Agree that one of the most interesting aspects is that QC made this sampling announcement. My guess is that with AMD and Huawei already announcing chips on 7 nm, QC wanted to show they are at or with the head of the pack when it comes to die tech. Another thing is that there were past questions about fab's abilities to scale-up of 7 nm processes to quantity, sampling is a good way to dispel doubts.
Yes, but only a single i3 CPU with low power efficiency, low clocks (a slightly lower boost clock than its closest 14nm equivalent at the same TDP), low yields and on top of it all a disabled iGPU. The fact that it has a lower clock and the same TDP *despite* the disabled iGPU is even more astounding.
This half-baked, effectively beta Cannon Lake i3 is based on Intel's problematic first-gen 10nm node. At the end of 2019 they plan high volume release of 10nm based CPUs but these will not be Cannon Lake CPUs. They will be second gen 10nm+ based Ice Lake CPUs, with a new architecture (their first redesigned arch after Skylake), a (presumably) much better power efficiency, and with fixes of the issues and bugs of their first gen 10nm node.
No other Cannon Lake CPUs are scheduled or expected to be released, so both Cannon Lake and their first gen 10nm node will be effectively skipped. Intel appears to have released that sole Cannon Lake i3 just to report that their 10nm node was technically released in 2018, and thus avoid mortally wounding their heavily injured Moore Law schedule.
If TSMC can ship Apple volumes (and they surely have, with the iPhone presumably being announced Sept 12 on TSMC 7nm), then doubts about 7nm volumes make no sense.
My guess is that this is more related to a perception of chaos within QC. Are their more national lawsuits headed their way? Do they or do they not have a plan for Servers? Is the future custom Kryo cores, or thinly modified ARM commodity cores?
Throwing out a "BTW we're totally on track for the next round of Snapdragons" is a way to calm outsiders that at least some parts of the company are functioning properly.
Anyone else get the feeling the most we'll see of TSMC's 7nm in 2018 is a similar notional "We're whipping! (technically)" as we got for Intel's 10nm at the end of 2017? Both are using SAQP for processes of similar scale, so both would be expected to be facing the same issues.
As I said, the A12 will be shipping in massive volumes in a month. TSMC 7nm may be a disappointment in some way (hotter, or lower frequency than expected) but it won't suffer from Intel's lack of mass manufacturability.
Yes, TSMC will be shipping A12s to Apple at least in some quantity. They'll better ship them, as Apple is not only one of their largest (the largest?) customer by $$$ volume, but also because Apple has a very big and aggressive (litigious) legal department that would sue TSMC out of existence if they don't deliver the SOCs on time. But, just because one customer gets what they ordered doesn't always mean that there is enough capacity for everybody. So, I agree with your earlier posting, this is QC yelling "me too, look here".
Really?!? HVM on 7nm TSMC was announced back in April - most of the early production likely was allocated to Apple. We're now a few weeks away from first 7nm products from AMD, Huawei and Apple.
QC's access to TSMC's 7 nm process in sufficient volumes is NOT a given; apparently, Apple pretty much takes whatever TSMC can make in 7 nm, and has, in turn, made TSMC their exclusive mobile SoC provider, at least for 7 nm. See this article and its pie chart here: https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=133361... That also means that it's vital for TSMC to come through for Apple, and vice versa. But, if this report is accurate, if QC wants to ship 7 nm snapdragons in quantity by 2019, they may have to talk to Samsung.
How long will we see 7nm snapdragons I wonder, i mean there needs to be a 'new' smartphone cpu every year right? And its not like arm/samsung will be releasing a 5nm or smaller processor next year... so maybe an 855 this year and an 856 next year (or 855 and three quarters) Marketing teams are going to have to put their thinking caps on!
Cant wait to see some solid performance data for 7nm Arm, and are wondering how well windows for example would run on a higher TDP 7nm arm part...?
We’ve updated our terms. By continuing to use the site and/or by logging into your account, you agree to the Site’s updated Terms of Use and Privacy Policy.
