In order to be an apples to Apples comparison, your review must be on a notebook that comes preloaded with Linux and supported by the OEM. The Eee PC would qualify.
If you want to compare a Windows machine to a Linux computer that does not come with Linux preloaded and factory-supported then the Windows machine for comparison should be a Playstation 3 running Windows.
Jesus Christ, the Holy Ghost and many virgins have endorsed Linux as the official operating system of God.
God recommends Linux v2.6.24.4.
In order to be an apples to Apples comparison, your review must be on a notebook that comes preloaded with Linux and supported by the OEM. The Eee PC would qualify.
If you want to compare a Windows machine to a Linux computer that does not come with Linux preloaded and factory-supported then the Windows machine for comparison should be a Playstation 3 running Windows.
Jesus Christ, the Holy Ghost and many virgins have endorsed Linux as the official operating system of God.
God recommends Linux v2.6.24.4.
Last week I started using the a new version's alpha (never failed in anything, compare this with others) with an old 2800 athlon and a rusty gf 5200.
I'm amazed at how i can get all the bells and whistles of compiz, super efficient software, i was going to buy a new computer this month but i'm postponing it, i have everything i need now, games, quicker internet, I'm never going back to the past of Windows, maybe a dual boot just for a 3d game... i love linux!!!
I have actually recently switched over to Ubuntu 7.10, and I'll have to say, considering the amount of research I did before this, and since I"m not an inexperienced windows user, there are a number of points I wish had been iterated (or more seriously re-iterated) during my pre-install research.
First thing that came up is that despite statements to the contrary: there is no seamless switchover. "Out of the box" as it were, Ubuntu does most of things that Windows does and a few things it doesn't (it comes with an office suite for instance, as well as a pretty advanced image editor). On the other hand, none of the things it does work the same way. Which doesn't seem like a big deal until you want to do something you take for granted in Windows. You want to launch a website that uses flash? good luck. How about edit a text document in the default openoffice document editor, not so hard, but also not the same as the Microsoft Word you're used to. You used to Photoshop? Gimp apparently does everything Photoshop does, but I wasn't going to completely relearn the process after I had already paid for Photoshop. How about installing the programs that Ubuntu does lack? I've been using linux for over a month, and although there are some handy mechanisms in place (add/remove and the synaptic package manager) to install or uninstall software, they are even less reliable than windows, and I find myself having to google software install instructions which almost always involve the DOS-like terminal. Not hard, but I honestly still couldn't just install any old program via apt-get or a download without instructions, something that as a windows user I took for granted.
And that doesn't even touch on things like Windows' pretty interface. Maybe I'm just silly, but I kind of like pretty menu bars, and shrinking windows when I minimize them. This stuff requires separate software (i.e. compiz-fusion) which is not as easy to use as Windows, or even necessarily installed by default in Ubuntu. When it is installed it breaks another of the linux myths, being that my 4 gigabytes of reserved space, while perfectly adequate for a default install and far more than I had been lead to believe was needed for a linux install, just barely left enough hard drive space for the experience I had become used to with Windows. Install Java, flash (both of which seem to need multiple versions, both free and commercial installed to work consistantly), Openoffice (to replace microsoft office), video players as competent as zoomplayer for instance, and pretty soon my 4 gigabytes, plenty for a careful install of Win XP, is gone. Not necessarily because linux takes more space, but more likely because as a new user, I don't know how to optimize my linux install, and space savings while well documented for linux, are not as consistent as windows. Try finding five linux websites that agree on how to optimize a linux install. I dare you.
Mostly I think that a real review of Ubuntu requires more than just casual use of linux. There are just so many things you can take for granted in Windows, so many little programs you use occasionally that enrich or simplify your computer using experience. Go through all of the installed programs on your computer (or all of your computers if you use more than one regularly) and try to use or find equivilant programs for everything that you have installed on them. Not just the web and word processing and email, but photo editing, video games, music and movie players, cd burners, torrent programs, how about cpu-z for general computer info? or gspot for identifying codecs? even do little things like opening the nfo files that come with many torrents and just work differently on linux, this stuff is out there, but I bet if you need cpu-z and you're an advanced windows user, you just type cpu-z into google and then go download the latest version, you don't have to run a google search for a linux equivilant. Let us know what that's like. Show us the install process for anything that needs installing rather than just saying, "this program needed to be installed, which required a google search but was painless" try using sites like youtube and facebook, that normal people use regularly and report problems and bugs, put music on your ipod, and tell us how that goes. I'm happy with Linux, but I'm not "joe sixpack" and I wouldn't leave my mom with a linux computer unless I was commited to stop by and fix it every week. This is the kind of info I think most "spend a while with linux" reviews lack.
I built a system based on the ASUS P5k-VM motherboard (G33 NB, ICH9 SB, GMA 3100 Video, Realtek ALC833 audio, Marvell 88E8056 GigEth), LG SATA DVD Burner, E2160 CPU OC to 3Ghz, 2G DDR 800 RAM. Except for 3D graphics, it's a modern competitive system. I put Ubuntu 7.10 on it because it's the 5th PC on my home network and I'm just sick & tired of paying MSFT and dealing with the on-line genuine Microsoft validation BS (All it takes is having to do this one time over the phone instead of the network and you'll never want to buy MSFT products again). It worked first time every time. I set it up for my non-technical wife. Used the Gnome GUI and made it look quite similar to Windows. She uses it to surf the web, blog, read, write, and print documents, manage pictures, and view media content. It works great, has full support for my gigEth based home network with a NAS and networked printers. Yes, I had to tweak a file to auto-mount the NAS on login, but other than that, all configuration was very easy and 100% GUI based. Auto updates, extensive application/package installation, new printers install via CUPS, etc.
Wifey uses it everyday and she loves it. I haven't touched it in 2 months now, and I love it. If it wasn't for games, (and does Quicken work in Linux?), I'd put it on every machine in the house. Overall, it's a very impressive installation.
Is Ubuntu ready for prime time on the desktop? At my house, the answer is absolutely!
For example Adobe Photoshop CS2 (so not yet CS3, Adobe is not contributing, but now Google is contributing to make that happen), in games for example World of Warcraft.
Wine is getting better and better as it gets older, you already knew that.
So it's a good time to sell those Windows licenses on Ebay, their value is in downward spiral. Things are going to look different in 24 months. One can come and rise against the Goliaths, in some European countries Firefox leads browser market share with 60%, and rising with few percentage points every month.
(it's only 14 days to brand new 8.04 Ubuntu and only 203 days to 8.10, which is a smaller version improvement)
It would be great if you could try installing Ubuntu on several different hardware configurations to see what kind of compatibiilty issues you might encounter. Using Ubuntu to run a "folding at home farm," I have been flatly unable to install 64 bit Ubuntu on a DFI P35 or X38 board, regardless of the components used or flavor of Ubuntu (server, Kubuntu, text only installation, etc.) (FWIW, Fedora and openSUSE 10.3 wouldn't install on the DFI boards either, but openSUSE 11 alpha 2 works OK.) I had some Ubuntu issues on an Asus X38 board too, although with the latest bios that seems to be resolved.
If only for the fact you can run the OS off a usb stick, the free versions of the distro come with most of the drivers and utilities you need for a functioning OS right off, including the ability to update apps from Mandriva's mirrors with no configuring or extra work on the users part. I have an extra hard drive in my PC with 2008 power pack, which I can surf the web and email from the same folders I use in windows, despite being NTFS format. The ironic thing is I can access all my files on windows, including the ones windows won't let me touch. A word of caution is do NOT install nix and windows on the same hard drive if you can all avoid it they do not always play nice due to fat issues(the original meaning ie the one all formats use). The avg user who does not play games will have very little issue with nix as in the corporate setting it is faster, no over head. One my of the jobs is rendering assets for cg which means I'm talking render times in days, which means when I'm rendering in Nix verse windows I get bonus money when I shave four or five days off the time, which is where the difference between command line rendering mental ray in windows vs the same in nix is usually enough to get that bonus every time. One thing about Mandriva which used to be mandrake is the good version of the demo was club only, and now that they are out of the red they have opened the club to everyone and taken all the features they would have added to the club distro and rolled them into the free version or the power pack. The most annoying thing about the nix distros is how much they depend on torrents to spread most of their apps and software updates. I did not notice it but http://sourceforge.net/">http://sourceforge.net/ needs to be mentioned in the article as most open software in the last five has some connection to it. Last if you want to play games, have fun there... there is a reason I have an XP hard drive with just my games on it.
If you want to see why corporations are switching to it, try one of the corporate versions of the distros they are far more stable, and have open office, firefox/mozilla, or in house versions of these that are installed as images same as windows only with far less support needed. Even monkeys can install them our tier one techs manged with no problems... I still think one of the clipboards secretly helped them.
So what can a "novice" expect from a month with linux? That depends on what they want to do with it. I am not familiar with Umbutu, but can describe what I do for Fedora based installations, specifically FC7 as I have done several in the past several weeks. After the basic install, there are the updates, addition software installations, either the NVidia or ATI video driver installation. You cannot forget about the java and flash player plugins, then there is the mplayer and mplayer plugin with those separate codec packages, and edit the ssh_conf file to permit running remote X programs and some other things. Would a novice know how to do these things or even know to do these things?
Then there are the complications. The Java plugin is real good example of DUH? And why do you need java? One use is printing online labels and postage. So, can a novice setup the plugin? The instructions are very good. First of all, you find out jre is already installed because the package manager tells you it is. But, that does not matter because it's not the full version as it's missing the plugin. Why is it missing the plugin? Likely because it's not open source. For the full version you have to download that from SUN website and follow the instructions. These are all command lines you run as root and include chmod a+x jre1.5.0_06.rpm.bin to make the self extracting file you just finished downloading an executable file and then ./jre1.5.0_06.rpm.bin to extract the rpm file. Then rpm -U --force jre1.5.0_06.rpm to install because the package manager has it listed as already installed. Then you make the symbolic link to the mozilla plugin directory that looks something like this, so you cd ~/.mozilla/plugins/ and the make a symbolic link
ln -s /home/username/java/jre1.5.0_06/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
That is the kind of thing that prevents large scale acceptance by the masses of point and click windows users who have never even seen a command line and are not completely sure what the keyboard is for other than pressing any key to continue or typing in a username or password.
I don't use Ubuntu (I'm running Debian), but last time I looked at Ubuntu you could install/enable flash java ati/nvidia drivers etc without needing to touch the commandline. (And they are automatically configured ready for use). Windows media codecs just needed a single line added to /etc/apt/sources.list and I think that could also be done from the gui package manager.
IMO thats a large part of what has made Ubuntu so popular.
(And a typical new linux user who does't use the commandline won't want to run remote X programs over ssh).
I think the most important thing is to have reasonable expectations.
Given your job, I expect you are an expert windows user. Linux is different to windows. It will take quite some time to learn to use it as effectively as you can use windows. (Think how many hours you have spent learning to get the most out of various windows programs. One month isn't going to be enough time to duplicate that).
Some applications just aren't feasible for companies to distribute because without special licences for legal reasons. (Licence restrictions, patents, DCMA etc). Sometimes the licence issues can be worked around eg. http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/web/flashplugin-n...">http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/web/flashplugin-n... . Things like libdvdcss2 and win32codecs for watching DVDs and .wmv are more problematic. (They are also available, just not from ubuntu.com). It would be unfair to criticise Ubuntu over this without also commenting on the legal issues.
A lot of hardware will work right out of the box. For some of the rest, you just need to install and/or configure the right "drivers". When things are properly packaged this is similar to installing drivers on window and/or tweaking a value in the registry.
When things aren't properly packaged this can be much harder. (It's the sort of experience where you can learn a lot about linux. Its also the sort of experience where you can easily make a mistake that you know won't have the experience to be able to recover from). Try to stick with hardware that other people have reported works with Ubuntu. eg see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport">https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport . If googling for advice, consider adding ubuntu as a search term, just as you would use vista if searching for drivers for Vista.
I think setteling for one (or a couple) of distributions makes sense. Just make sure that you state expclicitly in your review that this is "one month with Ubuntu/Linux" or "SuSe/Linux".
And try to do some decent research so that you know whethere a problem is with the distribution, with the kernel, or some upstream project (eg Gnome).
Yes, there are many distributions. No, you can't do anything useful on a "linux system" without some userspace tools -- and most people wouldn't get anything done without the framework of a distribution. Yes, you *have* to choose a distribution, just as you would have to choose a distribution of Windows (95/98/ME/2000/XP/Vista/2003 Server/2000 Server etc), Mac OS (9/X.4/X.5), BSD (netbsd/freebsd/openbsd/dragonflybsd/pcbsd) etc.
"Linux" might be the most self-incompatible OS there is -- but that's just the way it is.
Yes, if you want to claim to have reviewed "Linux for the desktop", you'd have to review at least Debian/etch, Debian/lenny (testing), Ubuntu/6.06, Ubuntu/7.10, Suse (?), RedHat/Centos (?) and Gentoo at the very least.
I don't think there's much point in *that* however.
I'd be very interested to see a thorough review of linux, as I've yet to read *any* good linux reviews (in the past 10 years I've been using the linux-based distributions).
I think you should respect the distributions LTS-status - Ubuntu is a natural choice for Desktop linux, and I think you should comparte the current LTS with the upcomming one, including the upgrade-path.
I realize a lot of home users are using 7.10 - but it is considered a BETA realease -- if you do want to review it, please take that into consideration.
It would be interesting to see you compare some of the uniqe benefits of Linux - such as running Ubuntu on a 64-bit amd/intel, a 32-bit machine and on a powerpc-based mac - and see if that helps you a as a new user share files etc.
If you do choose Ubuntu, a comparison with Debian might be interesting, particularily on support - eg compare:
Or - if you only choose to do Ubuntu - try the paid support, and compare that to Apple and Microsoft.
You should spend som extra time to see if you get wifi w/wpa to work, memorycard readers and other stuff that isn't well supported in Linux (note; I use Linux as my primary platform, but I'd like to see a balanced, realistic review).
You should also spend some time looking at the strenghts; eg trying to install a persnal wiki/blog, a cms-system, a database system using the package manager etc.
Other features to look at: full disk encryption, sharing a computer with other family members, available games (possibly trying to get eg WoW to work with wine -- it *should* be fairly easy; it'd be interesting to see what a new user thinks), running windows in a vm (preferably qemu or xen as they are available as Free software), dvd (video) mastering.
Also as a follow-up it might be interesting to see a comparison of Ubuntu on a mac vs os X with fink installed.
I suggest you do ver 7.10,The only differences I"ve seen has to do with setting up software sources and auto loading of wireless adapter without a password.(The adapter I use is a Belkin F5D7050 ver.4000 which loads the driver when you load the Ubuntu OS.)I"ve used a number of Linux Distr.and ubuntu is the best.Good networking(home),good printer setup and with a Msi 945 board,3.0 Core 2 Duo,Its the fastest thing around.
I read on the front comment page "PCLinuxos".... Really are we even calling this linux. Hey here is a novel idea, lets write an article on linux distros that are not fakies "ie pclinuxos" or now considered "main stream for the next couple of years" cra...ubuntu. There are lots of great distros out there that are not debian based or not so watered down you really can't even call it linux.
examples:
Arch Linux
Rhel5
Gentoo
and the list goes on.
Just because its excepted as easy yet not functional or mainstream "even though rhel4/5 is about 50x more used then ubuntu" doesn't mean we can't see articles on real distros.
IMO, doing a review of something so close to obsolete, especially when the next release has LTS, would be a mistake.
If others also want to hear about your experiences in doing an upgrade, let that experience be moving from the LTS to the next version, since anyone who isn't looking to do the upgrades periodically would be best off choosing the LTS releases.
Since the LTS release is so close, it is pretty much finished and the contemporary experience, remembering that a lot of people won't be reading the review the moment it is published but rather many will read it later. The review's useful lifespan is much longer if based on the LTS than the last version prior to it.
Let me rephrase that. This review could be a big deal for Linux.
I'm of the opinion, that doing two one month reviews would be in order. One now, and one after the new release. That would give the OS a point of reference.
The other thing if you were to do an extended review, it wouldn't take that much to do a follow up article once the new version is released.
Of course, Linux is not Ubuntu, but Ubuntu has been leading the effort to make Linux accessible.
Anyhow, I would certainly be interested to see what anandtech has to say about Linux. I'm particularly interested in tips for using it as a replacement to the mainstream OSs. How to make it work on general tasks. I think that's what people are most interested in.
The Mac review you did was great but it was a long time ago now!
However, since you are a respected tech site it is likely that it will continue to be read for a long time.
The same is likely to be true of your Ubuntu review.
The fact that 8.04 is a LTS release also means that the review will automatically have a longer shelf life.
Therefore, in order that you do not have to pepper your article with caveats such as "of course this may be fixed in the new version arriving next month", I would recommend waiting until 8.04 is a few weeks old.
This will also reduce the thousands of comments that you would otherwise receive from Linux fanboys (such as myself) of the form "Just upgrade, that's fixed in Hardy Heron"
A little off subject, but . . .
Lets face it, most people don't game with Linux, but as an OS for a HTPC, it has some real positives. I use MythDora (MythTV on the Fedora Core), and would have interest in a review of Linux HTPC solutions. Running Myth has also prompted me to get off my Windows using butt, and find a good text editor, Database GUI tool etc.
I've been toying around with Linux in my spare time for the past year, and to summarize what I've experienced, I think you should use openSUSE for a base KDE test platform and Ubuntu for a base Gnome platform.
I wouldn't mind seeing KDE/Gnome testing for both, since both actively develop both UIs for their Distros. But to simplify things, I think Ubuntu currently summarizes the best Gnome has to offer as does openSUSE with KDE.
I agree with an earlier post. I would like to see a review as soon as possible. I have been toying with the idea of switching to linux but have yet to make up my mind. I would very much like to read a professional, in-depth review of the operating system as soon as possible. In addition, when the new version comes out, ammend that review to include a review of the upgrade process. That would be wonderful.
Every once in a while when I visit AT I click on the Linux tab, only to be disappointed. I am kind of excited for this review, and I must admit, hopeful that the OS impresses. I, for one, would not want a review that was a schizophrenic mess or collage of the distro's available, and I know it simply isn't something you guys would do.
