That's odd. AMD R7 SSDs have been sold for a while here in Norway, but they aren't very common. The new R3s are listed on price comparison sites, but don't have prices or store listings yet.
@Krysto: "Why is AMD in SSDs again? Just because Intel is?"
I don't believe so. As far as I can tell, it is Microsoft's fault. Once upon a time, windows PCs had gotten themselves into a rut design wise. Windows tablets were heading the same direction. So, Microsoft decided that they would put out higher quality / more appealing in-house designs for these markets to generate some innovation in the market. Despite an initial poor reception, they continued with the Surface line as the point was more about prompting other manufacturers to raise their standards than about Microsoft generating significant revenue. Interestingly, they eventually had some good success with their Surface line, despite never being particularly cost competitive.
AMD's story looks similar, but from an even lower quality outlook. AMD has been relegated to the most budget of system by OEMs. The combination of parts that they often get paired with make them appear even more budget than they probably deserve. AMD isn't in a position to build full out PCs or laptops, but building certain components could be their way of trying to let OEMs know that these are the quality of parts they'd rather the OEMs use. It also provides an easy way for the inexperienced to get an upgrade that they know will work. I believe that this is less about turning a profit than raising the baseline experience for their platform.
@Krysto: "Surely, AMD needs the R&D money for its more core businesses?"
They surely do. However, if they can raise the baseline experience with their platform, then they can start pushing out of the ultra low margin budget sector and back into the higher margin mainstream and performance sectors. Given that the RAM and SSDs thus far are developed by a third party, checked for compatibility, and then rebranded, the R&D here is minimal. It the program is successful in raising the standard of AMD systems, it could even pay for itself indirectly. In any case, AMD certainly seems to think it's worth pursuing.
Except Intel actually engineers and builds the components for their SSDs and doesn't just re-badge an existing product. There is a difference there... :)
Ridiculous. They are fools. Radeon = graphics, not bargain bin SSD.
These things aren't even good. If they're hurting for cash that bad, then sell the things but give them a proper name. These are not even made by AMD, let alone their ATi capacity.
Yeah. I do think they are hurting the Radeon brand by using it here. Even if they offerings were dominating the high end of the market, I think it would be better to save the Radeon name for graphics products. Are these even made by the Radeon Technologies Group division of AMD?
In light of the fact that few OEMs have been willing to put SSDs in AMD machines this is a great strategy that is directed at AMD users that want to replace their HDDs with quicker SSDs. Even these slow R3 SSDs will provide very noticeably quicker boot times at chump change prices.
This is a very good plan that will give AMD users a more pleasant experience that OEMs have been unwilling to provide.
Any non-AMD branded SSD will achieve the same thing. These are SATA SSDs. it's a standard. Has anyone here ever had an SSD not work because it wasn't compatible? With AMDs tight budget this is a waste of resources and money that could be saved or used elsewhere.
And if you really need to do it, please offer something worth buying instead of yet another crappy TLC drive.
@beginner99: "Any non-AMD branded SSD will achieve the same thing."
True, but AMD branded SSDs will send a message to OEMs and consumers that this is the quality of parts AMD thinks should be used with the system. Most of them certainly aren't high end, but consider what OEMs usually put into AMD systems.
@beginner99: "And if you really need to do it, please offer something worth buying instead of yet another crappy TLC drive."
Crappy TLC drives are still night and day difference from 5400RPM HDDs that OEMs often pair in AMD systems. Also, the R7 drives are MLC. I'd expect that trend to continue.
I think that you're right on the money - given that AMD isn't normally relegated at top tier OEMS, what IS true is that putting together "reasonable" RAM and CPU (AMD is reasonable - but not super-fast) into a system, then slapping a slow 5400 RPM drive in it makes the computer seem "terrible" by today's standards. The message to OEMs with an AMD branded SSD (even a low-end one) is still that if they go with an entire AMD branded system, at least it won't be total garbage (slower CPU than Intel, RAM makes little to no difference, but even the slowest "modern" SSD is an order of magnitude faster than any HDD). THAT is the play - convince people that an AMD based system with an SSD is at least usable.
