I'll assume that's sarcasm. Long term - Apple has lots of money in the bank, so if the ship sinks, it won't be for a long time. With regards to the short term, the back to school and holiday shopping seasons are around the corner which will likely feature multiple product refreshes.
Rumour also has it that this years iphone refresh is going to be extremely minor and that apple may be changing it's product cycle for the first time., and that next year the real refresh is coming.
The biggest change... removing the headphone jack... for one reason and one reason only. SO you have to buy a lightning adapter to use headphones with your iphone. FUCK THAT.
How short sighted you are. That isn't going to be the only change and it's definitely not just to sell you an adapter. The traditional 3.5mm headphone port is pretty limited. You can't get a very good immersive audio experience from it for example.
Apple has lots of money in the bank, it mean apple is losing its market share they are trying tobring in new hard wares so lets see if hardware refreshes in the fall can stop the drop in sales.https://app2c.com
You're assuming an awful lot without evidence. The people who actually HAVE evidence (based on, eg) talking to prospective buyers, feel that the two year update cycle remains as strong as ever: http://ped30.com/2016/06/21/apple-huberty-calls-bs...
"next years refresh will be minor" is a meaningless statement. Minor compared to what? The iPhone 6S is around 1.7x as fast as the iPhone 6 and comes with 3D Touch and 2Gib RAM. Throw in Wide Gamut and even a small CPU boost (so it's 2x as fast as iPhone 6) you have something that's compelling in lots of ways (obviously faster, obviously nicer screen, obviously new UI modalities) compared to your existing iPhone 6 (or even iPhone 5S).
Every damn year we have this --- clueless idiots who compare this year's model to last year's model and complain that it's not "significantly different". Well, guess the fsck what? That's not the relevant comparison. The relevant comparison (for EVERY product) is with the model that was shipped one "standard purchase replacement cycle" ago.
Because they normally update their iPod, iPhone, iPad, AppleTV, iMac, and Mac Pro around that time. Given they didn't update the MacBook or Watch or MBP yet, they'll also update then as well.
Maybe because applefreaks will still gladly pay almost $3000 for a 'top of the line' retina MacBook pro 15 sporting a 3 year old cpu and a 4 year old gpu and there's no convincing them otherwise
The issue for Apple is they really nailed it with the iPhone 6. The 6S wasn't compelling enough to upgrade most phones (although it's a great phone) and the iPad Pro is just ridiculously expensive for a mobile OS device. Again, it's cool, but I get why they aren't selling in droves. Then the iPhone SE was launched which are into their higher margin products, the Apple Watch sales slowed to a trickle, and there is still no MacBook Pro refresh to speak of causing people to continue waiting to upgrade.
All Apple needs to do is launch a phone on par with the Galaxy S7's features (especially water resistance and storage capacity) and update their portfolio with skylake. Dropping prices of the iPad Pro will help sell them, too. If WatchOS 3 helps performance as much as they are saying it will, well, I'll be happier with mine that's for sure. As it is, half the stuff I want to do on the watch is done faster on the phone, including the time it takes to remove it from my pocket and unlock it.
Apple has just slowed down too much, they were driving themselves hard for years and now they are taking an extended vacation from everything and launching these anomaly products like the new MacBook and the way overpriced Apple TV.
people stop buying these over expensive phones, only the wanne bee remain in the end.... even the lower cost iphone did not increase the declining volume.
pitty that the tablet sales is always going down, if there is a device worth buying from apple its the ipad, although a bit to expensive storage wise...
Goddamit Apple, refresh the Macs already and you'll reverse that 13% fall in revenue. There are literally millions waiting to open their wallet the moment the Macs get updated to Intel's latest and greatest platform.
This! The Hardware Frustration Level among MacBook Pro/Air users has reached an extreme. With MacOS Sierra due in a couple months, I'm expecting new MacBooks in the same time frame. But then again, I was expecting them at WWDC too. I hope is Apple is polishing these shiny new MacBooks to re-seat themselves at top of the market - with new "Gotta Have It" features that PC makers will ridicule at first and then copy a few cycles down the road.
Completely agree with the above. I am still using a 2008 Macbook Pro and want to upgrade but I drug my feet a couple of years ago and there just isn't anything compelling to me right now--aka, I want to buy a laptop with the most recent hardware. I really like the Apple ecosystem for my mobile devices despite doing a lot of computing on my Windows desktop. There is no way that they are getting my money though until they release something up to date.
On a mildly related note: I want a Mac Surface. I use a Surface Pro 4 at work and it just isn't very polished despite it being the fourth generation. Battery life is poor even after optimizing a bunch of the settings (it did improve quite a bit from the out of the box settings) and it is really unstable. I find myself hard restarting it almost everyday.
Back to the thread, Apple need to update the Mac Pro. The complete abandonment after that design change is inexcusable.