Ubuntu with Gnome is a good choice (though a brief look at VMWare in a windows world and maybe PCLinuxOS in conclusion wouldn't sink the boat). While Ubuntu and all of the different distro's have improved a lot in the last couple of years, it does require patience with the learning curve and the unfamiliarity of a new OS.
Purely on a time sensitivity gameplan, I think that if you started your analysis a couple weeks before the release with a pre-release, just to study up, you would get a good feel for it. Then when you hit the real thing, the testing would have fewer hick ups. Hardy Heron is in Alpha 4 now, the problems with these releases are usually small and well documented. My experience with the later and more mature Beta releases has not been awful. I have done multiple installs in a short period of time, just being anxious for the release, and with the forum and HOW TO's printed out, it isn't that much of a pain for hardware installs. In my mind, building computers and the linux variants have always gone hand in hand as good and sometimes frustrating fun. I look forward to your review.
Linux distro's have become mature to a point whare installing, maintaining and upgrading one can be achieved with the click of an icon. Anyone with a general knowlege of a PC and Windows should be able to install a distro from the big boys.
Equally, I don't think it's very relevant to the average user if a KDE is v.3.1, 3.2 or 4.x, if it works it's OK.
What DOES however interest me (and I think most users) is : how does it perform with stuff you buy in the store ? Can you get the scanner of your multifunctional to work, can you switch that USB printer switch that didn't come with a 'nux driver, how do you get that software that came with your Garmin to work, how do I stream movies to my TV.
Teh OS itself is just a foundation for the apps. No matter how easy it is to install or how good it is, if half of the peripheral stuff you own doesn't work (or you can't get it to work), you'll just end up reinstalling Windoze and ignore 'nux for the next 10 years with a sour grape taste left in your mouth.
With the snowballing quality of Linux front ends, awesome apps like OpenOffice and GIMP, ubiquitous webmail and chat, the only thing keeping the upcoming generation on Windows is Games Games Games.
If all the great games were released for Linux, it would not be long before the extra 50-100 dollars was just too much to pay. If I was Google, that might be tempting.
Is it possible to contact some of the other distro developers and ask them what criteria they use to test for hardware compatibility?
Also, have you asked yourself what it is you can provide the AT forum readers that they can't find elsewhere?
I believe Linux requires a long term commitment so if your goal includes aiding users to ween themselves off Windows as I suppose many do desire then I completely applaud you in this effort. I'll be along for the ride so save me a seat.
I've got a task on the backburner. It seems using a wireless network is pretty near impossible on Linux. I don't know, I hadn't really tried it yet, but, like linux itself to all non-engineering kind, it seems REALLY complicated. I have a supported adapter (I think...), I just can't connect... aah, I'll get to it later. Anyway if you can keep this in mind in your review (setting up wireless networking). Maybe I'm just an idiot and blowing this thing up WAY more than I should, but, just thought I'd bring it up.
I tried Ubuntu on my new-build PC: burned it to disk and booted with it. It should have worked like a real OS, instead it froze. Maybe the next release will be able to handle moderately-new components.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Mobo: Gigabyte GA-P335-DS3L || CPU: Intel Q6600
Video: XFX 8800GT 512mb || RAM: 2x2gb Corsair 6400 (800MHz)
yeah i had started to include in my comment too that ubuntu won't work on my x2 4800 with either a via 890 chipset or ati 3200 chipset with the ati x1900xtx installed. so much for 3d desktop, you have a modern 3d card and it fails all the time trying to acces the vid card for even 2d. suse 10.xx works at least, no 3d acceleration but it at least "works out of the box" after an install. ame with redhat's distros they at least assume to try 2d first and let you deal with immature 3d features at your own risk.
seriously try a different distro or several and see which one is the real best desktop os instead of following the herd of other review sites praising ubuntu as "the best desktop distro".
You can't just review one distribution and leave it at that. There are several major Linux distributions, and each one deserves to be looked at. If it requires the input from those more familiar with Linux, then get it, because it would be like calling a review of Vista Home Basic a full review of Vista. It might apply to THAT version, but it doesn't cover all the features available, and won't touch on the features that many people need to know about.
At the least, you should cover Redhat and Debian as two of the bigger distributions out there. Don't just focus on Linux as a replacement for Windows as a workstation, but look at using it for server functions as well. This is where Linux really shines.
I think you actually raise the problem issues with Linux in your post, it's too many distros and being mentioned mainly as a server because it can't do nearly as well as a desktop. There should be a single flavor that is easy to choose. I, as an end user, have no desire to become verbose and schooled in the nuances of the different distro's in their strengths and weakness. Should I have to be? Nor should being able to name the majority of them provide me some badge of Linux honor ;).
As an example Vista basic, Home premium and Ultimate is already too many choices for people, although pretty easy to make comparatively to Linux. I surely don't want to run more than one distro so I don't 'want to need to know' about more than one. The OS should be about productivity with applications and ease of use, not the OS itself. The OS is a tool as a means to an end and people shouldn't have to think about the hammer, I just need to be able to use it to accomplish the job, while giving very little or no thought to it's construction. The more invisible the OS is, the less I have to think about it, the better it is.
Since Anandtech's focus for the review is as a desktop OS, it should be one distro, furthermore the value and quality of it in a server environment isn't in question here. that's a seperate subject entirely and realistically that would be a much more technically demanding article requiring greater time and depth of testing (in-depth security, quantitative performance analysis, stability, connectivity, server tools & software, ease of use, ease of support). Nobody is really interested in knowing if some tech guru can successfully use Linux in a closet somewhere, the question is can your girlfriend or wife (not both), nephews, nieces, parents, grandparents, etc. Is it a viable competition to the bloat that is Vista, or Mac OSX, and if not why? Well that's my look at it.
the whole point of the review is to see if linux is a viable replacement for windows or osx et al. the issue is linux isn't in reality one thing, it is split into several distros each doing slightly different things with different ease of use factors and included software. focusing on one distro is like saying windows is crap and is out of date after reviewing windows 95. or saying i don't like editing photos on a p.c. after reviewing paintshop pro and ignoring gimp and photoshop entirely. the sad fact is linux doistros include software with the install and each has a method of ditributing extra software and updates. suse uses a different system to redhat and neither use the same one as debian derrivitives like ubuntu. packages that are easily available for one distro using it's built in package manager aren't easily available in other distro's and need custom compiling and sometimes even after that simply won't work correctly or at all without an indepth knowledge of the linux kernal and distro's package system and gui api's, driver developement or programming in general. how do you recommend linux or not after sitting in the shallow end of the pool using only a limited set of tools? you need to dive in and if it's a mess for a review site writer on andtech it's gonna be a complete farce for any average "browser/email can't install a printer in windows" person to deal with what they need either. which sounds like the point of the article, is linux a capable desktop replacement os for the unwashed masses.
[QUOTE]the whole point of the review is to see if linux is a viable replacement for windows or osx et al[/QUOTE]
If you are looking for a gratis windows-look-alike then you're out
of luck. It doesn't look like it and doesn't behave like it, and I
hope it never will. The sooner people realize this, the better.
7.10 is the product of many major changes (that's the "gutsy" in Gutsy Gibbon) and even as a stable release it wouldn't represent "the real deal" you'll see with 8.04.
As 8.04 will be a LTS release where stability is central I'd suggest to wait until it's released.
If you keep waiting for the next release of linux version, you'll be waiting forever. Fedora also has a pretty quick release cycle, but all in all, changes from one release to the next are minimal. If you perform a yearly review that should get pretty much everything.
If you look back at the changes from RH8 all the way up to FC7 what all is there really that has changed. I cannot recall any bombshells, it's been a steady improvement in usability. It's the programs that make linux so advantageous. It's free, secure, and stable. The only missing program would be AutoCAD. That is the only program I need Windows for.
Maybe you can title it -
Linux: The many distro's that killed the penguin. Or maybe
Linux: The penguin that steps on it's own foot.
hehe, yeah too controversial I know. ;)
I'm hardly a Linux guy and I don't dislike it, I just wish it could get out of it's own way. IMO too many distro's is what kills Linux from being a real competitor for common daily use and keeps mainstream from supporting it. People and their little personal preferences are keeping any one distro from rising and getting the full united support and full united backing. If people would stop messing around with umpteen different projects and distro's, maybe Linux would be much more refined and competitive in the desktop space having full commercial support.
It's open source stepping on it's own foot.
You are not going to get manufacturers, driver writers, software developers, etc. to QA and support multiple distro's to accomodate people's silly little techie preferences.
Everyone wants their own little distro and everyone wonders why Linux doesn't get supported. Maybe people don't wonder, cause it does seem kind of obvious. I'm sure some people would prefer Linux being some hidden black art, but it's unfortunate that it doesn't get the desktop support that it could realize if people would get unified behind a single project.
After all these years of hoping Linux would move to the forefront, it is still hardly something I would try and teach my wife to use for day to day, I wouldn't subject her to it. It's kind of a shame, because Windows needs some good competition and I don't like Apple's proprietary stifling nature, even though they do it well.
what i'd realy like to see is something different.
every damn review site on the planet has already done a xx days with yyyyy distro article. do something new.
install around 4 different distros on seperate partitions and do some daily repetitve tasks on one distro then the next day do those same tasks on the next distro. then report on what you liked/disliked about the different distros and how linux is compared to windows or osx.
i am frankly sick of ubuntu reviews as if it's the only desktop distro out there. try ubuntu if you want but include fedora and suse and maybe even kubuntu or even xubuntu for low end/older systems.
I'd prefer to wait for the new release even thou I'm not interested in linux precompiled distributions that much. One of the most interesting linux features to me it's the chance to compile kernel and sw onto the target machine. This can improve performance and be an added value compared to windows. Otherwise I wouldn't feel so enthusiast to prefer linux to windows expecially for what concerning gui behaviour. Linux's tweakability and free tools for programming are to me the most interesting things so my dreams would be a distribution like Gentoo with some more intuitive (and working!) and logical procedure for installing SO manually that could be done via my netgear wifi card. What I can't stand of that distribution is you have to learn by heart the content of modules and there's not a clear list of them and what they are for. When you have hw that's not recognized during intalling you always have to ask some other to tell you what the hell of module, following no arguable stardard naming system, you have manually to load.
Sorry for the offtopic, I hope it can be of some interest.
A few years ago, anandtech did a review of an asus board call a8n-vm-csm. The review was in my opinion fairly complimentary. However, when I bought the board I found to my dismay that linux support for the board (which had integrated hardware) was very little.
The acpi hardware on the board was broken (bad dsdt tables), the nvidia integrated graphics chipset did not have proper support from nvidia (only specific drivers worked). A recompile was needed everytime the kernel was upgraded. Most distros at that time were failing to initialize the sata drivers. Essentially there was whole host of problems which I over time resolved with the help of the community.
I would like to see every non-gamer's motherboard (gaming motherboards would probably just be used for windows) to have a standard set of linux compatibility tests run against them.
Admittedly, I should have done my research a lot more before buying that board. Expecting integrated chipsets to work out of the box was a stupid expectation on my part.
I find that in most cases, depending on selection, hardware features are broadly supported, but there subtle nuances with which linux distros give problems. This is more exacerbated in notebooks. This would be an area that I would like the review to focus (assuming the review is for desktop/mobile distributions)
1. Support for Extended desktops (multi-monitor setups) . Switching between, cloning, extended desktop and resolution handling (per screen) without having to restart X.
2. wifi support - Detection of networks, sorting on strength, switching to closest network. Support for turning off wifi to save battery (using a hardware or software switch)
3. acpi support (comparison of battery life between operating systems when the hardware idles). Access and ease of use of hibernation feature.
4. Volume controls (Can application volumes be controlled individually)
5. bluetooth support : (what exactly does that entails? supporting applications if any).
I have to agree that you guys should wait for the review. April isn't that far away. If 8.04 were just another basic release, I'd be tempted to recommend doing the review right now, but since 8.04 is long-term support release, and thus will be a viable option not just for six months thereafter but several years, I think waiting is by far the best option.
I would like to see the review include aspects of using a linux desktop in the enterprise. Supportability, Asset Management, Deployment, audit and client health monitoring, etc. Migrating a home user from Windows to Linux is one thing. Migrating 190K clients in diverse geographic locations is another.
Do it now with a mature/sound version rather than one that's new and has potential bugs that could have an adverse affect on your experience. You can then update your experience with the newer version and you'll have the opportunity to compare and contrast. I myself just threw together a Linux system that I use as second computer conjunction with my “Super Vista Rig”. It has all the pizzazz of Vista with the ability to run smoothly on a SFF 2.26 Northwood and 512 RAM!
DON'T compare different distributions. Everyone has their favorite (mine is currently openSuse) But if you want to do a "state of linux on the desktop" review then pick ONE distro and really put it through it's paces. A comparison of different distros is good idea for a separate article.
Similarly:
DON'T get into the KDE vs Gnome debate. Pick one desktop and stick with it. KDE vs Gnome is an age-old argument that you're not going to decide. A comparison of all the different desktop environments for linux, including Enlightenment 17 (which is pretty if a little buggy) would be a great idea-- again for a separate article.
DO
Get to know basic programs that come with the distro you go with, including doing presentations, spreadsheet work, document editing, programming...
DO
check out other "consumer" type apps-- video and music stuff, especially.
DO
Try out some of the great games available for linux. My kids love super tux and super tux kart!
DO
try to install it on different machines. Not all hardware is supported equally. nvidia cards are generally less buggy than ati ones. And some wireless chips work out of the box and others need you to hunt for firmware or supply a windows driver, which is awkward and cumbersome to say the least.
DO
install linux on, at least, a laptop. try to note any battery life and power management issues you have.
DO
take everything i've just typed with a grain of salt. Your mileage may vary.
I'd recommend going for it now.
There are minimal changes between releases, most of the time they are cosmetic.
If you wanted to do a review on KDE4 the sure wait, but for the GNOME based Ubuntu there are minimal changes between versions.
Our company has 5k+ Linux workstations and we use a mixture of RHEL3/4, and we also support Ubuntu and Linux Mint for some of the advanced users.
Having a large Solaris community the move to Linux was painless for us and I've installed it for some of my family and they are reasonably happy with it.
Have fun with the trial, should be an interesting experience
I'd like to see you guys try out a few hdtv tuner cards (or see if you can get an hdhomerun from silicondust). Beyond that, try out beryl/compiz and compare it to the fancy stuff that Vista does.
I'd look at Mint Daryna 4.0 32bit and Ubuntu Hardy Heron Alpha 64bit, since Hardy is a long term release.
Mint Daryna is based on Ubuntu Gutsy 32bit, but with very nice desktop and themes, but also other subtile differences. Their menu is "different", but I like it now after getting used to it. Mint is our everyday OS now. Samba took about 3 clicks to set up in Mint, very nice. This is as close to Windows as I've seen. The only hard Mint problem I had was setting up 2 HP w2207 monitors in 1680x1050 with dual Big Desktop working on a TA690G board using onboard graphics, requires the latest ATI drivers, not from Ubuntu repos or Envy. I did use Envy to remove drivers though.
I have run Ubuntu 64bit since Warty I think. It seems like Hardy 8.04(?) would be the way to go. It is on Alpha 4 and I'd bet it is fairly stable by now. If you get stuff to work, don't update it during testing. I'll be testing it soon, after I find out why my old soft RAID has went spastic in 64bit Dapper 6.06. Comparing the 64bit and 32bit versions would be good. I know there are a few 64bit issues to hurdle (Java), but it should not be too bad to do if you use the Ubuntu Guides.
[QUOTE]One of the things we have been wanting to do for some time now is to do a proper review of Linux as an end-user operating system. We have done articles on Linux in the past relating to performance, but never a complete OS review.[/QUOTE]
Good idea, but can you at least point out the fact that "Linux" is NOT an Operating System, it is merely a kernel and that it's useless without the GNU userland. It would be technically correct to stress that important distinction in any article, in my opinion.
No I'm not a FSF fanboy but it is pretty annoying constantly seeing the word "Linux" being used in the wrong context.
I think any artical at this point on Linux, regardless of distro is needed. The very last artical on Linux on Anandtech dates back to only July 1/2005, and I'd be interested in any artical published.
I've been using Ubuntu Linux exclusively for about a year now. For the first few months I wanted to return to Windows, not because of any merits Windows might have, but simply because of familiarity. Now I can't imagine returning to Windows.
The biggest problems Linux has are due to hardware and software vendors who simply don't support the OS. When reviewing Ubuntu, keep this in mind and imagine trying to use a piece of hardware on Windows if they didn't provide drivers, or using software on Windows if they didn't provide Windows binaries.
Would you wait to review Vista until it's service pack?
It's not like the distro came out 6 months ago and this is the first patch. The thing has been floating around for years, review what the climate of linux is today, not 3 months from now, not 6 months from now.
I'll bet you a bag of chips Linux 6 months from now will still show all the same major problems it has shown for the last 5 years in preventing it from being easily adopted as a primary desktop OS by normal computer users. Waiting makes no sense.
The point is that since the review is not going to be published for 6-8 weeks (if Ryan starts soon) then when people are actually reading it a new version of Ubuntu will be about 3 weeks away.
The "need for a question like this" comes from the extremely rapid rate of development and improvement of the Linux desktop.
I would like to see it sooner than later. I doubt there will be any significant changes in the next upgrade, so sooner would be better. As a side note, I would like to see some windows based gaming results/comparison (using both the free and paid versions of wine) on ubuntu vs. windows xp.
I'd like to finally see a review where they show user-friendliness (AKA,none) and ease of use for people who don't understand the terminology (AKA, still none). Also the difference between linux types and the reason why there's 20 binaries to select from for any piece of software, and how to figure it all out.
Hmm, that's more like a guide. But a review of linux for the non-linux savvy would be interesting.
You're going to get plenty of comments about how you should try one distro or another. Some people will say that those kinds of comments are should be ignored, and that's sort of true. Very few people new to Linux have the time or motivation to try several different distros. However, each distro has different strengths and weaknesses even though each is Linux. So, even though you should indicate that your evaluation is of Linux in the title, the first paragraph (or two) should clarify the fact that a different distro might present a very different experience from the one evaluated.
