Yeah they should do what HP does with their Elitebooks and build 4GB or 8GB on-board, with an empty SODIMM slot for the end-user.
My 810 G1 has 4GB on-board and I dropped 8GB in the SODIMM slot to give me 12GB. I also installed a 512GB double-sided M2 NGFF SSD when HP officially states only single-sided can be used (and only equips it up to 180GB with an Intel Pro 1500, ie SSD530)
HP won me over from Lenovo a few years ago after it was obvious the IBM quality was going away. My Thinkpad X41 was still by far the most solid mobile machine I've ever owned. Even in 2001, it had a 60GB PATA SSD, a $1400 option and well worth it.
The real irony is that from Haswell onwards (X240,T440), Lenovo have mostly gone with a single SODIMM and hence single channel. Since Haswell also introduced a max of 15W CPUs, this has meant that not only did the CPU performance go down vs the Ivy Bridge generation (X230 / T430), but with single channel the one advantage that Haswell *should* bring (better GPU performance) is absent.
HP went for dual SODIMM slots in all except for the 11.6" 1.33KG 810 which makes a lot more sense. Pity about the Elitebooks cursor key arrangement as I really do not like the layout.
But really Lenovo, single-channel Broadwell sounds even stupider than single-channel Haswell did.
This so much. The ultrathin craze is out of hand. Everything is coming soldered at the bare minimums. I have a Folio 1040 and I was happy that I would be able to upgrade the RAM if I needed it, but apparently HP has, for this laptop, some strange single-sided RAM chips that I've never even seen used before anywhere, and two-sided ones don't fit. They're unavailable except for the HP store where they are quite expensive.
Business-grade laptops, at the very least, should be a bit more accessible with their hardware, even if they are ultrabooks.
This has been a concern for me as well. The T450 is supposed to once again have to memory slots and support up to 16GB of RAM. I imagine details on it will be coming out soon at CES. If you want documentation on this, I'm not aware of any yet. The best documentation is the Product Support Reference sheets (PSREF) and that document hasn't been updated since the December release.
Is this true for the Yoga series as well ? I am referring to the new 2015 wave based on the 5th gen core processors. The CPUs all Support dual channel why would lenovo do that to those notebooks ?
Finally brought back the trackpoint buttons instead of the clickable touchpad. I'd actually consider upgrading from my X220 now if it wasn't such a good machine. Wouldn't touch the X240 though.
The X220 was the last good X-series. I don't expect the X250 to be much better, if at all, except for battery life. Build quality has been tanking for years with Lenovo, just research overheating problems, cracking USB ports, BIOS bugs, and so on.
Do a convertible tablet version with digitizer/wacom with this like the old X-series. Otherwise there is not much point in keeping them around. X1 Carbon already caters to the ultraportable space.
No, look at the older models like X230t, X220t, X200t. Not awkward detach plus flip or flip-over versions (Yoga) latter without active digitizer. The touch functionality is obviously mostly for business use and for quick sketching. It has no real use as a stand alone slate, and older X-tablet series did support docking stations.
@satai, sure it has it's merits too but on the X1 you got the ugly onelink dock too. Should be available in tablet version too as the older models still when it comes to the X-series, I think. Otherwise they could help the series out by supporting more ram.
I must disagree. While the X1 Carbon caters to ultraportable space, it caters to those business folks that go to a 90 minute meeting down the hall and then plug back in. The x250 gives you glorious unplugged time (tons of it). Until Intel rolls out their wireless charging vision (and we begin to have wireless charging hitting us everywhere that networking currently does), there is room for a device that can go the distance unplugged. I run an x230 on SSD and love it for it's battery life. I liked the hot swappable battery concept of the x240, but passed on buying one because of the crappy mouse configuration. The x250 is going to be my next go-to device. I just hope the docking stations they are using these days (the one for my x230 worked great) are going to perform, as the x250 with multiple docks will be my laptop, work desktop and home computer. Now if only I could get 16 GB of memory in it, I'd have nothing to complain about...
I think it's just a matter of time until the ThinkPad steals the MacBook's glory. Since Steve Jobs has passed, Apple costumers have been having so many problems with their products that Apple is starting to lose costumers to competition. The company is going in a direction that Steve Jobs would never have pursued, making things like detoxmymac.org very useful with getting your MacBook back to the fast speed it was functioning at before. The ThinkPad and other Microsoft products usually come installed with protective software, so it's sad that Apple isn't keeping up with the Joneses.
