Are you certain about the inaccessible 8GB single channel ram? It sounds like a rather strange limitation. Either AMD's platform specs really suck, to the point where escape routing two DDR4 channels off the package is stupidly difficult, or AMD just isn't providing any engineering help. If there ever was a time when AMD actually needed to package 4GB or more of on-package memory, Ryzen APUs were it.
My guess is that HP is just being cheap here. The same thing has happened to previous AMD notebook generations, OEMs viewed them as the budget option and started cutting costs. Which had the effect of turning them into budget machines, something like a self fulfilling prophecy.
this is NOT AMD making such "choices" never is, they do the base "spec" which they have approved, their various partners can and do constantly muck with amount of ram, soldered or not etc etc etc.....they are not as "iron fist" as Intel would be, nor do they ultimately have a heavy enough hand to force any major OEM to bend over and do it the way they tell them to... unlike Intel, Nvidia, Apple and some others who can tell the OEM to "do it this way or else"
All that being said, many many times OEM or whatever such as Dell, HP, Acer etc "cut down" the AMD offering and yet "up" the Intel offering in regards to possibly soldered or non soldered components (including ability to add) battery size, thermal limits, cooler design/capacity etc etc.
I had a few times seen more or less Intel v AMD offering that the Intel one had more memory, was allowed to use wider range of tdp for the cpu-gpu etc, and often enough (mostly HP actually) that they gimp the AMD offering by memory selection but the Intel offering does not, converniant to make the AMD system appear "slower" or less capable?
Which is why I believe AMD should have preempted all of this and released their APUs with HBM sideport memory, or at least higher specced versions of their APUs with HBM. Instead, Intel beat them to the punch (using AMD's own GPUs!), and the remaining laptops are at the mercy of ODMs.
Not that Ryzen APUs are blameless, I have a Thinkpad E485 (a very good implementation of an AMD notebook, especially compared to the Intel version), and up until last month, it was littered with countless little problems w.r.t. video playback, color profiles, general stability of the ancient AMD drivers, etc. Last month, AMD's driver website finally admitted they have been making Ryzen laptop chips for the last year or so (yay!). Now I have to chase down why a 45Whr battery only lasts 3.5 hours, worse than my 6 year old Sony Vaio with a 48Whr battery and a dGPU (with wear, it only holds about 4.0 hours nowadays).
Actually , considering that the past 2 versions of AMD-based HP Envy x360 already HAVE dual DIMM slots, HP would actually have to SPEND MORE money to change the design, test & certify the new version.
IF this has happened (I don't believe it) it might as well be a personal discussion between Intel's HP contact and HP's guy responsible for the the development and design of the Envy x360 line.
Intel might have offered something to HP and asked HP to handicap the Ryzen Mobile systems, because the systems released last year, trounced most of the HP Intel-based lineup.
I have been in this industry for more than 23 years now and I've been part of such "dirty" discussions.
No matter if this actually happened or not, trust me : it costs HP MORE money, to change and re-certify the design, than reuse the old one.
We all know that AMD Ryzen benefits from better memory bandwidth & latency, therefore it would be a simple thing for Intel to ask HP.
Single channel for Intel is not a big problem compared with AMD and for HP this would be beneficial, because it would push clients to go for a higher grade (more expensive product line) to get Dual Channel and most likely, that higher product line doesn't even have an AMD Ryzen option.
That is probably not true. Matebook D with 2500U is one of the best performing Ryzen mobile laptops, it comes with 53Wh battery, and also offers great (6-9h) battery life- much better than others. So, it must be laptop components and laptop configuration at fault, not the AMD APU.
Nah, I say AMD should just go the Apple and MS way and manufacture their own laptop. I certainly hope that this laptop is not limited to 8GB of RAM. It's everything I look for, except for the RAM. I want/need 32 for what I do.
I also believe AMD going microsoft's way to produce its own line up would eventually be better as the techies like us would really consider those properly implemented systems.
Lenovo is doing well with their AMD based machines as well, with the majority being onboard memory plus one slot for the second channel. You may not have the option to swap out both memory channels, but at least you do get dual-bank for the memory configuration.