Due to its popularity (and therefore community support), Ubuntu is a good candidate, arguably the best, for this kind of review. However, after several attempts at using it, I wouldn't recommend it for anyone other than my mother for long term use. It simply lacks a lot of polish in my opinion. So, it never lasts long on one of my computers. I think that openSUSE is far more polished, but it can feel sluggish at times if you don't have the latest hardware. So, there are tradeoffs, but Fedora and Mandriva are also viable options. Xandros used to be a decent recommendation for Windows converts because their file browser was built to work well with Windows and provide a similar experience, but it has kind of been a joke lately (along with Linspire). Other distros are more suited either for more experienced Linux users or very inexperienced computer users.
With respect to which version of Ubuntu should be used if you're committed to that, I would recommend 8.04. More importantly, I would recommend waiting not only until 8.04 has been released, but wait until 8.04 has been out for about a month. There may not be much difference during that month, but I've found that Linux distros are often very good about ironing out serious issues in a very short time if any show up. Additionally, the approach to an Ubuntu LTS release (8.04) is much more like a commercial OS release than their other releases. Though, I still preferred other distros to their last LTS release (6.06).
There are lots of opinions about GNOME vs KDE. Ubuntu's strength is GNOME. So, if you're looking at Ubuntu, that's the desktop that will likely come out the best. I personally prefer KDE to GNOME, but whenever I've used Ubuntu, I've chosen GNOME over KDE due to failings in Kubuntu.
KDE 4 looks very promising, but I certainly wouldn't recommend trying it until KDE 4.1 is released. KDE 4.0 isn't really meant for use by anyone other than developers, or at the very least, experienced users.
is ubuntu considered the best in end user experience and in user friendliness? i have only used it on a ps3 and i wont comment.
you should probably look at what most people use their pc's for.
mine is very simple, web browsing, downloading , skype, bittorrent and the ability to watch all those torrents be it xvid divx MKV etc in the best quality. can you get ffdshow for linux? a quality h264/avc decoder supporting dual core? - i am using powerdvds filter.
then theres dvd and hddvd. i cant see anything besting xp in the ease of use and quality of media or the simplicity in installing new drivers. i am not interested in media centre features like tv tuners or epg
If you are going to use Ubuntu then please make the title Ubuntu Linux review. Saying that Ubuntu represents Linux is like saying that Windows XP is Windows. I can hear the flamers now for what I am about to say. Please before you write about Ubuntu or as you are writing about Ubuntu write a companion artical by a differnt author on a couple of other Linux distros and how they differ from Ubntu. Ubuntu is not allways the best choice or best working desktop Linux. Ubuntu may not load on your particular computer at all. So a new person will try the live disk and it dose not work. So they say all Linux is bad and dose not work or too hard. So again a companion artical on two other flavors of linux, the differnce between KDE and Gnome and how to find other distros. Buy the way my choice for the other two distros for a fast look at are PClinuxOS (#1 on distrowatch) and Open SUSE (#3 on Distrowatch). Ubuntu is #2.
Now on to your real question. When to start. NOW. Linux like all things computers. It never stands still. Just pick the best equipment at your price point and jump in. Upgrading your computer or operating system is a on going process if you wish to be current. So writing the artical during an upgrade period is perfect.
The idea of a main stream site posting articals about Linux is great. Just don't forget dual booting for Windows games
and that Ubuntu is not the only Linux in town.
Maybe some information on multiple monitor support too (non clone view). Its possible just not easy. I'm sure most of us use extended desktops on our Windows installations.
A novice user such as yourself won't be able to provide much valuable insight into how the next Ubuntu version compares with the current version. No offense meant; the differences are subtle and take some familiarity to recognize.
I suspect that most of the issues you will have will be very similar to those encountered by any other new Ubuntu user for the last several versions.
Just make sure you identify clearly identify the version in the review, and your knowledge that by the time we see it the next one will already be available. If your review came out 3 or more months after a more recent version was released, than it would cross the line of being uselessly out-of-date.
I don't really mind if you do it now, or later. Except for one thing: Multi-user support. Apparently the latest version (8.04) is going to be "long-support", for three years only bugfixes will be made. But the best part is support for multiple users (simultaneous and independent, with their own desktop and keyboard/mouse), with only a configuration file modification.
Let's face it, PC's nowadays are hard to fully use: Quad Cores, Dual output video cards, TWO dual output video cards. USB has had the ability to put 100's of keyboards and mice on a single PC for at least 10 years. Now you can share a PC (even a used one), between 2 or 3 people who just want to browse the web or do some word processing, even play some simple games.
Even if you only review the current Ubuntu, at least use the experience garnered to attempt a review on multi-user systems. It seems that all of the attention is focused on the acquisition of more computing power, not logical distribution of the power.
Microsoft is not going to embrace multi-person PC's anytime soon (and certainly not without a $xx or more charge per head), so alternative Operating systems are needed. Many OEMs, such as ASUS are realizing this, the Eeepc and some of their High-end boards come with Linux embedded (ostensibly to "browse the web in 5 seconds", but they aren't fooling anyone, MS can't do it. How long until we see MS hyping a "new paradigm of web usefulness" and trying to offer a lame version of this feature?)
I would personally LOVE a article about upgrading linux. As a long term windows user im well aware of what happens when you 'upgrade' windows - xp, to vista without just doing a full reformat. Its not pretty. Im VERY interested to see how this works on the Ubuntu OS.
Also, id personally love it if you take into account some of the 'special' things linux can do. In particular use the compiz-settings-manager and play with all the advanced effects Ubuntu offers (mulitple desktops / a application switcher similar but better to vista's fly out thing, etc). I think these are the things that really make Ubuntu shine. Simply using the default install style may be what many users use, but its hardly representative of what the OS really offers.
For whatever it's worth, my opinion is that you should begin testing whenever you're prepared to spend the time on it. Ubuntu's release cycle should be comletely irrelevant to your schedule. For starters, the next release is unlikely to be so radically different as to change one's experience significantly and if a new release does come, treat it just like any other update or service pack one might get from Microsoft or Apple because on a six month cycle it's more of a bug fix update than an entire paradigm shift.
I think it'd be better to leave the word linux out of the title, since it really is a review of Ubuntu, and not linux as a whole.
What I would like to see is a first time user review that shows what it is about the OS that is attractive to the newcomer. More importantly, I'd like to know what such a user feels is missing, confusing, or downright frustrating. There are enough convert articles out there today and I think Ubuntu is ready to undergo the same critical eye as the more mature OS's.
As far as waiting for the next release or not, I think it'd make little to no difference.
Why not emphasize a little on the "switch to" factor that a newb can appreciate. I mean, everyone that plays with a copy of linux knows a bit about it, and I'm guessing everyone who's posted here so far knows more about linux than the average person.
As a kid who grew up with dos, then windows(from the first installment to 3.1 to 95 to xp and now vista) and has never touched linux, please include something that can grab my attention. It seems everyone who pushes linux as superior hasn't given a reason the average user should switch. Looking at perhaps the best windows platform, XP was easy to use, fun to look at, and worked better than the current platform, so maybe that should be a hyp. benchmark.
With windows problems will crop up a month from now you didn't have last week but with linux this doesn't really happen.
For good test of linux you should first determine the distro to test by trying to setup a few different ones on your test platform. fedora, suse and ubuntu are the kings of the desktop and while others are being mentioned in this discussion the are quite niche are are not nearly as flexible as the big name distros.
There are some common linux stumble blocks the install test should cover:
1) wireless cards. try testing both a supported card like an intel chipset and something that needs ndiswrapper
2) 3-d graphics: nvidia closed sourced drivers tend to be good but the nvidia installer is stupid and not very friendly. How well does each distro handle hiding this fact from users? ATI closed source drivers are a pain even in the best of distros but can they be made to work?
3) proprietary codec support: most distros ship without codecs that get them into DMCA trouble. how much fuss is it to activate this support if you A) don't like in the US and therefore are not bound by their laws or B) don't care and just want to listen to mp3s and watch dvds
4) scanner and printer support
5) software that is equal to or better then its Windows counterpart is available for linux. how clear does the distro make instant messaging, media players, productivity tools and other common applications that may be named differently then windows users may be expecting?
Any distro that can handle these 5 things with a minimum of fuss is worth testing long term.
I see this as a 2 part article. Part 1 would be choosing the distro that is right for you. Some distros do different things from this list with varying degrees of success and so fedora might be right for someone interested in switching to linux at work and doesn't care about 3d and mp3 support whereas ubuntu sets 98% up out of the box and therefore makes more sense at home. Part 2 picks the general most user friendly distro and digs deeper to see what good and bad traits it has for the long haul.
As for the question of 7.10 vs 8.04 I would suggest comparing them side-by-side makes a lot of sense. How much improvement can ubuntu make in just 6 months? What problems have they fixed and how many remain? With a 6 month release schedule any article written even at the release of Heron will be out of date by the fall and so seeing the rate of change in ubuntu is much more meaningful then a snapshot of it at any given point. To that end testing the various alpha and beta releases may even be worthwhile.
I would actually rather see a review of suse. I had a friend at work who swore by it. I think SUSE is probably the most likely to replace windows for "regular" people. Of course ubuntu is nice too, but from my experience it is great until something doesn't work. Once something doesn't work, it can be maddening to fix. Perhaps it would be good to have a couple guys there use 2 or 3 linux distros simultaneously, then compare your experiences afterwords. I would really like to know which linux distro would be best for my parents.
Installing drivers on different distros of Linux has always been a challenge for me. I'm a perpetual Linux noob because I lose patience spending hours online searching forums and guides just to install Nvidia, ATI, or Creative drivers PRORPERLY. My last bout was with my 2900XT and Mandrake Linux which apparently has some "special" driver version just for it's distro. I switched to SuSE and had more success but still had installation errors that caused problems. Nvidia made it easier but I still spent time hunting lines in config files that needed editing. Also upgrading Linux has sometimes been a hassle too. If this site did a write up about using Linux and getting it to work with a few common hardware brands then it would be extremely useful. Basic use conditions like using the 3D desktop, watching videos (avi, h.264, etc...), listening to music, word processing, and 3D gaming with common hardware would be useful things to write about.
Personally, I think you should just wait for the April release, but that's just me. Every release gets better and better; more recent reviews are nearly always more favorable than ones done in the past. Since I'm an Ubuntu lover, I naturally want you to review the latest and best. :)
While to some extent I understand why Ubuntu has been chosen it has been my experience with setting up Linux for newbies & experimenting Windows users that Linux Mint (In the top 5 on Distrowatch), an Ubuntu derivative, is a better choice.
While still Ubuntu with all it's advantages, Mint offers up a more complete initial experience with it's inclusion of all the popular audio & video codecs pre-installed.
Twice I performed an extended (4-9 months) "experiment" where I installed Linux on a Windows user's PC and pretty much left them to their own devices judging their experiences by their cries for help.
With both PCLinuxOS 2007 & Linux Mint the calls just didn't happen! The only calls I received was when one person asked me if their Digital camera would be recognized before even trying it. After I urged that person to just plug it in it worked great & I never got another call about their linux (PCLinuxOS) box.
My latest "experiments" have used Suse 10.3, Pardus Linux (Great distro!) and now Linux Mint. Mint has been a joy to use for the Linux newbies whose pc I have installed it on.
In short while I understand the desire to use Vanilla Ubuntu, IMHO Mint will probably lead to, at least initially, a more positive experience since it includes all of Ubuntu's positives while adding some welcome enhancements.
I'd second the opinion that LinuxMint would be a better choice than Ubuntu. It has everything good about Ubuntu but it really does add alot of additional and welcome features that make it easier for a user new to Linux to use. It is gnome based but the way that it functions, on the surface anyway, is a bit more like KDE. SUSE has a similar "start" menu as well. I think that this helps those more accustomed to Windows adjust and actually bedin to use the OS instead of having to get over the GUI change and then learn the OS.
If measuring Ubuntu, then please be sure to include the ease of which common tasks can be done. With the exception of Linux Mint (Based off of Ubuntu) I don't know of any Linux distros that play mp3s and wma files "out of the box", let alone can play Half Life 2, IE, and other XP programs via Wine-Doors as easily as Linux Mint.
PC Mech has a great deal of coverage on Linux Mint due to their successes with the distro.
Right now Ubuntu is at version 7.10. A lot of things were added in this version. It is not a LTS version which means some features are not 100%. While I doubt compiz-fusion will be rewritten in time for the upcoming version it most definitely will include GIT version updates which will most likely be more feature rich and more stable.
In addition 8.04 will include some significant changes to security as well as a new standard sound daemon (Pulse Audio) which will allow for individualized sound settings for each application. For it being a LTS version I'm actually surprised at just how many changes and/or additions they are making within this version (8.04).
So my two cents are for you to wait or if you decide to review the current version have a keen understanding that the current version is more of a vehicle for new ideas and features with stability being the focus with the later version.
As for KDE or using other distributions, I wouldn't recommend it as KDE 4.0 was just released, which is not feature complete either and further away from being what I could stable. Most other distributions I feel for average desktop users can be a little bit more complicated than Ubuntu.
Otherwise your choice of using Ubuntu is a good one. I currently use it and find it a joy.
If you went for late March you could get Dreamlinux and the old versions of Ubuntu, Opensuse, and Fedora.
If you go for late May you can add the most recent versions of Mandriva, Ubuntu, and Fedora.
If you went for late July there is a very good chance you could get opensuse 11.0 with the first implementation of a KDE 4.1 desktop. KDE 4.0.x doesn't really count.
Personally, I would like to see you include opensuse 11.0 with a KDE 4.1 desktop, but i realise this may not fit well in your schedule.
I don't know if you have reviewed a MS based OS before but I want you to think about it as if you have. When you review an OS, what do you review and test?
If you were to review Windows 7, how would you approach it? Will you test MS Office? Will you test apps in various fields or just the most common things that everyone is interested in?
Will you test connectivity? Gaming performance etc?
Whatever it is that you might want to do when reviewing a MS based OS, take the same ideas over to Linux - whether it be Ubuntu, Debian or whatever. Note that I say ideas, not exact apps to test. That way you are creating a proper perspective on which to evaluate an OS.
Where there are glaring differences that such a process doesn't quite illustrate, feel free to vary and explain why.
I think that for reviewing purposes it makes no difference whether the release has Long Term Support or not. The experience of a new user will be the same with both versions (given that the hardware is not only supported by the newer version), so I don't see any reason for waiting for the next release.
I would recommend using rather standard intel-based hardware. I think that hardware incompatibilities would just spoil the review. Given that MAC OSX only runs on Apple hardware and that ALL hardware manufacturers support Windows, it seems unfair to run Linux in not supported hardware and then complain about incompatibilities.
As much as Ubuntu is probably one of the better Linux Desktop OS's out of the box it fails in one major area. “Commercial support” What I mean is many corporate products, such as SSL VPN Clients, Eng tools (Synplicity, Modelsim, MatLab, etc...) and many other "over the counter" tools are designed to run on RedHat EL4 (and many variants there of). Though most of these tools can be made to run on Ubuntu, this is not for "Newbie's".
This coupled with the number of Distro's, X desktop environments, x86 vs. x86_64 simply makes Linux too thin to be a viable desktop platform for most - if not all - newbie's!
The MAC with a month was well received because people with accept the "pain" of OS X because their MAC makes a lifestyle statement.
However, I highly doubt that a generic x86 laptop loaded with Linux that suddenly refuses to surf at your favorite Starbacks make the same "Life Style" statement...
I would like to see the Ubuntu review, since I toyed around with Mandrake about 5 years ago, but concluded that Linux wasn't really ready enough for me to want to use it on a regular basis.
I think it would be great if you also did a review focusing on the 64-bit version of Vista particularly with regards to gaming compatibility and performance. SP! is done and will be available in the next few weeks and I bet there are a lot of people who have held back for the release of SP1. I am planning to build a new rig in the next month or so, and because of the memory limitation with 32-bit Vista I though I would go with 64-bit instead, but I am unsure about what the drawbacks (if any) might be.
I dunno it's too easy. Why not try for a more revealing and tougher test.
Get Slack.
The install is lightning and you'll be up in KDE, if you so chose, in a very short time. The only hard part is creating and assigning partitions. The curses installer aint pretty but it does the job. Just say yes a bunch and select "install everything".
I think wt will be good to wait till the next revision is released so that the new OS can be reviewed properly. But why can't we have a small story on the current version?
I'd say go for the 8.04. It the one thats going to be supported for the longest. It's the newest OS. Many people who are interested might have already tried the current version of Ubuntu at some point or another so it doesn't seem AS useful to cover the current version. Might as well cover a new OS when it comes out.
I think no matter what, the article you write up about this will be very helpful but I think you'd be doing the Linux community better justice if you wrote an article on an OS that is the fresh on the scene.
It pains my soul the state of video editing capabilities in Ubuntu/Linux. I still need either a OSX/Final Cut Pro or Windows/Avid for serious editing. Why oh why cant Apple license Final Cut Pro to linux (that would be the day).
Good luck with the review, i would put my vote for 8.04 being LTS and all that.
"I refer you to the Airline and toaster jokes, I may
have missed some of the finer points/details of the
jokes but essentially they are:
a)MS Windows Airlines:
The flight is very expensive, but the checkin desk is
fabulous and glitzy, everyone makes you feel great,
the baggage checkin is painless, there is no queueing,
you get straight on the plane. The plane taxes down
the run way and takes off, no problems at all, then
suddenly 10 minutes into the flight the plane explodes
with no warning and for no apparent reason and
everyone is dead.
b)Unix/Linux Airlines:
Everyone turns up at the airport and brings piece an
aeroplane with them, they all sit around on the tarmac
and argue about what the plane should do and look
like, eventually they manage to build 5 or six
different planes, they call them all the same name,
but they do fly and the customers all *believed* they
got to their destinations.
c)MAC Airlines
The customers arrive at the airport, checkin desk is
very funky and modern in its design, with wacky curves
and great colour schemes - a designers dream. The
customers get on the plane which simply taxes up and
down for hours on the runway without actually going
anywhere. Having never experienced a proper
airline/aeroplane trip, the MAC users think this is
all there is to air travel and remain blissfully happy
and blissfully unaware of the fact they are going
nowhere.
Or perhaps the toaster Joke:
a)Windows toaster:
The windows toaster looks great, but sometime it just
won't make toast, it either comes out burnt or raw,
you have to unplug the toaster and plug it back in
again, each time you want to try and make some toast.
For every loaf of bread you buy you are forced to buy
a new toaster to go with it.
b)Linux toaster.
