Ryan slight correction on this topic: "Make in India and the country’s associated attempts to encourage internal manufacturing have not always been well received – Apple and others have balked at the concept at times "
Apple will start iphone production in India within next three months, the location(Bangalore) and supplier(Wistron) both have been already selected. Apart from that almost all the smartphone companies have opened up a factory in the last two years.
Apart from big companies like Samsung, Lenovo etc Even smaller Chinese companies like Xiaomi, OPPO, VIVO are have started local Indian manufacturing.
integrating a new core would require a lot more design effort than just cutting an existing SoC (the 210) down massively; making it too expensive an effort for the targeted market segment.
Assuming they make their way into consumer products at all which isn't a given (eg the A15 was intended as a faster A7 for segments where a 64bit CPU was overkill, but has gone more or less nowhere over the last few years), they'll show up on higher priced entry level smartphone or IoT products first. Developing world dumb phones are a segment of the market that's too poor to afford anything beyond the absolute minimum R&D spending. So what they're getting is a 210 that's been cut down even more on most fronts than the 208, but which is keeping the entry level LTE modem because LTE is starting to be deployed in that segment of the market.
Pretty sure you mean Cortex A12 as the A7 non-64bit successor. Cortex A15 was the successor to the A9 and has seen plenty of action (although it's high thermal output hindered its success).
It seems likely to me that it's the same silicon as the Snapdragon 210, with even more features disabled.
No need for a 64-bit core, however low-end, on a SKU like this. Not this year anyway. A custom design might have made use of A35 just because of course, but why spend money on a custom design for such a low-end product when you have something you can use already.
Those chips will power the basic phones which will cost anywhere around 10 usd. Jio telecom just wanted a volte enabled basic phone (only for calls and occasional internet) - they only have 4g network, no legacy 3g or 2g network. Hence this barebone chip with volte. In my opinion considering the usage of the target device, this chip is still a overkill.
Pretty cool stuff! I wonder if the new 205 will end up going global or if it's going to be an India-only product. The US could certainly do well with phones that have 45 days of standby time and more sane pricing.
This is not cool stuff! A few years ago some chinese SoC company, maybe HiSense or another was selling quadcore +modem SoCs for under $5. By now its probably a $1. The reason folks are buying the QCOM version is not because the QCOM one has more features or is cheaper, its because than they get the LTE patent license fees for less.
This is a shady practice, they're strong arming manufacturers to use their crap chips, otherwise folks will get sued. Shame on the media for not exposing these tactics. SAD.
What's not to be excited about? This is a reasonable SoC that's got nice specs and support for LTE. It's what I'd love to see more of in modern phones and tablets. We could get a little more battery life out of our devices for those of us that don't really care about performance after a point.
I fail to see what's exciting about an SoC that is terribly outdated. I tried using my Galaxy Nexus a few weeks back and it feels ancient with the load times of apps and websites. Even my Nexus 6 can't load apps and websites as fast as my PC or Laptop on the same Wifi, leading me to think that there are SoC performance issues more than internet bandwidth ones. So having LTE in such an underpowered SoC doesn't feel like it will add to the experience. Also, I can't believe you are impressed by their standby times. When was the last time anyone cared about phone standby? Or don't you do anything with your modern phone? If so, why not just get a flip phone, they already have terrific standby duration. Do you care if your laptop can last 48 hours with the display off and in connected standby? Because most people don't, they intend to use these things.
I really don't understand the hostility over someone's excitement in reading about a new budget SoC. I also don't understand why you'd compare a desktop or laptop to a phone and be surprised by the fact that the desktop and/or laptop are faster than the phone and I'm not sure why those platforms are even comparable. You're implyingapps and websites don't load as quickly, but what apps do they share in common and how is the browsing experience comparable at all?
As for phones, I don't currently have one. I was previously issued a Blackberry 8820 by my employer in 2009. A year or so later I purchased a Virgin Mobile LG Optimus V (3.2 inch screen, 600MHz single core, 320MB RAM, etc.) and it was fast enough. I only carried service for a couple of months before I quit and started loading custom ROMs to tinker with it. It's in a drawer someplace now and has Cyanogen 10.1 (jellybean IIRC) on it. Web browsing over WiFI on it was perfectly acceptable last time I powered it up, but that was a few months ago. Maybe you're just not patient or have unrealistic expectations.
I see both sides of this discussion, though I don't understand the anger/rage being displayed. The A7 is an ancient chip that needs to go away. A35's use less power while providing a better user experience, and the chip itself is absolutely tiny. It would seem to be even more cost effective than A7's in addition to being more performant.