I'm pretty sure you nailed it. If it were about this product line turning a profit, I'm pretty sure they'd do more than just buy a third party SSD(or RAM for that matter), validate it, and slap a label on it.
remember when Opterons were cleaning the floor with Intels chips. And all the best motherboards happened to be AMD motherboards. Remember when ATI made video cards that kicked ass and had solid drivers? It's been at least a decade now since I've wanted anything AMD in my systems. I'll happily fork offer a tiny bit more for a Samsung, Crucial or Intel SSD. Why bother subjecting my data to a cheap SSD?
I do actually remember when AMD made excellent video cards like it was yesterday. Oh wait, that's because AMD's been making fantastic GPUs with very solid drivers and I used one of their cards yesterday. Trading out my 970 for a 290 was the best thing I could've done for stability in games. To think that the 780 was once considered competition for the 290.
AMD drivers are amazingly stable and reliable, great performers. The AMD GPUs put the competition to shame. At one time the 680 was considered competition for the HD7970 lol.
You mean using HBM instead of a more traditional DRAM cache in SSDs? I'm not seeing why that would be a particularly good fit for SSDs. IIRC, HBM requires an interposer, which would mean adding cost and complexity to the SSD, and I don't know how well that would go over in the competitive SSD market. Especially given how cache performance is only aspect of SSD performance.
I'm certainly no expert here, but you seem to be reaching.
3d stacked memory is High Bandwidth Memory. Any kind of memory can be stacked. In fact Hynix has been stacking flash memory for almost a year now.
"SK Hynix begins to produce 3D NAND flash memory
SK Hynix has begun to produce 3D NAND flash memory, which will be used for solid-state drives later this year. The vertically-stacked NAND flash memory from SK Hynix will improve performance and reliability of the company’s solid-state drives.
The 3D NAND memory device that SK Hynix produces in volume features 36 layers and has capacity of 128Gb. The IC [integrated circuit] is a multi-layer cell NAND flash memory product designed for various devices, including SSDs and removable storage. SK Hynix has been sampling its 3D NAND memory with customers for several quarters.
SK Hynix is also finalizing design of 48-layer triple-level cell (TLC) 3D NAND flash memory. The memory device will be mass produced in 2016, reports EETimes."
What you are confusing is that HBM as a TERM has been used for DRAM. 3d stacked flash memory is stacked for the very same reason that volatile DRAM is: BANDWIDTH.
It is you who is confusing terms. HBM is not a catch-all for any stacked memory. It is a JEDEC standard referring to a type of DRAM involving stack dies and a wide interface.
That makes no sense. HBM gives you memory, not storage so it could only be used for caching. And it sits between a slow PCIe x4 connector and even slower SLC/MLC/TLC chips, the massive bandwidth would be totally wasted. Or you end up with an extreme niche memory only solution like FusionIO.
HBM is an architecture, literally. Chips are placed on top of each other and connected by VIAs through the entire stack. HBM and HBM2 is just associated with DRAM. But HBM is also a term used to describe HIGH BANDWIDTH MEMORY. Any memory can be stacked Gddr5 or NAND FLASH memory. It is all stacked for the same reason HIGH BANDWIDTH.
Anyway, regardless of the debate whether AMD should put their name on cheap SSDs, the SSDs exist and are very, very cheap. I just saw the cheapest 480 GB, at least in my country: it was an R3. The question is are they decent enough to be used?
Well... no, Intel isn't the leader in consumer SSDs. :-) If I want to buy something good for a SATA SSD I would buy Samsung 850 Pro. But for the kid's gaming pc, the price for that R3 480 GB looks great.
