Hi Joe, How is the Realtek Wifi card compared to Intel? And How many onboard USB Headers are available? and which versions are available, I see you mentioned USB 3.0 but are there others? Thank you...
Sorry, read it again and I see there are 2 USB 3.0 and 2 USB 2.0 onboard headers available. I still would like to know more about the Realtek Wifi Card though, I haven't see any itx boards with that so far.
On page 4 of the review under "Board Features" the card is listed as: 1 x Realtek TRL9922BE Wi-Fi ac 2T/2R
I don't have any direct experience with this model, but I have used their previous generation RTL-8821AE which is a 1T1R wireless-AC card. It came with a mini-ITX H97 board I bought for home theater use.
For Wi-Fi only duties the card performs fine, but the link rate is limited to 433Mbps due to the single stream nature of the card. With good signal I got almost exactly half the sustained transfer rates as with a 2 stream Intel 7260 or with the 2 stream Broadcom BCM94352. So in that regard performance seemed to be pretty good, matching what was expected based on the specs.
That said, I definitely saw some strange behavior when I tried to use Wi-Fi and Bluetooth simultaneously (playing audio to a BT speaker while watching streaming video online). Either the audio would have frequent dropouts OR the data stream would be interrupted, causing buffering.
My guess would be that, despite having both 2.4GHz and 5GHz capability, they only had 1 full transmit/receive chain and that the radio was having to cycle back and forth between the two to maintain both the wireless AC and Bluetooth. I worked around it by using a USB Bluetooth dongle I had on-hand until I was able to replace the card.
Hopefully Realtek has addressed this with the newer model.
There is interference between USB 3.0 and 2.4ghz wifi. As far as I know there is no solution other than moving the 2 as far apart as possible. Intel has a page about it here https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/io/univers...
Thanks, but: 1. I was using 5GHz WiFi 2. The card is mini-PCI-E, not USB.
Yeah, the Bluetooth is probably connected over USB, but I've tested both the Intel 7260AC and Broadcom BCM94352, and neither of those has issues streaming video while also doing Bluetooth audio.
Anything stopping us from pulling out the Realtek Wifi card and putting in a card with the same interface, i.e. mPCIe Intel 8260, or a M.2 2230 9260NGW?
It has all the features compared to other flagship boards except for Thunderbolt port I believe which if I am correct not many people use or need but other boards also do have their share of omissions.
1. Asus ROG Strix Z370 I (No HDMI 2.0, No rear USB 3.1 ports, only Header available) 2. Asrock Fatality Z370 I (No USB 3.1 Ports) 3. Gigabyte Z370N Wifi (No USB 3.1 Ports) 4. MSI Z370I GAMING PRO CARBON AC (No HDMI 2.0)
You realize USB 3.1 Gen 1 is just OG USB 3.0 renamed, right??? Gen 2's the only new USB tech. Including Gen 1 means the USB technology available is still identical to what it's been since 2012 = yawn.
I thought its going to be kind of self explanatory (at least in Anandtech) that USB 3.1 means USB 3.1 Gen 2. Sorry... Kind of infuriating with this marketing tactics. By the way, even though ASRock has Thunderbolt port, I don't know whether it will support USB 3.1 Gen 2 spec and there is no USB 3.1 Gen 2 Type A port as well.
Also, there are subtle differences between 3.0 and 3.1 Gen 1.
Technically, 3.1 Gen 1 is a superset of 3.0, as it has some esoteric specs that the general consumer may not use in addition to the 3.0 specs. For all practical purposes 3.0 = 3.1 Gen 1.
TB3 does not supercede USB3.1 gen2 at all. They (optionally) use the same connector but the underlying technology is completely different, also they were both introduced at nearly the same in late 2015. TB3 will probably remain relatively niche for the foreseeable future as long as the controllers are both more expensive and more power hungry than USB. TB3 also has the rather major disadvantage that cables over 0.5m long either need to be active (expensive and don't work as USB cables) or won't support the full data rate.
I'm sorry but I have an issue with the use of the word: "Still" Btw, I had installed a Biostar X370 GTB 2 months ago. Gen 2 USB A and C - confirmed. Not taking my word for it? Small Form Factor did an article back in September; where i learned about it as well.
Re Overclocking, LLC have to set separately for AC/DC and you configure it in Advanced tab/GT Slice ( don't ask me why there and not in CPU OC tab ). It affects CPU and IGP. I have no idea why they made it this way but it works. I was able to set 5.1GHz on 8600K / AIO cooler, for my review couple of weeks ago. Max OC profile which was stable for me was 4.8GHz. Like pick from the list, save settings and it works. Max stable memory clock was DDR4-3866, max boot with single stick DDR4-4000.