That manual clearly indicates that the DIMMS are removable. I own the late 2017 Ryzen 2700U model, and I can assure you that there are dual channel DRAM slots. I purchased a 2x4GB model and upgraded it myself to 2x8GB.
On testing sites, the AMD CPUs mentioned here look a little lower in single-core, but a little higher in multi-core, though I'm unsure whether they've re-tested with countermeasures to recent attacks.
The difference in frequencies between the 3500U and the 3700U is non-trival, esp. all-core turbo (3.0Ghz->3.5Ghz) - as is +25% Vega cores - but it'll depend on whether cooling is adequate, especially in an ultrabook chassis. I'd want to see reviews covering sustained load on the 3700U before deciding. Let's hope black helps them radiate heat better, like my Lenovo X120e! ;-)
Graphics-wise, AMD's APUs should shred Intel. Wireless performance is likely to be a tad lower - maybe not to a level that will be noticeable outside of tests?
Curiously, long range and faster speed modes are optional in Bluetooth 5: https://www.androidauthority.com/bluetooth-5-speed... However, I guess this might be because one or the other is more useful for particular devices.
"Graphics-wise, AMD's APUs should shred Intel." Not necessarily. If the AMD versions are memory limited due to single memory channels and the Intel ones have dual memory channels the graphics blocks of the AMD versions will be severely memory starved. It is unclear if that's the case, however Anton write "The APUs are accompanied by 8 GB of single-channel DDR4-2400 memory", which seems to suggest that only the versions with AMD's APUs have a single memory channel. The long history of AMD based laptops forced to work with one memory channel is also a bad indication, despite HP using dual memory channels in their previous gen of Ryzen based laptops.
So no TB3? For some reason I thought the previous x360's had it. Honestly, that's one thing that would hold me up from getting this one. Well, that and the RAM options stink. But price and other features seem good for a 2nd machine that I'd mostly use for travel.
Not exactly true, actually. The latest "Titan Ridge" based TB3 PCIe add-in cards (like Gigabyte's for ex) work with most TR4/X399 based motherboards right out of the box (aka, no fiddling required). This despite the platform still not having official Intel TB3 certification yet.
Ugh, giant 15 inch screen laptops. I know there's a market for them, but I'd prefer a notebook PC to have a screen below 13.5 inches with a preference for 11-12 inch screens. Make it slightly thicker if there's a need for battery capacity or cooling, but please give us more decent options that are easier to carry around than these enormous pancake computers.
There are plenty of 13-inch ultrabooks available. Also, with bezels shrinking and laptops getting thinner and lighter, 15-inch laptops are more portable than in the past.
Yeah, I do agree that they are better with smaller bezels, but 15 inch systems are still generally too large (smaller bezels reduce the footprint of 11-12 inch systems as well, after all) and using one makes me feel like I'm wandering around in the doldrums of 2009 with a dinosaur system of yore regardless of the hardware driving said screen.
There are only two 13" laptops with Ryzen mobile. One is 1.2kg light, but single channel, 12W TDP Lenovo 720S, and another- 13" HP Envy with dual channel RAM, but also limited by low 15W STAMP. Both are throtling hard. On the other hand, a 12-13", sub-1.5kg ultraportable with 35W 3550H would be perfect for me, I don't care if it is several milimeters thicker.
SO you want a tablet? 15" is anything but giant. As thin as these are, they are easily portable. Since switching to a modern machine (but not as thin as these), I can get my laptop AND my external USB monitor in the same carry bag that previously was a struggle to fit just the old laptop. Plus at 1080 - even on a 15" screen I need to set the magnification to 150% to be able to read the thing. 1080 on an 11 or 12 inch screen? Are you insane? Thankfully Windows 10 actually works in this regard, although web pages can;t seem to figure it out yet, and when remoting into servers, it can still be tough to read if the server was set on 1080 or higher.