I hear you. My SP4, although better machine on paper, was performing not as well as SP3. My problem was with touch screen completely stopping to respond to touch, every 2-3 days on average... and crashing/restarting GPU driver. At least GPU would restart itself... for touch screen, the only way was connecting keyboard and rebooting it, or, if keyboard is not handy, doing hard reset (power + volume up).
Eventually, I have called Surface support and asked if it is worth sending it back. There are a lot of unconfirmed stories on the web about Skylake platform, basically pointing to Intel's hardware/firmware/drivers... so I told support I'd rather not send it back if replacement is going to do the same. Support came back with a bit vague "it could be both software or/and hardware", asked me to try once more clean OS image and latest drivers/firmware update... which I have done already, but I did it again. Touch froze the following day. MS has sent me forward replacement, so fingers crossed... working fine after 2 days, and it looks to me touch is, in general, a bit more reliable. With old SP4, I had this scenario - sometimes, touching link in browser would give visual confirmation - link changes colour etc - but it would not be followed with action. Since replacement, when touch is registered, action always follows - so far.
I'm wondering if earlier batches of SP4 maybe had some factory fault, be it in manufacturing process or in faulty components... something that was fixed later on but MS is still not too keen to recall all the early SP4s and replace/fix them. Considering that I gave them option to blame it on drivers and avoid replacement, they were quite generous in my case, even sent me forward replacement. As if they knew something they are not (yet?) talking about :)
-- with new "Gotta Have It" features that PC makers will ridicule at first and then copy a few cycles down the road
back when Apple used "better" cpu(s) than X86, that was surely possible. running the same cpu as the PC limits them to the capability of said cpu. that some folks are willing to pay way more for a PC with "Apple" on the tag, may just be coming to an end.
Please Apple take my money for a MacBook Pro that actually deserves the Suffix "Pro" again. Make it big, make it screamingly fast, add a terrific dGPU, don't forget the good old Ethernet socket and figure out a way to replace the fscking mirror screen...
Until then I'll happily save my money and continue using my 2011 MBP...
Yeah that was my reaction as well. I like having an Ethernet port, but really it doesn't seem like they have a place on a laptop. If you are going to use it that much, use an adapter.
You can fit "expanding" Lan ports on thin laptops. Not ultrabooks, but reasonably thin business machines, like new Elitebooks 840 and Travelmates P645s... among others.
USB-Lan adapters work fine, too. Especially for devices deprived of any decent number of USB ports, like Surface Pro... where USB hub with lan port can be real lifesaver. But as long as laptop has more than 2 USB ports, I'd rather go for native lan port than another adapter to worry about.
There are less Apple haters now then there was previously. More and more people actually own Apple products.
Although the sales seem lower, that's mostly due to a maturing market. Considering the fact that most iPhone users will not need an upgrade just yet, and any Mac 2011 or later is actually fast by todays standards if you add an SSD.
Also to note, the iPhone SE release is another sign of a maturing market. Most users that can afford a 6 or 6s are satisfied and will not upgrade until a 7 or 7S. The iPhone SE was really only targeted at Asia sales, 4S users, budget users and new iPhone users.
I think Apple is already doing a great job themselves. They don't need extra help. It seems Desktop/AIO/Laptop is in Microsoft's ballpark and Google takes the phone and stale tablets part. China was down 30% in iPhone sales, so a market with proper growth potentials is gone. It's all, but slowly, downhill for Apple from now on. That's not hating, but being realistic.
The "other products" category's poor showing is no surprise. I'd hazard a guess at saying the Watch is performing very poorly based on the lack of interest Apple is showing in the platform. That really isn't an accusation directed at Apple citing poor execution, but more representative of the broader market of wearable technology in general. As people abandon their fitbits and Watches in dresser drawers because of their tiny screens, limited use case scenarios, and short battery life, I think you'll see only a few people that are both die hard wristwatch wearers from older generations that didn't grow up with clocks on literally every electronic device all around them that also happen to be goo-gaw device junkies still pine for attempts at modernizing such relics.
On the phone, tablet, and computer fronts the bottom line is that there's nothing really interesting going on in the industry with respect to technological advancement. Tablets are slowly following netbooks to their eventual demise. Phones have gotten too big to appeal to a lot of people who want to put them into a pocket instead of sticking them in a brick-like case and then carrying them in a holster like some modern replacement of the western movie cowboy's revolver. Meanwhile the PC industry is by-and-large stable with the only blips being new graphics cards that ultimately are still not in the the majority of computers because processor graphics have the market locked down pretty well while consoles have a large chunk of the gaming market. The only other blip is a misguided attempt to exhume VR headsets from their mid-1990's tombs while DX12 is poised to kill off multi-GPU setups that offer reasonable performance (read non-vomit inducing) in VR once and for all by making cost sensitive game developers responsible for baking in support, thus killing that zombie and putting it back in the dead-end tech heap with 3D televisions for another 15-20 years until someone attempts to dig them up again under the assumption that "it'll surely be different this time around now that we have technologies X, Y, & Z" without realizing the fundamentally bad outcomes in most humans that results in sensory conflicts VR creates.