Overclocking on this board isn't easy but it's also not so bad once you figure out all settings.
Run any power draw test to see if your OC hits current limit throttling in XTU.
Run memtest86 and see if you have any errors.
I can't get above 4.5 GHz non-AVX, 4.0 GHz AVX, and 2666 MHz to pass memtest86, with screenshots to prove. Using delidded 8700K and multiple Samsung B-die kits.
I actually have issue with many of the reviews out there not properly pushing the board to its limits to identify its weaknesses. Anandtech review completely mirrors my experience.
An OC isn't stable if it has more failure conditions than stock, that's my OC philosophy and that's how I test my boards.
Prime95 and memtest86 should be the minimum tests that people run, evne if they are unrealistically strict. Stock chips / boards can pass these tests with flying colors, OC'ed things should be able to as well, if they are to be called stable.
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Srikzquest - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
Hi Joe, How is the Realtek Wifi card compared to Intel? And How many onboard USB Headers are available? and which versions are available, I see you mentioned USB 3.0 but are there others? Thank you...Srikzquest - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
Sorry, read it again and I see there are 2 USB 3.0 and 2 USB 2.0 onboard headers available. I still would like to know more about the Realtek Wifi Card though, I haven't see any itx boards with that so far.MrCommunistGen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
On page 4 of the review under "Board Features" the card is listed as:1 x Realtek TRL9922BE Wi-Fi ac 2T/2R
I don't have any direct experience with this model, but I have used their previous generation RTL-8821AE which is a 1T1R wireless-AC card. It came with a mini-ITX H97 board I bought for home theater use.
For Wi-Fi only duties the card performs fine, but the link rate is limited to 433Mbps due to the single stream nature of the card. With good signal I got almost exactly half the sustained transfer rates as with a 2 stream Intel 7260 or with the 2 stream Broadcom BCM94352. So in that regard performance seemed to be pretty good, matching what was expected based on the specs.
That said, I definitely saw some strange behavior when I tried to use Wi-Fi and Bluetooth simultaneously (playing audio to a BT speaker while watching streaming video online). Either the audio would have frequent dropouts OR the data stream would be interrupted, causing buffering.
My guess would be that, despite having both 2.4GHz and 5GHz capability, they only had 1 full transmit/receive chain and that the radio was having to cycle back and forth between the two to maintain both the wireless AC and Bluetooth. I worked around it by using a USB Bluetooth dongle I had on-hand until I was able to replace the card.
Hopefully Realtek has addressed this with the newer model.
ianmills - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
There is interference between USB 3.0 and 2.4ghz wifi. As far as I know there is no solution other than moving the 2 as far apart as possible. Intel has a page about it here https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/io/univers...MrCommunistGen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
Thanks, but:1. I was using 5GHz WiFi
2. The card is mini-PCI-E, not USB.
Yeah, the Bluetooth is probably connected over USB, but I've tested both the Intel 7260AC and Broadcom BCM94352, and neither of those has issues streaming video while also doing Bluetooth audio.
Srikzquest - Tuesday, May 1, 2018 - link
I did further reading and looks like this particular card has MU-MIMO capability, may be that will help with the transmit/receive pipeline.Hakaslak - Tuesday, May 1, 2018 - link
Anything stopping us from pulling out the Realtek Wifi card and putting in a card with the same interface, i.e. mPCIe Intel 8260, or a M.2 2230 9260NGW?DanNeely - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
As limited as this boards power distribution appears to be I'm not convinced lifting the current limits is a good idea.Roen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
The power distribution is better than the Asus, even though it has less phases, it can handle more juice.Srikzquest - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
It has all the features compared to other flagship boards except for Thunderbolt port I believe which if I am correct not many people use or need but other boards also do have their share of omissions.1. Asus ROG Strix Z370 I (No HDMI 2.0, No rear USB 3.1 ports, only Header available)
2. Asrock Fatality Z370 I (No USB 3.1 Ports)
3. Gigabyte Z370N Wifi (No USB 3.1 Ports)
4. MSI Z370I GAMING PRO CARBON AC (No HDMI 2.0)
Roen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
Asrock has a TB3 port, which supercedes USB 3.1 Gen 2.All of them have 3.1 ports, just of the Gen 1 variety. Gen 2 is the interesting one.