The unnecessary accusation of insanity aside (over screen size of all things -- that's treading into turning computers into high drama), I would be highly reluctant to get a 1080 res screen at 11-12 inches. 1366x768 seems a lot more prudent at that size as I already find it necessary to 125% scale with 1080 on a 14.1 inch panel. I was pretty happy with 10 inch panels on those single core Atom netbooks from years ago, but performance was a tad slow when they were new and not at all fast enough now. Also, tablets seem pointless to me. I have a phone if I want something with an on-screen keyboard. Windows, despite Microsoft's efforts, still works a bit better for me with a keyboard and touchpad so I'd be reluctant to give that up or fumble around with components that aren't at least physically joined together on a full-time basis.
Was happy. Up to 2016 or so, an Atom n270 was good enough to serve as a primary home PC. It's not sufficient now and while I think iPads are awesome, I just don't like the idea of the keyboard being a physically independent component. If I'm at something with a larger-than-phone sized screen, I'm doing something that benefits from a keyboard so an iPad would effectively always end up being paired up with a keyboard so there isn't a point in paying a price premium for a computing device that I'd end up using as a laptop. And there's the matter of connectivity with other devices or external storage that is a bit more cumbersome on a tablet like the iPad. I think my breaking point for buying an iPad would be the inclusion of microSD and a user replaceable battery. That would absolutely make me think really hard about buying one at almost any price Apple saw fit to charge.
There are a number of times (pun intended) that I wanted a numpad on my laptops. I've got a USB external pad, but I'll concede it isn't the best solution as most smaller laptops have only a few USB ports. In your case, you're probably going to end up on 15+ inch systems for the time being. I would not want to use the Fn key combo for numpad extended data entry. It's a non-starter.
Just ordered Lenovo Thinkpad E585 (Ryzen 5 2500U, 1080p IPS, for under $700 after online coupons). Wasn't particularly looking for AMD, but it was ~$150 cheaper than i5 with no other compromises, so it works for me.
If only HP offered a laptop like the Elitebook x360 1020 G2 with a 12.5 inch screen. Oh wait.
You go get your ultrabook; there are plenty of choices available from every major notebook maker. If you insist on Ryzen, there's always the ThinkPad A285. Other people need that 15" screen for their work and I don't know why you even felt the need to comment when the product's clearly not meant for your needs.
I've been poking around online since the BBS days, so I should know better than to have an opinion or bother to express it. It'll always trigger someone, somewhere even if it isn't something you'd initially think was incendiary. Skins are distressingly soft where computers are concerned which is weird since I'd go out on a limb to say that most of AT's readers are male and many consider themselves on the logical/technical side of thought rather than being willing to admit they are emotional creatures with narrow band limits on what feelings they're conditioned to experience.
Go figure that HP would cripple any AMD based machine however they can. Single channel memory without the option to go dual channel limits performance. Due to the size, sustained testing would favor the Ryzen based machines due to the base speeds being higher, and limited cooling will make these models not run at turbo speeds for very long.
Lenovo has been better about this, where even if there is only a single slot for memory, there is one memory channel soldered to the motherboard.
Ideapad 330 and 330s with the Ryzen 5 2500U and 2700U both are dual-channel, even if there is only a single memory slot. You buy one of these with 8GB, that is 4 on motherboard with a 4GB DDR4-2400 or 2600 module in the slot. you buy one with 16GB, you get 8GB on the motherboard with an 8GB memory module. I don't know about the Yoga, except that the way the screens are mounted makes screen replacement VERY annoying.
I would not believe this single channel thing at this point. Probably a mistake in reporting, or a model with another RAM slot empty. Lets wait till we see actual laptops, or at least their manuals.
"When it comes to battery life, HP claims that its AMD Ryzen Mobile-powered Envy x360 15 convertibles offer exactly the same battery life as Intel-based machines: up to 13 hours of mixed usage when equipped with a 55.67 Wh battery."
Really want to see you guys review these Ryzen 3000 mobility stuff ASAP to investigate the battery issues you've found with the Ryzen 2000 laptops!!
For an "Intel Inside," pay $170 (>20%) more for "Spoiler Inside" with no effective patch, amazing and funny!
