I can't imagine what that system could cost, complete. Like, Mac Pro prices, probably. MainGear will have to rename to MillionaireGear. Private equity will announce the acquisitions of individual Alienware desktops. Apple will get into the RAM business, branded by Hermes and Vuitton. Microsoft will lose a billion dollars on just one Surface Studio.
Yes, it just kills me that the 64GB RAM (4x16) I bought in 2016 for ~$320 CAD now costs over $1000. It's 2400Mhz, and I want to upgrade to 3200MHz for Ryzen, but the current prices are absolutely outrageous.
Haven't you heard. It may be possible that dram prices will come down even 15% during the next year (if we are lucky) and that mean that 4x16 would cost only $850... cheap! https://press.trendforce.com/press/20181009-3167.h...
Yeah... They still cost way too much even if they will come down a little bit. And Samsung is supposed to reduce the Dram production to prevent over producing memory, so that 15% may be big overestimation...
Oh please, what price fixing? Just because prices are high doesn't mean you need to resort to conspiracy theories. High prices are a natural outcome of very high barriers to increasing supply - either for a new company wanting to enter the space, or existing companies. Nobody wants to casually drop tens of billions of dollars to make more.
I can't imagine a task that needs that much RAM! I know they exist, it's just that I have never experienced one. Every time I start thinking it's time to buy more RAM.. I'll fire up Task Manager to see how much I'm actually using. Even as a software developer, I'll admit that I don't need more than 16GB of RAM for any of the projects I work on.
Any sort of virtualization workload can quickly consume lots of memory. As a software developer, if you were spinning up multiple VMs locally to test your code across several operating system versions you could quickly gobble up 32GB or more of RAM on the host system depending on your program and how many VMs are running.
Any sort of graphics, video, or 3D work can easily chew up lots of memory as well. Adobe's tools like Photoshop, After Effects, and Premiere can use tons of RAM if it is available and you are working with large files.
Can confirm this. I've got GIMP, Kdenlive, and Audacity open plus Firefox and occasionally Pinta (depending on whether its more efficient than using GIMP for the task at hand) while I'm recording or editing a video and I find an alarming amount of RAM consumed. Of course, it's nothing like Adobe's suite when it comes to inefficiency, but I had to spring for 8GB for my Linux box because 4GB wasn't cutting it.
Kdenlive rendering can bring my 16gb system to its knees - so yeah same here. And gimp on large images... heavy too.
Plus browser tabs and virtualization - my next system won't be a mini itx simply because I don't want to be limited to 2 memory slots anymore... micro-atx it is (I know there are mini-itx boards with 4 so-dimm slots. Maybe, maybe.)
With modern 64 bit graphics applications, I can see even 16G is not enough. With Photoshop CS for example with larger image - it needs a lot of ram also - with PowerDirector with 4K movie it similar. Lightwave 3D is pretty efficient when it comes to memory but more memory the better. Vue 2016 is heavy on memory, I feel even 16G is low.
Of course VM's used alot - my Work thinkpad has 12G and I used 4G VM. I fortunately only used single VM because of older compiler and I actually have a lab in my house full of machines.
But I would find it hard to use 64G of ram - not to mention 128G - but then again I remember times when even 4G of memory was out of question and even 1G of ram was unheard of.
The problem is memory so available now in sizes - that developers have become lazy.
So true! Video Editing with 128GB of memory would be much better than with 16... It would be even better with 512GB of memory, but for that I need some expensive pro rig...
Don't forget to update the "ASUS Shows Off ROG Dominus Extreme Motherboard" which incorrectly says: "support for up to 512 GB of ECC or non-ECC system memory across twelve RAM slots". 12 slots x 32 Gb = 384 Gb maximum.
If only they'd been able to add LPDDR4 support to Whiskey Lake too. between the Spectre/Markdown fixes and the four cores from Kaby-R they're finally close to making something I want to replace my Haswell notebook with, and it's nuts that it's taken this long, but I can't justify LPDDR3 in 2019.
I used to be one of those that always thought hey why do we need so much memory and after having 32GB's memory in my system for about 5 years and never using more than maybe 16GB's in the most demanding games and with other tasks running I finally found a way to use some of the extra memory. I setup PrimoCache with LVL1 & LVL 2 setup. LVL1 is set so it uses 8GB of my system memory and LVL2 is setup to use 68GB of my SSD drive. With both of these caches setup to cache 2 4TB standard hard disks that have games installed on them.
It works very well and really speeds up the games I play as their loading times go down to a few seconds instead of the normal long wait times if you load them without the cache. This is with only a 32GB setup I can only dream what could happen if I had 64 or 128GB memory installed. It might not be the most graceful way to use up some of the extra memory in my system but I was happy to be able to find a way to at least make use of some of it that would normally just sit there doing nothing.
In fairness, the first often directly correlates to the second, at least if it's memory the CPU has to operate on. Sure, you might have RAM to play with, but it's still gotta get into the cache in order to be operated on, or travel over the bus to your GPU. And it might have to push useful stuff out to do that.
