"There is also BitTorrent support, but, frankly, how many users are going to download their copy of Ubuntu using the Fusion HD? That said, I find BitTorrent clients on many media streamers. There must be a market for this feature and consumers must be demanding this probably."
I might just attribute this to the author trying to be clever and just assume you are joking. Thanks for the article, helping the Friday afternoon go by!
It is great that you can use it as a hard disk, but what file systems does it support? FAT32 is usually not acceptable in these scenarios that need to accommodate large files, and ext2/3/4 is not widely deployed and used on Windows computers. I would love to see a nod to supported and default file systems in future reviews!
Ah! I should have mentioned it :) The hard drive in the system was formatted in NTFS, which is the default. Though ext file systems may have better features than NTFS in most scenarios, for media streamers in a Windows heavy environment (which is what most households are), NTFS is the best choice.
As you rightly note, FAT32 is no longer useful because most of the ISOs and MKVs are greater than the 4 GB limitation that FAT32 has.
I am curious about the security implications of using these NAS appliances. Are they secure, or are they gaping security holes? The whole HBGary thing has confirmed what I suspected about many security firms: not secure at all. Does that extend to our routers, NASes, modems?
I am using a Netgear Ultra 6 Plus NAS for my streaming needs. It also has BitTorrent support but I do not use it. I prefer to rip CDs using dBpoweramp.
When is this price point ever going to have a tuner (read: CableCARD)? The advantage of having an HD dock in the device would be amplified if you could actually record to it.
Even support for something like SiliconDust's HDHomeRun would be great. I have one of those that streams to my network, but I haven't decided what to do about recording (using my desktop for testing it out now). I'd love to have something like the Boxee Box that would be able to browse the TV guide and record shows to my NAS... one day maybe.
Popcorn Hour... No review units with AnandTech right now.. Once they put something new out, we will try to get hold of one :) Right now, our review queue is pretty full.
"One of our MKVs with DTS-HD audio exhibited random dropouts when bitstreaming. However, a couple of other movies with DTS-HD MA in MKV bitstreamed for the full duration without any issue. But, some points were docked because our test stream didn't play perfectly"
Could this be because of Ciniava DRM?? I only skimmed the artical so I don't know if Ciniava is present or not, But please look in to it and tell us if future players use this protection, or any others like it I'm not aware of.
No, that particular stream doesn't have Cinavia. It plays perfectly OK on the NTV 550 and the Boxee Box.
Cinavia is only applicable to streamers which have AACS license, and even then, it doesn't appear mandatory right now. So, none of the media streamers support it.
I am keeping a close watch on Cinavia developments, so if there is anything new I find not reported elsewhere, rest assured, AnandTech readers will be the first to know about it :)
I've read that Ciniava is part of the Sigma chips features. What I wasn't aware of is if it's something the OEM can turn on or off. I'm also worried that some firmware update could activate it. You know how the MPAA and RIAA types are with pushing there DRM on people.
Also correct me if I'm wrong please, but AACS is the protection of the content on the disk and it's unlocked/decrypted before it ever gets encrypted in HDCP, so I guess there is no risk of it being implemented on the HDCP/HDMI end (TV's AVR's) Does this sound correct?
Currently, Cinavia can be implemented on some of the Sigma processors, but not on the 865x ones because they are not meant for Blu-Ray playback. There will be no firmware update for this or the WDTV Live whch can enable Cinavia. On this one, I am pretty confident.
Currently, only BDA (Blu Ray alliance) requires Cinavia, and the player detects the watermark, checks if the file being played back is protected by AACS, i.e, it is from a protected disc, not a bootleg copy or a copy made after removing the AACS using AnyDVD or other similar software, and then allows the media to be played back. Cinavia doesn't extend beyond the actual Blu-Ray / media player.
However, this doesn't discount the fact that in the future there might be AV receivers which, when being used for HD audio bitstreaming, might implement a similar sort of muting or stopping of HD audio decode if the audio is not coming over HDCP. Currently, this is NOT happening, and this is admittedly a far-fetched scenario, but it is not implausible.
