The other use case is a non-upgradable eGPU box. Making it non-upgradable makes it substantially cheaper. Probably most of the savings is in the power supply.
Well now that Spunjii kindly converted the article into something coherent enough to understand... Maybe, but this is going to be a custom single board GPU solution tied to a TB controller so all of the costly parts are still present plus there's the low volume nature of a niche graphics card design so I'm not sure how much savings we would see at retail for a hypothetical graphics product.
I think they kinda mangled the description here - this is still a solution for externally adding a GPU to your existing TB3 capable device.
The difference between this and your average eGPU solution is that rather than having a large box that takes a standard graphics card in a PCIe slot, they've merged the GPU and the TB3 controller onto one board. That's been done before, though, so I'm not sure why they're talking about this as if it's a new concept.
I think this is a good idea. TB3.0 cases that take mini-ITX GPUs are ridiculously expensive. This way people can buy ASRock's mini-ITX fitting eGPU and put it into a regular Mini-ITX case that will be much cheaper.
It all depends on how much ASRock will be charging for the GPU+TB3 "motherboard", but since the TB3 eGPU cases are horribly expensive it might be a cheaper alternative to many end users.
USB4/TB3 and their next generations perhaps based on PCIe 4 and 5 allow to disaggregate our decades old notion of PC, with motherboards and slots. It now becomes a compute core and various docks connected by bundles of PCIe (or InfinityFabric) lanes, instead of tons of different legacy ports.
The break-out into legacy (including DP/HDMI or lower rate USB) happens in the docks, which contain some type of "southswitch".
Perhaps they'll even find a proper way to have the same 15Watt/TDP compute core that you carry inside your ultrabook-dock be cooled quitely yet efficiently when it runs at 80 Watts killing monsters on the eGPU.
I guess I'd like it even more if you could aggregate these compute cores and eGPUs via these USB4/TB3/PCIex fabrics to form 2x, 4x,... power workstations on demand (or budget).
This article was confusing (Ian I think you need another day of jet-lag recovery before getting back to work), and I feel like I'm missing something.
How does moving the TB3 chip from the enclosure to the box reduce the total initial price of the box+gpu? Long term I'd expect it to be more expensive since you'd need to buy a new TB3 chip every time you upgrade your car; and would be limited to cards from ASRock.
Wrapping my head around this... So, this is for OEMs who wish to build an TB3-connected eGPU in their own case or display, so that it is cheaper overall than a TB3-to-PCIe-to-PU configuration because they skip the PCIe step? The end user buys an external GPU for their PC/laptop, but loses the ability to upgrade the GPU - but they pay less than an external PCIe case and GPU. I suspect that's a reasonable trade-off for many users - those who don't value the ability to upgrade a GPU, or never plan to place it inside a larger system, or who think a USB-to-PCIe case is a bad idea since PCIe 4 is coming, or mabe those who just expect even more extreme changes to come to the PC market before they would buy their next GPU.
Ian I personally found the first paragraph very confusing. Even though I know about all the tech you are talking about. I'm sure you guys have been slammed for Computex coverage but it might be worth your time to reword the first paragraph.
Something like - ASRock is showing off a demo external GPU of sorts. ASRock's design integrates thunderbolts 3 into the pcb to connect to the computer instead of a PCIe lanes. This reduces the need for PCIe to thunderbolt adapter normally found in external GPU boxes. Which is how egpu in laptops are set up. Though this is a first for an external. Which makes the name ASRock is calling their device "Thunderbolt GPU" confusing.
"If you say ‘Thunderbolt GPU’, it makes it sound like a PCIe device with a Thunderbolt output. Rather than go in this direction, ASRock has developed a GPU + Thunderbolt connection like an eGPU, but all on one PCB. This means that this is an eGPU designed for internal applications, like mini PCs and GPU-accelerated monitors. Confused yet?"
So the value proposition is to make a GPU "board" of sorts that fits the motherboard form factor of a standard mini-ITX case, or in any PC case for that matter, as casing. This could be interesting if the eGPU board is not very expensive relative to a comparable GPU card. For most enthusiasts an empty PC case is already a sunk cost.
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PeachNCream - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Seems like it could just be on PCIe instead if its going to be internal anyhow.The Chill Blueberry - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
I think the point was to put the GPU in the monitor, being external to the laptop but not another box taking space on the desk.bryanlarsen - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
The other use case is a non-upgradable eGPU box. Making it non-upgradable makes it substantially cheaper. Probably most of the savings is in the power supply.PeachNCream - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Well now that Spunjii kindly converted the article into something coherent enough to understand... Maybe, but this is going to be a custom single board GPU solution tied to a TB controller so all of the costly parts are still present plus there's the low volume nature of a niche graphics card design so I'm not sure how much savings we would see at retail for a hypothetical graphics product.Spunjji - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
I think they kinda mangled the description here - this is still a solution for externally adding a GPU to your existing TB3 capable device.The difference between this and your average eGPU solution is that rather than having a large box that takes a standard graphics card in a PCIe slot, they've merged the GPU and the TB3 controller onto one board. That's been done before, though, so I'm not sure why they're talking about this as if it's a new concept.