If the new gen of GPU's isn't enough reason for Apple to update, then nothing will be. DX12 will do the exact opposite of what you claim, DX12 will make multi-GPU setups viable again. I am as surprised as anyone with the stagnation in the MacBook pro lineup, but I am quite certain we will see a refresh this fall. I have never, nor will I ever own anything Apple, but I think your assessment is quite off-base.
I honestly don't see how DX12 will help. NV has already thrown in the towel with > 2 GPU setups in the new hardware generation, effectively walking away from supporting such configurations with their new SLI bridge and that alone should clue people in that this sort of thing is being slowly abandoned.
The other obvious point is that DX12 shifts multi-GPU support responsibility to game developers (or game engine developers anyway). In order to support m-GPU configurations, human labor will be necessary which will drive up production costs. Game development is already a labor-intensive affair with a big chunk of expenses going to paying salaries. With highly cost-sensitive big studios being asked to soak up the price of additional labor to support halo and niche hardware configurations that don't really do much more than pointlessly increase FPS at resolutions the majority don't run, it's going to be difficult for a publisher to authorize the investment to support m-GPU. It boils down to dollars and I just don't see it making cost effective sense. Even the argument that there's a lot of unused iGPUs sitting around doing nothing in computers with discrete graphics doesn't hold a lot of water when the largest segments of computers sold don't even contain a d-GPU which could benefit from iGPU+dGPU DX12 scenarios. Atop that, the majority of those sales are laptops and small form factor machines where adding a discrete graphics chip isn't possible.
I'm gonna call it now, multi-GPU setups are going the way of the dodo bird. Desktops that are big enough and custom enough to support more than one GPU are already dinosaurs in a mobile computing world. There's just no real future for such things outside of professional rendering farms and whatnot. They certainly don't fit in a pocket or handbag overly well and with tighter integration of components that are cutting into modular expansion capability, PCs are losing the ability to be upgraded at all.
Replying to my own post...tacky. Still, when's the last time AT even reviewed a standard desktop PC -- something in an ATX case that can actually be upgraded? It looks like there was a workstation given a full review in 2015, but aside from that, complete desktops are a non-entity. Component-level reviews cover desktop hardware, but that market is shrinking as surely as companies like NewEgg now sell kitchen appliances in order to be diversified enough to stay afloat. -- Got a nice waffle iron from them 3 years ago when I bought some RAM for a laptop as a matter of fact.
Read the writing on the wall. It sucks, but it's been there for a few years already.
-- If the new gen of GPU's isn't enough reason for Apple to update, then nothing will be.
need a use case for a new gen of GPU. the three driving applications (spreadsheets, word processing, spreadsheets) get by just fine with embedded cpu graphics. games, CAD, and who knows are about the only use cases that need any kind of GPU. not large markets, at least compared to Excel and Word of two decades ago.
And how exactly do you get to "lack of interest Apple is showing in the platform"? Apple is releasing a massive OS update with WatchOS 3 in September, along with likely new hardware.
People like you seem utterly oblivious to the way the iPhone launched, under essentially exactly the same circumstances. iPhone 1 had inadequate hardware (no 3G for gods sake, slow, 128MiB RAM), and severe limitations in the OS. It sold poorly (worse than Apple Watch so far). But it mattered because it showed the direction of the future.
It took two more sub-par iterations (iPhone 3G then iPhone 3GS) before everything really started coming together with the iPhone 4, and even that success wrt design and technology was only reflected in sales with the iPhone 4S.
Change takes time. One reason to be optimistic about Apple is precisely that they have now calibrated themselves pretty well to this. Apple TV is a great example of REALLY understanding how slow some things would change (and even pre-emptively calling it a "hobby" to get people to shut up about how slow this would be). I expect wrist computers (ie Apple Watch) likewise to take around another two, even three, years of hardware that's not quite where we'd like it to be, and likely some flailing around with the visual design of the hardware and the details of the UI before Apple nails it AND the public starts to see the value AND the sorts of social infrastructure changes that really make it valuable (eg widespread Apple Pay, using your watch to identify you for transit and similar tasks). And even after the iPhone 4, it still took a few more years to consolidate and improve everything with iOS 7. And, big bang as iOS 7 was, we're still finding plenty of things to fix in later OSs.
-- I expect wrist computers (ie Apple Watch) likewise to take around another two, even three, years of hardware
hardware, strictly speaking, isn't the issue. they are: 1 - form factor is way too small. Dick Tracy was a cartoon 2 - battery power is determined by physics and chemistry, not cartoonists, and unless/until the science finds a battery chemistry with at least 100% more oomph than today's, then today's processing is what you'll get, forevvehhha
The inclusion of gimmick features like physical activity monitoring are just attempts by the manufacturers (Apple and others) to find the "killer app" that will appeal to a large enough audience to make platforms like the Watch sell to a broader audience to which they currently offer no utility. At the moment, they're something akin to a new exercise machine that someone purchases, uses twice, and the forgets about.
