than-sense crowd.
But that's basically my point: why are we putting up with this borderline false advertising, and why are we so happily complicit in helping those bozos inflict this BS upon naive consumers?
These sorts of utterly unrealistic, in-practice-meaningless, deliberately deceptive and borderline fraudulent numbers should be called out, harshly and mercilessly, systematically and tirelessly, for brutal scorn and ridicule by professional reviewers. It is appalling that you guys just stand by and glad-hand this kind of manipulative nonsense!
Power efficiency? Performance per Dollar? Even in completely unrealistic scenarios like 15k mysql requests a 960pro or 970pro are just measurably faster. Cool device though.
This is nice but given flash storage cannot sustain more than 2.5-3Gbps steadily throughout the entire length of the drive, this increase in interface speed is good just for bursts which will see minor improvements or for real case scenarios where you have multiple drives in parallel.
Sustained writes are about 90% of the reason for buying the 970 Pro vs the cheaper, "faster" 970 EVO (and many other "cheaper, faster" NVMe drives). Short of a massive about face in strategy - and nothing has indicated as such, so far - this seems likely to be the same for the 980 Pro.
250GB SSD shouldn't exist this day and age, even 500GB is borderline but its perfect for pure OS drive. I kinda want this SSD, but i wonder which will perform better 480GB Optane or the 500GB/1TB 980 Pro. If this SSD cheaper then my optane, maybe ill sell it, get the 500GB 980Pro and have some extra money left
actually.. they should... 250 gigs is a good size for win10.. and other programs.. with a larger drive to install games too.. and mechanical hdds for other things that dont need speed....
Guys, you are missing ONE HUGE point here, its Samsung PRO SSD! 970PRO when filled 0 to 100% loses just a tiny bit of speed, something unimportant, unlike TLC drives it doesn't need complicated RAM cache algorithms and SLC cache layers. When you run a benchmarks on standard SSD, even new gen PCIe 4.0, the more you fill them the lower the speed. What it means is that this 980PRO will be doing the same and we will get FULL SPEED from 0 to 100% fill.
quote from mr tallis : " There have been enough leaks about a 2TB 970 PRO that it clearly exists, but they can't make up their minds about when and whether to release it. "
Damnit, and in a week I wanted to buy a Samsung 970 EVO Plus. Now what do I do? Q2 is coming, but that could easily mean at the end of Q2. I want to keep my 2 Samsungs 860 as Boot Drives ( obviously one of the two ) and the EVO Plus NVME for Games.
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nandnandnand - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Is this the magical component PC gamers will have to buy to keep up with the next-gen consoles?Billy Tallis - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
No. If the new consoles have any storage-related magic, it'll be software, not hardware.Frenetic Pony - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Oh, good thing Samsung literally had an "Upcoming high speed SSD used for the PS5" teased only a few weeks ago, and the chief designer of the PS5 announced it was using a new high end NVME SSD last year. Glad you're keeping up with things and not anyone else though.Billy Tallis - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
There's no realistic interpretation of the leaks and hints about the upcoming consoles that should lead you to believe they'll use something like the 980 PRO. Samsung might have been able to score a design win for a console, but definitely not with a MLC drive.DemonHD - Sunday, April 19, 2020 - link
Why? What's so bad with MLC drive? I don't know anything about it. Can you explain pls?bagehi - Friday, May 8, 2020 - link
MLC (multi-level cell) is longer lasting, faster, but less dense than TLC (triple-level cell) which is longer lasting, noticeably faster, but less dense than QLC (quad-level cell). Density drives the price, so QLC is likely to be used in inexpensive consumer applications, such as a gaming console. MLC is the best we can get outside a data-center, which would be using MLC or possibly the holy grail that is SLC (single-level cell). Simply cost is the factor. A MLC drive of a size that will hold multiple next gen games will cost as much as a current gen console. So, unless consoles are going to double in price, they will have the cheaper, QLC (likely) SSDs.DnaAngel - Thursday, April 23, 2020 - link
Not only that, a $400 console isn't going to have a $500 SSD lol.Storris - Sunday, May 17, 2020 - link
this aged well...Storris - Sunday, May 17, 2020 - link
Do these comments need clarification at all, knowing what we now know?mode_13h - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
There were some hints that people interpreted to mean they'd have PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs.However, if that's the case, they'll probably use lower-end, DRAM-less controllers.