Often the best use of additional memory is for caching disk (where again, using as much of an abundant resource as you can is often a bad idea, compared to figuring out how to use less in the first place).
"However the launch of two different technologies, both double height double capacity 32GB DDR4 modules from Zadak and G.Skill, as well as new 16Gb DDR4 chips coming from Samsung, means that technically in a consumer system with four memory slots, up to 128GB might be possible."
I know these both technologies are available, ASUS stated when they promoted the DC DIMM that these are intended for mITX motherboards with only 2 DIMM's to allow these mITX to support 64GB of RAM by using non-standard 32GB per DIMM. But the new Samsung 16Gb DRAM chips will allow 32GB per DIMM without the need for DC DIMM.
In theory, if ASUS also supported those DC DIMM's on their mATX and ATX motherboards with 4 DIMM slots then they can support 128GB if the IMC can support it. But also, the same thing can be achieved by using the new 16Gb DRAM chips could allow the same thing.
But, what if we used both, I mean DC DIMM with 16Gb chips ? this will allow the mITX to have 128GB and if the IMC support it a 2DPC in mATX/ATX to have 256GB.. again only if the platform support it. Which I doubt.
Sounds ridicules with current RAM prices and the actual mainstream needs, I mean currently any body needs more than 64GB will already be working on HEDT which already support that, so next gen. HEDT will support 256GB now ? cool.
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nico_mach - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
I can't imagine what that system could cost, complete. Like, Mac Pro prices, probably. MainGear will have to rename to MillionaireGear. Private equity will announce the acquisitions of individual Alienware desktops. Apple will get into the RAM business, branded by Hermes and Vuitton. Microsoft will lose a billion dollars on just one Surface Studio.Pessimism - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
Agree. The rampant price fixing and collusion among the memory manufacturers is making the tech industry even more stagnant than it already is.sa666666 - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
Yes, it just kills me that the 64GB RAM (4x16) I bought in 2016 for ~$320 CAD now costs over $1000. It's 2400Mhz, and I want to upgrade to 3200MHz for Ryzen, but the current prices are absolutely outrageous.haukionkannel - Tuesday, October 16, 2018 - link
Haven't you heard. It may be possible that dram prices will come down even 15% during the next year (if we are lucky) and that mean that 4x16 would cost only $850... cheap!https://press.trendforce.com/press/20181009-3167.h...
Yeah... They still cost way too much even if they will come down a little bit. And Samsung is supposed to reduce the Dram production to prevent over producing memory, so that 15% may be big overestimation...
haukionkannel - Tuesday, October 16, 2018 - link
https://www.techpowerup.com/247407/samsung-sk-hyni...Bob-o - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
Oh please, what price fixing? Just because prices are high doesn't mean you need to resort to conspiracy theories. High prices are a natural outcome of very high barriers to increasing supply - either for a new company wanting to enter the space, or existing companies. Nobody wants to casually drop tens of billions of dollars to make more.TEAMSWITCHER - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
I can't imagine a task that needs that much RAM! I know they exist, it's just that I have never experienced one. Every time I start thinking it's time to buy more RAM.. I'll fire up Task Manager to see how much I'm actually using. Even as a software developer, I'll admit that I don't need more than 16GB of RAM for any of the projects I work on.duploxxx - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
i have 16GB ram in my laptop. Due to horrible windows memory manager i cant last 2 days active without a reboot to free ram again....damianrobertjones - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
Then there's something wrong with your machine. or turn off Superfetch.JoeyJoJo123 - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
^ This.Works on my machine(tm), so PEBCAK.
MrSpadge - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
You may want to conider closing programs you're finished using ;)WithoutWeakness - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
Any sort of virtualization workload can quickly consume lots of memory. As a software developer, if you were spinning up multiple VMs locally to test your code across several operating system versions you could quickly gobble up 32GB or more of RAM on the host system depending on your program and how many VMs are running.Any sort of graphics, video, or 3D work can easily chew up lots of memory as well. Adobe's tools like Photoshop, After Effects, and Premiere can use tons of RAM if it is available and you are working with large files.
PeachNCream - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
Can confirm this. I've got GIMP, Kdenlive, and Audacity open plus Firefox and occasionally Pinta (depending on whether its more efficient than using GIMP for the task at hand) while I'm recording or editing a video and I find an alarming amount of RAM consumed. Of course, it's nothing like Adobe's suite when it comes to inefficiency, but I had to spring for 8GB for my Linux box because 4GB wasn't cutting it.jospoortvliet - Wednesday, October 17, 2018 - link
Kdenlive rendering can bring my 16gb system to its knees - so yeah same here. And gimp on large images... heavy too.Plus browser tabs and virtualization - my next system won't be a mini itx simply because I don't want to be limited to 2 memory slots anymore... micro-atx it is
(I know there are mini-itx boards with 4 so-dimm slots. Maybe, maybe.)
