^ I'll second that. I have an ASUS board that would occasionally hang during post, until the latest BIOS revision came out last November and "improved stability and performance." That's an awfully big improvement in "stability" for me...
Some of it will be as mundane as 'we tweaked a DRAM channel GTL auto-config routine', which then begs the question 'from what to what and why does that matter?'. Other things might be related to how some of the custom stuff works, and of course they're not going to publish that if it might aid the competition. Or they might be fixing an oversight and don't want to let on what was off. Then there's the fact that the engineers updating the BIOSes ship the firmware to the people managing the website, who might not understand the explanation and prefer to use catch-all terms so as not to confuse non-technical users. Comments here will be read by ASUS for sure, so I wonder if there's room for a 'technical explanation' option dropdown next to updates in the future. But I wouldn't expect them (or anyone else) to open the whole bag of secrets.
Sorry Ian but I don't buy that explanation, look at the release notes on the BIOS updates for Z10PE-D16 WS as just one example. Yes I know it's marketed towards a different segment but never the less to try and excuse this and say it's for the benefit of "non-technical users" is just plain wrong IMO. If there's a communication issue between R&D and the website team then ASUS need to fix it! and I think you need to give "non-technical users" a little more credit if I'm honest. I've worked in the industry long enough to know that this complaint is one that is brought up all to regularly. I love ASUS products but this is definitely an area that I would welcome improvement.
I read Anandtech for 7 years (so not over 10 sorry) but I keep noticing more and more hidden advertisement pieces on the site and I don't like it. The fact that the video is on Asus' youtube channel is a proof that this has nothing to do on anandtech.com and having watched the first half of the video I definitely see less actual concerns that things like Intel Q&As which could contain with Anand / Brian Klug a few years back. Of course, my message was dramatic but I find Anandtech's quality of content going down ever since Anand and Bryan left. (Maybe I should watch the last part of the video instead, but the whole first 25 minutes is just advertisement on how great ROG is when it's actually overpriced crap.)
1) We proposed the idea to ASUS for a round table with Q&A at CES. We dictated the content. They offered their video recording and editing team.
2) You're confusing Intel sponsored mobile shows (our video variants of our podcast, with which I did one with Anand and Brian did two IIRC), with Intel's Q&A sessions with Anand.
a) The sponsored mobile shows/podcasts were similar to other youtube channels with their content - a short plug at the beginning in exchange for some compensation, in this case hosting the location and video editing, but just a podcast in terms of content hosted on the AT channel.
b) Anand's videos with Aicha at Intel, discussing the finer points of Intel's modem strategy, were done on a similar footing to what we did here. Our proposal, our content, our direction, but Intel's video production, and they're on the Intel YT channel. In both cases, we still have had the final say on the final edit.
The content structure is still AnandTech, as it always has been. If you think something's changed just because it's me up there and not Anand or Brian, then I think that's more a personal issue you have with my presence, rather than the content itself.
I wasn't confusing the different Intel Q&As and panels that happened, just generalizing about them in general (and not talking about video podcasts at all). Another great example was the ARM (about Big.Little and other things right around A15s came into market) Hangouts that happened at some point which was great and in depth, but other things I also disagreed with at the time (the NVMe roundtable video on intel's channel with anand).
I guess that talking for an hour about motherboards is not that interesting compared to CPUs and wouldn't really understand why you'd come forward to ROG to do a celebratory piece on their 10 year anniversary.
I still read anandtech daily and every in depth review but I find them to be more scarce lately and see more sponsored content. Didn't want to offend you personally, I got no problem with anyone, I'd just like Anandtech to keep its integrity as much as it can.
I've been reading Anandtech just as long and really... to be fair... there's always been a little bit of sponsored content... which is to be expected. But I am always curious about what's going on with the ROG line.. as it's driven Gigabyte and MSI down similar paths and brought a lot of selection into the enthusiast market that simply wasn't there before..
With a slow down in the performance curve of hardware these days there isn't a whole helluva lot to get excited about.. minor bumps and jumps so branding becomes even more key. Although... lol..