The linux toaster looks awful, it has wires crimped
together hanging out of it, the first time you make
toast with it it burns it, the next time its raw, you
read the man pages and invoke the command line, toast
-verbose -breadsize 50132 -eject -o z3321 > /dev/toast
| more and it makes perfect toast ever after.
c)MAC toaster
The MAC toaster has no settings or controls, it looks
very stylish, but will only accept proprietry size
bread which can only be bought from Apple main dealers
at 10 times the price of regular bread. The toast is
fine except that the size of the bread is so odd, you
can't actually eat the toast it produces, although it
does look good."
I think it is an awesome idea, just be careful about starting a few flame wars. You have the easy ones, like KDE vs Gnome, but what about one like email clients (kontact vs evolution), media players (amarok vs banshee vs exaile) office suits (openoffice vs koffice) IDEs (xemacs vs kdevelop vs eclipse)
Even in the Gnome vs KDE are you going to include both kde 4 and KDE 3.5.
I really like the idea just it would take you a good amount of time just for completeness.
I've been using Ubuntu for years, and its great, but new users are definitely much much better off to jump in when the latest release is an LTS release.
The version of Ubuntu coming out in April isn't just another every 6 month update, it is the culmination of the last 2 years of development in Ubuntu. But more than that, it has much more of a focus on stability, and compatibility. LTS releases undergo much more rigorous bug testing, and are what most would like to see compared to the other big 2 OS's.
Ubuntu 8.04 does not have much different from 7.10, but that is what makes it different. It takes what was created for 7.10, and cleans it up, tweaks it, and makes it more stable. There are a lot of important changes that users won't see going into 8.04, and it is worth the wait.
Finally, if you're going to do this right, please choose a system based on what is supported well in Linux, specifically Ubuntu. The last thing anyone wants to hear is a long-winded complaint piece about the state of hardware support in Linux. The truth is, with popularity will come hardware support, and all anyone can do for now is support the hardware vendors that support Linux.
(ie, Intel everything, especially wireless card-wise :)
The hardware will be similar to our usual test beds; an Intel processor, a P35 mobo, and a recent ATI/NVIDIA video card, there won't be anything exotic. This should be pretty plain and I would hope something that can be installed without an issue.
Well, ATI and NVIDIA video cards are kind of exotic hardware in Linux land. Not that it doesn't work for basic 2D or even you cannot have good 3D, but Intel is the only graphics vendor that properly support Linux. Their support is very good though and definitely on par with what you'd expect for a video card for Windows or Mac OS X.
And I don't think in any way that it is unfair in this comparison to require certain hardware, after all you cannot run Mac OS X on almost any hardware at all. You should really look at it the other way around that Linux just happen to work with more hardware out of the box than any other OS, but on a best effort basis. That is fair compared to Mac OS X at least, a Windows only comparison is arguably a different story.
The only thing required of the selection of hardware to be fair, is that it is easy to do up front, like in "buy a notebook with Intel graphics and wireless". That is about as easy as "buy a Mac from Apple if you want to run Mac OS X".
And just jump into it right away, then we'll be able to hear about your upgrade experience as well. I'm sure it will be painless - imaging all the readers cloning your setup and ironing out issues in order to ensure a good review :)
This was true a year or two ago, but not anymore. Ubuntu will install official nvidia and ati drivers though its restricted driver dialog and you'll have full 2d/3d acceleration. However I should say the newer 8800s (gt, 512 gts) aren't currently supported with the included driver.
It isn't about full 2D and 3D acceleration, it is about not being able to suspend and hibernate and about vendors that listen to the issues their customers might have. It is all but true today.
Yes, Intel is the only one who fully supports and provides open source drivers to the linux community. Yes, because of this it is much more likely that all of the features of your intel graphics will work properly out of the box.
Even so, none of that really matters if you need real 3d performance because Intel's parts simply don't offer enough. I've played Half Life 2, Portal and WoW on this linux installation at 1680x1050 with all the options on, and Intel's parts simply aren't an option for anyone with similar goals. Recommending only intel graphics on linux is really putting a limitation on what you can achieve.
It's great that you want to contribute to the discussion, but actually KNOWING about the subject you're trying to discuss is usually a good idea. I have two separate systems running two separate distributions, one with an ATI card and one with an NVIDIA card (and not old cards, either, an X1900XT and an 8400M) and I don't have any problems bringing either system out of suspend or hibernate (granted the desktop system is put into those states less often than the laptop).
So you define *knowing* as having two data points out of, say a million? Would there be the slightest chance that others than you had the problem? Let us see what we can find in 10 minutes with Google.
Aah, a thread[1] on ubuntuforums.org that shows up on the first page with search results when searching for "suspend linux ati":
"i usually have issues with ati, although the x1500 i'm using on this pc is working ok, but a dell laptop with an ati card keeps losing emerald"
"The only problem I've had is not being able to suspend or hibernate on my laptop." (seconded by another poster)
"The hibernate/suspend thing can be annoying, but only if you use those features often"
Nvidia gets good comments in that thread, but there are several issues reported this week alone on the unofficial forum for NVIDIA Linux [2].
[3]: "Suspend to RAM: Blank screen on second attempt"
[4]: "Default DualHead : one monitor goes blank w/FC3 and FX5700 - 169.xx"
Now, this is not to say that Nvidia and ATI cards don't work at all with suspend or whatever feature. If that is what you are trying to get at, you missed what my first post was about, which was "Intel is the only graphics vendor that properly support Linux."
And to be perfectly clear, it is as much or little about suspend and resume that it is about 2d or 3d acceleration, it is about having a vendor that properly supports Linux.
Speaking of Mac hardware support (and funny enough), the box that we'll be running this on is working right now as a Hackintosh. I'll have a small blog up about that next week, but it was a surprisingly easy process and the range of hardware support was greater than I was expecting.
You might have better luck with a mainboard with Intel integrated video than with the usual test boards. The lower price of admission into this might help.
As for performance benchmarks, I'm not sure I require them - they will be nice, certainly
Just please take hardware into consideration. You may have one system that Ubuntu installs on flawlessly, another system that will require expert assistance, and then another that will just not work until a driver is developed (if ever). For example, X-Fi cards from Creative will probably never function correctly on Ubuntu. However, a Dell laptop with Ubuntu preinstalled should work out of the box.
Point being a premise must be arrived at first. Are you an average Joe who decides to download Ubuntu because it looks cool. If so you could run into a lot of driver related problems. On the other hand, if you're at least savy enough to read up and ask around first, you'll probably hear that hardware must be taken into consideration - in which case you'll check and make sure your devices will work okay with Ubuntu first before wasting your time. Then there's the 'I'm giving up on non-free OSs!!' in which case you'll study up on compatible hardware first and build a system that is 100% Ubuntu compatible - or buy a complete system with Ubuntu already installed and ready to go.
Linux people swear their OS is better in every way yet you never see video benchmarks. Vista is no good at video support since they ruined the DirectShow system so I'd like to find an alternative when XP can not longer be supported.
Please determine whether hardware accelerated HD video is possible on Linux. This means accelerated decode and deinterlace/scaling. If they are possible, an HQV benchmark should be performed against something like Avivo in XP on a 38xx card. Besides quality, look at CPU utilization and resistance to frame skipping when performing other operations.
Also test whether the AMD Linux driver has all of the Avivo TheaterMode multi display functions. And, for Pete's sake, test HD tuner cards and Blu-ray playback!
If these functions are not available in Linux, that fact must not be overlooked in an objective OS review.
"Linux people swear their OS is better in every way": depends on the
people you're talking to. If you want games, then by all means stick
with windows. No other OS currently has better drivers and infrastructure to run games. If you want something thats configurable to your hearts content, then the free/open OSs are best choice.
New hardware is currently better supported on linux (sans the parts
where the manufacturer doesn't want linux drivers to happen).
Finally, UNIX is system initially designed by developers for developers. They never needed to appeal to the average joe like windows does.
RE accelerated video: there's no real hw acceleration beyond MPEG2-MC; although people from Intel are working on a generalized media acceleration framework. But performance of the available software decoders isn't that bad; Low-Bitrate 1080p-h264 material is no problem for my 2.4GHz Opteron (you know, the 10GB files you can get on the 'net).
As for the "benchmark" apps, good luck findind posix variants of all those stupid windows apps. WINE certainly won't be enough to run the win32 exes...
(minor nitpick: "Linux" is the kernel, not a complete OS)
I'll see what we can do about video tests, but I can't make any specific promises. BluRay/HD-DVD will probably be out of the question however, since there is no licensed/proper application for Linux.
Total nonsense, October 30, 2007 isn't that old. Vista driver's have already had a year to mature. Newer drivers won't change the results. Especially since there are also even newer drivers for Linux now. The results would probably be even better now for Linux.
Regarding HD video, I can see that DRMed HD video might be difficult, but over-the-air MPEG transport stream from tuners cards is completely open.
And I forgot about editing. There are extremely fast, simple, and low priced editing solutions for 1080i mpeg on the PC (Womble Mpeg2Vcr). What is video editing (SD and HD) like on Unix? Particlarly solutions like Mpeg2Vcr that simply copy input to output, where possible, without unecessary re-rendering.
Given that the upcoming version of Ubuntu (8.04, otherwise known as "Hardy Heron") is a long-term support release, meaning that it is supported on the desktop for 3 years and servers for 5 years, I would recommend waiting for it's release since it should be more comparable to Windows and OS-X as LTS releases are designed for maximum stability, reliability and compatability...
From my experience, the following are the critical issues vis-a-vis Linux:
1) It's a hell of a lot faster than Vista.
2) Prepare for major headaches installing wireless drivers.
3) Man, tons of free applications are available.
4) Really, you can pretty much kiss your old Windows applications goodbye -- Wine just isn't ready for primetime, even after over 10 years of development, and my guess is that it probably never will be.
5) Get ready for a STEEP learning curve when it comes to the command line. If you know DOS, you have a slight advantage, but not a huge one.
I've experimented with using Linux for my everyday tasks, and it works great 80% of the time. The problem is the other 20% -- I'm still having to boot to Windows. I'd like to get rid of it completely.
I'd say go ahead and review with a few considerations:
1. Ubuntu is GNOME-centric, and the latest version of Gnome has some evolutionary improvements but I doubt it will be enough to change your mind about the interface. So, at least in that sense, the "feel" will be similar.
2. Likewise your experience with the software repository will be identical.
3. The end-user security system is being totally redone in 8.04.
4. 8.04 will have better hardware detection and support. Any trials and tribulations you had getting some item to work may not apply to the newer version.
But given the pace of innovation in free software, any time you decide to do a review you will have the same problems. So I'd just go for it - nobody will consider it your "final say" on the topic.
I say do the review now, post the article and then in April when the new distro comes out, do a brief follow up with the upgrade experience. I wouldn't expect a full article the 2nd go 'round, just a brief article on your upgrade experience.
And prepare an article about it. After the new version is available, you might write a short follow-up about the new things - the upgrade process, things that appear different.
Also, you could try to use your computer with different amounts of RAM, and inform us about the speed/feel of the system (1GB of RAM, 2GB of RAM - a lower memory use - 512MB or less - might prove interesting but painful to you).
I'd like to see an Ubuntu review by a newcomer. To make it complete, though, at least two distros should be compared - and additional comparison of Gnome and KDE environments are warranted. I'm thinking along the lines of another relatively complete distro, say CentOS.
That's something we had considered early-on, but ultimately decided to pass on. We want to do one month with just one OS to keep things simple and to the point, so we're going with the most popular and user-friendly distro, and right now that's Ubuntu with Gnome.
It does bring up an interesting point about so much variety though, which is something we'll be tackling in our article.
I think that's a bit ambitious. I can agree with two or even three distributions being compared as they do then do differ. SuSE is better for the enterprise while Ubuntu seems the choice for the home desktop.
A separate one would be fine for Gnome and KDE. At least in terms of usability and other aspects.
A comparison to Windows and OSX would really sweeten up things.
I think that's a bit ambitious. I can agree with two or even three distributions being compared as they do then do differ. SuSE is better for the enterprise while Ubuntu seems the choice for the home desktop.
A separate one would be fine for Gnome and KDE. At least in terms of usability and other aspects.
A comparison to Windows and OSX would really sweeten up things.
How about you review it now, and then include a review of the upgrade process too, as that is something I find to (at times) be a challenge with linux distros.
I endorse the previous statement, and think that it is an excellent idea.
No, seriously, I feel that the selective but easy upgrade process is a strong point in Linux. The biggest downside is the lack of support from commercial software, something that might change as WINE-doors progresses.
My plug for coverage: user transition to linux, including ease of use/effictiveness of WINE/WINE-doors; driver support for ethernet, sound, and video acceleration, with focus on Intel, Broadcom, and Creative (as these make the mass majority of said devices out there); and the feel of the interface for typical usage and upgrades.
As a new user of Gutsy on my MacBook, I would actually find this idea particularly good, especially if the following could be tried:
- Looking into the end-user experience with Gutsy, of course
- ...As well as the upgrade path to their next release, if possible.
- Also, the ease of installing and using something like Cedega and also Wine (the latter is free) to play games like Oblivion (possibly even using this new rig for benchmarks with new games)
- You could check out the driver situations between AMD video cards and NVIDIA ones.
- You could look into the installation and optimization processes for various Windows-exclusive peripherals.
- Covering security issues (or the lack thereof) using Firefox on Ubuntu.
- Trying this OS on a PC platform, as well as a Mac platform (hopefully one that has a chance to use both wireless and wired internet connection, as the former often gets tricky early on).
I also thing that you should include a comparison of KDE and Gnome. The good reason to do one now and one later is that KDE 4 has recently been released and the new version of Kubuntu will likely use that as it's desktop environment.
As an avid Linux user, I would like to see more Linux news/coverage. Especially since this is a technology site with a focus on computers.
As another suggestion, please include my favorite distro, Slackware.
gusty (7.10?)is the worst ubuntu thay have made use 7.04 or wait for 8.04 as that one is an LTS one so thay Have to make it stable as its supported for 3 years
While I didn't think that Gutsy was the most stable release they've had, I'd hardly call it bad. But then again, I'm using KDE and not Gnome. It is my default OS at home, now if I could only convince my boss to let us use it at work.
I think this is the best idea. If you're going to do it for a month, start 2 weeks before the 8.04 update and then describe the upgrade procedure and new features.
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MelCarnahan - Thursday, April 3, 2008 - link
In order to be an apples to Apples comparison, your review must be on a notebook that comes preloaded with Linux and supported by the OEM. The Eee PC would qualify.If you want to compare a Windows machine to a Linux computer that does not come with Linux preloaded and factory-supported then the Windows machine for comparison should be a Playstation 3 running Windows.
Jesus Christ, the Holy Ghost and many virgins have endorsed Linux as the official operating system of God.
God recommends Linux v2.6.24.4.
MelCarnahan - Thursday, April 3, 2008 - link
In order to be an apples to Apples comparison, your review must be on a notebook that comes preloaded with Linux and supported by the OEM. The Eee PC would qualify.If you want to compare a Windows machine to a Linux computer that does not come with Linux preloaded and factory-supported then the Windows machine for comparison should be a Playstation 3 running Windows.
Jesus Christ, the Holy Ghost and many virgins have endorsed Linux as the official operating system of God.
God recommends Linux v2.6.24.4.
esancheo - Saturday, March 15, 2008 - link
Last week I started using the a new version's alpha (never failed in anything, compare this with others) with an old 2800 athlon and a rusty gf 5200.I'm amazed at how i can get all the bells and whistles of compiz, super efficient software, i was going to buy a new computer this month but i'm postponing it, i have everything i need now, games, quicker internet, I'm never going back to the past of Windows, maybe a dual boot just for a 3d game... i love linux!!!
snffff - Thursday, March 13, 2008 - link
I have actually recently switched over to Ubuntu 7.10, and I'll have to say, considering the amount of research I did before this, and since I"m not an inexperienced windows user, there are a number of points I wish had been iterated (or more seriously re-iterated) during my pre-install research.First thing that came up is that despite statements to the contrary: there is no seamless switchover. "Out of the box" as it were, Ubuntu does most of things that Windows does and a few things it doesn't (it comes with an office suite for instance, as well as a pretty advanced image editor). On the other hand, none of the things it does work the same way. Which doesn't seem like a big deal until you want to do something you take for granted in Windows. You want to launch a website that uses flash? good luck. How about edit a text document in the default openoffice document editor, not so hard, but also not the same as the Microsoft Word you're used to. You used to Photoshop? Gimp apparently does everything Photoshop does, but I wasn't going to completely relearn the process after I had already paid for Photoshop. How about installing the programs that Ubuntu does lack? I've been using linux for over a month, and although there are some handy mechanisms in place (add/remove and the synaptic package manager) to install or uninstall software, they are even less reliable than windows, and I find myself having to google software install instructions which almost always involve the DOS-like terminal. Not hard, but I honestly still couldn't just install any old program via apt-get or a download without instructions, something that as a windows user I took for granted.
And that doesn't even touch on things like Windows' pretty interface. Maybe I'm just silly, but I kind of like pretty menu bars, and shrinking windows when I minimize them. This stuff requires separate software (i.e. compiz-fusion) which is not as easy to use as Windows, or even necessarily installed by default in Ubuntu. When it is installed it breaks another of the linux myths, being that my 4 gigabytes of reserved space, while perfectly adequate for a default install and far more than I had been lead to believe was needed for a linux install, just barely left enough hard drive space for the experience I had become used to with Windows. Install Java, flash (both of which seem to need multiple versions, both free and commercial installed to work consistantly), Openoffice (to replace microsoft office), video players as competent as zoomplayer for instance, and pretty soon my 4 gigabytes, plenty for a careful install of Win XP, is gone. Not necessarily because linux takes more space, but more likely because as a new user, I don't know how to optimize my linux install, and space savings while well documented for linux, are not as consistent as windows. Try finding five linux websites that agree on how to optimize a linux install. I dare you.
