The implementation would have been more convincing if the UDC was on the Top-Left Corner. There needs to be some software/OS feature built-in to actually "black out" that section when the Front Camera is in use. Not just for the Stock Camera, but for other Apps like openCamera and Snapchat etc etc. On top of this, I think it requires a slightly better front camera (sharper camera, larger sensor).
Portrait mode; the UDC might be hidden by the icons in the notification bar. And when the Notification Bar isn't displayed, that entire section could just be a colour that blends in with the content. Landscape mode; that corner is mostly un-used. Think of most movies, that section is more like the blindspot. So here, the subtle differences, will also be masked.
Overall, they've done great with the UDC implementation, camera choice, 4MP downsampling, post-processing, and the adequately sharp 1080p display. Can't wait for this to get even better.
Kangal took the thoughts out of my brain bone: if they put this in a top corner its much more "transparent" to the user.
Either way, the under screen camera implementation is far more impressive than I thought it would be going into the article, and honestly the 4MP output is totally adequate unless you are actually taking selfies with the front camera.
Why do these manufacturers feel the need to do under display camera? It is at best horrible, NO ONE IS ASKING FOR IT. It is baffling the level of nonsensical decision making that goes into going into this direction. The display cut out is Already small enough to be a nonissue. Round cutouts are that are small enough and in the center are absolutely fine. Even having a small bezel at the top and bottom to accommodate the camera and front Firing speakers are even better. No one is asking for Zero bezel at the top and bottom, let alone an under display camera.
Hello, I am a human being and I am asking for under-display cameras. I bought a galaxy fold 3 instead of a 2 for this reason. I like big uninterrupted displays but a camera is still useful for video calls, face unlock and the occasional selfie. I would accept a motorised pop-out camera but that takes up more space than a UDC, space which I would rather use for batteries. I would love to have UDCs on my laptops in exchange for slimmer bezels leading to smaller laptops for a given screen size or more screen for a device size.
Speak for yourself not for others, we all have different opinions.
I'm only interested if the camera is going to be placed in or near the middle of the display. That would be innovative and useful (if still poor image quality).
Samsung also used previous gen tech. Even the recently launched Z Fold 3 uses a 4MP front camera (the actual sensor is 4MP, not just capturing at 4MP like this one.)
This phone appears a generation ahead on UDC technology.
Deiter at the Verge hated the under display camera more because of the shimmering it caused on the screen than anything else (see his Fold 3 review). He would have wished just to have a black hole as it tends not to distract.
Do you Andrei find it annoying too? Would you rather just have a black hole if they both magically had the same image quality? Is it any better or worse than the Samsung implementation? Never seen one my self so I am curious about your experience.
He's talking about the very low pixel density Fold3 UDC, which has a very different design than the one here. There's no shimmering or anything annoying here beyond noticing that the area is a little brighter.
Your quite positive Axon 30 Ultra review came out a bit after the July Android Phone recommendation article. Would the Axon 30 Ultra place on that list? I'm thinking specifically about the US and I'm on t-mobile (I heard Verizon is not supported).
I reside in Qatar, & here We have Exynos2100 S21s.
As of now Samsung UAE has officially recalled all the S20 FE Exynos 990 (SM-G780F). Now We Officially have S20 FE 5G & 4G both are SD865, models are SM-G781B & SM-G780G respectively. Our CSC/Product Code is XSG.
My colleague is asking Me to suggest one as an Overall great package in sustained performance of the phone. Which one will be a better choice S21 (E2100) or S21 (E2100) or S20 FE 5G or 4G ? And is there any difference in samsung's ufs 3.1 paired with lpddr5 (uMCP) in 128GB ROM vs 256GB ROM ? as I read itbon their semiconductor site for 128 850MB/s writes & 256/512 1200MB/s.
And personally I'd like to know Andrei, that, what is the Actaul difference between the SM-G781B & SM-G780G ? What has Samsung done in reality, as I remember Qualcomm mandated 5G Modem with SD865. Now did samsung added it in the g780g with giving no Command via Software or did they entirely removed Qualcomm 5G modem & put their's (Exynos Modem) ?
Hello Andrey! I'm impressed with the work you've done! And you couldn't pass the Pixel 5 vs. Pixel 4a camera test. Does this image processing chip, which is in the Pixel5, and which is not in the Pixel 4a, do anything.
I am probably the odd one out here, but why not make the selfie cam a (small, maybe 1.5-2 mm) hump that extrudes from the screen, instead of a notch. Having the front camera in a notch also limits what kind of lens setup one can have over that sensor (one does need at least a little distance for those lens elements to work), so, if selfies are really that important, why not owning up to it. Plus, no more notch!
The macro camera is my most used. The camera in the current phone is leaps and bounds above the camera in the previous phone, and yet I prefer to use (and prepare) a 10+ years old DSLR. However, the macro camera sees a lot of use as a magnifying glass for all that otherwise impossible to read smallprint on basically anything in brick-and-mortar shops.
