Just have a look at Notebook check's review of the Dell Inspiron 15 5575 (Ryzen 2200u).
The review's summary is: "Dell has equipped its 5000 series with a heavily-throttled Ryzen 3 chip, a dark, low-contrast screen and a storage device that clicks annoyingly. Was this clumsiness or intention?"
And the verdict:
"Acer has already shown us how to create a good office all-rounder that can keep up with current Intel chips and even trumped them during occasional gaming with Ryzen 3. Dell, unfortunately, has decided to take a different path, which, we believe, led the manufacturer to an unsuccessful implementation of Ryzen 3. The APU throttles so heavily that it cannot even get close to its turbo clock rates. Therefore, the processor, application and games benchmarks are disappointing - and the clicking hard drive is the last straw. Dell has not done the AMD Ryzen a favor with this laptop - unlike Acer with its Aspire 3 A315-41."
Don't get me wrong, I'd love for Dell's AMD gaming laptop to be good, it's just that so far Dell is not the OEM that you'd associate with good AMD based products. Maybe this has changed - we'll see.
You realise that previous mobile chips were based on older AMD tech, and that those new CPU are better than intel in thermal efficiency, right? It's not about judging how Dell integrates better AMD than intel, it's about how those CPU are able to perform under thermal constrain.
But if everyone else integrated that APU better than Dell, that says something about them, doesn't it. The review specifically quotes the Acer Laptop with the same APU that gets 30% (or so) better performance. The Dell model was poorly configured with bottom end parts, but wasn't a bargain either.
But, this IS about judging how Dell Integrates AMD and how they integrate Intel APU's. Its been noted from previous reviews that Dell artificially constrained an already constrained mobile APU. It was Dell's responsibility to build cooling which was capable of handling the APU and hw in question. Simple answer is, they chose not to.
I do hope they produce a far better option this time around.
Acer does better implementation of AMD hw with proper cooling, but their product support is rather lacking (they usually discontinue support about 6 months after releasing a product) and their BIOS is really outdated.
I loved the Acer Helios 500 PH517-61 though (Ryzen 2700 and Vega 56). Really efficient, dead silent (even at full load temps were around 65 degrees C for the CPU and GPU - that essentially beat MANY desktops), however, Acer did make a few mistakes with it: outdated BIOS interface and severely locked down at that... no new relevant BIOS updates. Acer also made a B450 mobo with 4 RAM slots... two of which were directly underneat the kb and populated them with 2x8GB 2400MhZ (slow) RAM. It was impossible to reach the RAM slots in question to swap out for more RAM unfortunately without completely disassembling the unit.
I wouldn't mind an Acer Zen 2 laptop which is powerful, but they need to introduce a better BIOS, sensible RAM implementation (all RAM slots on easily accessible side with the rest of the hw, such as the CPU/GPU, SSD, HDD, etc) and not discontinue product support after only 6 months.
That was a monster laptop with respectable performance. Acer did drop the ball with it.
Which is in some ways a good thing. Chunky thick chassis means more room for cooling and potentially quieter, larger fans. I would happily accept a two inch thick brick of a laptop if it was quiet and kept the guts inside cool.
Indeed. I don't mind a chunkier laptop, so long as the cooling is properly beefed up to allow the hw (both APU and dGPU) to reach and maintain MAXIMUM advertised boost speeds indefinitely (aka, for as long as one needs it) and has minimal noise.
Acer did it with PH517-61 (Ryzen 2700 and Vega 56) - insanely efficient and dead quiet, even at full load you could barely hear it ramp up lightly... but it was more like a low background hum (even with the CPU/GPU stressed to 100%). Shame Acer discontinued support for it 6 months after releasing it... and they had a rather poor choice for RAM implementation (along with an outdated BIOS UI).
The thermal protection will prevent the laptop from burning itself out... but only if the cooling is adequate. Asus made a mistake with GL702ZC cooling where the temps reached about 85 deg C at full load... but after about a month of consistent use,the motherboard would fry (basically because Asus botched the cooling assembly in a 17" unit).