As an aside, I went two years without a phone. The first few months was brutal, but then it was WONDERFUL! Yes, it's annoying not being able to research things on the spot, or many of the other things modern mobile phones provide, but the ability to be "unreachable" was priceless. BrokenCrayons isn't as crazy as some might think.
Yes, it will be available world-wide. Though I would be surprised to see it come to the US, simply because the market for such a phone is very small relative to more profitable smartphones.
Am I the only one who is thinking of DESK PHONES with VoLTE support? Here where I live (Eastern Europe) we still use fixed telephony a lot in enterprises. It would be great if we could eliminate the legacy telephony system and move entirely to the converged VoLTE system. I think you call this "cord cutting". What is it like in USA? Do you still use fixed line phones in enterprises? If yes, then isn't this a disruptive game-changer?
My old job (a company with ~400 people down from ~1400 a decade ago) had desk phones. My new one (~40 people) only has company phones in the conference rooms/etc. In both cases they're VOIP systems run over wired internet.
These chips are targeted towards poor farmers, who mostly use voice services. Now since the telecom company (jio) has only 4g network they demanded a lot cost volte chip to power phone that will cost around 10 to 15 usd.
Qualcomm must needed to bring this chip into USB Modem/Mi-Fi device than Phone, because many unlocked 4G LTE modem/mi-fi price still very high in 3rd country.
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BMNify - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Ryan slight correction on this topic: "Make in India and the country’s associated attempts to encourage internal manufacturing have not always been well received – Apple and others have balked at the concept at times "Apple will start iphone production in India within next three months, the location(Bangalore) and supplier(Wistron) both have been already selected. Apart from that almost all the smartphone companies have opened up a factory in the last two years.
Apart from big companies like Samsung, Lenovo etc Even smaller Chinese companies like Xiaomi, OPPO, VIVO are have started local Indian manufacturing.
Some news links for the same:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/india-...
https://www.macrumors.com/2017/02/02/apple-iphone-...
http://www.huffingtonpost.in/2017/01/25/with-83-mi...
Ryan Smith - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
"Apart from that almost all the smartphone companies have opened up a factory in the last two years."Aye. Hence the "balked at times" comment. India's been playing hardball here, and is winning.
hojnikb - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
A7 cores in 2017 ? Really qualcomm ?At least use something like A32/35..
lmcd - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
It still frustrates me to no end that A35s aren't commonplace.Mobile-Dom - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Only place i've seen the A35 (sadly) is in the MediaTek Helio X30, their top of the line SoC -_- 2xA73,4xA53,4xA35DanNeely - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
integrating a new core would require a lot more design effort than just cutting an existing SoC (the 210) down massively; making it too expensive an effort for the targeted market segment.Assuming they make their way into consumer products at all which isn't a given (eg the A15 was intended as a faster A7 for segments where a 64bit CPU was overkill, but has gone more or less nowhere over the last few years), they'll show up on higher priced entry level smartphone or IoT products first. Developing world dumb phones are a segment of the market that's too poor to afford anything beyond the absolute minimum R&D spending. So what they're getting is a 210 that's been cut down even more on most fronts than the 208, but which is keeping the entry level LTE modem because LTE is starting to be deployed in that segment of the market.
Death666Angel - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Pretty sure you mean Cortex A12 as the A7 non-64bit successor. Cortex A15 was the successor to the A9 and has seen plenty of action (although it's high thermal output hindered its success).DanNeely - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
I did. Posted too early in the morning.psychobriggsy - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
It seems likely to me that it's the same silicon as the Snapdragon 210, with even more features disabled.No need for a 64-bit core, however low-end, on a SKU like this. Not this year anyway. A custom design might have made use of A35 just because of course, but why spend money on a custom design for such a low-end product when you have something you can use already.
vikkisah - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Those chips will power the basic phones which will cost anywhere around 10 usd. Jio telecom just wanted a volte enabled basic phone (only for calls and occasional internet) - they only have 4g network, no legacy 3g or 2g network. Hence this barebone chip with volte. In my opinion considering the usage of the target device, this chip is still a overkill.BrokenCrayons - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Pretty cool stuff! I wonder if the new 205 will end up going global or if it's going to be an India-only product. The US could certainly do well with phones that have 45 days of standby time and more sane pricing.webdoctors - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
This is not cool stuff! A few years ago some chinese SoC company, maybe HiSense or another was selling quadcore +modem SoCs for under $5. By now its probably a $1. The reason folks are buying the QCOM version is not because the QCOM one has more features or is cheaper, its because than they get the LTE patent license fees for less.This is a shady practice, they're strong arming manufacturers to use their crap chips, otherwise folks will get sued. Shame on the media for not exposing these tactics. SAD.