I honestly think the compromise in picture quality from the UDC substantially outweighs the tiny functional - and questionable aesthetic - benefits of it being there in the first place. But then I'm one of those weirdos who things having a border at the top and bottom of the screen for speakers and a camera is an asset, not a flaw, and I've been outvoted by the masses. All hail the impending victory of our crappy unsharp-mask-reliant overlords! 😅
Even funnier, you have the opposite thing when you look at the ASUS Zenfone 6/7 Pro/8 Flip. Here, you get to have the sharpest Selfie cam, and a bit of a bulge. But I like it.
I prefer the middle-ground set by the modern Sony 5.2, or the ASUS RoG 5. Other honourable mentions are the Pixel 2XL, ZTE Axon 7, Alcatel Idol 4s, Moto X Style.
Rant: -I hate these notches and cut-outs. It's functionally bad, and an eyesore. -And even worse are the curved screens. Why would I want to get content cut out weirdly, have the light glare back on my eyes, increase my accidental taps, and make the device fragile? Form and function should go hand in hand. -Not to mention the weird 19:9 aspect ratio. They should stick to 16:9 for best compact, or even 17:9 is alright... anything else is just wasteful. At least Sony's 21:9 serves a purpose: very niche people who watch Ultrawide content like Hollywood Movies (not youtube) on their phone.
I don't think we've been outvoted by the masses for support of bezels, but rather that most don't care if they are or aren't there (unless they are big) and just follow whatever is trendy.
I'd settle for an under-display camera in the middle of the display. I'd still like at least one decent one in a bezel too though.
But hey, this AnandTech. Remember the spats over user-replaceable batteries and SD cards?
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GreenReaper - Friday, September 3, 2021 - link
It seems what is essential to this phone is invisible to the eye... except at an angle.Kangal - Friday, September 3, 2021 - link
The implementation would have been more convincing if the UDC was on the Top-Left Corner. There needs to be some software/OS feature built-in to actually "black out" that section when the Front Camera is in use. Not just for the Stock Camera, but for other Apps like openCamera and Snapchat etc etc. On top of this, I think it requires a slightly better front camera (sharper camera, larger sensor).Portrait mode; the UDC might be hidden by the icons in the notification bar. And when the Notification Bar isn't displayed, that entire section could just be a colour that blends in with the content.
Landscape mode; that corner is mostly un-used. Think of most movies, that section is more like the blindspot. So here, the subtle differences, will also be masked.
Overall, they've done great with the UDC implementation, camera choice, 4MP downsampling, post-processing, and the adequately sharp 1080p display. Can't wait for this to get even better.
Samus - Sunday, September 5, 2021 - link
Kangal took the thoughts out of my brain bone: if they put this in a top corner its much more "transparent" to the user.Either way, the under screen camera implementation is far more impressive than I thought it would be going into the article, and honestly the 4MP output is totally adequate unless you are actually taking selfies with the front camera.
sharath.naik - Monday, September 6, 2021 - link
Why do these manufacturers feel the need to do under display camera? It is at best horrible, NO ONE IS ASKING FOR IT. It is baffling the level of nonsensical decision making that goes into going into this direction. The display cut out is Already small enough to be a nonissue.Round cutouts are that are small enough and in the center are absolutely fine. Even having a small bezel at the top and bottom to accommodate the camera and front Firing speakers are even better. No one is asking for Zero bezel at the top and bottom, let alone an under display camera.
CampGareth - Tuesday, September 7, 2021 - link
"NO ONE IS ASKING FOR IT"Hello, I am a human being and I am asking for under-display cameras. I bought a galaxy fold 3 instead of a 2 for this reason. I like big uninterrupted displays but a camera is still useful for video calls, face unlock and the occasional selfie. I would accept a motorised pop-out camera but that takes up more space than a UDC, space which I would rather use for batteries. I would love to have UDCs on my laptops in exchange for slimmer bezels leading to smaller laptops for a given screen size or more screen for a device size.
Speak for yourself not for others, we all have different opinions.
Tams80 - Tuesday, September 7, 2021 - link
You want slimmer bezels on your laptops...Sorry, but that alone makes your opinion silly.
Tams80 - Tuesday, September 7, 2021 - link
I'm only interested if the camera is going to be placed in or near the middle of the display. That would be innovative and useful (if still poor image quality).But otherwise, yeah, just use a damn bezel.
shabby - Friday, September 3, 2021 - link
Surprised the udc area ppi is identical to the main screen, Samsung's implementation has 10 year old ppi in that section, how are they so far behind?Fulljack - Saturday, September 4, 2021 - link
Samsung uses foldable display which adds complexity.Samus - Sunday, September 5, 2021 - link
Samsung also used previous gen tech. Even the recently launched Z Fold 3 uses a 4MP front camera (the actual sensor is 4MP, not just capturing at 4MP like this one.)This phone appears a generation ahead on UDC technology.
Sharken03 - Tuesday, September 7, 2021 - link
I am certainly going to have UDC on my list for the next phone, so i think you underestimate the interest for this feature.It is the end goal for displays to not show anything but the display and it's getting better each day.
Spunjji - Tuesday, September 7, 2021 - link
They can do that just find by having the camera above the display... then you don't have to have a crap camera.nicmonson - Friday, September 3, 2021 - link
Andrei,Deiter at the Verge hated the under display camera more because of the shimmering it caused on the screen than anything else (see his Fold 3 review). He would have wished just to have a black hole as it tends not to distract.