mode_13h - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Not to mention cheap, QLC 3D NAND.shabby - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Anything is better than slow laptop hard drives.dontlistentome - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Cheap QLC NAND is a perfect use case for consoles - write once, read lots.eek2121 - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
QLC is far too slow for that. It is also not durable enough to withstand the constant install/uninstall/reinstall cycle that most console gamers tend to do.Mr.Vegas - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
You right, but there is new QLC SSD Sabrent Rocket Q that does:1TB 3200/2000
2TB 3200/2900 <Thats just tad lower then what best TLC SSDs like MP510 do
4Tb 3200/2000
carbonium - Thursday, January 9, 2020 - link
my Sabrent 2TB Rocket NVMe 4.0 Gen4 PCIe M.2 Internal SSD does 5000/4300fred666 - Thursday, June 11, 2020 - link
QLC is more than fast enough for that. It is also more than durable enough to withstand the very few install/uninstall/reinstall cycle that most console gamers tend to do.willis936 - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Digital Foundry put out a 10 minute video named "In Theory: How SSD Could Radically Change Next-Gen Games Beyond Faster Loading" a few weeks ago. It is worth watching to inform yourself on what's going on with next gen console storage.I know it's poor form to reference other sources here, but anandtech has not been covering this.
Billy Tallis - Thursday, January 9, 2020 - link
We haven't been covering it, because most of what's out there is misguided speculation. A lot of it is stuff I know is outright wrong. When there's interesting and reliable information about console storage hardware, we'll publish it.DemonHD - Sunday, April 19, 2020 - link
Nope, it's hardware. It's specific designed SSD that designed for consoles. Also how can you say that software increases storage performance? lol.danielfranklin - Thursday, January 9, 2020 - link
Right, $400 console will have $800 worth of flash memory...You are dreaming mate. You will be lucky if you even get TLC.
Railander - Sunday, March 29, 2020 - link
i come from the future, you were absolutely correct.DnaAngel - Thursday, April 23, 2020 - link
Keep up? most are already ahead. Can't remember if it was this site or another one a while back reported or tested the PSS5's SSD benchmark scores. It was around 1000mbps (1 GB/s) actual read speed. Most PC nvme's are 3-4x that.Storris - Sunday, May 17, 2020 - link
Yes, it is.The post-GDC future says "hi"!
MTEK - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Surprised there is no 2TB capacity. You're slipping, Samsung!mode_13h - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
If they have a 2 TB 970 Pro, I'm not seeing it.See also: 2-bit MLC
Billy Tallis - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
There have been enough leaks about a 2TB 970 PRO that it clearly exists, but they can't make up their minds about when and whether to release it.austinsguitar - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
this is great news! phison's pcie4 controller is a mega energy hog and terrible performer in random writes, with other serious issues. hopefully samsung can correct this.Billy Tallis - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Phison E16 was obviously intended to be a short-lived stopgap product, so that they could ride the wave of the Ryzen 3000 release. The "real" Phison PCIe 4.0 design is the E18 coming later this year, which should take care of most of the E16's shortcomings.erinadreno - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
In the old 960 pros Samsung managed to create a 2TB drive with single sided PCB. Why they stopped using PoP for DRAM and controller packaging?boeush - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
"... by the end of this year we should start seeing the Phison E18 and other controllers offering sequential speeds around 7GB/s, so the 980 PRO may have little or no time to set throughput records for the consumer*** SSD market."*** "consumer" :: artificial benchmark that runs I/O at QD 128, I presume? I mean, we aren't *seriously* talking about QD1 numbers here, are we? In which case, WHAT THE HELL ARE WE TALKING ABOUT - AND WHY!?!?