Mostly I think that a real review of Ubuntu requires more than just casual use of linux. There are just so many things you can take for granted in Windows, so many little programs you use occasionally that enrich or simplify your computer using experience. Go through all of the installed programs on your computer (or all of your computers if you use more than one regularly) and try to use or find equivilant programs for everything that you have installed on them. Not just the web and word processing and email, but photo editing, video games, music and movie players, cd burners, torrent programs, how about cpu-z for general computer info? or gspot for identifying codecs? even do little things like opening the nfo files that come with many torrents and just work differently on linux, this stuff is out there, but I bet if you need cpu-z and you're an advanced windows user, you just type cpu-z into google and then go download the latest version, you don't have to run a google search for a linux equivilant. Let us know what that's like. Show us the install process for anything that needs installing rather than just saying, "this program needed to be installed, which required a google search but was painless" try using sites like youtube and facebook, that normal people use regularly and report problems and bugs, put music on your ipod, and tell us how that goes. I'm happy with Linux, but I'm not "joe sixpack" and I wouldn't leave my mom with a linux computer unless I was commited to stop by and fix it every week. This is the kind of info I think most "spend a while with linux" reviews lack.
Styln - Friday, February 22, 2008 - link
I built a system based on the ASUS P5k-VM motherboard (G33 NB, ICH9 SB, GMA 3100 Video, Realtek ALC833 audio, Marvell 88E8056 GigEth), LG SATA DVD Burner, E2160 CPU OC to 3Ghz, 2G DDR 800 RAM. Except for 3D graphics, it's a modern competitive system. I put Ubuntu 7.10 on it because it's the 5th PC on my home network and I'm just sick & tired of paying MSFT and dealing with the on-line genuine Microsoft validation BS (All it takes is having to do this one time over the phone instead of the network and you'll never want to buy MSFT products again). It worked first time every time. I set it up for my non-technical wife. Used the Gnome GUI and made it look quite similar to Windows. She uses it to surf the web, blog, read, write, and print documents, manage pictures, and view media content. It works great, has full support for my gigEth based home network with a NAS and networked printers. Yes, I had to tweak a file to auto-mount the NAS on login, but other than that, all configuration was very easy and 100% GUI based. Auto updates, extensive application/package installation, new printers install via CUPS, etc.Wifey uses it everyday and she loves it. I haven't touched it in 2 months now, and I love it. If it wasn't for games, (and does Quicken work in Linux?), I'd put it on every machine in the house. Overall, it's a very impressive installation.
Is Ubuntu ready for prime time on the desktop? At my house, the answer is absolutely!
Eri Hyva - Thursday, April 10, 2008 - link
But of course it does, my friend....http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=a...">http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=a...
Most "Windows (c) only" software work in Linux.
For example Adobe Photoshop CS2 (so not yet CS3, Adobe is not contributing, but now Google is contributing to make that happen), in games for example World of Warcraft.
Use wine! (BTW: I am teatotaler ;) )
http://www.winehq.org/">http://www.winehq.org/
Wine is getting better and better as it gets older, you already knew that.
So it's a good time to sell those Windows licenses on Ebay, their value is in downward spiral. Things are going to look different in 24 months. One can come and rise against the Goliaths, in some European countries Firefox leads browser market share with 60%, and rising with few percentage points every month.
(it's only 14 days to brand new 8.04 Ubuntu and only 203 days to 8.10, which is a smaller version improvement)
Aivas47a - Tuesday, February 19, 2008 - link
It would be great if you could try installing Ubuntu on several different hardware configurations to see what kind of compatibiilty issues you might encounter. Using Ubuntu to run a "folding at home farm," I have been flatly unable to install 64 bit Ubuntu on a DFI P35 or X38 board, regardless of the components used or flavor of Ubuntu (server, Kubuntu, text only installation, etc.) (FWIW, Fedora and openSUSE 10.3 wouldn't install on the DFI boards either, but openSUSE 11 alpha 2 works OK.) I had some Ubuntu issues on an Asus X38 board too, although with the latest bios that seems to be resolved.jiulemoigt - Saturday, February 16, 2008 - link
If only for the fact you can run the OS off a usb stick, the free versions of the distro come with most of the drivers and utilities you need for a functioning OS right off, including the ability to update apps from Mandriva's mirrors with no configuring or extra work on the users part. I have an extra hard drive in my PC with 2008 power pack, which I can surf the web and email from the same folders I use in windows, despite being NTFS format. The ironic thing is I can access all my files on windows, including the ones windows won't let me touch. A word of caution is do NOT install nix and windows on the same hard drive if you can all avoid it they do not always play nice due to fat issues(the original meaning ie the one all formats use). The avg user who does not play games will have very little issue with nix as in the corporate setting it is faster, no over head. One my of the jobs is rendering assets for cg which means I'm talking render times in days, which means when I'm rendering in Nix verse windows I get bonus money when I shave four or five days off the time, which is where the difference between command line rendering mental ray in windows vs the same in nix is usually enough to get that bonus every time. One thing about Mandriva which used to be mandrake is the good version of the demo was club only, and now that they are out of the red they have opened the club to everyone and taken all the features they would have added to the club distro and rolled them into the free version or the power pack. The most annoying thing about the nix distros is how much they depend on torrents to spread most of their apps and software updates. I did not notice it but http://sourceforge.net/">http://sourceforge.net/ needs to be mentioned in the article as most open software in the last five has some connection to it. Last if you want to play games, have fun there... there is a reason I have an XP hard drive with just my games on it.If you want to see why corporations are switching to it, try one of the corporate versions of the distros they are far more stable, and have open office, firefox/mozilla, or in house versions of these that are installed as images same as windows only with far less support needed. Even monkeys can install them our tier one techs manged with no problems... I still think one of the clipboards secretly helped them.
oldkawman - Thursday, February 14, 2008 - link
So what can a "novice" expect from a month with linux? That depends on what they want to do with it. I am not familiar with Umbutu, but can describe what I do for Fedora based installations, specifically FC7 as I have done several in the past several weeks. After the basic install, there are the updates, addition software installations, either the NVidia or ATI video driver installation. You cannot forget about the java and flash player plugins, then there is the mplayer and mplayer plugin with those separate codec packages, and edit the ssh_conf file to permit running remote X programs and some other things. Would a novice know how to do these things or even know to do these things?Then there are the complications. The Java plugin is real good example of DUH? And why do you need java? One use is printing online labels and postage. So, can a novice setup the plugin? The instructions are very good. First of all, you find out jre is already installed because the package manager tells you it is. But, that does not matter because it's not the full version as it's missing the plugin. Why is it missing the plugin? Likely because it's not open source. For the full version you have to download that from SUN website and follow the instructions. These are all command lines you run as root and include chmod a+x jre1.5.0_06.rpm.bin to make the self extracting file you just finished downloading an executable file and then ./jre1.5.0_06.rpm.bin to extract the rpm file. Then rpm -U --force jre1.5.0_06.rpm to install because the package manager has it listed as already installed. Then you make the symbolic link to the mozilla plugin directory that looks something like this, so you cd ~/.mozilla/plugins/ and the make a symbolic link
ln -s /home/username/java/jre1.5.0_06/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
That is the kind of thing that prevents large scale acceptance by the masses of point and click windows users who have never even seen a command line and are not completely sure what the keyboard is for other than pressing any key to continue or typing in a username or password.
avaughan - Friday, February 15, 2008 - link
I don't use Ubuntu (I'm running Debian), but last time I looked at Ubuntu you could install/enable flash java ati/nvidia drivers etc without needing to touch the commandline. (And they are automatically configured ready for use). Windows media codecs just needed a single line added to /etc/apt/sources.list and I think that could also be done from the gui package manager.IMO thats a large part of what has made Ubuntu so popular.
(And a typical new linux user who does't use the commandline won't want to run remote X programs over ssh).
avaughan - Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - link
I think the most important thing is to have reasonable expectations.Given your job, I expect you are an expert windows user. Linux is different to windows. It will take quite some time to learn to use it as effectively as you can use windows. (Think how many hours you have spent learning to get the most out of various windows programs. One month isn't going to be enough time to duplicate that).
Some applications just aren't feasible for companies to distribute because without special licences for legal reasons. (Licence restrictions, patents, DCMA etc). Sometimes the licence issues can be worked around eg. http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/web/flashplugin-n...">http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/web/flashplugin-n... . Things like libdvdcss2 and win32codecs for watching DVDs and .wmv are more problematic. (They are also available, just not from ubuntu.com). It would be unfair to criticise Ubuntu over this without also commenting on the legal issues.
A lot of hardware will work right out of the box. For some of the rest, you just need to install and/or configure the right "drivers". When things are properly packaged this is similar to installing drivers on window and/or tweaking a value in the registry.
When things aren't properly packaged this can be much harder. (It's the sort of experience where you can learn a lot about linux. Its also the sort of experience where you can easily make a mistake that you know won't have the experience to be able to recover from). Try to stick with hardware that other people have reported works with Ubuntu. eg see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport">https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport . If googling for advice, consider adding ubuntu as a search term, just as you would use vista if searching for drivers for Vista.
nameNotInUse - Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - link
I think setteling for one (or a couple) of distributions makes sense. Just make sure that you state expclicitly in your review that this is "one month with Ubuntu/Linux" or "SuSe/Linux".And try to do some decent research so that you know whethere a problem is with the distribution, with the kernel, or some upstream project (eg Gnome).
Yes, there are many distributions. No, you can't do anything useful on a "linux system" without some userspace tools -- and most people wouldn't get anything done without the framework of a distribution. Yes, you *have* to choose a distribution, just as you would have to choose a distribution of Windows (95/98/ME/2000/XP/Vista/2003 Server/2000 Server etc), Mac OS (9/X.4/X.5), BSD (netbsd/freebsd/openbsd/dragonflybsd/pcbsd) etc.
"Linux" might be the most self-incompatible OS there is -- but that's just the way it is.
Yes, if you want to claim to have reviewed "Linux for the desktop", you'd have to review at least Debian/etch, Debian/lenny (testing), Ubuntu/6.06, Ubuntu/7.10, Suse (?), RedHat/Centos (?) and Gentoo at the very least.
I don't think there's much point in *that* however.
maveric7911 - Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - link
Debian/etch, Debian/lenny (testing), Ubuntu/6.06, Ubuntu/7.10why write an article on 4 different debian/debian based distros. Doesn't make any sense what so ever.
I'd settle with seeing contrast of ubuntu and rhel/fedora/arch/suse ect, but would not want to see someone compare debian to itself.
nameNotInUse - Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - link
Hi,I'd be very interested to see a thorough review of linux, as I've yet to read *any* good linux reviews (in the past 10 years I've been using the linux-based distributions).
I think you should respect the distributions LTS-status - Ubuntu is a natural choice for Desktop linux, and I think you should comparte the current LTS with the upcomming one, including the upgrade-path.
I realize a lot of home users are using 7.10 - but it is considered a BETA realease -- if you do want to review it, please take that into consideration.
It would be interesting to see you compare some of the uniqe benefits of Linux - such as running Ubuntu on a 64-bit amd/intel, a 32-bit machine and on a powerpc-based mac - and see if that helps you a as a new user share files etc.
If you do choose Ubuntu, a comparison with Debian might be interesting, particularily on support - eg compare:
http://www.debian.org">http://www.debian.org
http://www.ubuntu.com">http://www.ubuntu.com
http://ubuntuforums.org">http://ubuntuforums.org
http://www.debian-administration.org">http://www.debian-administration.org
http://wiki.debian.org">http://wiki.debian.org
http://wiki.ubuntu.com">http://wiki.ubuntu.com
Or - if you only choose to do Ubuntu - try the paid support, and compare that to Apple and Microsoft.
You should spend som extra time to see if you get wifi w/wpa to work, memorycard readers and other stuff that isn't well supported in Linux (note; I use Linux as my primary platform, but I'd like to see a balanced, realistic review).
You should also spend some time looking at the strenghts; eg trying to install a persnal wiki/blog, a cms-system, a database system using the package manager etc.
Other features to look at: full disk encryption, sharing a computer with other family members, available games (possibly trying to get eg WoW to work with wine -- it *should* be fairly easy; it'd be interesting to see what a new user thinks), running windows in a vm (preferably qemu or xen as they are available as Free software), dvd (video) mastering.
Also as a follow-up it might be interesting to see a comparison of Ubuntu on a mac vs os X with fink installed.
rettrukdrv - Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - link
I suggest you do ver 7.10,The only differences I"ve seen has to do with setting up software sources and auto loading of wireless adapter without a password.(The adapter I use is a Belkin F5D7050 ver.4000 which loads the driver when you load the Ubuntu OS.)I"ve used a number of Linux Distr.and ubuntu is the best.Good networking(home),good printer setup and with a Msi 945 board,3.0 Core 2 Duo,Its the fastest thing around.zemane - Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - link
Do a review of installing Ubuntu on a machine that already have Windows installed, i.e., a dual-boot install.Thanks!
maveric7911 - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
I read on the front comment page "PCLinuxos".... Really are we even calling this linux. Hey here is a novel idea, lets write an article on linux distros that are not fakies "ie pclinuxos" or now considered "main stream for the next couple of years" cra...ubuntu. There are lots of great distros out there that are not debian based or not so watered down you really can't even call it linux.examples:
Arch Linux
Rhel5
Gentoo
and the list goes on.
Just because its excepted as easy yet not functional or mainstream "even though rhel4/5 is about 50x more used then ubuntu" doesn't mean we can't see articles on real distros.
mindless1 - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
IMO, doing a review of something so close to obsolete, especially when the next release has LTS, would be a mistake.If others also want to hear about your experiences in doing an upgrade, let that experience be moving from the LTS to the next version, since anyone who isn't looking to do the upgrades periodically would be best off choosing the LTS releases.
Since the LTS release is so close, it is pretty much finished and the contemporary experience, remembering that a lot of people won't be reading the review the moment it is published but rather many will read it later. The review's useful lifespan is much longer if based on the LTS than the last version prior to it.
quantex - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
Why not start using linux right now and make a review in March and in May you could make a update of your review with the new version of Ubuntu.gochichi - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
Let me rephrase that. This review could be a big deal for Linux.I'm of the opinion, that doing two one month reviews would be in order. One now, and one after the new release. That would give the OS a point of reference.
The other thing if you were to do an extended review, it wouldn't take that much to do a follow up article once the new version is released.
Of course, Linux is not Ubuntu, but Ubuntu has been leading the effort to make Linux accessible.
Anyhow, I would certainly be interested to see what anandtech has to say about Linux. I'm particularly interested in tips for using it as a replacement to the mainstream OSs. How to make it work on general tasks. I think that's what people are most interested in.
FelixO - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
The Mac review you did was great but it was a long time ago now!
However, since you are a respected tech site it is likely that it will continue to be read for a long time.
The same is likely to be true of your Ubuntu review.
The fact that 8.04 is a LTS release also means that the review will automatically have a longer shelf life.
Therefore, in order that you do not have to pepper your article with caveats such as "of course this may be fixed in the new version arriving next month", I would recommend waiting until 8.04 is a few weeks old.
This will also reduce the thousands of comments that you would otherwise receive from Linux fanboys (such as myself) of the form "Just upgrade, that's fixed in Hardy Heron"
schmunk - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
A little off subject, but . . .Lets face it, most people don't game with Linux, but as an OS for a HTPC, it has some real positives. I use MythDora (MythTV on the Fedora Core), and would have interest in a review of Linux HTPC solutions. Running Myth has also prompted me to get off my Windows using butt, and find a good text editor, Database GUI tool etc.
ShadowZERO - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
I've been toying around with Linux in my spare time for the past year, and to summarize what I've experienced, I think you should use openSUSE for a base KDE test platform and Ubuntu for a base Gnome platform.I wouldn't mind seeing KDE/Gnome testing for both, since both actively develop both UIs for their Distros. But to simplify things, I think Ubuntu currently summarizes the best Gnome has to offer as does openSUSE with KDE.
Jedi940 - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
I agree with an earlier post. I would like to see a review as soon as possible. I have been toying with the idea of switching to linux but have yet to make up my mind. I would very much like to read a professional, in-depth review of the operating system as soon as possible. In addition, when the new version comes out, ammend that review to include a review of the upgrade process. That would be wonderful.chippa - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
Every once in a while when I visit AT I click on the Linux tab, only to be disappointed. I am kind of excited for this review, and I must admit, hopeful that the OS impresses. I, for one, would not want a review that was a schizophrenic mess or collage of the distro's available, and I know it simply isn't something you guys would do.Ubuntu with Gnome is a good choice (though a brief look at VMWare in a windows world and maybe PCLinuxOS in conclusion wouldn't sink the boat). While Ubuntu and all of the different distro's have improved a lot in the last couple of years, it does require patience with the learning curve and the unfamiliarity of a new OS.
Purely on a time sensitivity gameplan, I think that if you started your analysis a couple weeks before the release with a pre-release, just to study up, you would get a good feel for it. Then when you hit the real thing, the testing would have fewer hick ups. Hardy Heron is in Alpha 4 now, the problems with these releases are usually small and well documented. My experience with the later and more mature Beta releases has not been awful. I have done multiple installs in a short period of time, just being anxious for the release, and with the forum and HOW TO's printed out, it isn't that much of a pain for hardware installs. In my mind, building computers and the linux variants have always gone hand in hand as good and sometimes frustrating fun. I look forward to your review.
Landiepete - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
Linux distro's have become mature to a point whare installing, maintaining and upgrading one can be achieved with the click of an icon. Anyone with a general knowlege of a PC and Windows should be able to install a distro from the big boys.Equally, I don't think it's very relevant to the average user if a KDE is v.3.1, 3.2 or 4.x, if it works it's OK.
What DOES however interest me (and I think most users) is : how does it perform with stuff you buy in the store ? Can you get the scanner of your multifunctional to work, can you switch that USB printer switch that didn't come with a 'nux driver, how do you get that software that came with your Garmin to work, how do I stream movies to my TV.
Teh OS itself is just a foundation for the apps. No matter how easy it is to install or how good it is, if half of the peripheral stuff you own doesn't work (or you can't get it to work), you'll just end up reinstalling Windoze and ignore 'nux for the next 10 years with a sour grape taste left in your mouth.
Good luck,
Peter
trexpesto - Sunday, February 10, 2008 - link
With the snowballing quality of Linux front ends, awesome apps like OpenOffice and GIMP, ubiquitous webmail and chat, the only thing keeping the upcoming generation on Windows is Games Games Games.If all the great games were released for Linux, it would not be long before the extra 50-100 dollars was just too much to pay. If I was Google, that might be tempting.
bupkus - Sunday, February 10, 2008 - link
Is it possible to contact some of the other distro developers and ask them what criteria they use to test for hardware compatibility?Also, have you asked yourself what it is you can provide the AT forum readers that they can't find elsewhere?