They're lower power, yes, and depending on the CPUs in question they may be clocked slower. Standard voltage parts tend to not throttle as much (as they have 35W or more thermal headroom), but I've noticed with Haswell-U at least that most laptops can run the CPU at full Turbo Boost all the time. There are almost certainly exceptions, but the better OEMs are able to effectively cool 17W without overheating or throttling.
WHat I don't understand is why Lenovo put a "U" part in the L450. In its prior incarnation, the L440, it used to be a poor man's T440 with an i5 4300M, and since the CPU wasn't even soldered, you could upgrade it to an i7 47** or 48** - those are relatively cheap on e-bay from Chinese sellers. Now I guess it's either soldered or another socket, and of course you can't buy a full-power Broadwell chip on ebay yet. Anyone still need computing power, or just more battery life and cloud applications?
i just received my X250. first thing i did was disable the trackpad, since it gets in the way of typing. :-) i like the HD touchscreen. it comes handy in presentations. i also like the thinner design and metal feeling.
i was surprised by the fact the new i7 CPu scored identically in WEI compared to the old i5 i have in my X220. and the graphics part isn't that much more powerful either. not that WEI is the ultimate benchmark, but still weird.
all in all it seems i am resisting to move over my stuff from my X220 (which has provided me with excellent service) to the X250, but it shall happen over the next week...
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Wally Simmonds - Sunday, January 4, 2015 - link
8gb, eh? Not much point in upgrading my X220 apart from battery life really..Samus - Sunday, January 4, 2015 - link
Yeah they should do what HP does with their Elitebooks and build 4GB or 8GB on-board, with an empty SODIMM slot for the end-user.My 810 G1 has 4GB on-board and I dropped 8GB in the SODIMM slot to give me 12GB. I also installed a 512GB double-sided M2 NGFF SSD when HP officially states only single-sided can be used (and only equips it up to 180GB with an Intel Pro 1500, ie SSD530)
HP won me over from Lenovo a few years ago after it was obvious the IBM quality was going away. My Thinkpad X41 was still by far the most solid mobile machine I've ever owned. Even in 2001, it had a 60GB PATA SSD, a $1400 option and well worth it.
KompuKare - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
The real irony is that from Haswell onwards (X240,T440), Lenovo have mostly gone with a single SODIMM and hence single channel. Since Haswell also introduced a max of 15W CPUs, this has meant that not only did the CPU performance go down vs the Ivy Bridge generation (X230 / T430), but with single channel the one advantage that Haswell *should* bring (better GPU performance) is absent.HP went for dual SODIMM slots in all except for the 11.6" 1.33KG 810 which makes a lot more sense. Pity about the Elitebooks cursor key arrangement as I really do not like the layout.
But really Lenovo, single-channel Broadwell sounds even stupider than single-channel Haswell did.
kspirit - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
This so much. The ultrathin craze is out of hand. Everything is coming soldered at the bare minimums.I have a Folio 1040 and I was happy that I would be able to upgrade the RAM if I needed it, but apparently HP has, for this laptop, some strange single-sided RAM chips that I've never even seen used before anywhere, and two-sided ones don't fit. They're unavailable except for the HP store where they are quite expensive.
Business-grade laptops, at the very least, should be a bit more accessible with their hardware, even if they are ultrabooks.