Do OEMs and Intel have any legal liability for selling "Intel Inside" (i.e. "Spoiler Inside") products without warning labels to warn customers that the products have the "Spoiler" security problem with no effective patch?
U.S. banned Huawei and has been having its allies do the same for security reasons (proven or not?), but does U.S. have the balls to do the same to Intel for the PROVEN security problem of "Spoiler" (caused by its INTENDED design) with no effective patch?
A big issue that makes many stick with crApple is the screen quality. The majority of laptops(not necessarily the machines mentioned in this article) still use 1344x768 displays, even if there are more 1080p displays showing up in the $500 price range these days.
Touchpad. it's nearly magically good on the macs. I don't really miss an external mouse on the mbp, but miss it on most other laptops. So unless they screw it up on future models ( like they screwed up the keyboard past 2015 ) it's one more thing. Screens ( haven't seen this ) have already caught up, plenty of good QHD / UHD screens out there.
"When it comes to battery life, HP claims that its AMD Ryzen Mobile-powered Envy x360 15 convertibles offer exactly the same battery life as Intel-based machines: up to 13 hours of mixed usage when equipped with a 55.67 Wh battery." And that's exactly why despite the rated clock-speeds barely changing gen to gen (just +100-200MHz), 12nm Zen+ is going to have a MUCH larger overall beneficial effect on Mobile than it did on Desktop. Where "Precision Boost 2" was merely really handy on DT, it's an absolute game changer for Mobile, where power efficiency/scaling were by FAR the biggest issues vs Intel. Zen+ lets it run at higher average clock-speeds overall, but without having to run every core at the max all-core boost speed during mid-thread count loads (aka, less than all-cores/threads, but >2t), saving a bunch of power.
It appears that the 3700U, comparing to the 2700U has the same specifications, except the lithography, the boost frequency that is slightly higher. But the global performance is 19% more powerful. On the single core it has also made a good improvement.
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jeremyshaw - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Are you certain about the inaccessible 8GB single channel ram? It sounds like a rather strange limitation. Either AMD's platform specs really suck, to the point where escape routing two DDR4 channels off the package is stupidly difficult, or AMD just isn't providing any engineering help. If there ever was a time when AMD actually needed to package 4GB or more of on-package memory, Ryzen APUs were it.Mr Perfect - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
My guess is that HP is just being cheap here. The same thing has happened to previous AMD notebook generations, OEMs viewed them as the budget option and started cutting costs. Which had the effect of turning them into budget machines, something like a self fulfilling prophecy.jeremyshaw - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
I've taken a look at service manuals of prior Envy x360 AMD laptops, those seem to have dual slots.http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c06172053.pdf
http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c06001791
However, the datasheet for that model also explicitly listed dual channel DDR4...
http://www8.hp.com/h20195/v2/GetPDF.aspx/4AA7-2465...
Dragonstongue - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
this is NOT AMD making such "choices" never is, they do the base "spec" which they have approved, their various partners can and do constantly muck with amount of ram, soldered or not etc etc etc.....they are not as "iron fist" as Intel would be, nor do they ultimately have a heavy enough hand to force any major OEM to bend over and do it the way they tell them to... unlike Intel, Nvidia, Apple and some others who can tell the OEM to "do it this way or else"All that being said, many many times OEM or whatever such as Dell, HP, Acer etc "cut down" the AMD offering and yet "up" the Intel offering in regards to possibly soldered or non soldered components (including ability to add) battery size, thermal limits, cooler design/capacity etc etc.
I had a few times seen more or less Intel v AMD offering that the Intel one had more memory, was allowed to use wider range of tdp for the cpu-gpu etc, and often enough (mostly HP actually) that they gimp the AMD offering by memory selection but the Intel offering does not, converniant to make the AMD system appear "slower" or less capable?
jeremyshaw - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Which is why I believe AMD should have preempted all of this and released their APUs with HBM sideport memory, or at least higher specced versions of their APUs with HBM. Instead, Intel beat them to the punch (using AMD's own GPUs!), and the remaining laptops are at the mercy of ODMs.Not that Ryzen APUs are blameless, I have a Thinkpad E485 (a very good implementation of an AMD notebook, especially compared to the Intel version), and up until last month, it was littered with countless little problems w.r.t. video playback, color profiles, general stability of the ancient AMD drivers, etc. Last month, AMD's driver website finally admitted they have been making Ryzen laptop chips for the last year or so (yay!). Now I have to chase down why a 45Whr battery only lasts 3.5 hours, worse than my 6 year old Sony Vaio with a 48Whr battery and a dGPU (with wear, it only holds about 4.0 hours nowadays).