When I read the title and the fact that Ian was doing it I was half ways expecting some new product with a ton of info to get my greedy little hands on. In that sense I was disappointed. But I don't have a problem with articles like this at all. It's adding content on a relatively slow week so why not?
I also think you missed the mark a little here.. Having former Anandtech staff working for a recognized brand and doing a round table with them offers up a chance at a interesting perspective.. (as they all know what drives readership.. what the site wants.. and Raj/Gary might be willing to drop a little more info than they otherwise would or be a little more candid.
What misconceptions? Your own predecessor is now a literal PR man at this firm! Anandtech has become a freelance marketing arm for tech firms. Your own list of former AT employees demonstrates clearly that the prize of working for AT is obtaining a position at one of the firms that you are covering.
ASUS made a competition with prizes in Europe. In Western countries prizes range from GF980 Ti Strix, through Z170 board to GF960. In Poland, they offer two mice and budget smartphone. Thank you, I'm staying away from ASUS just because of this.
Using an extra slot is a bit of a stretch. Something tells me that the people using 2 way or even 3 way graphics won't care about losing an expansion slot. Hell, most people who build ATX or larger enclosures are wondering how they can use those slots they've paid for! It just seems that in this world, PCIe is basically relegated to either graphics, or wireless nics...especially now with the advent of m.2 NVMe.
Regardless, THANK YOU x a million for asking my question.
Well, PCIe is not quite relegated to GPUs or WiFi NICs for a variety of reasons.
First up, almost all good RAID cards are PCIe x4 or x8, and of course then you'll also need the available drive bays for anyone looking to build a combined gaming/NAS machine.
Then there are the other specialized cards. Video capture cards (good ones) are PCIe. Quad wired NIC cards are also PCIe x8.
So - build yourself a good NAS/gaming system and you can easily use 2 GPUs, a RAID card, and a quad NIC (or even just a secondary NIC) for four PCIe x8 slots...
It would be crazy to make a machine that is both a NAS and Gaming system, if it's a gaming system 3 (4 at max) PCIe are more than enough, if it's a NAS 2 PCIe are more than enough. Many boards already have like 4-6 SATA ports, 2 NICs and what not... I'm pretty sure 2 PCIe slots would be enough for like 99% of the users, it's no wonder Micro-ATX is soo widespread nowadays and probably selling a lot more than ATX.
I love that my main desktop is still running the third ROG motherboard you ever tested, the Rampage formula. With a couple of ssds and a Fury X, it still performs great. Have to admire the longevity of both that board (the chipset gets scorching hot, but it's stable as anything) and the poor Q9450 that lives in it. I've even been pushing it to higher OCs in the last year with good results (used to use the built-in OC profiles, but I've gained another 500MHz from that). Will definitely look closely at anything ROG for my upcoming platform upgrade!
I really like the Maximus IV Extreme, so ridiculously easy to get a 2700K running at 5GHz, done it with six different builds so far, only needs an air cooler to work fine with good temps and little noise, though I use H80s in final builds for optimal results. Only down side is the NEC USB3 chip which is flawed, the board often ends up with dropped ports in later usage.
After that, the Rampage IV Extreme is my other favourite. Bit surprised AT never did a review of this, instead just the B.E. was covered later.
Thanks Ian for seeing a perspective with my question for ASUS. Yet, I still do believe there is value with an RoG smartphone because there's nothing out there that caters to a gamer such as consistent FPS, long battery life, and stereo speakers. It can pre-installed with software to monitor and control RoG products such as motherboards and routers.
Since the video was recorded, I've had some hands on time with the Acer Predator tablet. That felt much like what a ROG tablet might be like, in terms of looks and style at least. The hardware wasn't anything to shout too much about though.
"How does ASUS evolve when an i7 920 still offers good performance?" --
I listened to the answers and one thing I wanted to point out is people are looking more and more for boards that support their still good processors. Selections for socket 775-1155 (lets not discuss 1156..) are pretty slim pickings. There's a market there still which isn't being taken advantage of and should be.