Kornfeld - Tuesday, January 6, 2015 - link
This has been a concern for me as well. The T450 is supposed to once again have to memory slots and support up to 16GB of RAM. I imagine details on it will be coming out soon at CES. If you want documentation on this, I'm not aware of any yet. The best documentation is the Product Support Reference sheets (PSREF) and that document hasn't been updated since the December release.plsgtfo - Tuesday, January 20, 2015 - link
Is this true for the Yoga series as well ? I am referring to the new 2015 wave based on the 5th gen core processors. The CPUs all Support dual channel why would lenovo do that to those notebooks ?mjrpes3 - Tuesday, January 6, 2015 - link
The X41 was released in 2005. The biggest SSD in 2001 apparently was 14GB and cost $42,000.YouGotRioted - Sunday, January 4, 2015 - link
Finally brought back the trackpoint buttons instead of the clickable touchpad. I'd actually consider upgrading from my X220 now if it wasn't such a good machine. Wouldn't touch the X240 though.Samus - Sunday, January 4, 2015 - link
The X220 was the last good X-series. I don't expect the X250 to be much better, if at all, except for battery life. Build quality has been tanking for years with Lenovo, just research overheating problems, cracking USB ports, BIOS bugs, and so on.tuxRoller - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
Eh, the x230t is fine as well. Keys have nice feedback.Penti - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
Do a convertible tablet version with digitizer/wacom with this like the old X-series. Otherwise there is not much point in keeping them around. X1 Carbon already caters to the ultraportable space.satai - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
2.5"HDD, replaceable battery, classical dockability...MrSpadge - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
That sounds like an updated version of the Helix.. which probably didn't sell well due to the high price.Penti - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
No, look at the older models like X230t, X220t, X200t. Not awkward detach plus flip or flip-over versions (Yoga) latter without active digitizer. The touch functionality is obviously mostly for business use and for quick sketching. It has no real use as a stand alone slate, and older X-tablet series did support docking stations.@satai, sure it has it's merits too but on the X1 you got the ugly onelink dock too. Should be available in tablet version too as the older models still when it comes to the X-series, I think. Otherwise they could help the series out by supporting more ram.
GeekyITGuy - Saturday, January 17, 2015 - link
I must disagree. While the X1 Carbon caters to ultraportable space, it caters to those business folks that go to a 90 minute meeting down the hall and then plug back in. The x250 gives you glorious unplugged time (tons of it). Until Intel rolls out their wireless charging vision (and we begin to have wireless charging hitting us everywhere that networking currently does), there is room for a device that can go the distance unplugged. I run an x230 on SSD and love it for it's battery life. I liked the hot swappable battery concept of the x240, but passed on buying one because of the crappy mouse configuration. The x250 is going to be my next go-to device. I just hope the docking stations they are using these days (the one for my x230 worked great) are going to perform, as the x250 with multiple docks will be my laptop, work desktop and home computer. Now if only I could get 16 GB of memory in it, I'd have nothing to complain about...Krysti_Fallon - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
I think it's just a matter of time until the ThinkPad steals the MacBook's glory. Since Steve Jobs has passed, Apple costumers have been having so many problems with their products that Apple is starting to lose costumers to competition. The company is going in a direction that Steve Jobs would never have pursued, making things like detoxmymac.org very useful with getting your MacBook back to the fast speed it was functioning at before. The ThinkPad and other Microsoft products usually come installed with protective software, so it's sad that Apple isn't keeping up with the Joneses.gw74 - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
er, aren't "U" processors slower than the M in my 2012 X230?JarredWalton - Monday, January 5, 2015 - link
They're lower power, yes, and depending on the CPUs in question they may be clocked slower. Standard voltage parts tend to not throttle as much (as they have 35W or more thermal headroom), but I've noticed with Haswell-U at least that most laptops can run the CPU at full Turbo Boost all the time. There are almost certainly exceptions, but the better OEMs are able to effectively cool 17W without overheating or throttling.crazynightowl - Tuesday, January 6, 2015 - link
WHat I don't understand is why Lenovo put a "U" part in the L450. In its prior incarnation, the L440, it used to be a poor man's T440 with an i5 4300M, and since the CPU wasn't even soldered, you could upgrade it to an i7 47** or 48** - those are relatively cheap on e-bay from Chinese sellers. Now I guess it's either soldered or another socket, and of course you can't buy a full-power Broadwell chip on ebay yet. Anyone still need computing power, or just more battery life and cloud applications?pablolie - Wednesday, March 11, 2015 - link
i just received my X250. first thing i did was disable the trackpad, since it gets in the way of typing. :-) i like the HD touchscreen. it comes handy in presentations. i also like the thinner design and metal feeling.i was surprised by the fact the new i7 CPu scored identically in WEI compared to the old i5 i have in my X220. and the graphics part isn't that much more powerful either. not that WEI is the ultimate benchmark, but still weird.
all in all it seems i am resisting to move over my stuff from my X220 (which has provided me with excellent service) to the X250, but it shall happen over the next week...