I've had problems too but after a complete system reinstall (uninstalling steam VR and all the HTC drivers, updating the firmware on all the hardware.. reinstalling everything.. pretty tedious) its been alright.
The timing would be good for HTC to up the game for real. A high-res VR headset would also drive GPU purchases that are pretty slow atm. The graphics cards are there, we just need a good reason to buy them. A new-gen VR headset would be that.
Graphics cards are still 2 or 3 generations behind VR. They are far too slow for proper graphics comparable to normal games and 90 Hz displays. And that (and a humane price of those graphics cards) ist still the no. 1 reason why VR doesnt take off fully.
Also Nvidia went all in on new hardware accelerators this generation of consumer cards, so the actual performance difference between a new card and a 3 year old card is smaller than it's been in quite a long time. Mainstream mid-tier cards (<$300) are at least another full generation or two away from being able to power 1440p-2160p HMDs at a comfortable refresh rate, but higher tier ($300-500) cards are right on that edge now, and the halo products from both red and green teams can manage currently (for $700-1000).
Nope. You can maybe power one 60 Hz display in 4k with one card that costs $1500. But not 2 90 Hz ones. 2 1080p maybe work with such a card, but everyone knows 1080p is a far too low resolution for VR.
The tracking may not be as bad as you think. I get excellent tracking on my Samsung Odyssey+, except if my hands are behind me, and some early hands-on tests indicate Oculus' inside-out tracking may be even better.
In the long run, I think inside-out tracking with the assistance of in-controller sensors is going to be the way to go. Most people don't have a room to dedicate to VR, and inside-out tracking is far more accessible. It'll only get better, and a larer user base is good for current users, too.
As for headphones, I can see it both ways. I think I'd rather have "good enough" but removable/replaceable. The AKG phones on the Odyssey+ sound good, but they don't isolate that well and are the only option for that HMD. I'm excited about the Quest in part because I can use my own IEMs for private and sound-isolating listening while playing games or watching movies while travelling.
Oh I don't doubt inside out tracking is here to stay. At least on the low end. In fact I 100% expect this to be really similar to what is released for the next round of consoles tracking wise. The ease of setup and being able to really put it away is a huge advantage going mass market. However it is undeniably worse tracking.
It makes sense for them. Other than the price, it probably makes sense to new consumers of VR. For current VR customers I feel like Oculus has been sending a strong signal they don't care about PC VR. Everyone was hoping that this would have at least the Quest Panels in it, but instead got the Go panels. I don't think anyone was expecting a real 2.0 rift. But its largely a step backwards for current owners. Not even like a 1.1. More like regression.
I think the idea is that they want cameras on it so that you can see your surroundings. And they used the cameras for tracking. They just saw an opportunity to cheap out on tracking and went for it. I could care less about being able to see my surroundings. I would like to see lense replacement supported by an hmd.
Think you got this one backwards. The use of PenTile (only 2 subpixels per pixel in an irregular layout) on OLED display's is the major reason for their ridiculously excerbated "screen-door effect" & total uselessness to see fine details or read text. And it requires a MASSIVE leap in nominal resolution to make up for these deficits. This is why Pimax's RGB-stripe LCD based 5K+ unit looks SOOOOO much clearer/sharper image-wise versus their much higher resolution, but PenTile OLED 8K headset. I for one welcome Oculus' shift away from OLED until Samsung stops it with all this PenTile trash, which isn't gonna happen bc $.
LCD's main advantages are a better fill ratio 'n full RGB stripes by default.
OLED's main advantages are being able to switch quickly (only 3ms out of the 11.1ms in a 90hz frame are actually displaying content in VR to minimize ghosting) and better contrast.
Up until LCDs get something like a +240hz display rate, they're not even going to hope to compare in the former, and that's actually super-important to minimizing VR fatigue. LCD's fine until you wanna play for more than 5 minutes.
What makes you equate pentile with OLED? There have been a lot of LCD pentile displays, and a lot of non pentile OLED displays.
I'll phrase it slightly differently, even if OLED had to be pentile, which is laughable, but even if it had to quadrupling pixel density would make it vastly superior even when looking at screen door effect.
If you made LCD pixel response time ten times faster than it currently is, OLED still would beat it badly.
LCD on VR makes it hot trash for anyone that wants to play for more than ten minutes.
I've been waiting for pixel density to get around 4k because of the screen door effect, 16k LCD would just be nausea inducing trash.
They have to release something to refresh the line or Facebook is going to have to answer for why the company acquired Oculus to begin with on the falling edge of this iteration of VR (admittedly that's mostly to Zuck, but it does have enough other shareholders that are willing to apply pressure). Anyhow, the shortcuts they're taking with the hardware can be explained thusly - It's a more cautious product intended to fatten margins to contend with fewer than expected sales of the prior iteration.
Ever try one of these headsets? Pixel density is too low, but FOV is WAYYYYYY too low. It looks like you're peeping through a keyhole, it's not even remotely immersive. Fix FOV and then we'll talk about spending hundreds of dollars for your toy.