PixyMisa - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Cost.IGTrading - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
This is NOT about cost.The "savings" are less than minimal.
Actually , considering that the past 2 versions of AMD-based HP Envy x360 already HAVE dual DIMM slots, HP would actually have to SPEND MORE money to change the design, test & certify the new version.
IF this has happened (I don't believe it) it might as well be a personal discussion between Intel's HP contact and HP's guy responsible for the the development and design of the Envy x360 line.
Intel might have offered something to HP and asked HP to handicap the Ryzen Mobile systems, because the systems released last year, trounced most of the HP Intel-based lineup.
I have been in this industry for more than 23 years now and I've been part of such "dirty" discussions.
No matter if this actually happened or not, trust me : it costs HP MORE money, to change and re-certify the design, than reuse the old one.
We all know that AMD Ryzen benefits from better memory bandwidth & latency, therefore it would be a simple thing for Intel to ask HP.
Single channel for Intel is not a big problem compared with AMD and for HP this would be beneficial, because it would push clients to go for a higher grade (more expensive product line) to get Dual Channel and most likely, that higher product line doesn't even have an AMD Ryzen option.
patel21 - Sunday, March 24, 2019 - link
Or a customer can go for a different brand rather than going for higher product line.supdawgwtfd - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Issue with battery life is the CPU has high power draw when idle.I don't believe there is any fix for this.
Is an inherent issue with the CPU itself.
neblogai - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
That is probably not true. Matebook D with 2500U is one of the best performing Ryzen mobile laptops, it comes with 53Wh battery, and also offers great (6-9h) battery life- much better than others. So, it must be laptop components and laptop configuration at fault, not the AMD APU.lenghui - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
Nah, I say AMD should just go the Apple and MS way and manufacture their own laptop. I certainly hope that this laptop is not limited to 8GB of RAM. It's everything I look for, except for the RAM. I want/need 32 for what I do.patel21 - Sunday, March 24, 2019 - link
I also believe AMD going microsoft's way to produce its own line up would eventually be better as the techies like us would really consider those properly implemented systems.Irata - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
That's why OEM only get my money if they do their AMD based laptops right (for the price range) and do not gimp it in any way.Right now, that was Huawei with their Matebook.
Targon - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
Lenovo is doing well with their AMD based machines as well, with the majority being onboard memory plus one slot for the second channel. You may not have the option to swap out both memory channels, but at least you do get dual-bank for the memory configuration.Irata - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Not, it's not really difficult - Huawei had no problem supplying their Ryzen based Matebook with dual channel RAM.But: At least the AMD option uses the same screen, battery and chassis as the Intel option which is already an improvement.
Just hope that the single channel RAM is the only way it is gimped and that the cooling solution, drivers and configuration are all as they should be.
DanNeely - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Does not user accessible just mean the chassis is hard to open, or that it's soldiered and non-upgradable?GreenReaper - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
If it's like earlier versions, you'll need two types of screwdriver to open it, and the RAM is hidden behind a shield that needs to be spudged off; but the first link shows it socketed, as is the SSD (see the video at 08:20, or the third picture, in the first link):https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/HP+Spectre+x360+Co...
https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/HP+Envy+x360+m6-aq103...
Of course they could change anything as long as it's in line with the specification.
notashill - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
I have the previous gen of this machine and it has 4GB soldered RAM plus a SODIMM slot, of course that doesn't say anything about the new model.HP publishes service manuals for most of their machines so that's probably the easiest way to find out once they're released for these models.
