Doesn't that invalidate VMware's x86 emulation in their VMs and also for KVM/QEMU? I don't think emulating a hardware is illegal. The Apps running on top of it are. Like how the Nintendo emulators are all OK to publish and distribute, but it is the game ROMs that land the websites in trouble with Nintendo.
The part about calling it "Windows on Snapdragon" is off putting too, and indeed Microsoft hasn't been calling it that at all: it is good you can boot this OS on a Raspberry Pi just as well as Snapdragon phones. Sure they have the lead for now, but this won't have legs if it's just a single vendor SoC choice console, it needs to be an ecosystem open to all vendors.
Is it just me, or is mmWave just a head fake? Who's (Verizon, et al) going pay for transceivers on every street light. phone pole, and traffic light? And, of course, in lots of places that won't make for sufficient density for mmWave. And, again, unless something has changed very recently, mmWave won't make it through even stick built houses, so you'll need a transceiver on every roof and a high speed router(s) wired to it. If all that sounds like a land line, your right. All to support infotainment?? The fall of Western Civilization.
A head fake? No. But it's definitely not going to be deployed everywhere -- I mean really everyone who is sitting there thinking it's a joke because they would need to deploy it on every corner is missing the point. It's not meant to cover everywhere. It will be used in high density areas -- downtown areas of large cities, sports arenas, convention centers, etc. I mean mmWave is PERFECT for some of these areas -- think of how bad cellular data coverage can be in some of these ultra-dense environments (sports arenas, convention centers, etc) this is where mmWave will be deployed, especially initially, and where it will actually have a legit huge impact.
Actually they just brushed past low band but 600-800MHz is what 5G you're gonna get in most parts of the world due to coverage and cost, and it's no faster than 4G.
Yeah but I was talking about 600-800MHz, not the 3GHz+ range which has much weaker coverage. If you paid attention to every sentence they brushed past that, which is actually the frequency that will be utilized with the widest distribution.
mmWave require mmWave antena and SOC chip in phones. Huawei and Mediatek chips currently will not support it and there are probably a reason. And Qualcomm don't have a cheap SOC intergrated with 5G. There is rumor that mmwave speed will make the SOC too hot? So it remain a question that telcos will bother to use mmWave in a few locations. The US real example of mmWave is a joke.
is it Verizon that has the teevee advert about putting 5G (type unspecified, but might be mmWave) in NFL stadiums (presumably so fans can watch the game on their phones?)? then the advert goes on with, appr. "if XYZ can do this for the NFL, imagine what it can do for you". yeah, if you have a Tom Brady sized mansion.
> Who's (Verizon, et al) going pay for transceivers on every street light. phone pole, and traffic light?
That is the problem with Small Cells. The incentives right now isn't there. That is why there are talks about Government leasing Lamp post or traffic light, and form a separate company that handles small cells around cities .
But then we have Carriers using different tech and dont play well with each other.
I was hoping for a little more detail of another perspective but more or less as expected Qualcomm didn't go into details, they have a piece of the pie, just not as big as Huawei's eating from both the consumers' and the operators' sides.