The trouble in developing that utility and finding that killer app is overcoming essentially insurmountable problems in the tiny screen and the physics of current battery technology. E-Ink screens might offset the battery problem, but their refresh rate is too low to offer a visually interesting interface or differentiate the product from a cheap digital watch that just tells the time.
The bottom line is that the platform is doomed. A few companies are riding a fad wave to drum up some money with limited function hardware (fitbit pops into mind right away -- as does dusty exercise equipment everyone's forgotten after a year) but I don't think any of those companies would be realistic if it were to forecast this sort of thing being enduring in the long run. Their best bet is to cash grab while they can and diversify into related products by using wrist platforms as their company's proverbial first rocket booster stage.
Apple is different in that its already got a variety of other products and their strategy in approaching watches is different as well. They're trying to continue to give the public the perception the company is innovative in a post-Jobs era where its impossible for Steve to return to save the company from itself again (unless the fine people at Apple have figured out that necromancy thing). Even if the Watch ends up a loss, its probably worth the cost because of the intangible benefit of public perception. That's why I think they're making a dog and pony show of it, but ultimately aren't all-in with the Watch for the long haul.
Great stat reporting. Very good job of making the data easy to understand - and pretty darn comprehensive. Forbes links to this article making the case that Apple bulls have plenty to worry about as Apple remains in a Growth Stall http://bit.ly/2ahpVAf
until someone invents a battery with at least 100% more energy density than present ones, there's not much more function that can fit in a phone or watch and still last long enough to be desirable.
IMHO the interesting and relevant fact of that graph is that the BIG Apple jumps are at the "visually" new models --- big jump at iPhone 5 and iPhone 6, flat for the iPhone 5S and 6S. (I think the graph also shows that things change slower than people expect --- the iPhone 4 was, IMHO, the first iPhone that really hit it out of the park, but it took a while, not really until the iPhone 4S, for "society" to realize the significance of the product. Relevant to the Apple Watch...)
The real question, then, is will the iPhone 7 be more compelling than the 6? (ie will Apple just pick up the crowd who are renewing their phones after two years, or significant new sales?) Who knows; but Apple clearly are trying to push 3D Touch and Wide Gamut as reasons you notice everyday (in how you use the phone and what you see there) to upgrade.
(They may also do something to give the product line more heft in the mid-range, not just the high-end. The 6 will be two years old by then, and missing wide gamut and 3D touch, but otherwise still a nice developer target --- 64 bit, reasonable amount of RAM, large retina screen, touchID. Especially in India and China, we might see Apple pushing the SE and the 6 [or a rebranded 6, something like the SE+] hard to sell into the middle class, at around the $350 to $450 price point. My guess is the numbers for next year this time will show essentially flat phone revenue, but rather higher sales, reflecting more sales of this mid-range phones and Apple accepting that this is the only place left to grow.)
-- The real question, then, is will the iPhone 7 be more compelling than the 6?
what function, must have division, can the 7 have? without that question answered, we live in a "good enough" Dark Age of stasis. iPhone 1 had cap touch screen. and for a few years, only iPhone had it. the distinguishing parts since then, i.e. camera, are bought-in anyways.
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shabby - Tuesday, July 26, 2016 - link
Looks like apple is doomed...JanSolo242 - Tuesday, July 26, 2016 - link
I'll assume that's sarcasm. Long term - Apple has lots of money in the bank, so if the ship sinks, it won't be for a long time. With regards to the short term, the back to school and holiday shopping seasons are around the corner which will likely feature multiple product refreshes.Samus - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
lol. if that isn't obvious sarcasm, you be way too serious.osxandwindows - Tuesday, July 26, 2016 - link
Why are they expecting a bigger quarter in September?Cliff34 - Tuesday, July 26, 2016 - link
Rumour has it that iPhone 7 is coming out in Sept.dsumanik - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Rumour also has it that this years iphone refresh is going to be extremely minor and that apple may be changing it's product cycle for the first time., and that next year the real refresh is coming.The biggest change... removing the headphone jack... for one reason and one reason only. SO you have to buy a lightning adapter to use headphones with your iphone. FUCK THAT.
cmdrdredd - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
How short sighted you are. That isn't going to be the only change and it's definitely not just to sell you an adapter. The traditional 3.5mm headphone port is pretty limited. You can't get a very good immersive audio experience from it for example.Impulses - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
What does that even mean?phillock - Friday, January 12, 2018 - link
Apple has lots of money in the bank, it mean apple is losing its market share they are trying tobring in new hard wares so lets see if hardware refreshes in the fall can stop the drop in sales.https://app2c.comFunBunny2 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
-- The traditional 3.5mm headphone port is pretty limited.it's hardly the size of the jack which determines the quality of the sound.
cryptonx - Sunday, July 31, 2016 - link
You are correct, 3.5mm is no good for audio, Maybe Apple should've used a 6.35mm port or an optical output, also we need a hdmi port, a full one.prisonerX - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
I bet you pine for floppy disks too.The digitisation of the headphone port is long overdue. The attendant hysterics gives you some idea why.
name99 - Thursday, July 28, 2016 - link
You're assuming an awful lot without evidence. The people who actually HAVE evidence (based on, eg) talking to prospective buyers, feel that the two year update cycle remains as strong as ever:http://ped30.com/2016/06/21/apple-huberty-calls-bs...