Can you review the Argosy HV335T 2TB in the near future?
I have purchased four such units (actually 3, and one wireless version), and they function amazingly well for their price point, $170. Has a 1073DD chipset and a Samsung 2TB 2040UI HDD.
"A perfect companion in your home theater setup, HV335T can play contents from internal HDD (optional), USB HDD/flash drive, or stream contents from another server in your home network. The player also supports uPNP and can work seamless with DMS (Digital Media Server). With DMS software running on a PC, such as PlayOn, HV335T can display internet video/audio supported by DMS directly on the TV. Selected internet services (Picasa, Flickr, Weather, Youtube, Last.FM, MediaFly, Internet TV, Internet Radio, etc) are also available directly.
Audio video output include Composite A/Vand Component output, HDMI output, and Optical digital output. HDMI output support up to 1080p resolution. HV335T supports Dolby Digital and DTS downmixing as well as digital pass through.
Managing the contents on the inernal HDD can be done either with direct USB connection to a PC or over the SAMBA networking connection. The UI also allow copying from USB drives and SAMBA servers to internal HDD or deletion from internal HDD."
====
The reason I bring it up is since they are very supportive of the product (constant firmware updates with new features) and are very responsive to support emails; I wish to see such a company succeed.
Which performs similar to the RealTek 1073DD chipset, but the RealTek 1283 has a bit more features... from my experience with RealTek media players they almost have similar GUI and similar features or shortcomings due to RealTek's SDKs... with the exceptions of good known brands such as AC Ryan whom are known for better support/quality...
Bug # 11 on the list is and continues to be, the deal breaker for me for any streamer on the market. (ASS subs (stylized and karaoke effects) are not supported properly.)
It is frustrating that no one seems to be able to do these subtitles as well as a standalone PC.
I've pretty up given up hope for a streaming device that works correctly with these kind of subtitles.
I guess I'm going to continue with a spare PC hooked up to the TV for *proper* playback.
I own the Viewsonic NexTV VMP75. It has the same interface and remote as this, without the built-in USB dongle, HD bay, or bittorrent, but it does have Netflix. I've got an external HD hooked up to it with eSata for local playback. Do me a favor and get your hands on one so that Viewsonic addresses some of your bug reports and gives me a firmware update?!?
Would definitely like that, but the problem is that the big companies don't pay attention to our bug reports, while the startups like Nixeus pay more attention.
If you take a look at TViX Slim S1, we reported a big set of bugs, but not all of them were resolved.
HQV scores indicate the video post-processing quality.. for example, cadence detection is important when you are watching interlaced video at non-native refresh rate. Some SoCs also have noise reduction and other features. HQV score can find out how effective that feature is...
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31 Comments
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3DoubleD - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
"There is also BitTorrent support, but, frankly, how many users are going to download their copy of Ubuntu using the Fusion HD? That said, I find BitTorrent clients on many media streamers. There must be a market for this feature and consumers must be demanding this probably."I might just attribute this to the author trying to be clever and just assume you are joking. Thanks for the article, helping the Friday afternoon go by!
ganeshts - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
Anything to keep the readers entertained and happy :)Btw, the geeky pirates have better avenues than P2P (BitTorrent / DC++ etc.) to satisfy their needs.... ;)
fbking - Friday, March 11, 2011 - link
you can get it from fookbuy.com for $184.95 with free shippinggoyuix - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
It is great that you can use it as a hard disk, but what file systems does it support? FAT32 is usually not acceptable in these scenarios that need to accommodate large files, and ext2/3/4 is not widely deployed and used on Windows computers. I would love to see a nod to supported and default file systems in future reviews!ganeshts - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
Ah! I should have mentioned it :) The hard drive in the system was formatted in NTFS, which is the default. Though ext file systems may have better features than NTFS in most scenarios, for media streamers in a Windows heavy environment (which is what most households are), NTFS is the best choice.As you rightly note, FAT32 is no longer useful because most of the ISOs and MKVs are greater than the 4 GB limitation that FAT32 has.