Note: this article has some formatting issues resulting in repeated content
A lot translation errors I'll need to take care of: "the headline": toutiao.com, a Chinese news portal "flew to prison/write prison": literary inquisition, censorship "was drunk": Orz, left speechless
"harmonious strength": enforcement of censorship "251 mobile phone": refers to Huawei, for its power over the judicial branch(there is no branch actually since there's no separation of power in China) to jail its former employee for 251 days in an attempt to extort a confession and NDA from him "this number": this account
"fired by the media": a buzz in the media
"The most loud": the hottest
"it is practical when it is practical": it tanks when tested in real-life conditions (no idea how Google translated this) "the practical problem of MIMO": the issue of real-life use of MIMO "if there is a need to increase equipment, there will be costs": but equipment expenditure must increase, and there will be higher costs
"built with a golden frequency": built to operate in a frequency band with ideal characteristics "N infrastructures ": countless basestations
"very 'touching'": (sarcasm)serious headache
"pure testing": testing under theoretical circumstances
"so pitted": such a disappointment
"one radish and one pit are already full": bands are already assigned dedicated functions
"technology pocket": technology to fall back on "the three major operators can only divide the 23M bandwidth":the three major operators can only get 23M bandwidth each "5G uses this bandwidth and the network speed is similar to 4G": If 5G uses this bit of bandwidth, network speed would be similar to 4G
"for 5G and 5G": 5G for 5G's sake "In addition to equipment vendors": Except for infrastructure vendors
"Mi - wave radar": meter-wave radar "violently piled up/violent stacking": achieved through brute force "bandwidth N doubles, the antenna doubles N": many times the bandwidth, many times the antennas
"broadcast and television": China Broadcast Network "raise the bar": bicker "what a company to do whatever": the "you know who" company(refering to Huawei) could do something different
"If this gadget is deployed near the community, it is estimated that the residents of the community will make various complaints.": refers to various disputes between homeowners(who fear cell towers) and carriers (who want coverage) in the past caused by fear of RF radiation in China
"communication professionals": telecoms industry insiders "lose their imagination and thus dismiss the industry": become disillusioned and leave with their money
"5G is a breakthrough in the basic theory": 5G is *without* a breakthrough in fundamental theory(another very strange mistranslation) "already a wildfire": already possessed, gone mad
"very rogue propaganda routine": very deceitful advertisement "three or five hundred megabytes of bandwidth": three or five hundred megahertz of bandwidth
"is the second TDS"：is yet another TDS(TDS-CDMA, China Mobile's compromised 3G solution) "Mobile will not wield its sword in a short time": China Mobile will not castrate itself in the short term
Oh for the record I'm posting this to see if anybody could dispute him with something solid, I guess Anandtech is as good a place as any. I know two Huawei trolls eager to call him a liar, but they have nothing on him, nada. I actually suspect that nobody could, because I haven't seen anything substantial inside the wall for a year either, while the Party wouldn't have had to censor him back in June if they could publically refute him instead.
He compared real 5G speed to theory 4G speed. Why he didn't go out and ask real China 5G user their opinions and experience? If you don't get super high 4G speed now then you will not get it forever, because the telcos will stop invest in 4G and switch to 5G because it is more cost effective GB per investment dollar. If you think 4G speed is better then you can always turn off 5G in your phone but cannot turn on 5G on 4G network! The 5G speed in China starting at 10 times more than 4G and will be better time by time when more user switch to them. For 5G factories you can always have special 5G mmWave equipment and special contracts.
"He compared real 5G speed to theory 4G speed." No he compared real 5G speed to real 4G speed, bar carrier throttling which is part of carrier's business plans, not whether or not 5G is truly superior. Part of his argument was that carriers crippling 4G to make room for 5G only hurts consumers.
"If you think 4G speed is better then you can always turn off 5G in your phone but cannot turn on 5G on 4G network" Where did you even get that idea? Because of the push to 5G and in China Mobile's instance band overlap some if not soon all 4G cell towers will be converted to 5G, and the cheapest 4G plans are more than a magnitude cheaper than 5G plans with a mandatory high data cap that many may never need. "cost effective GB per investment dollar" I suppose this makes more sense where there's net neutrality, but in China where there is none, a certain 1.5GB/mo plan would be enough for almost everybody, because contained within the plan is free unlimited data toward certain video apps(choice between Tencent or Alibaba), music apps(choice between Tencent or Alibaba), shopping apps(choice between Tencent or Alibaba), even browsers in the case of Alibaba, so aside from Wechat that's only covered in Tencent's plan you need very little data otherwise and it would be very hard to push consumers to expend data elsewhere. Oh, currently there are no such plans in 5G and the rates would be hard to say by then.
"The 5G speed in China starting at 10 times more than 4G" You didn't understand the article, it's fast, where they allow it to be, before they inevitably push for coverage across most of China with the 600-800MHz band where speeds will drop because low frequencies don't have the bandwidth. And you probably didn't watch the embedded video, the guy demonstrated near 1Gbps speeds near a window, and 3-5m into the room speeds drop to ~20Mbps.
"For 5G factories you can always have special 5G mmWave equipment and special contracts." Certainly possible, but Tieliu made it clear that 5G should serve mid-low range spot coverage between WiFi and 4G, not replace 4G, and this doesn't refute him.
"in China Mobile's instance band overlap some if not soon all 4G cell towers will be converted to 5G"
yeah. big deal. mmWave transceivers on those towers will provide nearly no coverage. sub6 (and only very 'sub') "5G" may almost get to 4G limits. but I doubt. ya cannow fool the laws of physics.