"next years refresh will be minor" is a meaningless statement. Minor compared to what? The iPhone 6S is around 1.7x as fast as the iPhone 6 and comes with 3D Touch and 2Gib RAM. Throw in Wide Gamut and even a small CPU boost (so it's 2x as fast as iPhone 6) you have something that's compelling in lots of ways (obviously faster, obviously nicer screen, obviously new UI modalities) compared to your existing iPhone 6 (or even iPhone 5S).
Every damn year we have this --- clueless idiots who compare this year's model to last year's model and complain that it's not "significantly different". Well, guess the fsck what? That's not the relevant comparison. The relevant comparison (for EVERY product) is with the model that was shipped one "standard purchase replacement cycle" ago.
michael2k - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Because they normally update their iPod, iPhone, iPad, AppleTV, iMac, and Mac Pro around that time. Given they didn't update the MacBook or Watch or MBP yet, they'll also update then as well.Pneumothorax - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Maybe because applefreaks will still gladly pay almost $3000 for a 'top of the line' retina MacBook pro 15 sporting a 3 year old cpu and a 4 year old gpu and there's no convincing them otherwiseHoekie - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
yep, compared to last year's quarter in September. Isn't that obvious?keyc - Tuesday, July 26, 2016 - link
Think the 5th paragraph should read 4.25 million. Did a double take when I saw unit sales of 4.25 billion macs.Brett Howse - Tuesday, July 26, 2016 - link
Yeah that would be quite the quarter - fixed!hlovatt - Tuesday, July 26, 2016 - link
I am amazed that all the Apple haters that unfortunately ruin the comments section of this site are not all over this!Good that Apple are under at least a tiny bit of pressure. Should mean better tech for everyone.
Michael Bay - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Here is your pity reply.Samus - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
The issue for Apple is they really nailed it with the iPhone 6. The 6S wasn't compelling enough to upgrade most phones (although it's a great phone) and the iPad Pro is just ridiculously expensive for a mobile OS device. Again, it's cool, but I get why they aren't selling in droves. Then the iPhone SE was launched which are into their higher margin products, the Apple Watch sales slowed to a trickle, and there is still no MacBook Pro refresh to speak of causing people to continue waiting to upgrade.All Apple needs to do is launch a phone on par with the Galaxy S7's features (especially water resistance and storage capacity) and update their portfolio with skylake. Dropping prices of the iPad Pro will help sell them, too. If WatchOS 3 helps performance as much as they are saying it will, well, I'll be happier with mine that's for sure. As it is, half the stuff I want to do on the watch is done faster on the phone, including the time it takes to remove it from my pocket and unlock it.
Apple has just slowed down too much, they were driving themselves hard for years and now they are taking an extended vacation from everything and launching these anomaly products like the new MacBook and the way overpriced Apple TV.
Klug4Pres - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Apple put only 1GB RAM in the iPhone 6, which will ensure a huge upgrade cycle, at least for those who don't care about price.smilingcrow - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Apple aren't competing against Windows PCs which is why they are so complacent and use very old hardware.prisonerX - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
True, but it's Windows PCs' fault. I wish they had better competition.duploxxx - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
and my stories continues, falling empire.people stop buying these over expensive phones, only the wanne bee remain in the end.... even the lower cost iphone did not increase the declining volume.
pitty that the tablet sales is always going down, if there is a device worth buying from apple its the ipad, although a bit to expensive storage wise...
damianrobertjones - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Capitals?xype - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Capitals are for interlektshuals.r3loaded - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Goddamit Apple, refresh the Macs already and you'll reverse that 13% fall in revenue. There are literally millions waiting to open their wallet the moment the Macs get updated to Intel's latest and greatest platform.TEAMSWITCHER - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
This! The Hardware Frustration Level among MacBook Pro/Air users has reached an extreme. With MacOS Sierra due in a couple months, I'm expecting new MacBooks in the same time frame. But then again, I was expecting them at WWDC too. I hope is Apple is polishing these shiny new MacBooks to re-seat themselves at top of the market - with new "Gotta Have It" features that PC makers will ridicule at first and then copy a few cycles down the road.ingwe - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Completely agree with the above. I am still using a 2008 Macbook Pro and want to upgrade but I drug my feet a couple of years ago and there just isn't anything compelling to me right now--aka, I want to buy a laptop with the most recent hardware. I really like the Apple ecosystem for my mobile devices despite doing a lot of computing on my Windows desktop. There is no way that they are getting my money though until they release something up to date.On a mildly related note: I want a Mac Surface. I use a Surface Pro 4 at work and it just isn't very polished despite it being the fourth generation. Battery life is poor even after optimizing a bunch of the settings (it did improve quite a bit from the out of the box settings) and it is really unstable. I find myself hard restarting it almost everyday.