We see it somewhat on the AMD side of things (with longevity and compatibility with the AM2-AM3+) but not so much for intel stuff. The odd board here and there with a cheap chipset... (I'll give Asus a bit of credit with that older 1155 mini itx solution but ..that's about it)
Having worked for GE's Global Research Laboratory for many years, I don't think people realize how much time and effort go into bringing a viable product to market. A very informative video, keep up the great work.Much appreciated!
I am one of the few people who don't overclock, but do play games. For such series, the B-series is usually more than enough, and ASUS was one of the few that had that right mix.
Asus lost me years ago when they made wall hacks, started gaining my trust again just to release a monitor with a cross hair overlay and a sound radar.
Republic of Gamers? more like Republic of Cheat Enablers.
Republic of Gamers? More like Republic of Garbage.
It would be great if media outlets like yourselves hold companies like Asus to account for their abhorrent record of product quality and warranty support instead of just helping sell their products. I ask you to take a look into the horror stories at Newegg for the PG278Q monitor. Filter for the 1 star reviews to see how great a job Asus is doing.
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Shadow7037932 - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Oh, hey, my question got asked :DPissedoffyouth - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
I would personally like to see better changelogs of BIOS revisions. They can be very very vagueChefJeff789 - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
^ I'll second that. I have an ASUS board that would occasionally hang during post, until the latest BIOS revision came out last November and "improved stability and performance." That's an awfully big improvement in "stability" for me...Ian Cutress - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Some of it will be as mundane as 'we tweaked a DRAM channel GTL auto-config routine', which then begs the question 'from what to what and why does that matter?'. Other things might be related to how some of the custom stuff works, and of course they're not going to publish that if it might aid the competition. Or they might be fixing an oversight and don't want to let on what was off. Then there's the fact that the engineers updating the BIOSes ship the firmware to the people managing the website, who might not understand the explanation and prefer to use catch-all terms so as not to confuse non-technical users. Comments here will be read by ASUS for sure, so I wonder if there's room for a 'technical explanation' option dropdown next to updates in the future. But I wouldn't expect them (or anyone else) to open the whole bag of secrets.mark0409mr01 - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Sorry Ian but I don't buy that explanation, look at the release notes on the BIOS updates for Z10PE-D16 WS as just one example. Yes I know it's marketed towards a different segment but never the less to try and excuse this and say it's for the benefit of "non-technical users" is just plain wrong IMO. If there's a communication issue between R&D and the website team then ASUS need to fix it! and I think you need to give "non-technical users" a little more credit if I'm honest. I've worked in the industry long enough to know that this complaint is one that is brought up all to regularly. I love ASUS products but this is definitely an area that I would welcome improvement.hans_ober - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Nice show, but mic placement could use work. Vivien is really soft.SaolDan - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Neat!ImSpartacus - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
I haven't watched this yet, but I'll be damned if Ian leaves for asus like his two predecessors. It ain't gon happen.Ryan Smith - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
This is why we keep him chained to his desk.dragosmp - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
I'd replace Timestamps HH:MM with Timestamps MM:SSIan Cutress - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Heh, good point. :)gregounech - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
The downfall of Anandtech continues.BrokenCrayons - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Having read AT for over ten years, I think it's safe to say that you're acting a bit silly.gregounech - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
I read Anandtech for 7 years (so not over 10 sorry) but I keep noticing more and more hidden advertisement pieces on the site and I don't like it. The fact that the video is on Asus' youtube channel is a proof that this has nothing to do on anandtech.com and having watched the first half of the video I definitely see less actual concerns that things like Intel Q&As which could contain with Anand / Brian Klug a few years back. Of course, my message was dramatic but I find Anandtech's quality of content going down ever since Anand and Bryan left. (Maybe I should watch the last part of the video instead, but the whole first 25 minutes is just advertisement on how great ROG is when it's actually overpriced crap.)Ian Cutress - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Just to clarify your misconceptions here.1) We proposed the idea to ASUS for a round table with Q&A at CES. We dictated the content. They offered their video recording and editing team.