PeachNCream - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Ah, that makes more sense. I'm glad someone has an Anandtech-to-English translator that works.29a - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Thank you. I had no clue what this thing was after reading the article.MrSpadge - Thursday, June 6, 2019 - link
+1Retycint - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Yes exactly. Pretty sure Lenovo has had this sort of integrated non-upgradeable box before, with the 1050 Ti if I'm not wrongToTTenTranz - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
I think this is a good idea.TB3.0 cases that take mini-ITX GPUs are ridiculously expensive.
This way people can buy ASRock's mini-ITX fitting eGPU and put it into a regular Mini-ITX case that will be much cheaper.
It all depends on how much ASRock will be charging for the GPU+TB3 "motherboard", but since the TB3 eGPU cases are horribly expensive it might be a cheaper alternative to many end users.
abufrejoval - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
USB4/TB3 and their next generations perhaps based on PCIe 4 and 5 allow to disaggregate our decades old notion of PC, with motherboards and slots. It now becomes a compute core and various docks connected by bundles of PCIe (or InfinityFabric) lanes, instead of tons of different legacy ports.The break-out into legacy (including DP/HDMI or lower rate USB) happens in the docks, which contain some type of "southswitch".
Perhaps they'll even find a proper way to have the same 15Watt/TDP compute core that you carry inside your ultrabook-dock be cooled quitely yet efficiently when it runs at 80 Watts killing monsters on the eGPU.
I guess I'd like it even more if you could aggregate these compute cores and eGPUs via these USB4/TB3/PCIex fabrics to form 2x, 4x,... power workstations on demand (or budget).
DanNeely - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
This article was confusing (Ian I think you need another day of jet-lag recovery before getting back to work), and I feel like I'm missing something.How does moving the TB3 chip from the enclosure to the box reduce the total initial price of the box+gpu? Long term I'd expect it to be more expensive since you'd need to buy a new TB3 chip every time you upgrade your car; and would be limited to cards from ASRock.
cm959 - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Wrapping my head around this...So, this is for OEMs who wish to build an TB3-connected eGPU in their own case or display, so that it is cheaper overall than a TB3-to-PCIe-to-PU configuration because they skip the PCIe step?
The end user buys an external GPU for their PC/laptop, but loses the ability to upgrade the GPU - but they pay less than an external PCIe case and GPU.
I suspect that's a reasonable trade-off for many users - those who don't value the ability to upgrade a GPU, or never plan to place it inside a larger system, or who think a USB-to-PCIe case is a bad idea since PCIe 4 is coming, or mabe those who just expect even more extreme changes to come to the PC market before they would buy their next GPU.
Skeptical123 - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
Ian I personally found the first paragraph very confusing. Even though I know about all the tech you are talking about. I'm sure you guys have been slammed for Computex coverage but it might be worth your time to reword the first paragraph.Something like - ASRock is showing off a demo external GPU of sorts. ASRock's design integrates thunderbolts 3 into the pcb to connect to the computer instead of a PCIe lanes. This reduces the need for PCIe to thunderbolt adapter normally found in external GPU boxes. Which is how egpu in laptops are set up. Though this is a first for an external. Which makes the name ASRock is calling their device "Thunderbolt GPU" confusing.
"If you say ‘Thunderbolt GPU’, it makes it sound like a PCIe device with a Thunderbolt output. Rather than go in this direction, ASRock has developed a GPU + Thunderbolt connection like an eGPU, but all on one PCB. This means that this is an eGPU designed for internal applications, like mini PCs and GPU-accelerated monitors. Confused yet?"
NeBlackCat - Thursday, June 6, 2019 - link
Or even "this is an eGPU card that connects directly to TB3 rather than PCIe, thereby allowing its use in standard SFF PC cases".I may have a brain no bigger my own eyeball, but even I could instantly the implications of that.
wr3zzz - Wednesday, June 5, 2019 - link
So the value proposition is to make a GPU "board" of sorts that fits the motherboard form factor of a standard mini-ITX case, or in any PC case for that matter, as casing. This could be interesting if the eGPU board is not very expensive relative to a comparable GPU card. For most enthusiasts an empty PC case is already a sunk cost.