Back to the thread, Apple need to update the Mac Pro. The complete abandonment after that design change is inexcusable.
Hoekie - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Apple users are not tech savy. Most don't care.nikon133 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
I hear you. My SP4, although better machine on paper, was performing not as well as SP3. My problem was with touch screen completely stopping to respond to touch, every 2-3 days on average... and crashing/restarting GPU driver. At least GPU would restart itself... for touch screen, the only way was connecting keyboard and rebooting it, or, if keyboard is not handy, doing hard reset (power + volume up).Eventually, I have called Surface support and asked if it is worth sending it back. There are a lot of unconfirmed stories on the web about Skylake platform, basically pointing to Intel's hardware/firmware/drivers... so I told support I'd rather not send it back if replacement is going to do the same. Support came back with a bit vague "it could be both software or/and hardware", asked me to try once more clean OS image and latest drivers/firmware update... which I have done already, but I did it again. Touch froze the following day. MS has sent me forward replacement, so fingers crossed... working fine after 2 days, and it looks to me touch is, in general, a bit more reliable. With old SP4, I had this scenario - sometimes, touching link in browser would give visual confirmation - link changes colour etc - but it would not be followed with action. Since replacement, when touch is registered, action always follows - so far.
I'm wondering if earlier batches of SP4 maybe had some factory fault, be it in manufacturing process or in faulty components... something that was fixed later on but MS is still not too keen to recall all the early SP4s and replace/fix them. Considering that I gave them option to blame it on drivers and avoid replacement, they were quite generous in my case, even sent me forward replacement. As if they knew something they are not (yet?) talking about :)
FunBunny2 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
-- with new "Gotta Have It" features that PC makers will ridicule at first and then copy a few cycles down the roadback when Apple used "better" cpu(s) than X86, that was surely possible. running the same cpu as the PC limits them to the capability of said cpu. that some folks are willing to pay way more for a PC with "Apple" on the tag, may just be coming to an end.
Daniel Egger - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Please Apple take my money for a MacBook Pro that actually deserves the Suffix "Pro" again. Make it big, make it screamingly fast, add a terrific dGPU, don't forget the good old Ethernet socket and figure out a way to replace the fscking mirror screen...Until then I'll happily save my money and continue using my 2011 MBP...
TEAMSWITCHER - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
"...good old Ethernet socket..." Your living in the past.ingwe - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Yeah that was my reaction as well. I like having an Ethernet port, but really it doesn't seem like they have a place on a laptop. If you are going to use it that much, use an adapter.nikon133 - Sunday, July 31, 2016 - link
You can fit "expanding" Lan ports on thin laptops. Not ultrabooks, but reasonably thin business machines, like new Elitebooks 840 and Travelmates P645s... among others.USB-Lan adapters work fine, too. Especially for devices deprived of any decent number of USB ports, like Surface Pro... where USB hub with lan port can be real lifesaver. But as long as laptop has more than 2 USB ports, I'd rather go for native lan port than another adapter to worry about.
jase240 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
There are less Apple haters now then there was previously. More and more people actually own Apple products.Although the sales seem lower, that's mostly due to a maturing market. Considering the fact that most iPhone users will not need an upgrade just yet, and any Mac 2011 or later is actually fast by todays standards if you add an SSD.
Also to note, the iPhone SE release is another sign of a maturing market. Most users that can afford a 6 or 6s are satisfied and will not upgrade until a 7 or 7S. The iPhone SE was really only targeted at Asia sales, 4S users, budget users and new iPhone users.
Hoekie - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
I think Apple is already doing a great job themselves. They don't need extra help. It seems Desktop/AIO/Laptop is in Microsoft's ballpark and Google takes the phone and stale tablets part.China was down 30% in iPhone sales, so a market with proper growth potentials is gone. It's all, but slowly, downhill for Apple from now on. That's not hating, but being realistic.
FunBunny2 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
-- More and more people actually own Apple products.not actual computers, at least on a "growth" basis. read the filings.