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mmrezaie - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
Maybe it is only in the usa. I cannot find anyone selling any AMD ssd in Sweden. But who cares!mmrezaie - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
I mean there are many SSD manufacturers already selling in here and prices are not bad.Valantar - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
That's odd. AMD R7 SSDs have been sold for a while here in Norway, but they aren't very common. The new R3s are listed on price comparison sites, but don't have prices or store listings yet.wiak - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
fancy meeting you here, yeah a quick check at prisjakt.no says most of them are out of stockProsp3ctus - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
They are on Amazon, so you should be able to get them. I'm ordering mine.Ariknowsbest - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
The R7 was available before but haven't seen it in a while. The R3 I haven't seen yet, but there are a few in rest of Europe.Will probably get one for my mac mini
wiak - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
funny dustinhome in norway has them and they are headquartered in swedenand for some wierd reason they are sold as OCZ Radeon
https://www.dustinhome.se/product/5010798438/radeo...
SeanJ76 - Monday, May 23, 2016 - link
That's because Swede's are smart, they wouldn't allow such garbage in their country. Skol!Visual - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
AMD SSD... since when is that even a thing?Krysto - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
Why is AMD in SSDs again? Just because Intel is? The herd mentality of an industry can be so annoying sometimes.Surely, AMD needs the R&D money for its more core businesses?
naris - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
Marketing and as the article noted, to provide a single source (brand/distributor) for all (most?) of the components for a PC.wiak - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
it makes it simpler for system builders/integrators to build systems that has components verified by amd that works for their platformsa little like XMP
vladx - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
AMD didn't spend any R&D budget on these SSDs, everything comes from third-party suppliers.ImSpartacus - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
Anandtech explains it in the article.BurntMyBacon - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
@Krysto: "Why is AMD in SSDs again? Just because Intel is?"I don't believe so. As far as I can tell, it is Microsoft's fault. Once upon a time, windows PCs had gotten themselves into a rut design wise. Windows tablets were heading the same direction. So, Microsoft decided that they would put out higher quality / more appealing in-house designs for these markets to generate some innovation in the market. Despite an initial poor reception, they continued with the Surface line as the point was more about prompting other manufacturers to raise their standards than about Microsoft generating significant revenue. Interestingly, they eventually had some good success with their Surface line, despite never being particularly cost competitive.
AMD's story looks similar, but from an even lower quality outlook. AMD has been relegated to the most budget of system by OEMs. The combination of parts that they often get paired with make them appear even more budget than they probably deserve. AMD isn't in a position to build full out PCs or laptops, but building certain components could be their way of trying to let OEMs know that these are the quality of parts they'd rather the OEMs use. It also provides an easy way for the inexperienced to get an upgrade that they know will work. I believe that this is less about turning a profit than raising the baseline experience for their platform.
@Krysto: "Surely, AMD needs the R&D money for its more core businesses?"
They surely do. However, if they can raise the baseline experience with their platform, then they can start pushing out of the ultra low margin budget sector and back into the higher margin mainstream and performance sectors. Given that the RAM and SSDs thus far are developed by a third party, checked for compatibility, and then rebranded, the R&D here is minimal. It the program is successful in raising the standard of AMD systems, it could even pay for itself indirectly. In any case, AMD certainly seems to think it's worth pursuing.
Michael Bay - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
If Intel does it, so can AMD.But is it profitable?
godrilla - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
It seems amd is into the number game, the more you sell the more profits you make even if the margins are thin just like the console business.ExarKun333 - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
Except Intel actually engineers and builds the components for their SSDs and doesn't just re-badge an existing product. There is a difference there... :)Intel999 - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
"Except Intel actually engineers and builds the components for their SSDs and doesn't just re-badge an existing product."Take a look at Intel's recent quarterly report to see how that is working out for them.
Impulses - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
Different goals in mind, different approaches...bt4 - Thursday, June 23, 2016 - link
look at the intel 540s series........stephenbrooks - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
Perhaps the "R9" SSD could be a PCIe add-in card with an HBM cache :)innovandrew - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
Ridiculous. They are fools. Radeon = graphics, not bargain bin SSD.These things aren't even good. If they're hurting for cash that bad, then sell the things but give them a proper name. These are not even made by AMD, let alone their ATi capacity.