BrokenCrayons - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
What's not to be excited about? This is a reasonable SoC that's got nice specs and support for LTE. It's what I'd love to see more of in modern phones and tablets. We could get a little more battery life out of our devices for those of us that don't really care about performance after a point.Death666Angel - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
I fail to see what's exciting about an SoC that is terribly outdated. I tried using my Galaxy Nexus a few weeks back and it feels ancient with the load times of apps and websites. Even my Nexus 6 can't load apps and websites as fast as my PC or Laptop on the same Wifi, leading me to think that there are SoC performance issues more than internet bandwidth ones. So having LTE in such an underpowered SoC doesn't feel like it will add to the experience.Also, I can't believe you are impressed by their standby times. When was the last time anyone cared about phone standby? Or don't you do anything with your modern phone? If so, why not just get a flip phone, they already have terrific standby duration. Do you care if your laptop can last 48 hours with the display off and in connected standby? Because most people don't, they intend to use these things.
BrokenCrayons - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
I really don't understand the hostility over someone's excitement in reading about a new budget SoC. I also don't understand why you'd compare a desktop or laptop to a phone and be surprised by the fact that the desktop and/or laptop are faster than the phone and I'm not sure why those platforms are even comparable. You're implyingapps and websites don't load as quickly, but what apps do they share in common and how is the browsing experience comparable at all?As for phones, I don't currently have one. I was previously issued a Blackberry 8820 by my employer in 2009. A year or so later I purchased a Virgin Mobile LG Optimus V (3.2 inch screen, 600MHz single core, 320MB RAM, etc.) and it was fast enough. I only carried service for a couple of months before I quit and started loading custom ROMs to tinker with it. It's in a drawer someplace now and has Cyanogen 10.1 (jellybean IIRC) on it. Web browsing over WiFI on it was perfectly acceptable last time I powered it up, but that was a few months ago. Maybe you're just not patient or have unrealistic expectations.
fanofanand - Tuesday, March 21, 2017 - link
I see both sides of this discussion, though I don't understand the anger/rage being displayed. The A7 is an ancient chip that needs to go away. A35's use less power while providing a better user experience, and the chip itself is absolutely tiny. It would seem to be even more cost effective than A7's in addition to being more performant.As an aside, I went two years without a phone. The first few months was brutal, but then it was WONDERFUL! Yes, it's annoying not being able to research things on the spot, or many of the other things modern mobile phones provide, but the ability to be "unreachable" was priceless. BrokenCrayons isn't as crazy as some might think.
Ryan Smith - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Yes, it will be available world-wide. Though I would be surprised to see it come to the US, simply because the market for such a phone is very small relative to more profitable smartphones.BrokenCrayons - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Thanks Ryan! There are probably alternatives out there in the budget handset market. They don't get the publicity of top end models though.vtomin - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Am I the only one who is thinking of DESK PHONES with VoLTE support? Here where I live (Eastern Europe) we still use fixed telephony a lot in enterprises. It would be great if we could eliminate the legacy telephony system and move entirely to the converged VoLTE system. I think you call this "cord cutting". What is it like in USA? Do you still use fixed line phones in enterprises? If yes, then isn't this a disruptive game-changer?DanNeely - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
My old job (a company with ~400 people down from ~1400 a decade ago) had desk phones. My new one (~40 people) only has company phones in the conference rooms/etc. In both cases they're VOIP systems run over wired internet.fanofanand - Tuesday, March 21, 2017 - link
My employer has 269,000 employees, the majority have a legacy phone in each "cubicle"vikkisah - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
These chips are targeted towards poor farmers, who mostly use voice services. Now since the telecom company (jio) has only 4g network they demanded a lot cost volte chip to power phone that will cost around 10 to 15 usd.agoyal - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Wow and Apple/android is charging $100-$130 for LTE for iPad/Tab when you get a whole phone with LTE for $45Death666Angel - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Android isn't charging anything for LTE enabled Tabs, because Android isn't producing any hardware.sutamatamasu - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Qualcomm must needed to bring this chip into USB Modem/Mi-Fi device than Phone, because many unlocked 4G LTE modem/mi-fi price still very high in 3rd country.Ariknowsbest - Monday, March 20, 2017 - link
Modem/mifi use different chips with just the baseband and radio stuff.fanofanand - Tuesday, March 21, 2017 - link
A7's don't provide a solid user experience and need to be put out to pasture.