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DigitalFreak - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Nice. I may pick one of these up to replace my current Rift. I was never able to get it working properly with the external cameras due to room layout.The Chill Blueberry - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
I've had problems too but after a complete system reinstall (uninstalling steam VR and all the HTC drivers, updating the firmware on all the hardware.. reinstalling everything.. pretty tedious) its been alright.Midwayman - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
"Upgraded" No IPD adjustment. Lower refresh. Worse color. Worse tracking. Worse 'headphones' I'd say this version is a net negative vs the CV1.The Chill Blueberry - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Totally, I don't understand what they are going for, except maybe a larger margin on a cheaper product.rtho782 - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
I'd agree except that it's more expensive!The Chill Blueberry - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
The timing would be good for HTC to up the game for real. A high-res VR headset would also drive GPU purchases that are pretty slow atm. The graphics cards are there, we just need a good reason to buy them. A new-gen VR headset would be that.Beaver M. - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
Graphics cards are still 2 or 3 generations behind VR. They are far too slow for proper graphics comparable to normal games and 90 Hz displays. And that (and a humane price of those graphics cards) ist still the no. 1 reason why VR doesnt take off fully.FullmetalTitan - Friday, March 22, 2019 - link
Also Nvidia went all in on new hardware accelerators this generation of consumer cards, so the actual performance difference between a new card and a 3 year old card is smaller than it's been in quite a long time. Mainstream mid-tier cards (<$300) are at least another full generation or two away from being able to power 1440p-2160p HMDs at a comfortable refresh rate, but higher tier ($300-500) cards are right on that edge now, and the halo products from both red and green teams can manage currently (for $700-1000).Beaver M. - Saturday, March 23, 2019 - link
Nope. You can maybe power one 60 Hz display in 4k with one card that costs $1500.But not 2 90 Hz ones.
2 1080p maybe work with such a card, but everyone knows 1080p is a far too low resolution for VR.
bloodgain - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
The tracking may not be as bad as you think. I get excellent tracking on my Samsung Odyssey+, except if my hands are behind me, and some early hands-on tests indicate Oculus' inside-out tracking may be even better.In the long run, I think inside-out tracking with the assistance of in-controller sensors is going to be the way to go. Most people don't have a room to dedicate to VR, and inside-out tracking is far more accessible. It'll only get better, and a larer user base is good for current users, too.
As for headphones, I can see it both ways. I think I'd rather have "good enough" but removable/replaceable. The AKG phones on the Odyssey+ sound good, but they don't isolate that well and are the only option for that HMD. I'm excited about the Quest in part because I can use my own IEMs for private and sound-isolating listening while playing games or watching movies while travelling.
Midwayman - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Oh I don't doubt inside out tracking is here to stay. At least on the low end. In fact I 100% expect this to be really similar to what is released for the next round of consoles tracking wise. The ease of setup and being able to really put it away is a huge advantage going mass market. However it is undeniably worse tracking.It makes sense for them. Other than the price, it probably makes sense to new consumers of VR. For current VR customers I feel like Oculus has been sending a strong signal they don't care about PC VR. Everyone was hoping that this would have at least the Quest Panels in it, but instead got the Go panels. I don't think anyone was expecting a real 2.0 rift. But its largely a step backwards for current owners. Not even like a 1.1. More like regression.
Opencg - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
I think the idea is that they want cameras on it so that you can see your surroundings. And they used the cameras for tracking. They just saw an opportunity to cheap out on tracking and went for it. I could care less about being able to see my surroundings. I would like to see lense replacement supported by an hmd.Dr. Swag - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Any idea if it's OLED or LCD?BenSkywalker - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
I would imagine it would have to be OLED, LCD isn't a good choice for VR.Cooe - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
Think you got this one backwards. The use of PenTile (only 2 subpixels per pixel in an irregular layout) on OLED display's is the major reason for their ridiculously excerbated "screen-door effect" & total uselessness to see fine details or read text. And it requires a MASSIVE leap in nominal resolution to make up for these deficits. This is why Pimax's RGB-stripe LCD based 5K+ unit looks SOOOOO much clearer/sharper image-wise versus their much higher resolution, but PenTile OLED 8K headset. I for one welcome Oculus' shift away from OLED until Samsung stops it with all this PenTile trash, which isn't gonna happen bc $.mukiex - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
LCD's main advantages are a better fill ratio 'n full RGB stripes by default.OLED's main advantages are being able to switch quickly (only 3ms out of the 11.1ms in a 90hz frame are actually displaying content in VR to minimize ghosting) and better contrast.
Up until LCDs get something like a +240hz display rate, they're not even going to hope to compare in the former, and that's actually super-important to minimizing VR fatigue. LCD's fine until you wanna play for more than 5 minutes.
BenSkywalker - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
What makes you equate pentile with OLED? There have been a lot of LCD pentile displays, and a lot of non pentile OLED displays.I'll phrase it slightly differently, even if OLED had to be pentile, which is laughable, but even if it had to quadrupling pixel density would make it vastly superior even when looking at screen door effect.
If you made LCD pixel response time ten times faster than it currently is, OLED still would beat it badly.
LCD on VR makes it hot trash for anyone that wants to play for more than ten minutes.
I've been waiting for pixel density to get around 4k because of the screen door effect, 16k LCD would just be nausea inducing trash.
sheh - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
LCD.rtho782 - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
It's LCD.SunLord - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Thus is basically an upgraded windows mixed reality headset it's basically ba stro Side ways and backwards.PeachNCream - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
They have to release something to refresh the line or Facebook is going to have to answer for why the company acquired Oculus to begin with on the falling edge of this iteration of VR (admittedly that's mostly to Zuck, but it does have enough other shareholders that are willing to apply pressure). Anyhow, the shortcuts they're taking with the hardware can be explained thusly - It's a more cautious product intended to fatten margins to contend with fewer than expected sales of the prior iteration.Samus - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
No price increase over the last version!? Blasphemy. Apparently they didn't get the memo from other tech giants!flyingpants265 - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
Ever try one of these headsets? Pixel density is too low, but FOV is WAYYYYYY too low. It looks like you're peeping through a keyhole, it's not even remotely immersive. Fix FOV and then we'll talk about spending hundreds of dollars for your toy.Beaver M. - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
Everyone was hoping they would fix all that in the new generation. But guess we have to wait a few generations more, if VR doesnt die on the way.