Milleman - Saturday, March 5, 2011 - link
The 100 Mbps is also a dealbreaker...Azethoth - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
I am curious about the security implications of using these NAS appliances. Are they secure, or are they gaping security holes? The whole HBGary thing has confirmed what I suspected about many security firms: not secure at all. Does that extend to our routers, NASes, modems?I am using a Netgear Ultra 6 Plus NAS for my streaming needs. It also has BitTorrent support but I do not use it. I prefer to rip CDs using dBpoweramp.
ganeshts - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
Comment intended for another article? :)vol7ron - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
When is this price point ever going to have a tuner (read: CableCARD)? The advantage of having an HD dock in the device would be amplified if you could actually record to it.Discombobulated28 - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
Hmmm... I never noticed that... most media players in the USA don't have tuners in them... I know they're very popular outside of the USA...Trefugl - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
Even support for something like SiliconDust's HDHomeRun would be great. I have one of those that streams to my network, but I haven't decided what to do about recording (using my desktop for testing it out now). I'd love to have something like the Boxee Box that would be able to browse the TV guide and record shows to my NAS... one day maybe.Suntan - Saturday, March 5, 2011 - link
Have you looked into SageTV?HD300 hardware extender at the TV, computer running the tuners at the backend.
It's another option.
-Suntan
TrevorH - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
Why no reviews of the market leaders in this segment? Where is Popcornhour? TVIX?ganeshts - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
TViX Slim S1 is up next :)Popcorn Hour... No review units with AnandTech right now.. Once they put something new out, we will try to get hold of one :) Right now, our review queue is pretty full.
DigitalFreak - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
As soon as one of these streamers gets the ability to properly play back WTV files, I might just pick one up.mgl888 - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
off topic, but is Anandtech located in Sunnyvale?ganeshts - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
AnandTech has a set of freelance reporters spread all over the world. It is just that I happen to reside in Sunnyvale :)mgl888 - Sunday, March 6, 2011 - link
Awesome, we could be neighbors!We have the same postcode. :)
SlyNine - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
"One of our MKVs with DTS-HD audio exhibited random dropouts when bitstreaming. However, a couple of other movies with DTS-HD MA in MKV bitstreamed for the full duration without any issue. But, some points were docked because our test stream didn't play perfectly"Could this be because of Ciniava DRM?? I only skimmed the artical so I don't know if Ciniava is present or not, But please look in to it and tell us if future players use this protection, or any others like it I'm not aware of.
ganeshts - Saturday, March 5, 2011 - link
No, that particular stream doesn't have Cinavia. It plays perfectly OK on the NTV 550 and the Boxee Box.Cinavia is only applicable to streamers which have AACS license, and even then, it doesn't appear mandatory right now. So, none of the media streamers support it.
I am keeping a close watch on Cinavia developments, so if there is anything new I find not reported elsewhere, rest assured, AnandTech readers will be the first to know about it :)
SlyNine - Saturday, March 5, 2011 - link
Thanks.I've read that Ciniava is part of the Sigma chips features. What I wasn't aware of is if it's something the OEM can turn on or off. I'm also worried that some firmware update could activate it. You know how the MPAA and RIAA types are with pushing there DRM on people.
Also correct me if I'm wrong please, but AACS is the protection of the content on the disk and it's unlocked/decrypted before it ever gets encrypted in HDCP, so I guess there is no risk of it being implemented on the HDCP/HDMI end (TV's AVR's) Does this sound correct?
ganeshts - Saturday, March 5, 2011 - link
Currently, Cinavia can be implemented on some of the Sigma processors, but not on the 865x ones because they are not meant for Blu-Ray playback.There will be no firmware update for this or the WDTV Live whch can enable Cinavia. On this one, I am pretty confident.
Currently, only BDA (Blu Ray alliance) requires Cinavia, and the player detects the watermark, checks if the file being played back is protected by AACS, i.e, it is from a protected disc, not a bootleg copy or a copy made after removing the AACS using AnyDVD or other similar software, and then allows the media to be played back. Cinavia doesn't extend beyond the actual Blu-Ray / media player.