Here's the one for the previous model: http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c06140010
ft555555 - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
That manual clearly indicates that the DIMMS are removable. I own the late 2017 Ryzen 2700U model, and I can assure you that there are dual channel DRAM slots. I purchased a 2x4GB model and upgraded it myself to 2x8GB.GreenReaper - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
On testing sites, the AMD CPUs mentioned here look a little lower in single-core, but a little higher in multi-core, though I'm unsure whether they've re-tested with countermeasures to recent attacks.The difference in frequencies between the 3500U and the 3700U is non-trival, esp. all-core turbo (3.0Ghz->3.5Ghz) - as is +25% Vega cores - but it'll depend on whether cooling is adequate, especially in an ultrabook chassis. I'd want to see reviews covering sustained load on the 3700U before deciding. Let's hope black helps them radiate heat better, like my Lenovo X120e! ;-)
Graphics-wise, AMD's APUs should shred Intel. Wireless performance is likely to be a tad lower - maybe not to a level that will be noticeable outside of tests?
Loss of Bluetooth 5.0 is unfortunate for those using its features: https://www.howtogeek.com/343718/whats-different-i...
Curiously, long range and faster speed modes are optional in Bluetooth 5:
https://www.androidauthority.com/bluetooth-5-speed...
However, I guess this might be because one or the other is more useful for particular devices.
Intel's specs claim these as features of Bluetooth 5, so hopefully they're in their products: https://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en...
Santoval - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
"Graphics-wise, AMD's APUs should shred Intel."Not necessarily. If the AMD versions are memory limited due to single memory channels and the Intel ones have dual memory channels the graphics blocks of the AMD versions will be severely memory starved. It is unclear if that's the case, however Anton write "The APUs are accompanied by 8 GB of single-channel DDR4-2400 memory", which seems to suggest that only the versions with AMD's APUs have a single memory channel.
The long history of AMD based laptops forced to work with one memory channel is also a bad indication, despite HP using dual memory channels in their previous gen of Ryzen based laptops.
Trefugl - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
So no TB3? For some reason I thought the previous x360's had it. Honestly, that's one thing that would hold me up from getting this one. Well, that and the RAM options stink. But price and other features seem good for a 2nd machine that I'd mostly use for travel.notashill - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Spectre X360 has had TB, the Envy line is a bit lower end and has never had it.Targon - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
None of the AMD based machines have Thunderbolt support, even if they have a USB-C connector for USB 3.1 performance.Cooe - Monday, April 8, 2019 - link
Not exactly true, actually. The latest "Titan Ridge" based TB3 PCIe add-in cards (like Gigabyte's for ex) work with most TR4/X399 based motherboards right out of the box (aka, no fiddling required). This despite the platform still not having official Intel TB3 certification yet.peevee - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Now this warrants a 1:1 test to see what performance, both CPU and GPU, is really like!Please.
PeachNCream - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Ugh, giant 15 inch screen laptops. I know there's a market for them, but I'd prefer a notebook PC to have a screen below 13.5 inches with a preference for 11-12 inch screens. Make it slightly thicker if there's a need for battery capacity or cooling, but please give us more decent options that are easier to carry around than these enormous pancake computers.Stochastic - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
There are plenty of 13-inch ultrabooks available. Also, with bezels shrinking and laptops getting thinner and lighter, 15-inch laptops are more portable than in the past.PeachNCream - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Yeah, I do agree that they are better with smaller bezels, but 15 inch systems are still generally too large (smaller bezels reduce the footprint of 11-12 inch systems as well, after all) and using one makes me feel like I'm wandering around in the doldrums of 2009 with a dinosaur system of yore regardless of the hardware driving said screen.neblogai - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
There are only two 13" laptops with Ryzen mobile. One is 1.2kg light, but single channel, 12W TDP Lenovo 720S, and another- 13" HP Envy with dual channel RAM, but also limited by low 15W STAMP. Both are throtling hard.On the other hand, a 12-13", sub-1.5kg ultraportable with 35W 3550H would be perfect for me, I don't care if it is several milimeters thicker.