That's the point he was making, no sign of mmWave deployment in China, only sub-6, and quite a large share of that "very sub", as you said. And the ultimate conclusion is that 5G should only be used for spot coverage, while retaining 4G as it is or continuing to increase density with existing 4G as it's more cost effective at the lower theoretical speeds of "very sub 6".
Sorry, I'm not getting what exactly you don't understand so I don't think I can answer that in a way you could. As for the layout it's just a sentence of Chinese with a sentence of translated English, but...there are duplicate sentences here and there. But I don't believe it impedes comprehension, it's not like any of the content self-contradict, it all says the same thing in the end. There's another paraphrase above that maybe you could understand, IDK.
Unless you live in a tent located in a park with mmWave enabled light posts, then 5G will be an evolution rather than a revolution. Regardless, I'll take penetration over raw speed all day, every day.
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nandnandnand - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
"Fireside Interview"*Fireside Chat
Ian Cutress - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
I had that as my first suggested title, but then it wasn't really a chat 😅GreenReaper - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
Lying naked on a bearskin rug, enjoying the warming caress of 5G mmWave...nandnandnand - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
Is Intel still threatening to sue over x86 emulation on Windows on ARM? Maybe they will do it if sales rise.SeleniumGlow - Tuesday, December 3, 2019 - link
Doesn't that invalidate VMware's x86 emulation in their VMs and also for KVM/QEMU? I don't think emulating a hardware is illegal. The Apps running on top of it are. Like how the Nintendo emulators are all OK to publish and distribute, but it is the game ROMs that land the websites in trouble with Nintendo.andychow - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
Q: Would it ever be beneficial, from your point of view, to see a ‘Windows on Exynos’, or ‘Windows on Kirin’ device, to help drive scale?A: I work for Qualcomm, so no.
Raqia - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
The part about calling it "Windows on Snapdragon" is off putting too, and indeed Microsoft hasn't been calling it that at all: it is good you can boot this OS on a Raspberry Pi just as well as Snapdragon phones. Sure they have the lead for now, but this won't have legs if it's just a single vendor SoC choice console, it needs to be an ecosystem open to all vendors.FunBunny2 - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
Is it just me, or is mmWave just a head fake? Who's (Verizon, et al) going pay for transceivers on every street light. phone pole, and traffic light? And, of course, in lots of places that won't make for sufficient density for mmWave. And, again, unless something has changed very recently, mmWave won't make it through even stick built houses, so you'll need a transceiver on every roof and a high speed router(s) wired to it. If all that sounds like a land line, your right. All to support infotainment?? The fall of Western Civilization.extide - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
A head fake? No. But it's definitely not going to be deployed everywhere -- I mean really everyone who is sitting there thinking it's a joke because they would need to deploy it on every corner is missing the point. It's not meant to cover everywhere. It will be used in high density areas -- downtown areas of large cities, sports arenas, convention centers, etc. I mean mmWave is PERFECT for some of these areas -- think of how bad cellular data coverage can be in some of these ultra-dense environments (sports arenas, convention centers, etc) this is where mmWave will be deployed, especially initially, and where it will actually have a legit huge impact.s.yu - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
Actually they just brushed past low band but 600-800MHz is what 5G you're gonna get in most parts of the world due to coverage and cost, and it's no faster than 4G.extide - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
Ehh, there is better spectral efficiency and better handling of high density -- even in the sub 6 range as well.s.yu - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
Yeah but I was talking about 600-800MHz, not the 3GHz+ range which has much weaker coverage. If you paid attention to every sentence they brushed past that, which is actually the frequency that will be utilized with the widest distribution.extide - Tuesday, December 3, 2019 - link
Yeah, but even in that low band you get better spectral efficiency with 5G over 4G -- so it is faster. There is better channel sharing, etc.s.yu - Wednesday, December 4, 2019 - link
"better spectral efficiency"Yeah...but how much? According to the article below , it's 1-2%.