I believe Linux requires a long term commitment so if your goal includes aiding users to ween themselves off Windows as I suppose many do desire then I completely applaud you in this effort. I'll be along for the ride so save me a seat.
Knowname - Sunday, February 10, 2008 - link
I've got a task on the backburner. It seems using a wireless network is pretty near impossible on Linux. I don't know, I hadn't really tried it yet, but, like linux itself to all non-engineering kind, it seems REALLY complicated. I have a supported adapter (I think...), I just can't connect... aah, I'll get to it later. Anyway if you can keep this in mind in your review (setting up wireless networking). Maybe I'm just an idiot and blowing this thing up WAY more than I should, but, just thought I'd bring it up.bupkus - Sunday, February 10, 2008 - link
...maybe you can stop by and wash my car. Jeeshhh!DanInPhilly - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
I tried Ubuntu on my new-build PC: burned it to disk and booted with it. It should have worked like a real OS, instead it froze. Maybe the next release will be able to handle moderately-new components.-------------------------------------------------------------
Mobo: Gigabyte GA-P335-DS3L || CPU: Intel Q6600
Video: XFX 8800GT 512mb || RAM: 2x2gb Corsair 6400 (800MHz)
wetwareinterface - Sunday, February 10, 2008 - link
yeah i had started to include in my comment too that ubuntu won't work on my x2 4800 with either a via 890 chipset or ati 3200 chipset with the ati x1900xtx installed. so much for 3d desktop, you have a modern 3d card and it fails all the time trying to acces the vid card for even 2d. suse 10.xx works at least, no 3d acceleration but it at least "works out of the box" after an install. ame with redhat's distros they at least assume to try 2d first and let you deal with immature 3d features at your own risk.seriously try a different distro or several and see which one is the real best desktop os instead of following the herd of other review sites praising ubuntu as "the best desktop distro".
Targon - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
You can't just review one distribution and leave it at that. There are several major Linux distributions, and each one deserves to be looked at. If it requires the input from those more familiar with Linux, then get it, because it would be like calling a review of Vista Home Basic a full review of Vista. It might apply to THAT version, but it doesn't cover all the features available, and won't touch on the features that many people need to know about.At the least, you should cover Redhat and Debian as two of the bigger distributions out there. Don't just focus on Linux as a replacement for Windows as a workstation, but look at using it for server functions as well. This is where Linux really shines.
MadBoris - Sunday, February 10, 2008 - link
I think you actually raise the problem issues with Linux in your post, it's too many distros and being mentioned mainly as a server because it can't do nearly as well as a desktop. There should be a single flavor that is easy to choose. I, as an end user, have no desire to become verbose and schooled in the nuances of the different distro's in their strengths and weakness. Should I have to be? Nor should being able to name the majority of them provide me some badge of Linux honor ;).As an example Vista basic, Home premium and Ultimate is already too many choices for people, although pretty easy to make comparatively to Linux. I surely don't want to run more than one distro so I don't 'want to need to know' about more than one. The OS should be about productivity with applications and ease of use, not the OS itself. The OS is a tool as a means to an end and people shouldn't have to think about the hammer, I just need to be able to use it to accomplish the job, while giving very little or no thought to it's construction. The more invisible the OS is, the less I have to think about it, the better it is.
Since Anandtech's focus for the review is as a desktop OS, it should be one distro, furthermore the value and quality of it in a server environment isn't in question here. that's a seperate subject entirely and realistically that would be a much more technically demanding article requiring greater time and depth of testing (in-depth security, quantitative performance analysis, stability, connectivity, server tools & software, ease of use, ease of support). Nobody is really interested in knowing if some tech guru can successfully use Linux in a closet somewhere, the question is can your girlfriend or wife (not both), nephews, nieces, parents, grandparents, etc. Is it a viable competition to the bloat that is Vista, or Mac OSX, and if not why? Well that's my look at it.
wetwareinterface - Sunday, February 10, 2008 - link
the whole point of the review is to see if linux is a viable replacement for windows or osx et al. the issue is linux isn't in reality one thing, it is split into several distros each doing slightly different things with different ease of use factors and included software. focusing on one distro is like saying windows is crap and is out of date after reviewing windows 95. or saying i don't like editing photos on a p.c. after reviewing paintshop pro and ignoring gimp and photoshop entirely. the sad fact is linux doistros include software with the install and each has a method of ditributing extra software and updates. suse uses a different system to redhat and neither use the same one as debian derrivitives like ubuntu. packages that are easily available for one distro using it's built in package manager aren't easily available in other distro's and need custom compiling and sometimes even after that simply won't work correctly or at all without an indepth knowledge of the linux kernal and distro's package system and gui api's, driver developement or programming in general. how do you recommend linux or not after sitting in the shallow end of the pool using only a limited set of tools? you need to dive in and if it's a mess for a review site writer on andtech it's gonna be a complete farce for any average "browser/email can't install a printer in windows" person to deal with what they need either. which sounds like the point of the article, is linux a capable desktop replacement os for the unwashed masses.mlau - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
[QUOTE]the whole point of the review is to see if linux is a viable replacement for windows or osx et al[/QUOTE]If you are looking for a gratis windows-look-alike then you're out
of luck. It doesn't look like it and doesn't behave like it, and I
hope it never will. The sooner people realize this, the better.
deldorama - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
7.10 is the product of many major changes (that's the "gutsy" in Gutsy Gibbon) and even as a stable release it wouldn't represent "the real deal" you'll see with 8.04.As 8.04 will be a LTS release where stability is central I'd suggest to wait until it's released.
oldkawman - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
If you keep waiting for the next release of linux version, you'll be waiting forever. Fedora also has a pretty quick release cycle, but all in all, changes from one release to the next are minimal. If you perform a yearly review that should get pretty much everything.If you look back at the changes from RH8 all the way up to FC7 what all is there really that has changed. I cannot recall any bombshells, it's been a steady improvement in usability. It's the programs that make linux so advantageous. It's free, secure, and stable. The only missing program would be AutoCAD. That is the only program I need Windows for.
omfgenuffalrdy - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
for an idea of what to expect from the next Ubuntu release:Ubuntu 8.04 roadmap
https://blueprints.launchpad.net/sprints/uds-bosto...">https://blueprints.launchpad.net/sprints/uds-bosto...
gnome 2.22 roadmap
http://live.gnome.org/RoadMap">http://live.gnome.org/RoadMap
juntti - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
Personally, in my opinion, the release of KDE 4 is so important that it deserves to be included. Therefore, wait until Ubuntu/Kubuntu 8.04 is out.MadBoris - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
Maybe you can title it -Linux: The many distro's that killed the penguin. Or maybe
Linux: The penguin that steps on it's own foot.
hehe, yeah too controversial I know. ;)
I'm hardly a Linux guy and I don't dislike it, I just wish it could get out of it's own way. IMO too many distro's is what kills Linux from being a real competitor for common daily use and keeps mainstream from supporting it. People and their little personal preferences are keeping any one distro from rising and getting the full united support and full united backing. If people would stop messing around with umpteen different projects and distro's, maybe Linux would be much more refined and competitive in the desktop space having full commercial support.
It's open source stepping on it's own foot.
You are not going to get manufacturers, driver writers, software developers, etc. to QA and support multiple distro's to accomodate people's silly little techie preferences.
Everyone wants their own little distro and everyone wonders why Linux doesn't get supported. Maybe people don't wonder, cause it does seem kind of obvious. I'm sure some people would prefer Linux being some hidden black art, but it's unfortunate that it doesn't get the desktop support that it could realize if people would get unified behind a single project.
After all these years of hoping Linux would move to the forefront, it is still hardly something I would try and teach my wife to use for day to day, I wouldn't subject her to it. It's kind of a shame, because Windows needs some good competition and I don't like Apple's proprietary stifling nature, even though they do it well.
wetwareinterface - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
what i'd realy like to see is something different.every damn review site on the planet has already done a xx days with yyyyy distro article. do something new.
install around 4 different distros on seperate partitions and do some daily repetitve tasks on one distro then the next day do those same tasks on the next distro. then report on what you liked/disliked about the different distros and how linux is compared to windows or osx.
i am frankly sick of ubuntu reviews as if it's the only desktop distro out there. try ubuntu if you want but include fedora and suse and maybe even kubuntu or even xubuntu for low end/older systems.
Black Imp - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I'd prefer to wait for the new release even thou I'm not interested in linux precompiled distributions that much. One of the most interesting linux features to me it's the chance to compile kernel and sw onto the target machine. This can improve performance and be an added value compared to windows. Otherwise I wouldn't feel so enthusiast to prefer linux to windows expecially for what concerning gui behaviour. Linux's tweakability and free tools for programming are to me the most interesting things so my dreams would be a distribution like Gentoo with some more intuitive (and working!) and logical procedure for installing SO manually that could be done via my netgear wifi card. What I can't stand of that distribution is you have to learn by heart the content of modules and there's not a clear list of them and what they are for. When you have hw that's not recognized during intalling you always have to ask some other to tell you what the hell of module, following no arguable stardard naming system, you have manually to load.Sorry for the offtopic, I hope it can be of some interest.
rbsrao79 - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
A few years ago, anandtech did a review of an asus board call a8n-vm-csm. The review was in my opinion fairly complimentary. However, when I bought the board I found to my dismay that linux support for the board (which had integrated hardware) was very little.The acpi hardware on the board was broken (bad dsdt tables), the nvidia integrated graphics chipset did not have proper support from nvidia (only specific drivers worked). A recompile was needed everytime the kernel was upgraded. Most distros at that time were failing to initialize the sata drivers. Essentially there was whole host of problems which I over time resolved with the help of the community.
I would like to see every non-gamer's motherboard (gaming motherboards would probably just be used for windows) to have a standard set of linux compatibility tests run against them.
Admittedly, I should have done my research a lot more before buying that board. Expecting integrated chipsets to work out of the box was a stupid expectation on my part.
rbsrao79 - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I find that in most cases, depending on selection, hardware features are broadly supported, but there subtle nuances with which linux distros give problems. This is more exacerbated in notebooks. This would be an area that I would like the review to focus (assuming the review is for desktop/mobile distributions)1. Support for Extended desktops (multi-monitor setups) . Switching between, cloning, extended desktop and resolution handling (per screen) without having to restart X.
2. wifi support - Detection of networks, sorting on strength, switching to closest network. Support for turning off wifi to save battery (using a hardware or software switch)
3. acpi support (comparison of battery life between operating systems when the hardware idles). Access and ease of use of hibernation feature.
4. Volume controls (Can application volumes be controlled individually)
5. bluetooth support : (what exactly does that entails? supporting applications if any).
hurtstotalktoyou - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I have to agree that you guys should wait for the review. April isn't that far away. If 8.04 were just another basic release, I'd be tempted to recommend doing the review right now, but since 8.04 is long-term support release, and thus will be a viable option not just for six months thereafter but several years, I think waiting is by far the best option.Kevin Day - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I would like to see the review include aspects of using a linux desktop in the enterprise. Supportability, Asset Management, Deployment, audit and client health monitoring, etc. Migrating a home user from Windows to Linux is one thing. Migrating 190K clients in diverse geographic locations is another.MatrixVPR - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
Do it now with a mature/sound version rather than one that's new and has potential bugs that could have an adverse affect on your experience. You can then update your experience with the newer version and you'll have the opportunity to compare and contrast. I myself just threw together a Linux system that I use as second computer conjunction with my “Super Vista Rig”. It has all the pizzazz of Vista with the ability to run smoothly on a SFF 2.26 Northwood and 512 RAM!incognito9 - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
Some tips on a good review:DON'T compare different distributions. Everyone has their favorite (mine is currently openSuse) But if you want to do a "state of linux on the desktop" review then pick ONE distro and really put it through it's paces. A comparison of different distros is good idea for a separate article.
Similarly:
DON'T get into the KDE vs Gnome debate. Pick one desktop and stick with it. KDE vs Gnome is an age-old argument that you're not going to decide. A comparison of all the different desktop environments for linux, including Enlightenment 17 (which is pretty if a little buggy) would be a great idea-- again for a separate article.
DO
Get to know basic programs that come with the distro you go with, including doing presentations, spreadsheet work, document editing, programming...
DO
check out other "consumer" type apps-- video and music stuff, especially.
DO
Try out some of the great games available for linux. My kids love super tux and super tux kart!
DO
try to install it on different machines. Not all hardware is supported equally. nvidia cards are generally less buggy than ati ones. And some wireless chips work out of the box and others need you to hunt for firmware or supply a windows driver, which is awkward and cumbersome to say the least.
DO
install linux on, at least, a laptop. try to note any battery life and power management issues you have.
DO
take everything i've just typed with a grain of salt. Your mileage may vary.
VeyronMick - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I'd recommend going for it now.There are minimal changes between releases, most of the time they are cosmetic.
If you wanted to do a review on KDE4 the sure wait, but for the GNOME based Ubuntu there are minimal changes between versions.
Our company has 5k+ Linux workstations and we use a mixture of RHEL3/4, and we also support Ubuntu and Linux Mint for some of the advanced users.
Having a large Solaris community the move to Linux was painless for us and I've installed it for some of my family and they are reasonably happy with it.
Have fun with the trial, should be an interesting experience
R3MF - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
opensuse is a very popular distro with quality desktops for both KDE and Gnome, and it has a pretty recent release out and about.it is commercially backed
it has long-term update support
it has a commercially supported version Suse Enterprise Desktop
it is ace
SanLouBlues - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I'd like to see you guys try out a few hdtv tuner cards (or see if you can get an hdhomerun from silicondust). Beyond that, try out beryl/compiz and compare it to the fancy stuff that Vista does.najames - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I'd look at Mint Daryna 4.0 32bit and Ubuntu Hardy Heron Alpha 64bit, since Hardy is a long term release.Mint Daryna is based on Ubuntu Gutsy 32bit, but with very nice desktop and themes, but also other subtile differences. Their menu is "different", but I like it now after getting used to it. Mint is our everyday OS now. Samba took about 3 clicks to set up in Mint, very nice. This is as close to Windows as I've seen. The only hard Mint problem I had was setting up 2 HP w2207 monitors in 1680x1050 with dual Big Desktop working on a TA690G board using onboard graphics, requires the latest ATI drivers, not from Ubuntu repos or Envy. I did use Envy to remove drivers though.
I have run Ubuntu 64bit since Warty I think. It seems like Hardy 8.04(?) would be the way to go. It is on Alpha 4 and I'd bet it is fairly stable by now. If you get stuff to work, don't update it during testing. I'll be testing it soon, after I find out why my old soft RAID has went spastic in 64bit Dapper 6.06. Comparing the 64bit and 32bit versions would be good. I know there are a few 64bit issues to hurdle (Java), but it should not be too bad to do if you use the Ubuntu Guides.
JinxterX - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
[QUOTE]One of the things we have been wanting to do for some time now is to do a proper review of Linux as an end-user operating system. We have done articles on Linux in the past relating to performance, but never a complete OS review.[/QUOTE]Good idea, but can you at least point out the fact that "Linux" is NOT an Operating System, it is merely a kernel and that it's useless without the GNU userland. It would be technically correct to stress that important distinction in any article, in my opinion.
No I'm not a FSF fanboy but it is pretty annoying constantly seeing the word "Linux" being used in the wrong context.
nukedathlonman - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I think any artical at this point on Linux, regardless of distro is needed. The very last artical on Linux on Anandtech dates back to only July 1/2005, and I'd be interested in any artical published.TheRealFink - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
Compare Linux Distros (3 or 4) for:o Desktop
o Server
o Multimedia/HTPC use
I personally would like to see more tech related Software reviews. For example, NAS comparisons:
o FreeNAS
o Openfiler
o NASLite
KazenoKoe - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I've been using Ubuntu Linux exclusively for about a year now. For the first few months I wanted to return to Windows, not because of any merits Windows might have, but simply because of familiarity. Now I can't imagine returning to Windows.The biggest problems Linux has are due to hardware and software vendors who simply don't support the OS. When reviewing Ubuntu, keep this in mind and imagine trying to use a piece of hardware on Windows if they didn't provide drivers, or using software on Windows if they didn't provide Windows binaries.
MadBoris - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
Would you wait to review Vista until it's service pack?It's not like the distro came out 6 months ago and this is the first patch. The thing has been floating around for years, review what the climate of linux is today, not 3 months from now, not 6 months from now.
I'll bet you a bag of chips Linux 6 months from now will still show all the same major problems it has shown for the last 5 years in preventing it from being easily adopted as a primary desktop OS by normal computer users. Waiting makes no sense.
MadBoris - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
Another thing, people are using it today, it's available today. If I want to start using it in March I need a review now.The very need for a question like this already seems to indicate the unnecessary over complexity, and lack of simplicity, of the Linux OS. ;)
FelixO - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
The point is that since the review is not going to be published for 6-8 weeks (if Ryan starts soon) then when people are actually reading it a new version of Ubuntu will be about 3 weeks away.
The "need for a question like this" comes from the extremely rapid rate of development and improvement of the Linux desktop.
spazzytazz111 - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I would like to see it sooner than later. I doubt there will be any significant changes in the next upgrade, so sooner would be better. As a side note, I would like to see some windows based gaming results/comparison (using both the free and paid versions of wine) on ubuntu vs. windows xp.Pyrii - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I'd like to finally see a review where they show user-friendliness (AKA,none) and ease of use for people who don't understand the terminology (AKA, still none). Also the difference between linux types and the reason why there's 20 binaries to select from for any piece of software, and how to figure it all out.Hmm, that's more like a guide. But a review of linux for the non-linux savvy would be interesting.
hands - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
You're going to get plenty of comments about how you should try one distro or another. Some people will say that those kinds of comments are should be ignored, and that's sort of true. Very few people new to Linux have the time or motivation to try several different distros. However, each distro has different strengths and weaknesses even though each is Linux. So, even though you should indicate that your evaluation is of Linux in the title, the first paragraph (or two) should clarify the fact that a different distro might present a very different experience from the one evaluated.Due to its popularity (and therefore community support), Ubuntu is a good candidate, arguably the best, for this kind of review. However, after several attempts at using it, I wouldn't recommend it for anyone other than my mother for long term use. It simply lacks a lot of polish in my opinion. So, it never lasts long on one of my computers. I think that openSUSE is far more polished, but it can feel sluggish at times if you don't have the latest hardware. So, there are tradeoffs, but Fedora and Mandriva are also viable options. Xandros used to be a decent recommendation for Windows converts because their file browser was built to work well with Windows and provide a similar experience, but it has kind of been a joke lately (along with Linspire). Other distros are more suited either for more experienced Linux users or very inexperienced computer users.