Cooe - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
You realize USB 3.1 Gen 1 is just OG USB 3.0 renamed, right??? Gen 2's the only new USB tech. Including Gen 1 means the USB technology available is still identical to what it's been since 2012 = yawn.Roen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
Yes, just correcting the previous poster mentioning no USB 3.1 Ports.Srikzquest - Tuesday, May 1, 2018 - link
I thought its going to be kind of self explanatory (at least in Anandtech) that USB 3.1 means USB 3.1 Gen 2. Sorry... Kind of infuriating with this marketing tactics. By the way, even though ASRock has Thunderbolt port, I don't know whether it will support USB 3.1 Gen 2 spec and there is no USB 3.1 Gen 2 Type A port as well.Srikzquest - Tuesday, May 1, 2018 - link
Read again in ASRock website and the thunderbolt port supports USB 3.1 Gen 2... :)Roen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
Also, there are subtle differences between 3.0 and 3.1 Gen 1.Technically, 3.1 Gen 1 is a superset of 3.0, as it has some esoteric specs that the general consumer may not use in addition to the 3.0 specs. For all practical purposes 3.0 = 3.1 Gen 1.
notashill - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
TB3 does not supercede USB3.1 gen2 at all. They (optionally) use the same connector but the underlying technology is completely different, also they were both introduced at nearly the same in late 2015. TB3 will probably remain relatively niche for the foreseeable future as long as the controllers are both more expensive and more power hungry than USB. TB3 also has the rather major disadvantage that cables over 0.5m long either need to be active (expensive and don't work as USB cables) or won't support the full data rate.Roen - Thursday, May 17, 2018 - link
Are there any TB3 ports that don't support full USB 3.1 Gen 2 speeds?Roen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
ASRock Fatal1ty ITX is the hardware spec king for OC in the Z370 space. I think that would interesting for a review before the Asus.Roen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
Most thorough and best review of the SuperMicro board yet.Roen - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
Still the only 300 series ITX board to have Gen 2 Type A and Type C ports available.Surprised that this spec is so difficult to achieve.
DanNeely - Monday, April 30, 2018 - link
It's another chip to be squeezed onto a board lacking in room for chips.Halfnidea - Wednesday, May 2, 2018 - link
I'm sorry but I have an issue with the use of the word: "Still" Btw, I had installed a Biostar X370 GTB 2 months ago. Gen 2 USB A and C - confirmed. Not taking my word for it? Small Form Factor did an article back in September; where i learned about it as well.Roen - Thursday, May 17, 2018 - link
Let me rephrase: Intel 300 series.Beaver M. - Tuesday, May 1, 2018 - link
A board like that should still have a mPCIe slot. Theres just too many useful mPCIe cards available and they are not available as M.2 yet.Woomack - Monday, May 7, 2018 - link
Re Overclocking, LLC have to set separately for AC/DC and you configure it in Advanced tab/GT Slice ( don't ask me why there and not in CPU OC tab ). It affects CPU and IGP. I have no idea why they made it this way but it works.I was able to set 5.1GHz on 8600K / AIO cooler, for my review couple of weeks ago.
Max OC profile which was stable for me was 4.8GHz. Like pick from the list, save settings and it works.
Max stable memory clock was DDR4-3866, max boot with single stick DDR4-4000.
Overclocking on this board isn't easy but it's also not so bad once you figure out all settings.
Roen - Thursday, May 17, 2018 - link
Run any power draw test to see if your OC hits current limit throttling in XTU.Run memtest86 and see if you have any errors.
I can't get above 4.5 GHz non-AVX, 4.0 GHz AVX, and 2666 MHz to pass memtest86, with screenshots to prove. Using delidded 8700K and multiple Samsung B-die kits.
I actually have issue with many of the reviews out there not properly pushing the board to its limits to identify its weaknesses. Anandtech review completely mirrors my experience.
An OC isn't stable if it has more failure conditions than stock, that's my OC philosophy and that's how I test my boards.
Roen - Thursday, May 17, 2018 - link
I can't get above 4.5 GHz non-AVX, 4.0 GHz AVX in Prime95 before current throttling hits in XTU.Roen - Thursday, May 17, 2018 - link
Prime95 and memtest86 should be the minimum tests that people run, evne if they are unrealistically strict. Stock chips / boards can pass these tests with flying colors, OC'ed things should be able to as well, if they are to be called stable.Rene23 - Wednesday, May 9, 2018 - link
It's using the wrong platform, need X470 AM4 instead, ..! ;-)