BurntMyBacon - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
Yeah. I do think they are hurting the Radeon brand by using it here. Even if they offerings were dominating the high end of the market, I think it would be better to save the Radeon name for graphics products. Are these even made by the Radeon Technologies Group division of AMD?mrdude - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
What's the profit margin on stickers?BurntMyBacon - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
More than you'd care to know (at least going by percentage).Intel999 - Monday, May 16, 2016 - link
In light of the fact that few OEMs have been willing to put SSDs in AMD machines this is a great strategy that is directed at AMD users that want to replace their HDDs with quicker SSDs. Even these slow R3 SSDs will provide very noticeably quicker boot times at chump change prices.This is a very good plan that will give AMD users a more pleasant experience that OEMs have been unwilling to provide.
beginner99 - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
Any non-AMD branded SSD will achieve the same thing. These are SATA SSDs. it's a standard. Has anyone here ever had an SSD not work because it wasn't compatible? With AMDs tight budget this is a waste of resources and money that could be saved or used elsewhere.And if you really need to do it, please offer something worth buying instead of yet another crappy TLC drive.
BurntMyBacon - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
@beginner99: "Any non-AMD branded SSD will achieve the same thing."True, but AMD branded SSDs will send a message to OEMs and consumers that this is the quality of parts AMD thinks should be used with the system. Most of them certainly aren't high end, but consider what OEMs usually put into AMD systems.
@beginner99: "And if you really need to do it, please offer something worth buying instead of yet another crappy TLC drive."
Crappy TLC drives are still night and day difference from 5400RPM HDDs that OEMs often pair in AMD systems. Also, the R7 drives are MLC. I'd expect that trend to continue.
erple2 - Saturday, May 21, 2016 - link
I think that you're right on the money - given that AMD isn't normally relegated at top tier OEMS, what IS true is that putting together "reasonable" RAM and CPU (AMD is reasonable - but not super-fast) into a system, then slapping a slow 5400 RPM drive in it makes the computer seem "terrible" by today's standards. The message to OEMs with an AMD branded SSD (even a low-end one) is still that if they go with an entire AMD branded system, at least it won't be total garbage (slower CPU than Intel, RAM makes little to no difference, but even the slowest "modern" SSD is an order of magnitude faster than any HDD). THAT is the play - convince people that an AMD based system with an SSD is at least usable.BurntMyBacon - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
@Intel999I'm pretty sure you nailed it. If it were about this product line turning a profit, I'm pretty sure they'd do more than just buy a third party SSD(or RAM for that matter), validate it, and slap a label on it.
The_Assimilator - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
Great! Now you can get a shitty AMD-branded SSD to go with your shitty motherboard, shitty CPU, shitty memory and hopefully less-shitty graphics card.atlantico - Wednesday, May 18, 2016 - link
Why would you want an AMD branded SSD with your shitty Intel/nvidia system?CalaverasGrande - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
remember when Opterons were cleaning the floor with Intels chips. And all the best motherboards happened to be AMD motherboards. Remember when ATI made video cards that kicked ass and had solid drivers? It's been at least a decade now since I've wanted anything AMD in my systems.I'll happily fork offer a tiny bit more for a Samsung, Crucial or Intel SSD. Why bother subjecting my data to a cheap SSD?
xthetenth - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
I do actually remember when AMD made excellent video cards like it was yesterday. Oh wait, that's because AMD's been making fantastic GPUs with very solid drivers and I used one of their cards yesterday. Trading out my 970 for a 290 was the best thing I could've done for stability in games. To think that the 780 was once considered competition for the 290.The_Assimilator - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
I guess a 290 is cheaper than a space heater.atlantico - Wednesday, May 18, 2016 - link
AMD drivers are amazingly stable and reliable, great performers. The AMD GPUs put the competition to shame. At one time the 680 was considered competition for the HD7970 lol.akamateau - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
ANAND Tech is generally pretty astute regarding tech trends and news. But you guys haven't yet connected AMD's SSD dots have you?SK Hynix is providing AMD's SSD products. SK Hynix also provides AMD with HBM stacked memory products whether it's HBM or HBM2.