So, its not impossible for the laptop to continue functioning with acceptable temps, only for something else to fry down the line.
The thickness is fine so long as the cooling assembly is good enough to ensure the APU and dGPU can both reach and maintain their advertised boost speeds indefinitely with minimal noise. We know its more than doable.
I really don't like it how OEM's can cut corners with AMD.
Lenovo did it with their all AMD laptops that had 2700u and 3700u by integrating a single cooling pipe, whereas the Intel variant (Without a dedicated GPU as well) had two cooling pipes as part of the cooling assembly.
The 2.5in spinning rust is wasted space. Just use one of the cheapo Intel 660p SSD's fo bulk storage. That could have made room for a seriously beefy battery.
Even in 15" units, there's more than enough space for SSD m.2 (say from crucial which are fast, cheap and reliable) and a HDD (though having 2 m.2 slots might be a far better option - problem is, the higher capacities are more expensive).
The HDD is useful for data storage and (unfortunately) still cheaper than SSD's when it comes to higher capacities.
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Irata - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Sounds nice, but a Dell system with an AMD CPU ?I'd probably be constantly wondering what they did to gimp it
olde94 - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
what?Irata - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Just have a look at Notebook check's review of the Dell Inspiron 15 5575 (Ryzen 2200u).The review's summary is: "Dell has equipped its 5000 series with a heavily-throttled Ryzen 3 chip, a dark, low-contrast screen and a storage device that clicks annoyingly. Was this clumsiness or intention?"
And the verdict:
"Acer has already shown us how to create a good office all-rounder that can keep up with current Intel chips and even trumped them during occasional gaming with Ryzen 3. Dell, unfortunately, has decided to take a different path, which, we believe, led the manufacturer to an unsuccessful implementation of Ryzen 3. The APU throttles so heavily that it cannot even get close to its turbo clock rates. Therefore, the processor, application and games benchmarks are disappointing - and the clicking hard drive is the last straw. Dell has not done the AMD Ryzen a favor with this laptop - unlike Acer with its Aspire 3 A315-41."
Irata - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Don't get me wrong, I'd love for Dell's AMD gaming laptop to be good, it's just that so far Dell is not the OEM that you'd associate with good AMD based products. Maybe this has changed - we'll see.dboris - Friday, January 10, 2020 - link
You realise that previous mobile chips were based on older AMD tech, and that those new CPU are better than intel in thermal efficiency, right?It's not about judging how Dell integrates better AMD than intel, it's about how those CPU are able to perform under thermal constrain.
Irata - Sunday, January 12, 2020 - link
But if everyone else integrated that APU better than Dell, that says something about them, doesn't it. The review specifically quotes the Acer Laptop with the same APU that gets 30% (or so) better performance.The Dell model was poorly configured with bottom end parts, but wasn't a bargain either.
deksman2 - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
But, this IS about judging how Dell Integrates AMD and how they integrate Intel APU's.Its been noted from previous reviews that Dell artificially constrained an already constrained mobile APU.
It was Dell's responsibility to build cooling which was capable of handling the APU and hw in question. Simple answer is, they chose not to.
I do hope they produce a far better option this time around.
Acer does better implementation of AMD hw with proper cooling, but their product support is rather lacking (they usually discontinue support about 6 months after releasing a product) and their BIOS is really outdated.
I loved the Acer Helios 500 PH517-61 though (Ryzen 2700 and Vega 56). Really efficient, dead silent (even at full load temps were around 65 degrees C for the CPU and GPU - that essentially beat MANY desktops), however, Acer did make a few mistakes with it: outdated BIOS interface and severely locked down at that... no new relevant BIOS updates.
Acer also made a B450 mobo with 4 RAM slots... two of which were directly underneat the kb and populated them with 2x8GB 2400MhZ (slow) RAM.