Billy Tallis - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
The Samsung PRO line has hardly ever been something for people who care about real-world performance or who have a realistic idea about their endurance requirements. These drives are largely for consumers who want bragging rights, plus a handful of niche use cases that really aren't common enough to sustain this product line without the more-money-than-sense crowd.boeush - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
But that's basically my point: why are we putting up with this borderline false advertising, and why are we so happily complicit in helping those bozos inflict this BS upon naive consumers?These sorts of utterly unrealistic, in-practice-meaningless, deliberately deceptive and borderline fraudulent numbers should be called out, harshly and mercilessly, systematically and tirelessly, for brutal scorn and ridicule by professional reviewers. It is appalling that you guys just stand by and glad-hand this kind of manipulative nonsense!
Chaser - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Nothing still touches my INTEL 900P.Foeketijn - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Power efficiency? Performance per Dollar? Even in completely unrealistic scenarios like 15k mysql requests a 960pro or 970pro are just measurably faster. Cool device though.Foeketijn - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Slower ofcourseminde - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
need now mobile cpu with pcie 4.yeeeeman - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
This is nice but given flash storage cannot sustain more than 2.5-3Gbps steadily throughout the entire length of the drive, this increase in interface speed is good just for bursts which will see minor improvements or for real case scenarios where you have multiple drives in parallel.jeremyshaw - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Sustained writes are about 90% of the reason for buying the 970 Pro vs the cheaper, "faster" 970 EVO (and many other "cheaper, faster" NVMe drives). Short of a massive about face in strategy - and nothing has indicated as such, so far - this seems likely to be the same for the 980 Pro.Alistair - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
I'm waiting for a drive that can do 4k read at 90 MB/s before I upgrade. So far every PCIe drive is the same old 60 MB/s.Nizzen - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Try Adata sx8200pro 1TB :)75+MB/s 4k random read @QD=1
I'm getting 78MB/s with overclocked Intel cpu and 4000c16 memory.
Nizzen - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Want even more? Try Intel 900p/905p with 300+ MB/s 4k rr @QD=1DnaAngel - Thursday, April 23, 2020 - link
Been done: https://imgur.com/a/pAJdjCMMr.Vegas - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
250GB SSD shouldn't exist this day and age, even 500GB is borderline but its perfect for pure OS drive.I kinda want this SSD, but i wonder which will perform better 480GB Optane or the 500GB/1TB 980 Pro.
If this SSD cheaper then my optane, maybe ill sell it, get the 500GB 980Pro and have some extra money left
Korguz - Friday, January 10, 2020 - link
actually.. they should... 250 gigs is a good size for win10.. and other programs.. with a larger drive to install games too.. and mechanical hdds for other things that dont need speed....Mr.Vegas - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Guys, you are missing ONE HUGE point here, its Samsung PRO SSD!970PRO when filled 0 to 100% loses just a tiny bit of speed, something unimportant, unlike TLC drives it doesn't need complicated RAM cache algorithms and SLC cache layers.
When you run a benchmarks on standard SSD, even new gen PCIe 4.0, the more you fill them the lower the speed.
What it means is that this 980PRO will be doing the same and we will get FULL SPEED from 0 to 100% fill.
jmadden5124 - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Its disappointing that they're only making a 1TB drive as the highest capacity when other companies have 2TB drives. I expect more from Samsung.Korguz - Friday, January 10, 2020 - link
quote from mr tallis :" There have been enough leaks about a 2TB 970 PRO that it clearly exists, but they can't make up their minds about when and whether to release it. "
yetanotherhuman - Thursday, January 30, 2020 - link
A real flagship. Top end drives should always be MLC, 2-bit per cell.Anymoore - Thursday, February 6, 2020 - link
1TB used up easily with games over 100 GB, speed is not helping.Deo-et-Patriae - Thursday, March 19, 2020 - link
Damnit, and in a week I wanted to buy a Samsung 970 EVO Plus. Now what do I do? Q2 is coming, but that could easily mean at the end of Q2. I want to keep my 2 Samsungs 860 as Boot Drives ( obviously one of the two ) and the EVO Plus NVME for Games.