Samsung is already using stacked memory for SSD products so what do you think? SK Hynix is providing HBM stacked memory for AMD's SSDs'?
Now if you do a Patent Search for Gabriel H Loh you will find many stacked memory patents including a memory controller among others.
Also Marvel has just released an SSD Memory controller for SSD.
"Marvell released its 88NV1140 SSD controller at CES 2016 in a move that will likely lead to a sweeping change in the way manufacturers design SSDs."
AMD's new SSD offerings are quite likely HBM1. The next higher tier SSD offerings could quite likely be HBM2.
SSD's are ideal for HBM also it increases volums and keeps prices low.
akamateau - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
Oh yeah one other thing.Gabriel H Loh is AMD's memory guru and probably the reason why AMD is out in front with HBM. It's largely GHL's baby.
dueckadam - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
You mean using HBM instead of a more traditional DRAM cache in SSDs? I'm not seeing why that would be a particularly good fit for SSDs. IIRC, HBM requires an interposer, which would mean adding cost and complexity to the SSD, and I don't know how well that would go over in the competitive SSD market. Especially given how cache performance is only aspect of SSD performance.I'm certainly no expert here, but you seem to be reaching.
akamateau - Wednesday, May 18, 2016 - link
3d stacked memory is High Bandwidth Memory. Any kind of memory can be stacked. In fact Hynix has been stacking flash memory for almost a year now."SK Hynix begins to produce 3D NAND flash memory
SK Hynix has begun to produce 3D NAND flash memory, which will be used for solid-state drives later this year. The vertically-stacked NAND flash memory from SK Hynix will improve performance and reliability of the company’s solid-state drives.
The 3D NAND memory device that SK Hynix produces in volume features 36 layers and has capacity of 128Gb. The IC [integrated circuit] is a multi-layer cell NAND flash memory product designed for various devices, including SSDs and removable storage. SK Hynix has been sampling its 3D NAND memory with customers for several quarters.
SK Hynix is also finalizing design of 48-layer triple-level cell (TLC) 3D NAND flash memory. The memory device will be mass produced in 2016, reports EETimes."
What you are confusing is that HBM as a TERM has been used for DRAM. 3d stacked flash memory is stacked for the very same reason that volatile DRAM is: BANDWIDTH.
dueckadam - Wednesday, May 18, 2016 - link
It is you who is confusing terms. HBM is not a catch-all for any stacked memory. It is a JEDEC standard referring to a type of DRAM involving stack dies and a wide interface.3D (stacked) NAND =/= HBM.
Kjella - Tuesday, May 17, 2016 - link
That makes no sense. HBM gives you memory, not storage so it could only be used for caching. And it sits between a slow PCIe x4 connector and even slower SLC/MLC/TLC chips, the massive bandwidth would be totally wasted. Or you end up with an extreme niche memory only solution like FusionIO.akamateau - Wednesday, May 18, 2016 - link
HBM is an architecture, literally. Chips are placed on top of each other and connected by VIAs through the entire stack. HBM and HBM2 is just associated with DRAM. But HBM is also a term used to describe HIGH BANDWIDTH MEMORY. Any memory can be stacked Gddr5 or NAND FLASH memory. It is all stacked for the same reason HIGH BANDWIDTH.Mugur - Monday, May 23, 2016 - link
Anyway, regardless of the debate whether AMD should put their name on cheap SSDs, the SSDs exist and are very, very cheap. I just saw the cheapest 480 GB, at least in my country: it was an R3. The question is are they decent enough to be used?SeanJ76 - Monday, May 23, 2016 - link
Your poor as hell if you buy anything AMD......Intel is the leader in SSD's currently, always have been!
Mugur - Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - link
Well... no, Intel isn't the leader in consumer SSDs. :-) If I want to buy something good for a SATA SSD I would buy Samsung 850 Pro. But for the kid's gaming pc, the price for that R3 480 GB looks great.