BrokenCrayons - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
The "other products" category's poor showing is no surprise. I'd hazard a guess at saying the Watch is performing very poorly based on the lack of interest Apple is showing in the platform. That really isn't an accusation directed at Apple citing poor execution, but more representative of the broader market of wearable technology in general. As people abandon their fitbits and Watches in dresser drawers because of their tiny screens, limited use case scenarios, and short battery life, I think you'll see only a few people that are both die hard wristwatch wearers from older generations that didn't grow up with clocks on literally every electronic device all around them that also happen to be goo-gaw device junkies still pine for attempts at modernizing such relics.On the phone, tablet, and computer fronts the bottom line is that there's nothing really interesting going on in the industry with respect to technological advancement. Tablets are slowly following netbooks to their eventual demise. Phones have gotten too big to appeal to a lot of people who want to put them into a pocket instead of sticking them in a brick-like case and then carrying them in a holster like some modern replacement of the western movie cowboy's revolver. Meanwhile the PC industry is by-and-large stable with the only blips being new graphics cards that ultimately are still not in the the majority of computers because processor graphics have the market locked down pretty well while consoles have a large chunk of the gaming market. The only other blip is a misguided attempt to exhume VR headsets from their mid-1990's tombs while DX12 is poised to kill off multi-GPU setups that offer reasonable performance (read non-vomit inducing) in VR once and for all by making cost sensitive game developers responsible for baking in support, thus killing that zombie and putting it back in the dead-end tech heap with 3D televisions for another 15-20 years until someone attempts to dig them up again under the assumption that "it'll surely be different this time around now that we have technologies X, Y, & Z" without realizing the fundamentally bad outcomes in most humans that results in sensory conflicts VR creates.
fanofanand - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
If the new gen of GPU's isn't enough reason for Apple to update, then nothing will be. DX12 will do the exact opposite of what you claim, DX12 will make multi-GPU setups viable again. I am as surprised as anyone with the stagnation in the MacBook pro lineup, but I am quite certain we will see a refresh this fall. I have never, nor will I ever own anything Apple, but I think your assessment is quite off-base.BrokenCrayons - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
I honestly don't see how DX12 will help. NV has already thrown in the towel with > 2 GPU setups in the new hardware generation, effectively walking away from supporting such configurations with their new SLI bridge and that alone should clue people in that this sort of thing is being slowly abandoned.The other obvious point is that DX12 shifts multi-GPU support responsibility to game developers (or game engine developers anyway). In order to support m-GPU configurations, human labor will be necessary which will drive up production costs. Game development is already a labor-intensive affair with a big chunk of expenses going to paying salaries. With highly cost-sensitive big studios being asked to soak up the price of additional labor to support halo and niche hardware configurations that don't really do much more than pointlessly increase FPS at resolutions the majority don't run, it's going to be difficult for a publisher to authorize the investment to support m-GPU. It boils down to dollars and I just don't see it making cost effective sense. Even the argument that there's a lot of unused iGPUs sitting around doing nothing in computers with discrete graphics doesn't hold a lot of water when the largest segments of computers sold don't even contain a d-GPU which could benefit from iGPU+dGPU DX12 scenarios. Atop that, the majority of those sales are laptops and small form factor machines where adding a discrete graphics chip isn't possible.
I'm gonna call it now, multi-GPU setups are going the way of the dodo bird. Desktops that are big enough and custom enough to support more than one GPU are already dinosaurs in a mobile computing world. There's just no real future for such things outside of professional rendering farms and whatnot. They certainly don't fit in a pocket or handbag overly well and with tighter integration of components that are cutting into modular expansion capability, PCs are losing the ability to be upgraded at all.
BrokenCrayons - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Replying to my own post...tacky. Still, when's the last time AT even reviewed a standard desktop PC -- something in an ATX case that can actually be upgraded? It looks like there was a workstation given a full review in 2015, but aside from that, complete desktops are a non-entity. Component-level reviews cover desktop hardware, but that market is shrinking as surely as companies like NewEgg now sell kitchen appliances in order to be diversified enough to stay afloat. -- Got a nice waffle iron from them 3 years ago when I bought some RAM for a laptop as a matter of fact.Read the writing on the wall. It sucks, but it's been there for a few years already.
FunBunny2 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
-- If the new gen of GPU's isn't enough reason for Apple to update, then nothing will be.need a use case for a new gen of GPU. the three driving applications (spreadsheets, word processing, spreadsheets) get by just fine with embedded cpu graphics. games, CAD, and who knows are about the only use cases that need any kind of GPU. not large markets, at least compared to Excel and Word of two decades ago.
name99 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
And how exactly do you get to "lack of interest Apple is showing in the platform"?Apple is releasing a massive OS update with WatchOS 3 in September, along with likely new hardware.
People like you seem utterly oblivious to the way the iPhone launched, under essentially exactly the same circumstances. iPhone 1 had inadequate hardware (no 3G for gods sake, slow, 128MiB RAM), and severe limitations in the OS. It sold poorly (worse than Apple Watch so far). But it mattered because it showed the direction of the future.
It took two more sub-par iterations (iPhone 3G then iPhone 3GS) before everything really started coming together with the iPhone 4, and even that success wrt design and technology was only reflected in sales with the iPhone 4S.
Change takes time. One reason to be optimistic about Apple is precisely that they have now calibrated themselves pretty well to this. Apple TV is a great example of REALLY understanding how slow some things would change (and even pre-emptively calling it a "hobby" to get people to shut up about how slow this would be).
I expect wrist computers (ie Apple Watch) likewise to take around another two, even three, years of hardware that's not quite where we'd like it to be, and likely some flailing around with the visual design of the hardware and the details of the UI before Apple nails it AND the public starts to see the value AND the sorts of social infrastructure changes that really make it valuable (eg widespread Apple Pay, using your watch to identify you for transit and similar tasks).