With respect to which version of Ubuntu should be used if you're committed to that, I would recommend 8.04. More importantly, I would recommend waiting not only until 8.04 has been released, but wait until 8.04 has been out for about a month. There may not be much difference during that month, but I've found that Linux distros are often very good about ironing out serious issues in a very short time if any show up. Additionally, the approach to an Ubuntu LTS release (8.04) is much more like a commercial OS release than their other releases. Though, I still preferred other distros to their last LTS release (6.06).
There are lots of opinions about GNOME vs KDE. Ubuntu's strength is GNOME. So, if you're looking at Ubuntu, that's the desktop that will likely come out the best. I personally prefer KDE to GNOME, but whenever I've used Ubuntu, I've chosen GNOME over KDE due to failings in Kubuntu.
KDE 4 looks very promising, but I certainly wouldn't recommend trying it until KDE 4.1 is released. KDE 4.0 isn't really meant for use by anyone other than developers, or at the very least, experienced users.
arcturion - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
is ubuntu considered the best in end user experience and in user friendliness? i have only used it on a ps3 and i wont comment.you should probably look at what most people use their pc's for.
mine is very simple, web browsing, downloading , skype, bittorrent and the ability to watch all those torrents be it xvid divx MKV etc in the best quality. can you get ffdshow for linux? a quality h264/avc decoder supporting dual core? - i am using powerdvds filter.
then theres dvd and hddvd. i cant see anything besting xp in the ease of use and quality of media or the simplicity in installing new drivers. i am not interested in media centre features like tv tuners or epg
efc321 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
If you are going to use Ubuntu then please make the title Ubuntu Linux review. Saying that Ubuntu represents Linux is like saying that Windows XP is Windows. I can hear the flamers now for what I am about to say. Please before you write about Ubuntu or as you are writing about Ubuntu write a companion artical by a differnt author on a couple of other Linux distros and how they differ from Ubntu. Ubuntu is not allways the best choice or best working desktop Linux. Ubuntu may not load on your particular computer at all. So a new person will try the live disk and it dose not work. So they say all Linux is bad and dose not work or too hard. So again a companion artical on two other flavors of linux, the differnce between KDE and Gnome and how to find other distros. Buy the way my choice for the other two distros for a fast look at are PClinuxOS (#1 on distrowatch) and Open SUSE (#3 on Distrowatch). Ubuntu is #2.Now on to your real question. When to start. NOW. Linux like all things computers. It never stands still. Just pick the best equipment at your price point and jump in. Upgrading your computer or operating system is a on going process if you wish to be current. So writing the artical during an upgrade period is perfect.
The idea of a main stream site posting articals about Linux is great. Just don't forget dual booting for Windows games
and that Ubuntu is not the only Linux in town.
Ryan Smith - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Don't worry, we'll make sure that it's clear that it's an Ubuntu review.4Linux - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I have used Linux on and off for awhile. Whenever I need to get a project done I return to a flavor of windows to "just get it done".Show me that I'm wrong and linux can be used for all things needed.
Thanks
rossmcdonald - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I think a version bridging article would be good too.What I would really be interested to see in this article is more info on.
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3108">http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3108
Maybe some information on multiple monitor support too (non clone view). Its possible just not easy. I'm sure most of us use extended desktops on our Windows installations.
malrost - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I recommend you do it ASAP.A novice user such as yourself won't be able to provide much valuable insight into how the next Ubuntu version compares with the current version. No offense meant; the differences are subtle and take some familiarity to recognize.
I suspect that most of the issues you will have will be very similar to those encountered by any other new Ubuntu user for the last several versions.
Just make sure you identify clearly identify the version in the review, and your knowledge that by the time we see it the next one will already be available. If your review came out 3 or more months after a more recent version was released, than it would cross the line of being uselessly out-of-date.
nubie - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I don't really mind if you do it now, or later. Except for one thing: Multi-user support. Apparently the latest version (8.04) is going to be "long-support", for three years only bugfixes will be made. But the best part is support for multiple users (simultaneous and independent, with their own desktop and keyboard/mouse), with only a configuration file modification.Let's face it, PC's nowadays are hard to fully use: Quad Cores, Dual output video cards, TWO dual output video cards. USB has had the ability to put 100's of keyboards and mice on a single PC for at least 10 years. Now you can share a PC (even a used one), between 2 or 3 people who just want to browse the web or do some word processing, even play some simple games.
http://netpatia.blogspot.com/2008/01/coming-soon-m...">http://netpatia.blogspot.com/2008/01/coming-soon-m...
Even if you only review the current Ubuntu, at least use the experience garnered to attempt a review on multi-user systems. It seems that all of the attention is focused on the acquisition of more computing power, not logical distribution of the power.
Microsoft is not going to embrace multi-person PC's anytime soon (and certainly not without a $xx or more charge per head), so alternative Operating systems are needed. Many OEMs, such as ASUS are realizing this, the Eeepc and some of their High-end boards come with Linux embedded (ostensibly to "browse the web in 5 seconds", but they aren't fooling anyone, MS can't do it. How long until we see MS hyping a "new paradigm of web usefulness" and trying to offer a lame version of this feature?)
Cali3350 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I would personally LOVE a article about upgrading linux. As a long term windows user im well aware of what happens when you 'upgrade' windows - xp, to vista without just doing a full reformat. Its not pretty. Im VERY interested to see how this works on the Ubuntu OS.Also, id personally love it if you take into account some of the 'special' things linux can do. In particular use the compiz-settings-manager and play with all the advanced effects Ubuntu offers (mulitple desktops / a application switcher similar but better to vista's fly out thing, etc). I think these are the things that really make Ubuntu shine. Simply using the default install style may be what many users use, but its hardly representative of what the OS really offers.
Kishkumen - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
For whatever it's worth, my opinion is that you should begin testing whenever you're prepared to spend the time on it. Ubuntu's release cycle should be comletely irrelevant to your schedule. For starters, the next release is unlikely to be so radically different as to change one's experience significantly and if a new release does come, treat it just like any other update or service pack one might get from Microsoft or Apple because on a six month cycle it's more of a bug fix update than an entire paradigm shift.Treripica - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I think it'd be better to leave the word linux out of the title, since it really is a review of Ubuntu, and not linux as a whole.What I would like to see is a first time user review that shows what it is about the OS that is attractive to the newcomer. More importantly, I'd like to know what such a user feels is missing, confusing, or downright frustrating. There are enough convert articles out there today and I think Ubuntu is ready to undergo the same critical eye as the more mature OS's.
As far as waiting for the next release or not, I think it'd make little to no difference.
Actius - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Why not emphasize a little on the "switch to" factor that a newb can appreciate. I mean, everyone that plays with a copy of linux knows a bit about it, and I'm guessing everyone who's posted here so far knows more about linux than the average person.As a kid who grew up with dos, then windows(from the first installment to 3.1 to 95 to xp and now vista) and has never touched linux, please include something that can grab my attention. It seems everyone who pushes linux as superior hasn't given a reason the average user should switch. Looking at perhaps the best windows platform, XP was easy to use, fun to look at, and worked better than the current platform, so maybe that should be a hyp. benchmark.
ekul - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
With windows problems will crop up a month from now you didn't have last week but with linux this doesn't really happen.For good test of linux you should first determine the distro to test by trying to setup a few different ones on your test platform. fedora, suse and ubuntu are the kings of the desktop and while others are being mentioned in this discussion the are quite niche are are not nearly as flexible as the big name distros.
There are some common linux stumble blocks the install test should cover:
1) wireless cards. try testing both a supported card like an intel chipset and something that needs ndiswrapper
2) 3-d graphics: nvidia closed sourced drivers tend to be good but the nvidia installer is stupid and not very friendly. How well does each distro handle hiding this fact from users? ATI closed source drivers are a pain even in the best of distros but can they be made to work?
3) proprietary codec support: most distros ship without codecs that get them into DMCA trouble. how much fuss is it to activate this support if you A) don't like in the US and therefore are not bound by their laws or B) don't care and just want to listen to mp3s and watch dvds
4) scanner and printer support
5) software that is equal to or better then its Windows counterpart is available for linux. how clear does the distro make instant messaging, media players, productivity tools and other common applications that may be named differently then windows users may be expecting?
Any distro that can handle these 5 things with a minimum of fuss is worth testing long term.
I see this as a 2 part article. Part 1 would be choosing the distro that is right for you. Some distros do different things from this list with varying degrees of success and so fedora might be right for someone interested in switching to linux at work and doesn't care about 3d and mp3 support whereas ubuntu sets 98% up out of the box and therefore makes more sense at home. Part 2 picks the general most user friendly distro and digs deeper to see what good and bad traits it has for the long haul.
As for the question of 7.10 vs 8.04 I would suggest comparing them side-by-side makes a lot of sense. How much improvement can ubuntu make in just 6 months? What problems have they fixed and how many remain? With a 6 month release schedule any article written even at the release of Heron will be out of date by the fall and so seeing the rate of change in ubuntu is much more meaningful then a snapshot of it at any given point. To that end testing the various alpha and beta releases may even be worthwhile.
shamgar03 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I would actually rather see a review of suse. I had a friend at work who swore by it. I think SUSE is probably the most likely to replace windows for "regular" people. Of course ubuntu is nice too, but from my experience it is great until something doesn't work. Once something doesn't work, it can be maddening to fix. Perhaps it would be good to have a couple guys there use 2 or 3 linux distros simultaneously, then compare your experiences afterwords. I would really like to know which linux distro would be best for my parents.wingless - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Installing drivers on different distros of Linux has always been a challenge for me. I'm a perpetual Linux noob because I lose patience spending hours online searching forums and guides just to install Nvidia, ATI, or Creative drivers PRORPERLY. My last bout was with my 2900XT and Mandrake Linux which apparently has some "special" driver version just for it's distro. I switched to SuSE and had more success but still had installation errors that caused problems. Nvidia made it easier but I still spent time hunting lines in config files that needed editing. Also upgrading Linux has sometimes been a hassle too. If this site did a write up about using Linux and getting it to work with a few common hardware brands then it would be extremely useful. Basic use conditions like using the 3D desktop, watching videos (avi, h.264, etc...), listening to music, word processing, and 3D gaming with common hardware would be useful things to write about.anachreon - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Personally, I think you should just wait for the April release, but that's just me. Every release gets better and better; more recent reviews are nearly always more favorable than ones done in the past. Since I'm an Ubuntu lover, I naturally want you to review the latest and best. :)nubian1 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
While to some extent I understand why Ubuntu has been chosen it has been my experience with setting up Linux for newbies & experimenting Windows users that Linux Mint (In the top 5 on Distrowatch), an Ubuntu derivative, is a better choice.While still Ubuntu with all it's advantages, Mint offers up a more complete initial experience with it's inclusion of all the popular audio & video codecs pre-installed.
Twice I performed an extended (4-9 months) "experiment" where I installed Linux on a Windows user's PC and pretty much left them to their own devices judging their experiences by their cries for help.
With both PCLinuxOS 2007 & Linux Mint the calls just didn't happen! The only calls I received was when one person asked me if their Digital camera would be recognized before even trying it. After I urged that person to just plug it in it worked great & I never got another call about their linux (PCLinuxOS) box.
My latest "experiments" have used Suse 10.3, Pardus Linux (Great distro!) and now Linux Mint. Mint has been a joy to use for the Linux newbies whose pc I have installed it on.
In short while I understand the desire to use Vanilla Ubuntu, IMHO Mint will probably lead to, at least initially, a more positive experience since it includes all of Ubuntu's positives while adding some welcome enhancements.
LinuxUser73 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I'd second the opinion that LinuxMint would be a better choice than Ubuntu. It has everything good about Ubuntu but it really does add alot of additional and welcome features that make it easier for a user new to Linux to use. It is gnome based but the way that it functions, on the surface anyway, is a bit more like KDE. SUSE has a similar "start" menu as well. I think that this helps those more accustomed to Windows adjust and actually bedin to use the OS instead of having to get over the GUI change and then learn the OS.just my opinion though.
Kougar - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
If measuring Ubuntu, then please be sure to include the ease of which common tasks can be done. With the exception of Linux Mint (Based off of Ubuntu) I don't know of any Linux distros that play mp3s and wma files "out of the box", let alone can play Half Life 2, IE, and other XP programs via Wine-Doors as easily as Linux Mint.PC Mech has a great deal of coverage on Linux Mint due to their successes with the distro.
kac77 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Right now Ubuntu is at version 7.10. A lot of things were added in this version. It is not a LTS version which means some features are not 100%. While I doubt compiz-fusion will be rewritten in time for the upcoming version it most definitely will include GIT version updates which will most likely be more feature rich and more stable.In addition 8.04 will include some significant changes to security as well as a new standard sound daemon (Pulse Audio) which will allow for individualized sound settings for each application. For it being a LTS version I'm actually surprised at just how many changes and/or additions they are making within this version (8.04).
So my two cents are for you to wait or if you decide to review the current version have a keen understanding that the current version is more of a vehicle for new ideas and features with stability being the focus with the later version.
As for KDE or using other distributions, I wouldn't recommend it as KDE 4.0 was just released, which is not feature complete either and further away from being what I could stable. Most other distributions I feel for average desktop users can be a little bit more complicated than Ubuntu.
Otherwise your choice of using Ubuntu is a good one. I currently use it and find it a joy.
R3MF - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Below is a good example of popular end-user distro's:2008-06-19 - opensuse 11.0 (KDE/Gnome)
2008-04-29 - Fedora 9 (Gnome)
2008-04-24 - Ubuntu 8.04 (Gnome)
2008-04-02 - Mandriva 2008.1 (KDE)
2008-03-10 - Sabayon 3.5 (KDE) speculative date
2008-02-27 - Dreamlinux 3.0 (xFce) Mac0S look-n-feel
If you went for late March you could get Dreamlinux and the old versions of Ubuntu, Opensuse, and Fedora.
If you go for late May you can add the most recent versions of Mandriva, Ubuntu, and Fedora.
If you went for late July there is a very good chance you could get opensuse 11.0 with the first implementation of a KDE 4.1 desktop. KDE 4.0.x doesn't really count.
Personally, I would like to see you include opensuse 11.0 with a KDE 4.1 desktop, but i realise this may not fit well in your schedule.
regards
Vtan - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I don't know if you have reviewed a MS based OS before but I want you to think about it as if you have. When you review an OS, what do you review and test?If you were to review Windows 7, how would you approach it? Will you test MS Office? Will you test apps in various fields or just the most common things that everyone is interested in?
Will you test connectivity? Gaming performance etc?
Whatever it is that you might want to do when reviewing a MS based OS, take the same ideas over to Linux - whether it be Ubuntu, Debian or whatever. Note that I say ideas, not exact apps to test. That way you are creating a proper perspective on which to evaluate an OS.
Where there are glaring differences that such a process doesn't quite illustrate, feel free to vary and explain why.
Decide on a suite of ideas first. Then evaluate.
alantay - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I think that for reviewing purposes it makes no difference whether the release has Long Term Support or not. The experience of a new user will be the same with both versions (given that the hardware is not only supported by the newer version), so I don't see any reason for waiting for the next release.I would recommend using rather standard intel-based hardware. I think that hardware incompatibilities would just spoil the review. Given that MAC OSX only runs on Apple hardware and that ALL hardware manufacturers support Windows, it seems unfair to run Linux in not supported hardware and then complain about incompatibilities.
Looking forward to it :-)
DonB - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
As much as Ubuntu is probably one of the better Linux Desktop OS's out of the box it fails in one major area. “Commercial support” What I mean is many corporate products, such as SSL VPN Clients, Eng tools (Synplicity, Modelsim, MatLab, etc...) and many other "over the counter" tools are designed to run on RedHat EL4 (and many variants there of). Though most of these tools can be made to run on Ubuntu, this is not for "Newbie's".This coupled with the number of Distro's, X desktop environments, x86 vs. x86_64 simply makes Linux too thin to be a viable desktop platform for most - if not all - newbie's!
The MAC with a month was well received because people with accept the "pain" of OS X because their MAC makes a lifestyle statement.
However, I highly doubt that a generic x86 laptop loaded with Linux that suddenly refuses to surf at your favorite Starbacks make the same "Life Style" statement...
LemonJoose - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I would like to see the Ubuntu review, since I toyed around with Mandrake about 5 years ago, but concluded that Linux wasn't really ready enough for me to want to use it on a regular basis.I think it would be great if you also did a review focusing on the 64-bit version of Vista particularly with regards to gaming compatibility and performance. SP! is done and will be available in the next few weeks and I bet there are a lot of people who have held back for the release of SP1. I am planning to build a new rig in the next month or so, and because of the memory limitation with 32-bit Vista I though I would go with 64-bit instead, but I am unsure about what the drawbacks (if any) might be.
Ryan Smith - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Look for a SP1 article next week.bongobear - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Well for other Linux distros I'd like to stick my vote in for PCLinuxos as it is seems a whole lot easier to get up and running compared to Ubuntu.Might be nice to get an opinion on VMware (you can download a free version) from you too for running Windows within Linux.
Karl
PenGun - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
I dunno it's too easy. Why not try for a more revealing and tougher test.Get Slack.
The install is lightning and you'll be up in KDE, if you so chose, in a very short time. The only hard part is creating and assigning partitions. The curses installer aint pretty but it does the job. Just say yes a bunch and select "install everything".
dvijaydev46 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I think wt will be good to wait till the next revision is released so that the new OS can be reviewed properly. But why can't we have a small story on the current version?NoToRiOuS1 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I'd say go for the 8.04. It the one thats going to be supported for the longest. It's the newest OS. Many people who are interested might have already tried the current version of Ubuntu at some point or another so it doesn't seem AS useful to cover the current version. Might as well cover a new OS when it comes out.I think no matter what, the article you write up about this will be very helpful but I think you'd be doing the Linux community better justice if you wrote an article on an OS that is the fresh on the scene.