rrinker - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
SO you want a tablet? 15" is anything but giant. As thin as these are, they are easily portable. Since switching to a modern machine (but not as thin as these), I can get my laptop AND my external USB monitor in the same carry bag that previously was a struggle to fit just the old laptop. Plus at 1080 - even on a 15" screen I need to set the magnification to 150% to be able to read the thing. 1080 on an 11 or 12 inch screen? Are you insane? Thankfully Windows 10 actually works in this regard, although web pages can;t seem to figure it out yet, and when remoting into servers, it can still be tough to read if the server was set on 1080 or higher.PeachNCream - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
The unnecessary accusation of insanity aside (over screen size of all things -- that's treading into turning computers into high drama), I would be highly reluctant to get a 1080 res screen at 11-12 inches. 1366x768 seems a lot more prudent at that size as I already find it necessary to 125% scale with 1080 on a 14.1 inch panel. I was pretty happy with 10 inch panels on those single core Atom netbooks from years ago, but performance was a tad slow when they were new and not at all fast enough now. Also, tablets seem pointless to me. I have a phone if I want something with an on-screen keyboard. Windows, despite Microsoft's efforts, still works a bit better for me with a keyboard and touchpad so I'd be reluctant to give that up or fumble around with components that aren't at least physically joined together on a full-time basis.hanselltc - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
I mean if you were happy with a 10 inch atom, you might as well just grab an ipad?PeachNCream - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Was happy. Up to 2016 or so, an Atom n270 was good enough to serve as a primary home PC. It's not sufficient now and while I think iPads are awesome, I just don't like the idea of the keyboard being a physically independent component. If I'm at something with a larger-than-phone sized screen, I'm doing something that benefits from a keyboard so an iPad would effectively always end up being paired up with a keyboard so there isn't a point in paying a price premium for a computing device that I'd end up using as a laptop. And there's the matter of connectivity with other devices or external storage that is a bit more cumbersome on a tablet like the iPad. I think my breaking point for buying an iPad would be the inclusion of microSD and a user replaceable battery. That would absolutely make me think really hard about buying one at almost any price Apple saw fit to charge.i-know-not - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
As a numpad user, I'll always be on 15 inch laptops unless someone decides cram one on a 13/14 inch one or find a creative solution.PeachNCream - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
There are a number of times (pun intended) that I wanted a numpad on my laptops. I've got a USB external pad, but I'll concede it isn't the best solution as most smaller laptops have only a few USB ports. In your case, you're probably going to end up on 15+ inch systems for the time being. I would not want to use the Fn key combo for numpad extended data entry. It's a non-starter.jaydee - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Same here, numpad is a must.Just ordered Lenovo Thinkpad E585 (Ryzen 5 2500U, 1080p IPS, for under $700 after online coupons). Wasn't particularly looking for AMD, but it was ~$150 cheaper than i5 with no other compromises, so it works for me.
Rookierookie - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
If only HP offered a laptop like the Elitebook x360 1020 G2 with a 12.5 inch screen. Oh wait.You go get your ultrabook; there are plenty of choices available from every major notebook maker. If you insist on Ryzen, there's always the ThinkPad A285. Other people need that 15" screen for their work and I don't know why you even felt the need to comment when the product's clearly not meant for your needs.
PeachNCream - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
I've been poking around online since the BBS days, so I should know better than to have an opinion or bother to express it. It'll always trigger someone, somewhere even if it isn't something you'd initially think was incendiary. Skins are distressingly soft where computers are concerned which is weird since I'd go out on a limb to say that most of AT's readers are male and many consider themselves on the logical/technical side of thought rather than being willing to admit they are emotional creatures with narrow band limits on what feelings they're conditioned to experience.Targon - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
Go figure that HP would cripple any AMD based machine however they can. Single channel memory without the option to go dual channel limits performance. Due to the size, sustained testing would favor the Ryzen based machines due to the base speeds being higher, and limited cooling will make these models not run at turbo speeds for very long.Lenovo has been better about this, where even if there is only a single slot for memory, there is one memory channel soldered to the motherboard.