And even after the iPhone 4, it still took a few more years to consolidate and improve everything with iOS 7. And, big bang as iOS 7 was, we're still finding plenty of things to fix in later OSs.
Change takes time!
FunBunny2 - Thursday, July 28, 2016 - link
-- I expect wrist computers (ie Apple Watch) likewise to take around another two, even three, years of hardwarehardware, strictly speaking, isn't the issue. they are:
1 - form factor is way too small. Dick Tracy was a cartoon
2 - battery power is determined by physics and chemistry, not cartoonists, and unless/until the science finds a battery chemistry with at least 100% more oomph than today's, then today's processing is what you'll get, forevvehhha
BrokenCrayons - Thursday, July 28, 2016 - link
You nailed it.The inclusion of gimmick features like physical activity monitoring are just attempts by the manufacturers (Apple and others) to find the "killer app" that will appeal to a large enough audience to make platforms like the Watch sell to a broader audience to which they currently offer no utility. At the moment, they're something akin to a new exercise machine that someone purchases, uses twice, and the forgets about.
The trouble in developing that utility and finding that killer app is overcoming essentially insurmountable problems in the tiny screen and the physics of current battery technology. E-Ink screens might offset the battery problem, but their refresh rate is too low to offer a visually interesting interface or differentiate the product from a cheap digital watch that just tells the time.
The bottom line is that the platform is doomed. A few companies are riding a fad wave to drum up some money with limited function hardware (fitbit pops into mind right away -- as does dusty exercise equipment everyone's forgotten after a year) but I don't think any of those companies would be realistic if it were to forecast this sort of thing being enduring in the long run. Their best bet is to cash grab while they can and diversify into related products by using wrist platforms as their company's proverbial first rocket booster stage.
Apple is different in that its already got a variety of other products and their strategy in approaching watches is different as well. They're trying to continue to give the public the perception the company is innovative in a post-Jobs era where its impossible for Steve to return to save the company from itself again (unless the fine people at Apple have figured out that necromancy thing). Even if the Watch ends up a loss, its probably worth the cost because of the intangible benefit of public perception. That's why I think they're making a dog and pony show of it, but ultimately aren't all-in with the Watch for the long haul.
ChicagoAdam - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Great stat reporting. Very good job of making the data easy to understand - and pretty darn comprehensive. Forbes links to this article making the case that Apple bulls have plenty to worry about as Apple remains in a Growth Stall http://bit.ly/2ahpVAfHoekie - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Remains going down you mean. There's no growth for 2 quarters. That's the news. And nothing new on the horizon. Just refreshes.cmdrdredd - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
Every phone ever released is a refresh though.FunBunny2 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
until someone invents a battery with at least 100% more energy density than present ones, there's not much more function that can fit in a phone or watch and still last long enough to be desirable.name99 - Wednesday, July 27, 2016 - link
"Much like last quarter, Apple has struggled to maintain the sales pace of the iPhone 6s, compared to the iPhone 6."This represents a misunderstanding of Apple's sales patterns. Look at the graph:
http://cdn.macrumors.com/article-new/2016/07/Scree...
IMHO the interesting and relevant fact of that graph is that the BIG Apple jumps are at the "visually" new models --- big jump at iPhone 5 and iPhone 6, flat for the iPhone 5S and 6S.
(I think the graph also shows that things change slower than people expect --- the iPhone 4 was, IMHO, the first iPhone that really hit it out of the park, but it took a while, not really until the iPhone 4S, for "society" to realize the significance of the product. Relevant to the Apple Watch...)
The real question, then, is will the iPhone 7 be more compelling than the 6? (ie will Apple just pick up the crowd who are renewing their phones after two years, or significant new sales?) Who knows; but Apple clearly are trying to push 3D Touch and Wide Gamut as reasons you notice everyday (in how you use the phone and what you see there) to upgrade.
(They may also do something to give the product line more heft in the mid-range, not just the high-end. The 6 will be two years old by then, and missing wide gamut and 3D touch, but otherwise still a nice developer target --- 64 bit, reasonable amount of RAM, large retina screen, touchID. Especially in India and China, we might see Apple pushing the SE and the 6 [or a rebranded 6, something like the SE+] hard to sell into the middle class, at around the $350 to $450 price point.
My guess is the numbers for next year this time will show essentially flat phone revenue, but rather higher sales, reflecting more sales of this mid-range phones and Apple accepting that this is the only place left to grow.)
FunBunny2 - Thursday, July 28, 2016 - link
-- The real question, then, is will the iPhone 7 be more compelling than the 6?what function, must have division, can the 7 have? without that question answered, we live in a "good enough" Dark Age of stasis. iPhone 1 had cap touch screen. and for a few years, only iPhone had it. the distinguishing parts since then, i.e. camera, are bought-in anyways.
juned393 - Friday, March 31, 2017 - link
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