MrJim - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
It pains my soul the state of video editing capabilities in Ubuntu/Linux. I still need either a OSX/Final Cut Pro or Windows/Avid for serious editing. Why oh why cant Apple license Final Cut Pro to linux (that would be the day).Good luck with the review, i would put my vote for 8.04 being LTS and all that.
sprockkets - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
"I refer you to the Airline and toaster jokes, I mayhave missed some of the finer points/details of the
jokes but essentially they are:
a)MS Windows Airlines:
The flight is very expensive, but the checkin desk is
fabulous and glitzy, everyone makes you feel great,
the baggage checkin is painless, there is no queueing,
you get straight on the plane. The plane taxes down
the run way and takes off, no problems at all, then
suddenly 10 minutes into the flight the plane explodes
with no warning and for no apparent reason and
everyone is dead.
b)Unix/Linux Airlines:
Everyone turns up at the airport and brings piece an
aeroplane with them, they all sit around on the tarmac
and argue about what the plane should do and look
like, eventually they manage to build 5 or six
different planes, they call them all the same name,
but they do fly and the customers all *believed* they
got to their destinations.
c)MAC Airlines
The customers arrive at the airport, checkin desk is
very funky and modern in its design, with wacky curves
and great colour schemes - a designers dream. The
customers get on the plane which simply taxes up and
down for hours on the runway without actually going
anywhere. Having never experienced a proper
airline/aeroplane trip, the MAC users think this is
all there is to air travel and remain blissfully happy
and blissfully unaware of the fact they are going
nowhere.
Or perhaps the toaster Joke:
a)Windows toaster:
The windows toaster looks great, but sometime it just
won't make toast, it either comes out burnt or raw,
you have to unplug the toaster and plug it back in
again, each time you want to try and make some toast.
For every loaf of bread you buy you are forced to buy
a new toaster to go with it.
b)Linux toaster.
The linux toaster looks awful, it has wires crimped
together hanging out of it, the first time you make
toast with it it burns it, the next time its raw, you
read the man pages and invoke the command line, toast
-verbose -breadsize 50132 -eject -o z3321 > /dev/toast
| more and it makes perfect toast ever after.
c)MAC toaster
The MAC toaster has no settings or controls, it looks
very stylish, but will only accept proprietry size
bread which can only be bought from Apple main dealers
at 10 times the price of regular bread. The toast is
fine except that the size of the bread is so odd, you
can't actually eat the toast it produces, although it
does look good."
qnetjoe - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I think it is an awesome idea, just be careful about starting a few flame wars. You have the easy ones, like KDE vs Gnome, but what about one like email clients (kontact vs evolution), media players (amarok vs banshee vs exaile) office suits (openoffice vs koffice) IDEs (xemacs vs kdevelop vs eclipse)Even in the Gnome vs KDE are you going to include both kde 4 and KDE 3.5.
I really like the idea just it would take you a good amount of time just for completeness.
Good Luck, May the source be with you...
kevincpbl - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I've been using Ubuntu for years, and its great, but new users are definitely much much better off to jump in when the latest release is an LTS release.The version of Ubuntu coming out in April isn't just another every 6 month update, it is the culmination of the last 2 years of development in Ubuntu. But more than that, it has much more of a focus on stability, and compatibility. LTS releases undergo much more rigorous bug testing, and are what most would like to see compared to the other big 2 OS's.
Ubuntu 8.04 does not have much different from 7.10, but that is what makes it different. It takes what was created for 7.10, and cleans it up, tweaks it, and makes it more stable. There are a lot of important changes that users won't see going into 8.04, and it is worth the wait.
Finally, if you're going to do this right, please choose a system based on what is supported well in Linux, specifically Ubuntu. The last thing anyone wants to hear is a long-winded complaint piece about the state of hardware support in Linux. The truth is, with popularity will come hardware support, and all anyone can do for now is support the hardware vendors that support Linux.
(ie, Intel everything, especially wireless card-wise :)
Ryan Smith - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
The hardware will be similar to our usual test beds; an Intel processor, a P35 mobo, and a recent ATI/NVIDIA video card, there won't be anything exotic. This should be pretty plain and I would hope something that can be installed without an issue.sht - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Well, ATI and NVIDIA video cards are kind of exotic hardware in Linux land. Not that it doesn't work for basic 2D or even you cannot have good 3D, but Intel is the only graphics vendor that properly support Linux. Their support is very good though and definitely on par with what you'd expect for a video card for Windows or Mac OS X.And I don't think in any way that it is unfair in this comparison to require certain hardware, after all you cannot run Mac OS X on almost any hardware at all. You should really look at it the other way around that Linux just happen to work with more hardware out of the box than any other OS, but on a best effort basis. That is fair compared to Mac OS X at least, a Windows only comparison is arguably a different story.
The only thing required of the selection of hardware to be fair, is that it is easy to do up front, like in "buy a notebook with Intel graphics and wireless". That is about as easy as "buy a Mac from Apple if you want to run Mac OS X".
And just jump into it right away, then we'll be able to hear about your upgrade experience as well. I'm sure it will be painless - imaging all the readers cloning your setup and ironing out issues in order to ensure a good review :)
MooseMuffin - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
This was true a year or two ago, but not anymore. Ubuntu will install official nvidia and ati drivers though its restricted driver dialog and you'll have full 2d/3d acceleration. However I should say the newer 8800s (gt, 512 gts) aren't currently supported with the included driver.sht - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
It isn't about full 2D and 3D acceleration, it is about not being able to suspend and hibernate and about vendors that listen to the issues their customers might have. It is all but true today.MooseMuffin - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
Yes, Intel is the only one who fully supports and provides open source drivers to the linux community. Yes, because of this it is much more likely that all of the features of your intel graphics will work properly out of the box.Even so, none of that really matters if you need real 3d performance because Intel's parts simply don't offer enough. I've played Half Life 2, Portal and WoW on this linux installation at 1680x1050 with all the options on, and Intel's parts simply aren't an option for anyone with similar goals. Recommending only intel graphics on linux is really putting a limitation on what you can achieve.
Goty - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
It's great that you want to contribute to the discussion, but actually KNOWING about the subject you're trying to discuss is usually a good idea. I have two separate systems running two separate distributions, one with an ATI card and one with an NVIDIA card (and not old cards, either, an X1900XT and an 8400M) and I don't have any problems bringing either system out of suspend or hibernate (granted the desktop system is put into those states less often than the laptop).sht - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
So you define *knowing* as having two data points out of, say a million? Would there be the slightest chance that others than you had the problem? Let us see what we can find in 10 minutes with Google.Aah, a thread[1] on ubuntuforums.org that shows up on the first page with search results when searching for "suspend linux ati":
"i usually have issues with ati, although the x1500 i'm using on this pc is working ok, but a dell laptop with an ati card keeps losing emerald"
"The only problem I've had is not being able to suspend or hibernate on my laptop." (seconded by another poster)
"The hibernate/suspend thing can be annoying, but only if you use those features often"
Nvidia gets good comments in that thread, but there are several issues reported this week alone on the unofficial forum for NVIDIA Linux [2].
[3]: "Suspend to RAM: Blank screen on second attempt"
[4]: "Default DualHead : one monitor goes blank w/FC3 and FX5700 - 169.xx"
Now, this is not to say that Nvidia and ATI cards don't work at all with suspend or whatever feature. If that is what you are trying to get at, you missed what my first post was about, which was "Intel is the only graphics vendor that properly support Linux."
And to be perfectly clear, it is as much or little about suspend and resume that it is about 2d or 3d acceleration, it is about having a vendor that properly supports Linux.
[1] http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=623880">http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=623880
[2] http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f...">http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f...
[3] http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1...">http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1...
[4] http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1...">http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1...
Ryan Smith - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Speaking of Mac hardware support (and funny enough), the box that we'll be running this on is working right now as a Hackintosh. I'll have a small blog up about that next week, but it was a surprisingly easy process and the range of hardware support was greater than I was expecting.Calin - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
You might have better luck with a mainboard with Intel integrated video than with the usual test boards. The lower price of admission into this might help.As for performance benchmarks, I'm not sure I require them - they will be nice, certainly
Bruneauinfo - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I say get crackin.Just please take hardware into consideration. You may have one system that Ubuntu installs on flawlessly, another system that will require expert assistance, and then another that will just not work until a driver is developed (if ever). For example, X-Fi cards from Creative will probably never function correctly on Ubuntu. However, a Dell laptop with Ubuntu preinstalled should work out of the box.
Point being a premise must be arrived at first. Are you an average Joe who decides to download Ubuntu because it looks cool. If so you could run into a lot of driver related problems. On the other hand, if you're at least savy enough to read up and ask around first, you'll probably hear that hardware must be taken into consideration - in which case you'll check and make sure your devices will work okay with Ubuntu first before wasting your time. Then there's the 'I'm giving up on non-free OSs!!' in which case you'll study up on compatible hardware first and build a system that is 100% Ubuntu compatible - or buy a complete system with Ubuntu already installed and ready to go.
paulpod - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Linux people swear their OS is better in every way yet you never see video benchmarks. Vista is no good at video support since they ruined the DirectShow system so I'd like to find an alternative when XP can not longer be supported.Please determine whether hardware accelerated HD video is possible on Linux. This means accelerated decode and deinterlace/scaling. If they are possible, an HQV benchmark should be performed against something like Avivo in XP on a 38xx card. Besides quality, look at CPU utilization and resistance to frame skipping when performing other operations.
Also test whether the AMD Linux driver has all of the Avivo TheaterMode multi display functions. And, for Pete's sake, test HD tuner cards and Blu-ray playback!
If these functions are not available in Linux, that fact must not be overlooked in an objective OS review.
mlau - Sunday, February 10, 2008 - link
"Linux people swear their OS is better in every way": depends on thepeople you're talking to. If you want games, then by all means stick
with windows. No other OS currently has better drivers and infrastructure to run games. If you want something thats configurable to your hearts content, then the free/open OSs are best choice.
New hardware is currently better supported on linux (sans the parts
where the manufacturer doesn't want linux drivers to happen).
Finally, UNIX is system initially designed by developers for developers. They never needed to appeal to the average joe like windows does.
RE accelerated video: there's no real hw acceleration beyond MPEG2-MC; although people from Intel are working on a generalized media acceleration framework. But performance of the available software decoders isn't that bad; Low-Bitrate 1080p-h264 material is no problem for my 2.4GHz Opteron (you know, the 10GB files you can get on the 'net).
As for the "benchmark" apps, good luck findind posix variants of all those stupid windows apps. WINE certainly won't be enough to run the win32 exes...
(minor nitpick: "Linux" is the kernel, not a complete OS)
Ryan Smith - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I'll see what we can do about video tests, but I can't make any specific promises. BluRay/HD-DVD will probably be out of the question however, since there is no licensed/proper application for Linux.designerfx - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
About HD,what about what VLC is doing? And/or what about Matroska setups...aren't those considered HD, and doesn't that work cross-platform?
BladeVenom - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
In Quake Wars, Linux stomps all over Vista. http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&...">http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&...murphyslabrat - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
But that benchmark is super old, the Windows drivers have had plenty of time to mature. I think you need to find a more recent benchmark.BladeVenom - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
Total nonsense, October 30, 2007 isn't that old. Vista driver's have already had a year to mature. Newer drivers won't change the results. Especially since there are also even newer drivers for Linux now. The results would probably be even better now for Linux.paulpod - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
How did gaming topics get in this reply thread?Regarding HD video, I can see that DRMed HD video might be difficult, but over-the-air MPEG transport stream from tuners cards is completely open.
And I forgot about editing. There are extremely fast, simple, and low priced editing solutions for 1080i mpeg on the PC (Womble Mpeg2Vcr). What is video editing (SD and HD) like on Unix? Particlarly solutions like Mpeg2Vcr that simply copy input to output, where possible, without unecessary re-rendering.
oznick - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Ryan,Given that the upcoming version of Ubuntu (8.04, otherwise known as "Hardy Heron") is a long-term support release, meaning that it is supported on the desktop for 3 years and servers for 5 years, I would recommend waiting for it's release since it should be more comparable to Windows and OS-X as LTS releases are designed for maximum stability, reliability and compatability...
pmonti80 - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I'd also wait for the next LTS version, Ubuntu 8.04.PolPot - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
From my experience, the following are the critical issues vis-a-vis Linux:1) It's a hell of a lot faster than Vista.
2) Prepare for major headaches installing wireless drivers.
3) Man, tons of free applications are available.
4) Really, you can pretty much kiss your old Windows applications goodbye -- Wine just isn't ready for primetime, even after over 10 years of development, and my guess is that it probably never will be.
5) Get ready for a STEEP learning curve when it comes to the command line. If you know DOS, you have a slight advantage, but not a huge one.
I've experimented with using Linux for my everyday tasks, and it works great 80% of the time. The problem is the other 20% -- I'm still having to boot to Windows. I'd like to get rid of it completely.
morphon - Wednesday, February 6, 2008 - link
I'd say go ahead and review with a few considerations:1. Ubuntu is GNOME-centric, and the latest version of Gnome has some evolutionary improvements but I doubt it will be enough to change your mind about the interface. So, at least in that sense, the "feel" will be similar.
2. Likewise your experience with the software repository will be identical.
3. The end-user security system is being totally redone in 8.04.
4. 8.04 will have better hardware detection and support. Any trials and tribulations you had getting some item to work may not apply to the newer version.
But given the pace of innovation in free software, any time you decide to do a review you will have the same problems. So I'd just go for it - nobody will consider it your "final say" on the topic.
Sasiki - Wednesday, February 6, 2008 - link
I say do the review now, post the article and then in April when the new distro comes out, do a brief follow up with the upgrade experience. I wouldn't expect a full article the 2nd go 'round, just a brief article on your upgrade experience.Calin - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
And prepare an article about it. After the new version is available, you might write a short follow-up about the new things - the upgrade process, things that appear different.Also, you could try to use your computer with different amounts of RAM, and inform us about the speed/feel of the system (1GB of RAM, 2GB of RAM - a lower memory use - 512MB or less - might prove interesting but painful to you).
tetrahedrons - Wednesday, February 6, 2008 - link
I'd like to see an Ubuntu review by a newcomer. To make it complete, though, at least two distros should be compared - and additional comparison of Gnome and KDE environments are warranted. I'm thinking along the lines of another relatively complete distro, say CentOS.Ryan Smith - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
That's something we had considered early-on, but ultimately decided to pass on. We want to do one month with just one OS to keep things simple and to the point, so we're going with the most popular and user-friendly distro, and right now that's Ubuntu with Gnome.It does bring up an interesting point about so much variety though, which is something we'll be tackling in our article.
Calin - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
After this article is complete, you might try to test a different distribution - but one operating system for one article is plenty.We do expect intermediary results ;)
InternetGeek - Wednesday, February 6, 2008 - link
I think that's a bit ambitious. I can agree with two or even three distributions being compared as they do then do differ. SuSE is better for the enterprise while Ubuntu seems the choice for the home desktop.A separate one would be fine for Gnome and KDE. At least in terms of usability and other aspects.
A comparison to Windows and OSX would really sweeten up things.
InternetGeek - Wednesday, February 6, 2008 - link
I think that's a bit ambitious. I can agree with two or even three distributions being compared as they do then do differ. SuSE is better for the enterprise while Ubuntu seems the choice for the home desktop.A separate one would be fine for Gnome and KDE. At least in terms of usability and other aspects.
A comparison to Windows and OSX would really sweeten up things.
Polynikes - Wednesday, February 6, 2008 - link
I doubt there will be any ground-breaking changes in the next release of Ubuntu that would make for a significantly different experience using the OS.dm0r - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I agree with you.I think there will be more Aesthetical changes than other things.I'd like to see the review soon.TIAcrimson117 - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
For the vast majority of users, aesthetic change are what they notice most in upgrades!pzkfwg - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
Agreed tooHilbertSpace - Wednesday, February 6, 2008 - link
How about you review it now, and then include a review of the upgrade process too, as that is something I find to (at times) be a challenge with linux distros.murphyslabrat - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I endorse the previous statement, and think that it is an excellent idea.No, seriously, I feel that the selective but easy upgrade process is a strong point in Linux. The biggest downside is the lack of support from commercial software, something that might change as WINE-doors progresses.
My plug for coverage: user transition to linux, including ease of use/effictiveness of WINE/WINE-doors; driver support for ethernet, sound, and video acceleration, with focus on Intel, Broadcom, and Creative (as these make the mass majority of said devices out there); and the feel of the interface for typical usage and upgrades.
Vanden - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
I agree, the upgrade process should be part of the review.Nehemoth - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
i support the abovexeutonmojukai - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
As a new user of Gutsy on my MacBook, I would actually find this idea particularly good, especially if the following could be tried:- Looking into the end-user experience with Gutsy, of course
- ...As well as the upgrade path to their next release, if possible.
- Also, the ease of installing and using something like Cedega and also Wine (the latter is free) to play games like Oblivion (possibly even using this new rig for benchmarks with new games)
- You could check out the driver situations between AMD video cards and NVIDIA ones.
- You could look into the installation and optimization processes for various Windows-exclusive peripherals.
- Covering security issues (or the lack thereof) using Firefox on Ubuntu.
- Trying this OS on a PC platform, as well as a Mac platform (hopefully one that has a chance to use both wireless and wired internet connection, as the former often gets tricky early on).
~ XM
mofo3k - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I also thing that you should include a comparison of KDE and Gnome. The good reason to do one now and one later is that KDE 4 has recently been released and the new version of Kubuntu will likely use that as it's desktop environment.As an avid Linux user, I would like to see more Linux news/coverage. Especially since this is a technology site with a focus on computers.
As another suggestion, please include my favorite distro, Slackware.
leexgx - Friday, February 8, 2008 - link
gusty (7.10?)is the worst ubuntu thay have made use 7.04 or wait for 8.04 as that one is an LTS one so thay Have to make it stable as its supported for 3 yearsMooseMuffin - Saturday, February 9, 2008 - link
Worst based on what? I'm posting this from gutsy right now and I have no complaints.mofo3k - Monday, February 11, 2008 - link
While I didn't think that Gutsy was the most stable release they've had, I'd hardly call it bad. But then again, I'm using KDE and not Gnome. It is my default OS at home, now if I could only convince my boss to let us use it at work.MooseMuffin - Thursday, February 7, 2008 - link
I think this is the best idea. If you're going to do it for a month, start 2 weeks before the 8.04 update and then describe the upgrade procedure and new features.