Facebook
Twitter
RSS
16 Comments
Back to Article
A5 - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
Timeline seems pretty typical. Guessing you'll get an invite to the hands-on with the development testbed in a few months?eastcoast_pete - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
Agree that one of the most interesting aspects is that QC made this sampling announcement. My guess is that with AMD and Huawei already announcing chips on 7 nm, QC wanted to show they are at or with the head of the pack when it comes to die tech. Another thing is that there were past questions about fab's abilities to scale-up of 7 nm processes to quantity, sampling is a good way to dispel doubts.shabby - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
Intel is sampling 10nm...doubt is still there.shabby - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
Wait, they're even shipping tiny laptop cpus.Santoval - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
Yes, but only a single i3 CPU with low power efficiency, low clocks (a slightly lower boost clock than its closest 14nm equivalent at the same TDP), low yields and on top of it all a disabled iGPU. The fact that it has a lower clock and the same TDP *despite* the disabled iGPU is even more astounding.This half-baked, effectively beta Cannon Lake i3 is based on Intel's problematic first-gen 10nm node. At the end of 2019 they plan high volume release of 10nm based CPUs but these will not be Cannon Lake CPUs. They will be second gen 10nm+ based Ice Lake CPUs, with a new architecture (their first redesigned arch after Skylake), a (presumably) much better power efficiency, and with fixes of the issues and bugs of their first gen 10nm node.
No other Cannon Lake CPUs are scheduled or expected to be released, so both Cannon Lake and their first gen 10nm node will be effectively skipped. Intel appears to have released that sole Cannon Lake i3 just to report that their 10nm node was technically released in 2018, and thus avoid mortally wounding their heavily injured Moore Law schedule.
Meteor2 - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
That's a great summary of where Intel is at, thank you.name99 - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
If TSMC can ship Apple volumes (and they surely have, with the iPhone presumably being announced Sept 12 on TSMC 7nm), then doubts about 7nm volumes make no sense.My guess is that this is more related to a perception of chaos within QC.
Are their more national lawsuits headed their way? Do they or do they not have a plan for Servers? Is the future custom Kryo cores, or thinly modified ARM commodity cores?
Throwing out a "BTW we're totally on track for the next round of Snapdragons" is a way to calm outsiders that at least some parts of the company are functioning properly.
edzieba - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
Anyone else get the feeling the most we'll see of TSMC's 7nm in 2018 is a similar notional "We're whipping! (technically)" as we got for Intel's 10nm at the end of 2017? Both are using SAQP for processes of similar scale, so both would be expected to be facing the same issues.edzieba - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
s/whipping/shipping. I blame the keys, they're right next to each other!name99 - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
As I said, the A12 will be shipping in massive volumes in a month.TSMC 7nm may be a disappointment in some way (hotter, or lower frequency than expected) but it won't suffer from Intel's lack of mass manufacturability.
eastcoast_pete - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
Yes, TSMC will be shipping A12s to Apple at least in some quantity. They'll better ship them, as Apple is not only one of their largest (the largest?) customer by $$$ volume, but also because Apple has a very big and aggressive (litigious) legal department that would sue TSMC out of existence if they don't deliver the SOCs on time. But, just because one customer gets what they ordered doesn't always mean that there is enough capacity for everybody. So, I agree with your earlier posting, this is QC yelling "me too, look here".Wilco1 - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
Really?!? HVM on 7nm TSMC was announced back in April - most of the early production likely was allocated to Apple. We're now a few weeks away from first 7nm products from AMD, Huawei and Apple.eastcoast_pete - Friday, August 24, 2018 - link
QC's access to TSMC's 7 nm process in sufficient volumes is NOT a given; apparently, Apple pretty much takes whatever TSMC can make in 7 nm, and has, in turn, made TSMC their exclusive mobile SoC provider, at least for 7 nm. See this article and its pie chart here: https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=133361...That also means that it's vital for TSMC to come through for Apple, and vice versa. But, if this report is accurate, if QC wants to ship 7 nm snapdragons in quantity by 2019, they may have to talk to Samsung.
WatcherCK - Wednesday, August 22, 2018 - link
How long will we see 7nm snapdragons I wonder, i mean there needs to be a 'new' smartphone cpu every year right? And its not like arm/samsung will be releasing a 5nm or smaller processor next year... so maybe an 855 this year and an 856 next year (or 855 and three quarters) Marketing teams are going to have to put their thinking caps on!Cant wait to see some solid performance data for 7nm Arm, and are wondering how well windows for example would run on a higher TDP 7nm arm part...?
YoloPascual - Sunday, August 26, 2018 - link
But iNtEl's 10nm iS bEtTeR tHaN tSmC 7nm ThOuGh.