Do you Andrei find it annoying too? Would you rather just have a black hole if they both magically had the same image quality? Is it any better or worse than the Samsung implementation? Never seen one my self so I am curious about your experience.
Andrei Frumusanu - Friday, September 3, 2021 - link
He's talking about the very low pixel density Fold3 UDC, which has a very different design than the one here. There's no shimmering or anything annoying here beyond noticing that the area is a little brighter.sabot00 - Friday, September 3, 2021 - link
Andrei,Your quite positive Axon 30 Ultra review came out a bit after the July Android Phone recommendation article. Would the Axon 30 Ultra place on that list? I'm thinking specifically about the US and I'm on t-mobile (I heard Verizon is not supported).
Andrei Frumusanu - Friday, September 3, 2021 - link
While that phone was generally positive, I wouldn't recommend it in the guide over an S21/S21+ or even S20+.** A - R ** - Saturday, September 4, 2021 - link
Andrei,I reside in Qatar, & here We have Exynos2100 S21s.
As of now Samsung UAE has officially recalled all the S20 FE Exynos 990 (SM-G780F). Now We Officially have S20 FE 5G & 4G both are SD865, models are SM-G781B & SM-G780G respectively. Our CSC/Product Code is XSG.
My colleague is asking Me to suggest one as an Overall great package in sustained performance of the phone. Which one will be a better choice S21 (E2100) or S21 (E2100) or S20 FE 5G or 4G ? And is there any difference in samsung's ufs 3.1 paired with lpddr5 (uMCP) in 128GB ROM vs 256GB ROM ? as I read itbon their semiconductor site for 128 850MB/s writes & 256/512 1200MB/s.
And personally I'd like to know Andrei, that, what is the Actaul difference between the SM-G781B & SM-G780G ?
What has Samsung done in reality, as I remember Qualcomm mandated 5G Modem with SD865. Now did samsung added it in the g780g with giving no Command via Software or did they entirely removed Qualcomm 5G modem & put their's (Exynos Modem) ?
1az2sx - Sunday, September 5, 2021 - link
Hello Andrey! I'm impressed with the work you've done! And you couldn't pass the Pixel 5 vs. Pixel 4a camera test. Does this image processing chip, which is in the Pixel5, and which is not in the Pixel 4a, do anything.eastcoast_pete - Sunday, September 5, 2021 - link
I am probably the odd one out here, but why not make the selfie cam a (small, maybe 1.5-2 mm) hump that extrudes from the screen, instead of a notch. Having the front camera in a notch also limits what kind of lens setup one can have over that sensor (one does need at least a little distance for those lens elements to work), so, if selfies are really that important, why not owning up to it. Plus, no more notch!Calin - Monday, September 6, 2021 - link
The macro camera is my most used.The camera in the current phone is leaps and bounds above the camera in the previous phone, and yet I prefer to use (and prepare) a 10+ years old DSLR.
However, the macro camera sees a lot of use as a magnifying glass for all that otherwise impossible to read smallprint on basically anything in brick-and-mortar shops.
Spunjji - Monday, September 6, 2021 - link
I honestly think the compromise in picture quality from the UDC substantially outweighs the tiny functional - and questionable aesthetic - benefits of it being there in the first place. But then I'm one of those weirdos who things having a border at the top and bottom of the screen for speakers and a camera is an asset, not a flaw, and I've been outvoted by the masses. All hail the impending victory of our crappy unsharp-mask-reliant overlords! 😅Kangal - Tuesday, September 7, 2021 - link
Even funnier, you have the opposite thing when you look at the ASUS Zenfone 6/7 Pro/8 Flip.Here, you get to have the sharpest Selfie cam, and a bit of a bulge. But I like it.
I prefer the middle-ground set by the modern Sony 5.2, or the ASUS RoG 5. Other honourable mentions are the Pixel 2XL, ZTE Axon 7, Alcatel Idol 4s, Moto X Style.
Rant:
-I hate these notches and cut-outs. It's functionally bad, and an eyesore.
-And even worse are the curved screens. Why would I want to get content cut out weirdly, have the light glare back on my eyes, increase my accidental taps, and make the device fragile? Form and function should go hand in hand.
-Not to mention the weird 19:9 aspect ratio. They should stick to 16:9 for best compact, or even 17:9 is alright... anything else is just wasteful. At least Sony's 21:9 serves a purpose: very niche people who watch Ultrawide content like Hollywood Movies (not youtube) on their phone.
Tams80 - Tuesday, September 7, 2021 - link
I don't think we've been outvoted by the masses for support of bezels, but rather that most don't care if they are or aren't there (unless they are big) and just follow whatever is trendy.I'd settle for an under-display camera in the middle of the display. I'd still like at least one decent one in a bezel too though.
But hey, this AnandTech. Remember the spats over user-replaceable batteries and SD cards?
nandnandnand - Monday, September 6, 2021 - link
The phone on the phone should have been showing a phone showing a phone showing a phone...