It was impossible to reach the RAM slots in question to swap out for more RAM unfortunately without completely disassembling the unit.
I wouldn't mind an Acer Zen 2 laptop which is powerful, but they need to introduce a better BIOS, sensible RAM implementation (all RAM slots on easily accessible side with the rest of the hw, such as the CPU/GPU, SSD, HDD, etc) and not discontinue product support after only 6 months.
That was a monster laptop with respectable performance. Acer did drop the ball with it.
jgraham11 - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Yep, mechanical HDs...qlum - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
at least those can easily be replaced and are pretty much dispoable in my opinion.Cliff34 - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Love to see how it performs compared to Ice Lake.sorten - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
This is an H-series AMD chip, so it's running at a 45w TDP, so it's in a completely different class than Ice Lake.drothgery - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
though there actually are 8-core H-series Intel partsSolarBear28 - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
True, but those are not Ice Lakedboris - Friday, January 10, 2020 - link
And are less efficient because note 7nmCliff34 - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
how about compare to Tiger Lake?Nozuka - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Looks like they travelled back in time for this design....PeachNCream - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Which is in some ways a good thing. Chunky thick chassis means more room for cooling and potentially quieter, larger fans. I would happily accept a two inch thick brick of a laptop if it was quiet and kept the guts inside cool.deksman2 - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
Indeed. I don't mind a chunkier laptop, so long as the cooling is properly beefed up to allow the hw (both APU and dGPU) to reach and maintain MAXIMUM advertised boost speeds indefinitely (aka, for as long as one needs it) and has minimal noise.Acer did it with PH517-61 (Ryzen 2700 and Vega 56) - insanely efficient and dead quiet, even at full load you could barely hear it ramp up lightly... but it was more like a low background hum (even with the CPU/GPU stressed to 100%).
Shame Acer discontinued support for it 6 months after releasing it... and they had a rather poor choice for RAM implementation (along with an outdated BIOS UI).
sorten - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
Yeah, I like it.benedict - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
The design is awesome. Those thin laptops that claim to be modern can't do any real work and overheat after a minute on full load.Retycint - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
Technically it can't overheat because thermal protections kick in and throttle the processor.Anyway the problem with the design is not so much the thickness, but rather the aesthetic that looks odd
deksman2 - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
The thermal protection will prevent the laptop from burning itself out... but only if the cooling is adequate.Asus made a mistake with GL702ZC cooling where the temps reached about 85 deg C at full load... but after about a month of consistent use,the motherboard would fry (basically because Asus botched the cooling assembly in a 17" unit).
So, its not impossible for the laptop to continue functioning with acceptable temps, only for something else to fry down the line.
The thickness is fine so long as the cooling assembly is good enough to ensure the APU and dGPU can both reach and maintain their advertised boost speeds indefinitely with minimal noise.
We know its more than doable.
I really don't like it how OEM's can cut corners with AMD.
Lenovo did it with their all AMD laptops that had 2700u and 3700u by integrating a single cooling pipe, whereas the Intel variant (Without a dedicated GPU as well) had two cooling pipes as part of the cooling assembly.
Ej24 - Tuesday, January 7, 2020 - link
The 2.5in spinning rust is wasted space. Just use one of the cheapo Intel 660p SSD's fo bulk storage. That could have made room for a seriously beefy battery.Korguz - Wednesday, January 8, 2020 - link
spinning rust.. the stupidest term to call a mechanical hdddeksman2 - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
Why use Intel?They can use Crucials' stuff (cheap and reliable).
deksman2 - Friday, February 21, 2020 - link
Even in 15" units, there's more than enough space for SSD m.2 (say from crucial which are fast, cheap and reliable) and a HDD (though having 2 m.2 slots might be a far better option - problem is, the higher capacities are more expensive).The HDD is useful for data storage and (unfortunately) still cheaper than SSD's when it comes to higher capacities.
jlanzobr - Friday, April 17, 2020 - link
Any word on what the Linux support will be like with Renoir and Navi mobile?