However, this doesn't discount the fact that in the future there might be AV receivers which, when being used for HD audio bitstreaming, might implement a similar sort of muting or stopping of HD audio decode if the audio is not coming over HDCP. Currently, this is NOT happening, and this is admittedly a far-fetched scenario, but it is not implausible.
Chillin1248 - Friday, March 4, 2011 - link
Can you review the Argosy HV335T 2TB in the near future?I have purchased four such units (actually 3, and one wireless version), and they function amazingly well for their price point, $170. Has a 1073DD chipset and a Samsung 2TB 2040UI HDD.
====
http://www.argosyusa.com/hv335t.shtml?DefaultTab=0
"A perfect companion in your home theater setup, HV335T can play contents from internal HDD (optional), USB HDD/flash drive, or stream contents from another server in your home network. The player also supports uPNP and can work seamless with DMS (Digital Media Server). With DMS software running on a PC, such as PlayOn, HV335T can display internet video/audio supported by DMS directly on the TV. Selected internet services (Picasa, Flickr, Weather, Youtube, Last.FM, MediaFly, Internet TV, Internet Radio, etc) are also available directly.
Audio video output include Composite A/Vand Component output, HDMI output, and Optical digital output. HDMI output support up to 1080p resolution. HV335T supports Dolby Digital and DTS downmixing as well as digital pass through.
Managing the contents on the inernal HDD can be done either with direct USB connection to a PC or over the SAMBA networking connection. The UI also allow copying from USB drives and SAMBA servers to internal HDD or deletion from internal HDD."
====
The reason I bring it up is since they are very supportive of the product (constant firmware updates with new features) and are very responsive to support emails; I wish to see such a company succeed.
Discombobulated28 - Monday, March 28, 2011 - link
Ganesh recently reviewed a RealTek 1283 based media player here:http://www.anandtech.com/show/4212/tvix-slim-s1-bi...
Which performs similar to the RealTek 1073DD chipset, but the RealTek 1283 has a bit more features... from my experience with RealTek media players they almost have similar GUI and similar features or shortcomings due to RealTek's SDKs... with the exceptions of good known brands such as AC Ryan whom are known for better support/quality...
Schugy - Sunday, March 6, 2011 - link
Would also have wiped out most limitations.hohowan - Monday, March 7, 2011 - link
Bug # 11 on the list is and continues to be, the deal breaker for me for any streamer on the market.(ASS subs (stylized and karaoke effects) are not supported properly.)
It is frustrating that no one seems to be able to do these subtitles as well as a standalone PC.
I've pretty up given up hope for a streaming device that works correctly with these kind of subtitles.
I guess I'm going to continue with a spare PC hooked up to the TV for *proper* playback.
ganeshts - Monday, March 7, 2011 - link
Have you tried Boxee Box? With the latest firmware, all the ASS samples I have seem to play OK (with karaoke effects)CrapONez - Thursday, March 10, 2011 - link
I own the Viewsonic NexTV VMP75. It has the same interface and remote as this, without the built-in USB dongle, HD bay, or bittorrent, but it does have Netflix. I've got an external HD hooked up to it with eSata for local playback. Do me a favor and get your hands on one so that Viewsonic addresses some of your bug reports and gives me a firmware update?!?ganeshts - Sunday, March 13, 2011 - link
Would definitely like that, but the problem is that the big companies don't pay attention to our bug reports, while the startups like Nixeus pay more attention.If you take a look at TViX Slim S1, we reported a big set of bugs, but not all of them were resolved.
Destiny - Saturday, March 12, 2011 - link
We finally have a test suite/bench mark/ something concrete to compare media players...HQV 2.0 serves what testing purposes for SoCs and Media Players?
ganeshts - Sunday, March 13, 2011 - link
HQV scores indicate the video post-processing quality.. for example, cadence detection is important when you are watching interlaced video at non-native refresh rate. Some SoCs also have noise reduction and other features. HQV score can find out how effective that feature is...