HStewart - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
With modern 64 bit graphics applications, I can see even 16G is not enough. With Photoshop CS for example with larger image - it needs a lot of ram also - with PowerDirector with 4K movie it similar. Lightwave 3D is pretty efficient when it comes to memory but more memory the better. Vue 2016 is heavy on memory, I feel even 16G is low.Of course VM's used alot - my Work thinkpad has 12G and I used 4G VM. I fortunately only used single VM because of older compiler and I actually have a lab in my house full of machines.
But I would find it hard to use 64G of ram - not to mention 128G - but then again I remember times when even 4G of memory was out of question and even 1G of ram was unheard of.
The problem is memory so available now in sizes - that developers have become lazy.
haukionkannel - Tuesday, October 16, 2018 - link
So true! Video Editing with 128GB of memory would be much better than with 16... It would be even better with 512GB of memory, but for that I need some expensive pro rig...James5mith - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
How about some articles on the actual availability of 32GB UDIMMs/SO-DIMMs?I know they are providing to OEMs first, but I haven't seen a single listing for the modules themselves for sale.
What is the timeline?
Cidona - Tuesday, October 16, 2018 - link
I've been thinking about getting a Clevo laptop in the near term and would like to get 2x32GB (SODIMM) sticks installed, keeping two slots open for possible future upgrade to fill the other two slots with a further 2x32GB.Don't know about any of the sources below but they are the only locations I've seen with stock or what seems to be stock on the way...
https://www.campuspoint.de/samsung-m471a4g43mb1-ct...
https://xceldatasolution.com/product-view/M471A4G4...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Single-32GB-DDR4-2400-Sod...
https://www.ramcity.com.au/ram/ddr4/2666/sodimm/M4...
vailr - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
Don't forget to update the "ASUS Shows Off ROG Dominus Extreme Motherboard" which incorrectly says: "support for up to 512 GB of ECC or non-ECC system memory across twelve RAM slots". 12 slots x 32 Gb = 384 Gb maximum.axfelix - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
If only they'd been able to add LPDDR4 support to Whiskey Lake too. between the Spectre/Markdown fixes and the four cores from Kaby-R they're finally close to making something I want to replace my Haswell notebook with, and it's nuts that it's taken this long, but I can't justify LPDDR3 in 2019.rocky12345 - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
I used to be one of those that always thought hey why do we need so much memory and after having 32GB's memory in my system for about 5 years and never using more than maybe 16GB's in the most demanding games and with other tasks running I finally found a way to use some of the extra memory. I setup PrimoCache with LVL1 & LVL 2 setup. LVL1 is set so it uses 8GB of my system memory and LVL2 is setup to use 68GB of my SSD drive. With both of these caches setup to cache 2 4TB standard hard disks that have games installed on them.It works very well and really speeds up the games I play as their loading times go down to a few seconds instead of the normal long wait times if you load them without the cache. This is with only a 32GB setup I can only dream what could happen if I had 64 or 128GB memory installed. It might not be the most graceful way to use up some of the extra memory in my system but I was happy to be able to find a way to at least make use of some of it that would normally just sit there doing nothing.
Tokamata - Monday, October 15, 2018 - link
And yet developers will continue to optimize memory usage at the expense of CPU usage.GreenReaper - Thursday, October 18, 2018 - link
In fairness, the first often directly correlates to the second, at least if it's memory the CPU has to operate on. Sure, you might have RAM to play with, but it's still gotta get into the cache in order to be operated on, or travel over the bus to your GPU. And it might have to push useful stuff out to do that.Often the best use of additional memory is for caching disk (where again, using as much of an abundant resource as you can is often a bad idea, compared to figuring out how to use less in the first place).
Xajel - Tuesday, October 16, 2018 - link
"However the launch of two different technologies, both double height double capacity 32GB DDR4 modules from Zadak and G.Skill, as well as new 16Gb DDR4 chips coming from Samsung, means that technically in a consumer system with four memory slots, up to 128GB might be possible."I know these both technologies are available, ASUS stated when they promoted the DC DIMM that these are intended for mITX motherboards with only 2 DIMM's to allow these mITX to support 64GB of RAM by using non-standard 32GB per DIMM.
But the new Samsung 16Gb DRAM chips will allow 32GB per DIMM without the need for DC DIMM.
In theory, if ASUS also supported those DC DIMM's on their mATX and ATX motherboards with 4 DIMM slots then they can support 128GB if the IMC can support it.
But also, the same thing can be achieved by using the new 16Gb DRAM chips could allow the same thing.
But, what if we used both, I mean DC DIMM with 16Gb chips ? this will allow the mITX to have 128GB and if the IMC support it a 2DPC in mATX/ATX to have 256GB.. again only if the platform support it. Which I doubt.
Sounds ridicules with current RAM prices and the actual mainstream needs, I mean currently any body needs more than 64GB will already be working on HEDT which already support that, so next gen. HEDT will support 256GB now ? cool.