Kabm - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
mmWave require mmWave antena and SOC chip in phones. Huawei and Mediatek chips currently will not support it and there are probably a reason. And Qualcomm don't have a cheap SOC intergrated with 5G. There is rumor that mmwave speed will make the SOC too hot? So it remain a question that telcos will bother to use mmWave in a few locations. The US real example of mmWave is a joke.s.yu - Wednesday, December 4, 2019 - link
Without mmWave peak speeds would already be far lower than promised.Industrial usage is fine, a form of expanded Wifi so to speak.
FunBunny2 - Wednesday, December 4, 2019 - link
"Industrial usage is fine"is it Verizon that has the teevee advert about putting 5G (type unspecified, but might be mmWave) in NFL stadiums (presumably so fans can watch the game on their phones?)? then the advert goes on with, appr. "if XYZ can do this for the NFL, imagine what it can do for you". yeah, if you have a Tom Brady sized mansion.
ksec - Tuesday, December 3, 2019 - link
> Who's (Verizon, et al) going pay for transceivers on every street light. phone pole, and traffic light?That is the problem with Small Cells. The incentives right now isn't there. That is why there are talks about Government leasing Lamp post or traffic light, and form a separate company that handles small cells around cities .
But then we have Carriers using different tech and dont play well with each other.
s.yu - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
I was hoping for a little more detail of another perspective but more or less as expected Qualcomm didn't go into details, they have a piece of the pie, just not as big as Huawei's eating from both the consumers' and the operators' sides.Meanwhile here's Tieliu's perspective, in much more detail than this, via Google translate:
https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&s...
Note: this article has some formatting issues resulting in repeated content
A lot translation errors I'll need to take care of:
"the headline": toutiao.com, a Chinese news portal
"flew to prison/write prison": literary inquisition, censorship
"was drunk": Orz, left speechless
"harmonious strength": enforcement of censorship
"251 mobile phone": refers to Huawei, for its power over the judicial branch(there is no branch actually since there's no separation of power in China) to jail its former employee for 251 days in an attempt to extort a confession and NDA from him
"this number": this account
"fired by the media": a buzz in the media
"The most loud": the hottest
"it is practical when it is practical": it tanks when tested in real-life conditions (no idea how Google translated this)
"the practical problem of MIMO": the issue of real-life use of MIMO
"if there is a need to increase equipment, there will be costs": but equipment expenditure must increase, and there will be higher costs
"built with a golden frequency": built to operate in a frequency band with ideal characteristics
"N infrastructures ": countless basestations
"very 'touching'": (sarcasm)serious headache
"pure testing": testing under theoretical circumstances
"so pitted": such a disappointment
"one radish and one pit are already full": bands are already assigned dedicated functions
"technology pocket": technology to fall back on
"the three major operators can only divide the 23M bandwidth":the three major operators can only get 23M bandwidth each
"5G uses this bandwidth and the network speed is similar to 4G": If 5G uses this bit of bandwidth, network speed would be similar to 4G
"for 5G and 5G": 5G for 5G's sake
"In addition to equipment vendors": Except for infrastructure vendors
"Mi - wave radar": meter-wave radar
"violently piled up/violent stacking": achieved through brute force
"bandwidth N doubles, the antenna doubles N": many times the bandwidth, many times the antennas
"broadcast and television": China Broadcast Network
"raise the bar": bicker
"what a company to do whatever": the "you know who" company(refering to Huawei) could do something different
"If this gadget is deployed near the community, it is estimated that the residents of the community will make various complaints.": refers to various disputes between homeowners(who fear cell towers) and carriers (who want coverage) in the past caused by fear of RF radiation in China
"communication professionals": telecoms industry insiders
"lose their imagination and thus dismiss the industry": become disillusioned and leave with their money
"5G is a breakthrough in the basic theory": 5G is *without* a breakthrough in fundamental theory(another very strange mistranslation)
"already a wildfire": already possessed, gone mad
"very rogue propaganda routine": very deceitful advertisement
"three or five hundred megabytes of bandwidth": three or five hundred megahertz of bandwidth
"is the second TDS"：is yet another TDS(TDS-CDMA, China Mobile's compromised 3G solution)
"Mobile will not wield its sword in a short time": China Mobile will not castrate itself in the short term
s.yu - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
Oh for the record I'm posting this to see if anybody could dispute him with something solid, I guess Anandtech is as good a place as any. I know two Huawei trolls eager to call him a liar, but they have nothing on him, nada.I actually suspect that nobody could, because I haven't seen anything substantial inside the wall for a year either, while the Party wouldn't have had to censor him back in June if they could publically refute him instead.