2) You're confusing Intel sponsored mobile shows (our video variants of our podcast, with which I did one with Anand and Brian did two IIRC), with Intel's Q&A sessions with Anand.
a) The sponsored mobile shows/podcasts were similar to other youtube channels with their content - a short plug at the beginning in exchange for some compensation, in this case hosting the location and video editing, but just a podcast in terms of content hosted on the AT channel.
b) Anand's videos with Aicha at Intel, discussing the finer points of Intel's modem strategy, were done on a similar footing to what we did here. Our proposal, our content, our direction, but Intel's video production, and they're on the Intel YT channel. In both cases, we still have had the final say on the final edit.
The content structure is still AnandTech, as it always has been. If you think something's changed just because it's me up there and not Anand or Brian, then I think that's more a personal issue you have with my presence, rather than the content itself.
gregounech - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
I wasn't confusing the different Intel Q&As and panels that happened, just generalizing about them in general (and not talking about video podcasts at all). Another great example was the ARM (about Big.Little and other things right around A15s came into market) Hangouts that happened at some point which was great and in depth, but other things I also disagreed with at the time (the NVMe roundtable video on intel's channel with anand).I guess that talking for an hour about motherboards is not that interesting compared to CPUs and wouldn't really understand why you'd come forward to ROG to do a celebratory piece on their 10 year anniversary.
I still read anandtech daily and every in depth review but I find them to be more scarce lately and see more sponsored content. Didn't want to offend you personally, I got no problem with anyone, I'd just like Anandtech to keep its integrity as much as it can.
just4U - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
I've been reading Anandtech just as long and really... to be fair... there's always been a little bit of sponsored content... which is to be expected. But I am always curious about what's going on with the ROG line.. as it's driven Gigabyte and MSI down similar paths and brought a lot of selection into the enthusiast market that simply wasn't there before..With a slow down in the performance curve of hardware these days there isn't a whole helluva lot to get excited about.. minor bumps and jumps so branding becomes even more key. Although... lol..
When I read the title and the fact that Ian was doing it I was half ways expecting some new product with a ton of info to get my greedy little hands on. In that sense I was disappointed. But I don't have a problem with articles like this at all. It's adding content on a relatively slow week so why not?
just4U - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
I also think you missed the mark a little here.. Having former Anandtech staff working for a recognized brand and doing a round table with them offers up a chance at a interesting perspective.. (as they all know what drives readership.. what the site wants.. and Raj/Gary might be willing to drop a little more info than they otherwise would or be a little more candid.dhotay - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
What misconceptions? Your own predecessor is now a literal PR man at this firm! Anandtech has become a freelance marketing arm for tech firms. Your own list of former AT employees demonstrates clearly that the prize of working for AT is obtaining a position at one of the firms that you are covering.Misconceptions, lol.
Vatharian - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
ASUS made a competition with prizes in Europe. In Western countries prizes range from GF980 Ti Strix, through Z170 board to GF960. In Poland, they offer two mice and budget smartphone. Thank you, I'm staying away from ASUS just because of this.mapesdhs - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
That's weird, Poland is in the EU, it should have been included for the same prizes as everywhere else...iamkyle - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
My comment was answered WHAAAAT!!!!Using an extra slot is a bit of a stretch. Something tells me that the people using 2 way or even 3 way graphics won't care about losing an expansion slot. Hell, most people who build ATX or larger enclosures are wondering how they can use those slots they've paid for! It just seems that in this world, PCIe is basically relegated to either graphics, or wireless nics...especially now with the advent of m.2 NVMe.
Regardless, THANK YOU x a million for asking my question.
bill.rookard - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
Well, PCIe is not quite relegated to GPUs or WiFi NICs for a variety of reasons.First up, almost all good RAID cards are PCIe x4 or x8, and of course then you'll also need the available drive bays for anyone looking to build a combined gaming/NAS machine.
Then there are the other specialized cards. Video capture cards (good ones) are PCIe. Quad wired NIC cards are also PCIe x8.