hanselltc - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
The Yogas and Ideapads with APU were almost all configured with single channel memory. The Thinkpads are not as crippled though.Targon - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
Ideapad 330 and 330s with the Ryzen 5 2500U and 2700U both are dual-channel, even if there is only a single memory slot. You buy one of these with 8GB, that is 4 on motherboard with a 4GB DDR4-2400 or 2600 module in the slot. you buy one with 16GB, you get 8GB on the motherboard with an 8GB memory module. I don't know about the Yoga, except that the way the screens are mounted makes screen replacement VERY annoying.neblogai - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
I would not believe this single channel thing at this point. Probably a mistake in reporting, or a model with another RAM slot empty. Lets wait till we see actual laptops, or at least their manuals.jabber - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
I look forward to telling customers "Sorry nothing I can fix here!" when they hand it to me in two years time.These modern machines are silly toys. Not proper laptops.
LarsBars - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
"When it comes to battery life, HP claims that its AMD Ryzen Mobile-powered Envy x360 15 convertibles offer exactly the same battery life as Intel-based machines: up to 13 hours of mixed usage when equipped with a 55.67 Wh battery."Really want to see you guys review these Ryzen 3000 mobility stuff ASAP to investigate the battery issues you've found with the Ryzen 2000 laptops!!
Targon - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
I am waiting on the Ryzen 4000 mobility parts once they come out, since the move to 7nm should be VERY nice for mobile products.wow&wow - Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - link
For an "Intel Inside," pay $170 (>20%) more for "Spoiler Inside" with no effective patch, amazing and funny!Do OEMs and Intel have any legal liability for selling "Intel Inside" (i.e. "Spoiler Inside") products without warning labels to warn customers that the products have the "Spoiler" security problem with no effective patch?
U.S. banned Huawei and has been having its allies do the same for security reasons (proven or not?), but does U.S. have the balls to do the same to Intel for the PROVEN security problem of "Spoiler" (caused by its INTENDED design) with no effective patch?
Samus - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
These are so sexy I can't believe anybody would pay double for a Macbook...Targon - Thursday, March 21, 2019 - link
A big issue that makes many stick with crApple is the screen quality. The majority of laptops(not necessarily the machines mentioned in this article) still use 1344x768 displays, even if there are more 1080p displays showing up in the $500 price range these days.igavus - Friday, March 22, 2019 - link
Touchpad. it's nearly magically good on the macs. I don't really miss an external mouse on the mbp, but miss it on most other laptops. So unless they screw it up on future models ( like they screwed up the keyboard past 2015 ) it's one more thing. Screens ( haven't seen this ) have already caught up, plenty of good QHD / UHD screens out there.Valantar - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Such a shame that they couldn't bother to fit a dual-channel memory subsystem into this. Pure laziness, and such a drag for iGPU performance.velanapontinha - Wednesday, March 20, 2019 - link
Any word on battery life? Elitebooks with 2700U PRO suck at battery life, I'm hoping they fix it with 3700uCooe - Monday, April 8, 2019 - link
"When it comes to battery life, HP claims that its AMD Ryzen Mobile-powered Envy x360 15 convertibles offer exactly the same battery life as Intel-based machines: up to 13 hours of mixed usage when equipped with a 55.67 Wh battery." And that's exactly why despite the rated clock-speeds barely changing gen to gen (just +100-200MHz), 12nm Zen+ is going to have a MUCH larger overall beneficial effect on Mobile than it did on Desktop. Where "Precision Boost 2" was merely really handy on DT, it's an absolute game changer for Mobile, where power efficiency/scaling were by FAR the biggest issues vs Intel. Zen+ lets it run at higher average clock-speeds overall, but without having to run every core at the max all-core boost speed during mid-thread count loads (aka, less than all-cores/threads, but >2t), saving a bunch of power.gronetwork - Monday, July 1, 2019 - link
It appears that the 3700U, comparing to the 2700U has the same specifications, except the lithography, the boost frequency that is slightly higher. But the global performance is 19% more powerful. On the single core it has also made a good improvement.https://gadgetversus.com/processor/amd-ryzen-7-370...