Kabm - Monday, December 2, 2019 - link
He compared real 5G speed to theory 4G speed. Why he didn't go out and ask real China 5G user their opinions and experience? If you don't get super high 4G speed now then you will not get it forever, because the telcos will stop invest in 4G and switch to 5G because it is more cost effective GB per investment dollar. If you think 4G speed is better then you can always turn off 5G in your phone but cannot turn on 5G on 4G network! The 5G speed in China starting at 10 times more than 4G and will be better time by time when more user switch to them. For 5G factories you can always have special 5G mmWave equipment and special contracts.s.yu - Tuesday, December 3, 2019 - link
"He compared real 5G speed to theory 4G speed."No he compared real 5G speed to real 4G speed, bar carrier throttling which is part of carrier's business plans, not whether or not 5G is truly superior. Part of his argument was that carriers crippling 4G to make room for 5G only hurts consumers.
"If you think 4G speed is better then you can always turn off 5G in your phone but cannot turn on 5G on 4G network"
Where did you even get that idea? Because of the push to 5G and in China Mobile's instance band overlap some if not soon all 4G cell towers will be converted to 5G, and the cheapest 4G plans are more than a magnitude cheaper than 5G plans with a mandatory high data cap that many may never need.
"cost effective GB per investment dollar"
I suppose this makes more sense where there's net neutrality, but in China where there is none, a certain 1.5GB/mo plan would be enough for almost everybody, because contained within the plan is free unlimited data toward certain video apps(choice between Tencent or Alibaba), music apps(choice between Tencent or Alibaba), shopping apps(choice between Tencent or Alibaba), even browsers in the case of Alibaba, so aside from Wechat that's only covered in Tencent's plan you need very little data otherwise and it would be very hard to push consumers to expend data elsewhere. Oh, currently there are no such plans in 5G and the rates would be hard to say by then.
"The 5G speed in China starting at 10 times more than 4G"
You didn't understand the article, it's fast, where they allow it to be, before they inevitably push for coverage across most of China with the 600-800MHz band where speeds will drop because low frequencies don't have the bandwidth.
And you probably didn't watch the embedded video, the guy demonstrated near 1Gbps speeds near a window, and 3-5m into the room speeds drop to ~20Mbps.
"For 5G factories you can always have special 5G mmWave equipment and special contracts."
Certainly possible, but Tieliu made it clear that 5G should serve mid-low range spot coverage between WiFi and 4G, not replace 4G, and this doesn't refute him.
FunBunny2 - Tuesday, December 3, 2019 - link
"in China Mobile's instance band overlap some if not soon all 4G cell towers will be converted to 5G"yeah. big deal. mmWave transceivers on those towers will provide nearly no coverage. sub6 (and only very 'sub') "5G" may almost get to 4G limits. but I doubt. ya cannow fool the laws of physics.
s.yu - Wednesday, December 4, 2019 - link
That's the point he was making, no sign of mmWave deployment in China, only sub-6, and quite a large share of that "very sub", as you said.And the ultimate conclusion is that 5G should only be used for spot coverage, while retaining 4G as it is or continuing to increase density with existing 4G as it's more cost effective at the lower theoretical speeds of "very sub 6".
ksec - Tuesday, December 3, 2019 - link
I can read both language but I dont understand a word of it by the way how it is lay out. Even your previous comment is hard to read.What do you want to be deputed? or Understand
s.yu - Wednesday, December 4, 2019 - link
Sorry, I'm not getting what exactly you don't understand so I don't think I can answer that in a way you could.As for the layout it's just a sentence of Chinese with a sentence of translated English, but...there are duplicate sentences here and there. But I don't believe it impedes comprehension, it's not like any of the content self-contradict, it all says the same thing in the end.
There's another paraphrase above that maybe you could understand, IDK.
mrvco - Saturday, December 7, 2019 - link
Unless you live in a tent located in a park with mmWave enabled light posts, then 5G will be an evolution rather than a revolution. Regardless, I'll take penetration over raw speed all day, every day.jasonadams - Tuesday, January 18, 2022 - link
That was an interesting interview!Recently learned about tracking Instagram users' activity without installing any apps: https://celltrackingapps.com/snoopreport-review/