So - build yourself a good NAS/gaming system and you can easily use 2 GPUs, a RAID card, and a quad NIC (or even just a secondary NIC) for four PCIe x8 slots...
Strunf - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
It would be crazy to make a machine that is both a NAS and Gaming system, if it's a gaming system 3 (4 at max) PCIe are more than enough, if it's a NAS 2 PCIe are more than enough. Many boards already have like 4-6 SATA ports, 2 NICs and what not... I'm pretty sure 2 PCIe slots would be enough for like 99% of the users, it's no wonder Micro-ATX is soo widespread nowadays and probably selling a lot more than ATX.Valantar - Wednesday, March 9, 2016 - link
I love that my main desktop is still running the third ROG motherboard you ever tested, the Rampage formula. With a couple of ssds and a Fury X, it still performs great. Have to admire the longevity of both that board (the chipset gets scorching hot, but it's stable as anything) and the poor Q9450 that lives in it. I've even been pushing it to higher OCs in the last year with good results (used to use the built-in OC profiles, but I've gained another 500MHz from that). Will definitely look closely at anything ROG for my upcoming platform upgrade!mapesdhs - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
I really like the Maximus IV Extreme, so ridiculously easy to get a 2700K running at 5GHz, done it with six different builds so far, only needs an air cooler to work fine with good temps and little noise, though I use H80s in final builds for optimal results. Only down side is the NEC USB3 chip which is flawed, the board often ends up with dropped ports in later usage.After that, the Rampage IV Extreme is my other favourite. Bit surprised AT never did a review of this, instead just the B.E. was covered later.
Ian Cutress - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
We did review the RIVE. It's in the combination ROG review back in August 2012 where I did the whole set: http://anandtech.com/show/6082/asus-republic-of-ga...zodiacfml - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
Thanks Ian for seeing a perspective with my question for ASUS. Yet, I still do believe there is value with an RoG smartphone because there's nothing out there that caters to a gamer such as consistent FPS, long battery life, and stereo speakers. It can pre-installed with software to monitor and control RoG products such as motherboards and routers.Ian Cutress - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
Since the video was recorded, I've had some hands on time with the Acer Predator tablet. That felt much like what a ROG tablet might be like, in terms of looks and style at least. The hardware wasn't anything to shout too much about though.just4U - Thursday, March 10, 2016 - link
"How does ASUS evolve when an i7 920 still offers good performance?"--
I listened to the answers and one thing I wanted to point out is people are looking more and more for boards that support their still good processors. Selections for socket 775-1155 (lets not discuss 1156..) are pretty slim pickings. There's a market there still which isn't being taken advantage of and should be.
We see it somewhat on the AMD side of things (with longevity and compatibility with the AM2-AM3+) but not so much for intel stuff. The odd board here and there with a cheap chipset... (I'll give Asus a bit of credit with that older 1155 mini itx solution but ..that's about it)
iamkyle - Monday, March 14, 2016 - link
And if Intel discontinues a chipset compatible with those processors, then what?fishtoolking - Friday, March 11, 2016 - link
Having worked for GE's Global Research Laboratory for many years, I don't think people realize how much time and effort go into bringing a viable product to market. A very informative video, keep up the great work.Much appreciated!SeleniumGlow - Monday, March 14, 2016 - link
I am one of the few people who don't overclock, but do play games. For such series, the B-series is usually more than enough, and ASUS was one of the few that had that right mix.C3PC - Wednesday, March 16, 2016 - link
Asus lost me years ago when they made wall hacks, started gaining my trust again just to release a monitor with a cross hair overlay and a sound radar.Republic of Gamers? more like Republic of Cheat Enablers.
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dcompiled - Tuesday, March 29, 2016 - link
Republic of Gamers? More like Republic of Garbage.It would be great if media outlets like yourselves hold companies like Asus to account for their abhorrent record of product quality and warranty support instead of just helping sell their products. I ask you to take a look into the horror stories at Newegg for the PG278Q monitor. Filter for the 1 star reviews to see how great a job Asus is doing.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N8...